Talk:Uvalde school shooting/Archive 1

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022
change deadliest school shooting since MSG to deadliest since Sandy Hook, surpasses MSG with 20 dead (so far) Adryan0520 (talk) 01:16, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Done. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 01:24, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (3)
The death count has been raised to nineteen (19) children, 2 adults and the shooter, as of 10:15PM 5/24/2022 2601:404:D480:D170:2913:334:5AB8:D442 (talk) 02:24, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: It seems like the error has been fixed and updated multiple times. `~HelpingWorld~` (👽🛸) 04:10, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (4)
Under "Aftermath," change "The school year had been previously scheduled for that Thursday[28]" to "The school year had been previously scheduled to end that Thursday.[28]" 2601:14D:8300:7360:A4EE:43E0:631B:A29 (talk) 03:19, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅ Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 03:37, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (5)
Invalid link in "Shooting" section; note the last link is invalid (it starts "http://Gunmhttps").

Change

Already done Seems like someone fixed the link. Happy editing! `~HelpingWorld~` (👽🛸) 04:20, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 May 2022
Change casualties from 2-14 to just 14. Aquavison (talk) 21:19, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Closing without action: The infobox is already updated to 16 people Happy Editing-- IAm Chaos  21:23, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 May 2022 - Source fix
Source fix Screendeemer (talk) 21:05, 24 May 2022 (UTC)


 * ❌ Insufficient explanation of what you want to fix. Dunutubble (talk) (Contributions) 21:07, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Shooting
According to a Facebook post by the school, it was placed on lockdown around 11:43 a.m CDT in response to gunshots in the neighborhood. Screendeemer (talk) 21:05, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Should just add that under the events. Aquavison (talk) 21:20, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Shooter
Anyone have any sources about the shooter? I have multiple ABC and NBC saying the shooter is dead in custody. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rocketman771 (talk • contribs) 20:35, 24 May 2022 (UTC)


 * It looks like that info's been added. Dunutubble (talk) (Contributions) 20:43, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * The shooter according to ABC and more recent sources (and live newscasts) released a name, though I am not going to include that as per WP:SUSPECT and we know how thigns evolve, but they are saying the police said he's dead and not in custody. PRAXIDICAE💕  20:52, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Sorry, meant per the governor, who I assume is briefed by police. PRAXIDICAE💕  20:53, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Source with the Governor saying the shooter's name Paris1127 (talk) 20:56, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Like all breaking news, we should wait until the initial storm has passed to include a name. PRAXIDICAE💕  21:02, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Not disagreeing, just providing a more local source than Heavy or the NY Post. Paris1127 (talk) 21:06, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Uvalde Consolidated Independent School District
Robb Elementary School is part of the Uvalde Consolidated Independent school district.-- 🐦DrWho42  👻  21:12, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Thanks to the editors
Hey everyone, I just wanted to give some appreciation to everyone working to give this article the attention to detail and respect it deserves. These types of events are very difficult for families and friends of the victims, and what you do here may or may not matter to them, but you all are doing your best. Thanks. DN (talk) 22:48, 24 May 2022 (UTC)


 * --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 23:01, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * The silver lining to every mass shooting is that the aftermath brings people together who mourn those who died and advocate for change. X-Editor (talk) 00:47, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Wikipedians' unique ability to quickly and neutrally build encyclopedic pagespace on tragic events is often impressive. I pointed this page work out to a mentee today, pointing out how serious and important our volunteering is, and how rough consensus and running code seems to be a workable way of organizing controversial data. I agree with the OP that some good people are doing fine work this afternoon by once again documenting an entirely preventable tragedy. BusterD (talk) 01:08, 25 May 2022 (UTC)\
 * I couldn't agree more. Hopefully something comes out of this, but I'm not holding my breath for that. X-Editor (talk) 02:06, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * You're welcome. Love of Corey (talk) 01:51, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Seconding, thank you everyone who's editing this article and doing their best to keep it up to date and accurate. Blysse (talk) 05:07, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 *  Chesapeake77 >>> ♥ Truth  11:14, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 *  Chesapeake77 >>> ♥ Truth  11:14, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Reference 40.
Can someone duplicate reference 35 because 40 is the same as 35. `~HelpingWorld~` (👽🛸) 02:27, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * With any current event, especially so with one that's receiving a lot of editorial action there will be some duplicate references. I can see at least one editor doing a source cleanup now though, so I'll ping em so they can make note of this when they're doing that. Sideswipe9th (talk) 03:02, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for pinging me. From what I see, I believe the ref was removed. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 03:43, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Shooting
Prior to the shooting, the perpetrator, 18-year-old Salvador Rolando Ramos (May 16, 2004 – May 24, 2022), a resident of Uvalde and a student at Uvalde High School, reportedly shot and wounded his grandmother at their home in Uvalde; she was hospitalized in critical condition. To

Shooting
Prior to the shooting, the perpetrator, 18-year-old Salvador Rolando Ramos (May 16, 2004 – May 24, 2022), a resident of Uvalde and a student at Uvalde High School, reportedly shot and wounded his grandmother at their home in Uvalde; she was hospitalized in critical condition. ReferentiallySeethru (talk) 04:13, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

there vs their victim section
it should be "there" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:6C54:7900:D4D:E9AC:2A0:2DA4:3096 (talk) 06:03, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

"A Month Ago"
One of the sentences under Background reads "He worked at a Wendy's for a year but quit a month ago." This should be changed to "He worked at a Wendy's for a year but quit a month prior to the shooting" to remove the present tense from the article, so it's useful to future readers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.185.209.98 (talk) 08:42, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅-- 🐦DrWho42  👻  08:48, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (4)
Please indicate that the murderer was Hispanic so his community's violent behavior can enter into the "national conversation", instead of blaming Constitutionally protected defense tools. 2600:8800:9290:C300:5871:44F7:F39F:87CA (talk) 13:00, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Full name
Full name: Salvador Rolando Ramos 2003:F3:270F:76CC:94A0:5047:9AAF:FA8D (talk) 12:44, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022
Remove the shooters name from this listing. Stop making them famous. Refer to them as “a shooter” or “the piece of shit that shot kids”, anything but the actual name 2600:1700:1CB0:7870:E41D:F1F4:F8EC:94E2 (talk) 10:56, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, he is a terrible person, but his name is widely known in many sources. The shooter is not even alive to enjoy the fame anymore. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 11:39, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (2)
Please remove the shooters name. We need to remember the victims not the sick individual who committed this horrible act 24.144.38.182 (talk) 12:05, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the template. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 12:15, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ❌ because we routinely include perpetrators' names in articles about crimes. Jim Michael 2 (talk) 12:18, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Robb Elementary School
while it might turn back into a redirect, started an article on the elementary school.-- 🐦DrWho42   👻  23:06, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I've contested this, and have reverted it back to a redirect. Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 23:11, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (4)
shooting section says: Soon after police reported that 911 calls were received about a vehicle that had crashed near the school and that a person armed with a rifle had heading inside.

should be: Soon after police reported that 911 calls were received about a vehicle that had crashed near the school and that a person armed with a rifle had ***BEEN SEEN*** heading inside. 38.140.7.250 (talk) 16:57, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅ with additional fixes for other issues. Mr rnddude (talk) 17:00, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (3)
Please consider merging the Paul Gosar comments at the end of the "Aftermath" section and the end of the "Responses" section. Thank you. Maxx-♥ talk and coffee ☕ 12:10, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅, a response now. InedibleHulk (talk) 12:24, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (5)
Remove the shooters name. Don't help make them famous for killing people. 198.179.6.183 (talk) 18:57, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ❌ feel free to continue discussion below, but the current consensus is to include this information in the article. — xaosflux  Talk 18:59, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Typo edit request
I've noticed a typo, but I don't have the required permissions to fix it – I hope you don't mind if I point it out here. In the Gun control and rights responses and actions section, "an press conference" in the fourth paragraph should be replaced with "a press conference". - Cheers, KoolKidz112   (hit me up)  19:10, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Looks like this was ✔️ by someone else. >>> Ingenuity . talk ; 19:39, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Biden did call for more gun control.
In the article, it states that Biden did not lay out any plans for gun control; although he did call for action. This should be changed to be more clear. Aquavison (talk) 19:40, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Updated. -Abhishikt (talk) 20:45, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Reactions of Former Presidents
The article states that the shooting was condemned by "former presidents" Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, but neglects to mention that it was also condemned by former president Donald Trump. The line should read "The attack was condemned by former presidents Bill Clinton, Barack Obama and Donald Trump." Source: https://nypost.com/2022/05/24/texas-school-shooting-live-updates/#22403254 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.101.25.192 (talk) 21:01, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * ✅ I used a source from Politico instead as it is generally seen as more reliable. >>> Ingenuity . talk ; 21:14, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (4)
Add one more person dead. My friend passed. 73.141.181.50 (talk) 22:17, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. WikiVirusC (talk) 22:52, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I am very sorry for you loss, but you must provide a reliable source. Thepanthersfan201 (talk) 23:58, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Injured Officers
CNN is reporting that 2 police officers sustained injuries. Where should this be listed? Brookline Fire buff (talk) 22:16, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * In the article, no? Also in the information box. --StellarNerd (talk) 22:28, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I would recommend adding a sentence to the victim section for now. I believe that the infobox does not list the number injured at the moment because it is unclear, but it would also go there.  --Super Goku V (talk) 22:50, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

Wrong details
Wrong amount of deaths, and information is not true. The grandmother is still alive thankfully. 14 students were killed, and one teacher along with the suspect. Information is still developing but dozens have been taken to the hospital.

Info is not true. 68.112.88.209 (talk) 23:39, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Provide a reliable source to support this. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 23:42, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * https://edition.cnn.com/us/live-news/texas-elementary-school-shooting-05-24-22/index.html says "State Sen. Roland Gutierrez told CNN the grandmother was airlifted to San Antonio and “is still holding on,” according to information he was given by the Texas Rangers.". This was posted 39 minutes ago. — Vincent Lefèvre (talk) 00:05, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Death count
Why does the start of the article list 19 deaths but the infobox 21? --Trade (talk) 00:46, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * The 19 is the number of people who died at the school, the 20th is the suspect, and the 21st is the suspect's grandmother who was killed before the shooting at the school. >>> Ingenuity . talk ; 00:49, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Should we include the name of the teacher in the article? --Trade (talk) 00:53, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Apparently the grandmother survived. Love of Corey (talk) 01:48, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I can confirm that. According to this CNN Source, State Sen. Roland Gutierrez told CNN the grandmother was airlifted to San Antonio and “is still holding on,” according to information he was given by the Texas Rangers. CastleFort1 (talk) 02:11, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * This number can possibly change over the next 24 hours, let's all be patient. DN (talk) 01:54, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Death Toll again
Sources are reporting 19 students and 2 adults dead. It's not clear if they are including the perp in the death toll. My hunch is not. It's also not clear if among the 2 dead is his grandmother or another teacher. Any input? Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 02:23, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Uvalde High School
started an article on the high school ramos attended.-- 🐦DrWho42  👻  07:53, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

The Dead Children
Who ever wrote this should never write again … really “The Dead Children” Have some sympathy!!!!! 2601:342:200:EEE0:C812:5FBC:EAC9:783D (talk) 01:36, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I've changed "dead" to "deceased" if that's any better. We describe the events as RS and try to avoid WP:NEWSSTYLE. Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 01:43, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * IMO it's "murdered", but there are rules and policies in place to help us with that. DN (talk) 01:51, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Addition To Weapon category
The rifle was found as an AR-15 2605:A601:ADB6:6000:801:50C3:647B:A959 (talk) 01:46, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Please provide a source. Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 01:46, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 May 2022 (plate carrier)
A plate carrier is NOT a Bullet Proof Vest. 75.159.179.81 (talk) 15:30, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * As of posting this, the article says, "Contrary to earlier reports, Ramos was not wearing body armor, instead only a plate carrier." But isn't "plate carrier", a type of bulletproof vest, body armor? IAmNitpicking (talk) 15:30, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * @IAmNitpicking from a quick review of the sources, it wasn't a bulletproof vest, but the shell that could be used to carry armor plates (that were absent). It might look like he was wearing armor to an outside observer, as they wouldn't necessarily be able to tell that the plates were absent. —  xaosflux  Talk 15:54, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I think we've got this rectified. Seems to be something similar to a Soldier Plate Carrier System (though unlikely to be that exact one) - have clarified with reference that the carrier did not contain armor plates, as reported by the reference. —  xaosflux  Talk 15:52, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you. IAmNitpicking (talk) 16:29, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * The distinction we are trying to draw is not helped by the fact that plate carrier just redirects to bulletproof vest.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 16:50, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Perhaps plate carrier would work. The section – despite its broad title – is about carriers. Mr rnddude (talk) 16:52, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Someone already relabeled it, I added the section link as well now it says tactical vest. — xaosflux  Talk 17:50, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

so it is more-or-less a type of bulletproof vest, but had the CRITICAL INTERNAL PLATES missing? as in, an empty, useless, bulletproof-LOOKING vest? why?
 * - think this is good now? — xaosflux  Talk 17:56, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * OK with me. Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:00, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

just fashion? like wearing camo? 2601:19C:527F:A680:2177:A157:A3DE:7DA2 (talk) 18:31, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Hi 2601, it's hard to tell their motivations. Could be fashion, could be they were using it to help carry things like magazines, could be for intimidation or to make themselves look more defended then they were. One can buy those vests and the plates separately, as the plates come in different prices/weights/strengths. — xaosflux  Talk 18:38, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅ think this section is resolved. — xaosflux  Talk 20:27, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Actual # of deceased victims
I believe that governor Greg Abbott misspoke / is unclear on how many deceased there are from this incident. Why are many news outlets reporting two dead, but Greg's address has caused multiple outlets to say that 14 people were killed? My understanding is that is the total # of people who were somehow physically affected by the event (injured or deceased). I think the 14 dead is inaccurate and is incorrectly shaping the narrative around this event.

Obviously this is a totally senseless crime and the tragedy is of the same magnitude whether there was one victim or one hundred, but I fear that this is going to turn into the Sago Mine incident where the rescue crew/law enforcement said that they had located the miners and the mews media en masse misinterpreted this to mean that the miners were all located alive, when in reality all but one were deceased. NERUALSI (talk) 21:45, 24 May 2022 (UTC)


 * RS is reporting 15 dead. I hope Abbott just mispoke, but we follow what RS is saying. This is a developing event, things can change User:IamreaIamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 22:00, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * It is possible that Abbott misspoke, but it isn't clear that he did. Currently, I can released articles in the last 20 minutes that are quoting Abbott for the number of deceased.  Unless there is proof that Abbott misspoke, we can only report what the sources say.  --Super Goku V (talk) 22:02, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * He could have misspoken, and I hope he did. But the majority of sources at the moment are saying that 16 died (including the shooter). He is quoted for a lot of these, but it seems like in this case RS consider his words to be reliable. Dunutubble (talk) (Contributions) 22:07, 24 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Because this is a very recent event, it is best to wait. Governor Abbott could have misspoken, but as of now, it's uncertain Brookline Fire buff (talk) 22:05, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * This just happened. He might have not had the full information. There is no real lasting relevance to these immediate statements. --StellarNerd (talk) 22:18, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * On second look, Abbot was correct. Some early sources were reporting Uvalde Memorial Hospital's very initial statement of 15 injuries taken to their emergency room. These 15 were all declared dead, either DOA or in very critical condition on arrival. --StellarNerd (talk) 22:26, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

This number may or may not change over the next 24 hours. Everyone, be patient and assume good faith, this is going to take some time to get it absolutely right. It is absolutely necessary that we all WP:AGF and not turn an already crappy situation into an edit war. Excellent work so far. Kudos. DN (talk) 01:47, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Archiving this section, as all of the values above have been superseded by newer information from reliable sources. —  xaosflux  Talk 13:25, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

Number of injured

 * On May 24, 2022, 18-year-old Salvador Ramos opened fire at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas, United States, killing 19 children and two teachers, and wounding about 16 others.
 * Infobox states 15 injured

What's the real number? Does the infobox not count the grandmother? --Trade (talk) 16:50, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure where those are even sourced from. It doesn't appear any of the given sources state the number injured.
 * I did find a source that has not yet been added that states there were at least 14 injuries: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/police-respond-active-shooter-texas-elementary-school-rcna30339 –– FormalDude  talk  18:00, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * So far the infobox has not included the grandmother, as the was not shot at Robb Elementary School. — xaosflux  Talk 18:03, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

Could you indicate this in the infobox to prevent confusion? --Trade (talk) 20:07, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅ I've added this as a WP:BOLD update for you, not sure if it will stick - if reverted feel free to discuss further here on the talk page. —  xaosflux  Talk 20:13, 25 May 2022 (UTC)