Talk:USS Freedom (LCS-1)

How Many Tons?
Fact box says 2500 tons, text says 3000 tons. 65.102.218.206 20:34, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

I updated dated the Length, Beam and Displacement in the fact box. I used data published at Lockheed's own official website and the Navy Vessel Registry.

http://www.lmlcsteam.com/solution.html http://www.nvr.navy.mil/nvrships/details/LCS1.htm

The NVR states that the light displacement is 2135t, dead weight, 727t and full load displacement 2862 ton. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.196.130.223 (talk) 14:47, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Previously unsectioned comments
The Freedom Class is far from the first surface combat ships built for the US Navy on the Great Lakes in the last century. Most recently the Avenger Class Mine Countermeasures Ships were built by Marietta Marine in Wisconsin in the same shipyards as the USS Fredom. -Ken Keisel

How can the two General Dynamics ships be considered Freedom-class littoral combat ships when even shape of their hulls are different?

-HJC

The Freedom-class is Lockheed Martin's LCS hull type. General Dynamics' version is the Independence-class. The Dark 00:47, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Christening/launch date
A navy news article erroneously reported the ship was christened and launched on 24 September 2006. Multiple sources, including the photograph on that very article, disagree. For example,. --Durin 16:28, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Speed Nit?
The factbox gives the speed of the ship as 45 knots, but the range is given for a speed of 50 knots. Which is it?


 * Depends when the performance was estimated. In the course of its design the boat has got a lot bigger, in fact it is so heavy now there is a good chance it won't plane at all (it was originally a semi-planing hull, hence the high speed). Greglocock 06:15, 14 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Could also be some confusion between knots and MPH. The article states a top speed of 40kts/50MPH, perhaps the range should be at that speed.  --J Clear (talk) 15:31, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I edited the speed and range to use the figures from the Navy's LCS page and cited same. The page feels out of date, but at least there's a citation now. --J Clear (talk) 15:59, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Something is fishy here.
This ship is 115 meters long with a max. crew of 75 people. This is no go. For any warship less than 100 meters long, crew size is non-issue, since they sink if hit by anti-shipping missile. Ships longer than 100 meters have a good chance to survive, because most air/sea-to-sea missiles are not big enough to sink them with a single hit. However, at least 250-300 people / every 100 meters sized crew is needed there to have enough hands onboard for all urgent, emergency work to stop a havaria and save the ship. US Navy would be stupid to send a 115 meters long, clearly survivable ship to combat with a crew less than 1/4th of that needed to solve a havaria situation successfully. A 400 million dollar ship will sink due to lack of hands aboard. 193.226.227.153 23:23, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * A small crew was a major selling point for the LCS. In part, the theory was that not enough chances are taken with existing ships because too many lives are at stake.  The strategic idea was to allow LCS to deploy in large numbers so that a fleet could afford to loose a few.  Also, smaller ships mean less cost. 65.102.218.206 20:34, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
 * This article only notes that there are two rotational crews similar to a Trident subs, blue and gold. &mdash; RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib 23:34, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * the Israeli Saar class quote 85m and a crew of 64, and survived a missile hit. to me a large crew simply makes for uncomfortable quiaters and a lot getting hit in the first blast. large crews did not save RN ships during the falklands war. in any case USN seems to assume that counter measures etc will ensure that these ships are never hit. 217.7.209.108 17:21, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't know about the LCS, but the Zumwalts have a lot of automatic damage control systems. 82.3.242.144 (talk) 11:29, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

The survivability of a ship is not dependent on "250-300 people / every 100 meters". That might be true for a very specific ship design, but it ignores many other factors. The design of a ship can reduce overall damage caused by a missile. Material used can affect the damage caused by a missile. The passageways, doors, hatches, etc. can all seriously effect the damage, and ability to perform damage control. If a missile were to strike, there is probability for both flooding and fire, the technology to put out fires and repair holes is a major factor. Training is number one. If everyone on the ship were fully trained for damage control, then response time, and quality of work would be substantially better than a ship where a certain minority of people are well trained. Promontoriumispromontorium (talk) 04:41, 19 December 2009 (UTC)

Article title
Since the ship has not yet been commissioned, isn't the article title incorrect? I.e. it isn't a USS yet and never has been, so the USS title is premature by a few months. --J Clear (talk) 15:25, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Technically you're right, but it's Wikipedia convention to refer to USS rather than PCU, as that's what's most "obvious" to the casual reader. See eg USS Gerald R. Ford (CVN-78) 82.3.242.144 (talk) 11:29, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

Already in San Diego?
A friend sighted what looked an awful lot like the USS Freedom in San Diego Bay on the evening of 6 November. Is is possible that the ship was commissioned or at least left the lakes early? I don't see how it could be back in Wisconsin in time for the ceremony if it is still scheduled to go off on the eighth. Has any one heard anything? HoratioVitero (talk) 02:23, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Avenger class was built and commissioned in the Great Lakes before Freedom
Apparently Chief Mass Communications Specialist Rhonda Burke didn't do her homework. Fourteen ships of the Avenger class mine countermeasures ship were built before USS Freedom. Stevecalloway (talk) 23:58, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

INSURV conflict
I have looked at and verified both references to the INSURV inspection. Both sources are well respected agencies of the United States Federal Government. I think each side is cherry picking so I will attempt to find the actual INSURV report. If I can't find it in a few days I'll merge the two comments together in one paragraph. Hcobb (talk) 15:25, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

Class article?
As it looks like both LCS designs will be green-lit, would it be an idea to split this article into a class article Freedom class littoral combat ship (which currently redirects here) and an article on the ship itself (at this title)? -- saberwyn 23:16, 10 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Support There's enough info in the main ship articles, and at Littoral combat ship, to create both Freedom class littoral combat ship and Independence class littoral combat ship articles, with the LCS article becoming mainly an overview of the term, like the articles on Destroyers and Frigates. - BilCat (talk) 10:29, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

I've knocked something together, but someone with a better understanding of the subject needs to go through and rebalance, the ship, class, and LCS articles. -- saberwyn 02:29, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Encyclopedic?
This article states: "assuming that the United States Congress passes some sort of budget for 2011" This is encyclopedic? Sounds more like some Wiki-idiot's snide commentary. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.131.133.236 (talk) 23:11, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Darrell_Greenwood (talk) 20:30, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

She is expected to be dry docked
Can some of these forward looking statements be switched to past tense by some kind editor who isn't arbitrarily rolled back, please?

While you're at it, add a note about the outrage in Congress about the ship.

http://thehill.com/blogs/defcon-hill/industry/224579-mccain-levin-call-for-gao-review-of-littoral-combat-ship

Hcobb (talk) 22:18, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

Freedom's got back
Here's some photos about the butt implants.

Before: http://jdwaggoner.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/lcs11.jpg

After: http://www.public.navy.mil/surfor/lcs1/Photos/Freedom_4thFleet.jpg

Not sure if it's really notable enough however. (Unique to this exact ship and will always be a quick means to distinguish her from rest of class.) Hcobb (talk) 02:05, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * What are you on about now? --OuroborosCobra (talk) 07:02, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Baby's got new bumps on her back. Look to the left and right of the "pod bay doors" at the far rear of the ship. Other "Freedom Class" ships are longer in the waist rather than bumpy in the back. Hcobb (talk) 08:40, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Can you try taking this seriously for one second and use actual terminology for whatever the hell you are talking about? --OuroborosCobra (talk) 09:06, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

From the article:

The workaround selected will be to install external tanks for additional buoyancy. And the Navy states that LCS-1 now meets the damage stability requirement with the addition of the external tanks and that the design of USS Fort Worth (LCS-3) includes additional stability improvements.

These tanks can been seen in the photos above. Observe that the rear of the ship has been extended in those two "bumps" from how the ship appeared after construction. These tanks will NOT be added to any other ships of this class. Therefore as soon as you see a "Freedom Class" ship with these bumps you will know instantly that she is LCS-1 and not LCS-3, 5, 7 or any other prime number.


 * Short hull without bumps: LCS-1 before refit.
 * Short hull with bumps: LCS-1 after refit.
 * Long hull: Other "Freedom Class" ships.

All clear now? Hcobb (talk) 09:31, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

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Relevant?
--Pawyilee (talk) 13:16, 23 August 2014 (UTC)

cost $631 million
http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/oct/02/lcs-gao-report/

Is there a slot in the infobox to add this in? Hcobb (talk) 18:38, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

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Is or Was?
At what point does the lede change from "is the lead ship" to "was the lead ship?" Decommissioning (as here) or at some other point? PaulinSaudi (talk) 15:40, 6 October 2021 (UTC)