Talk:United States v. Libby

Notes and References format
There is a problem in the citations formatting in this article. It is not consistent. Some of the sources do not post correctly as notes. There is a mixture of external links and note numbers with further external links following some notes. That is confusing. It needs re-formatting into one consistent format. --NYScholar 03:52, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Press coverage of the trial
The section currently in the article Lewis Libby would be more effectively placed here, but that cannot be done in a way that will preserve the notes features in that article. The notes and references format inconsistency in this article needs to be fixed (see my previous section comment) before the section can be correctly moved into this article. I am not familiar with using the citations format that previous editor or editors developed, so someone else who is familiar with the format used needs to fix the problem and to re-format citations in the section on "press coverage" in the course of moving it or copying it to this article. --NYScholar 03:52, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Tagged with semi-protection
Due to recent vandalism in the article Lewis Libby; see Talk:Lewis Libby for another editor's tagging that article; this article is being tagged for same reasons. --NYScholar 21:34, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Background
Minor detail: shouldn't the first sentence of the second paragraph: "Libby is charged with five counts, all related to alleged involvement in Plame affair, the "outing" of undercover CIA agent Valerie Plame"

be replaced with something like: "Libby is charged with five counts, all related to allegedly false statements made during the investigation of Plame affair, the "outing" of undercover CIA agent Valerie Plame"

He was not charged with anything involving the actual "outing" -- only with making false statements during the ensuing investigation regarding how he found out about Plame's identity.

Polacrilex 22:18, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes. That suggested wording is good; the phrasing should be "the Plame affair", though. --Fsotrain09 01:18, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

I tried to fix the misleading wording by placing the phrase "pursuant...investigation" in the sentence. It is accurate now. Please don't change it back to incorrect information. --NYScholar 01:24, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Semi-protection
Template tag was added on March 6, 2007 for same reasons as added to Lewis Libby; see editing history of this article when it was added first; and Talk:Lewis Libby. These articles have been subject to vandalism and are therefore being semi-protected to help prevent recurring vandalism. --NYScholar 21:21, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Faulty or outdated links
Current numberd ext. links in notes are problematic: for some I've provided pdf links that needed full citations; some seem outdated and all of them need full citations for proper sourcing. In attempt to make notes consistent, some prev. citations may have been lost and need full or better restoration. I've started the format. The rest of article needs similar cleanup. See the earlier comments re: this problem. --NYScholar 08:50, 14 March 2007 (UTC) [updated]--NYScholar 09:36, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Discussion of topics related to the content of this article
For discussion of topics related to the content of this article, please see: Talk:Lewis Libby. Replies to related queries by others and issues raised by them are there. Thank you. --NYScholar 19:26, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Facts of the charges
I came here to read up on actual facts of the charges. I am just wondering if there's anyway to add to the article the quotes of what statements he made that the prosocuter charged as contradictory in order to get the perjury charge or what actions he took to get obstruction charge. Ryratt 21:07, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Commutation and pardons
I heard a different take on this today, and I'm wondering if anyone can clarify this... If Bush had fully pardoned Libby, and he was then called to testify in court or in front of congress, he could not plead the 5th or have any other excuse not to testify because he would be fully immune from prosecution. But since he has not been pardoned, he is not immune from further prosecution. So assuming the Bush administration has something to hide, does it help keep Libby quiet by commuting his sentence instead of pardoning him? -- &#x2611; Sam uelWantman 06:54, 5 July 2007 (UTC)


 * What an interesting question.  I am not an attorney, but believe that even if he had been fully pardoned, he could still be re-called to testify, and again charged if he failed to tell the truth.  Remember that he was charged for specific charges of purjury and obstruction - and that they were in the past.  It is hard (but not impossible) to imagine Bush giving a pardon for intended future crimes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.206.202.139 (talk • contribs) 11:27, July 5, 2007 (UTC)

Controversial Decision
I'd like some feedback on putting some information into this article, on whether it is too "political." Though this really is an incredibly political topic. Senator Joe Biden wrote on his blog at criticizing Bush' ineptitude for not talking to the DoJ about commuting his sentence in light of the fact that just last year his administration had filed an amicus curaie brief actually supporting a 33 month sentence for a 25 year career marine found guilty of the same crimes of perjury and obstruction. This is newsworthy since his blog post has been picked up all over the internet. You can find this by searching for terms in his blog through google. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.206.202.139 (talk • contribs) 11:27, July 5, 2007 (UTC)


 * Sorry, my original comment was misleading, as well as the blog post itself, it may not actually be Biden speaking, rather a frontman for Biden.


 * http://blog.joebiden.com/?p=693 - Biden's original post
 * http://www.usdoj.gov/osg/briefs/2006/3mer/2mer/2006-5754.mer.aa.pdf - the Amicus Curaie brief against Victor Rita --167.206.202.139 15:27, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Question
I merely question whether Oberman's editorializing is appropriate here. My uninformed opinion of what the proticol should be would permit inclusion of comments of those directly involved, but not the editorial comments of pundits frome either side. (So Wilson, Fitzgerald, Libby, and Gonzales comments would be appropriate, while Limbaugh's and Oberman's would not.)

"On the following evening, in a special commentary Olbermann called for both President Bush and Vice-President Cheney to resign.[79]" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.152.124.38 (talk • contribs) 09:10, July 7, 2007 (UTC)


 * Making reference to Keith Olbermann's "point of view" is just like making reference to any other "editorials" (many of which are cited in the articles pertaining to this subject as sources of "points of view" on the subject): it is in keeping with WP:POV especially concerning WP:BLP. [Please sign your comment with four tildes, thank you; one can locate the user in editing history.]  --NYScholar 01:25, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Including various points of view (from reliable and verifiable sources, like Olbermann) is in keeping with Neutral point of view. It's we editors who are not supposed to be inserting our own points of view into Wikipedia articles.  Presenting a wide spectrum of points of view maintain neutrality.  President Bush's cited and quoted "Proclamation" and "Statement" about his commutation of Libby's prison sentence is one "point of view"; journalists' editorials and "special comment[s]" provide other points of view.  Limiting the article to presenting only President Bush's point of view would be violating Neutral point of view and WP:POV.  (Keith Olbermann is not a "pundit"; he is a journalist, with a highly-rated and highly-watched program on a major media cable network, MSNBC.)  --NYScholar 01:52, 9 July 2007 (UTC) (updated. --NYScholar 01:55, 9 July 2007 (UTC))

Earlier missing citation
Proper "full citation" is needed for an earlier Olbermann ref. (Wilson's quotation) [tagged "fact" template]; need a transcript as source? See WP:Cite, WP:BLP; see tagged notices at top of page. --NYScholar 01:28, 9 July 2007 (UTC) [updated: --NYScholar 01:39, 9 July 2007 (UTC)]

Article Still missing the basics, including Facts of the charges
As RyRatt noted eight years ago, this article still doesn't include the actual charges against Libby. It hardly qualifies as encyclopedic, missing the central information on a trial. It would be like having an article about the OJ trail without mentioning that he was accused of murdering his ex-wife and her friend.

If I can find them, I will add them.

ZeroXero (talk) 17:13, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20100922140112/http://www.nationaljournal.com:80/about/njweekly/stories/2006/0209nj1.htm to http://nationaljournal.com/about/njweekly/stories/2006/0209nj1.htm
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20070307104637/http://www.cnn.com:80/SPECIALS/2005/cia.leak/index.html to http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2005/cia.leak/index.html
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20070307104637/http://www.cnn.com:80/SPECIALS/2005/cia.leak/index.html to http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2005/cia.leak/index.html
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20091017203529/http://www.usdoj.gov:80/usao/iln/osc/ to http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/iln/osc/

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External links modified (January 2018)
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