Talk:Vauxhall Motors/Archives/2012

Opel
"From the 1970s, most models were designed and built in partnership with Opel in Germany. The Chevette, Cavalier and Carlton basically facelifted versions of the Kadett, Ascona and Rekord."

I dispute this somewhat. Vauxhall and Opel have always made similar cars, not surprising since they are both GM subsidiarys and there obviously was a lot of cross-fertilisation. This is true going back to the 60s - the then Opel Kadett is fairly similar to the Viva. However, they were not the same cars throughout the 70s, the Vauxhall versions were home-grown and engineered variants that shared relatively few parts in common with the Opel cars, they even had totally different engines. It wasn't really until the 80s that they became the exact same car, with nothing but badging to separate them. I'm not sure how to change the text to make this clear however. GRAHAMUK 03:46, 21 Nov 2003 (UTC)

Logo problem?
Recently it seems someone thumbnailed the logo image, then comments appeared like "trying to improve image", etc. As not just the original uploader of this image, but I actually drew it in Illustrator, I'm wondering what is wrong with it exactly? I have the original 2M file so if there is something wrong, let me know and I can fix it. I also feel that thumbnailing it is pointless - it's small anyway and was equally discreet in its original form - the additional border that thumbnailing causes doesn't improve the look of the page in this case. I'd suggest reverting to its original layout. Note - change for the sake of change is just daft - if it ain't broke, don't fix it! Graham 09:14, 8 Aug 2004 (UTC)
 * I've not played around with images before, but there was a load of HTML around the two images that looked as if it could be disposed of, so I did, and then the image started looking 'unclean'. Please tidy it up, if you would.  Noisy 09:27, 8 Aug 2004 (UTC)
 * I've restored the original HTML. The apparent complexity is a legacy of the older method WP used for aligning images - it's still supported though more complex to set up, so there is no need to "fix" it.Graham 12:34, 8 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Commentary not suitable for article
Came across this Jeremy Clarkson commentary. Too sarcastic/opinionated for the article, but funny nontheless. Clarkson is lamenting the effect GM has had on its Vauxhall subsidiary:
 * "...Vauxhall’s a part of General Motors which, so far as I can tell... seems to concentrate mainly on pensions and healthcare and for as long as I can remember has seen the car making side of the business as an expensive loss-making nuisance. This explains the [old] Vectra. They gave it some seats, a pair of windscreen wipers and a roof, and, just before the morning coffee break, with a sigh of relief, went back to their Medicare and pension plans." --Mark83 13:49, 21 May 2006 (UTC)


 * Clarkson has always been rude about Vauxhalls, I'm not sure why, probably had the trauma of learning to drive in a Viva or something - I know I did ;-) The Monaro is the only one he has ever seemed enthusiastic about, so it's clear that as long as you give it enough grunt it doesn't matter about the rest of it. One of his comments that stuck with me particularly was his scathing remarks about the HPF that "it sounds like a sporting tractor and goes about as well". Probably feels the same way about the HS Chevette, which Tiff Needell drove on Top Gear once and was really impressed with. These cars were the Monaros of their day, you'd think JC would get that! Ah well, he's entertaining enough in his way. Graham 00:19, 22 May 2006 (UTC)


 * If you get a chance read the full article because he actually likes the Astra Sport Hatch! Mark83 08:37, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Vauxhall motorcycle
Apparently Vauxhall made a motorcycle (just one model). Why is there no mention of this? I'm no expert - my information comes from the following link: http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:8OQ19Xb_AMYJ:mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/kevins_pages/vaux_history.html+8718MN&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=uk

"THE VAUXHALL MOTORBIKE (1922/23)

In 1922 Vauxhall started work on its first and only motorcycle. The machine was designed by Major Frank B Halford who was a very well known aero-engineer who created the Cirrus engine for de Havilland in 1924. Halford was also responsible for the flat H liquid cooled Napier Sabre and worked on the Jet engine development with Sir Frank Whittle.

By 1923 two machines had been completed before production difficulties made it clear that the machine was not going to be a financial success. A further six frames and twelve engines were made but the machines and spares were offered for sale to company personnel.

Two complete bikes are known to have been sold to a draftsman and an apprentice but only one machine is known to survive today. Registration number 8718MN was in a private collection on the Isle of Man for many years but is now believed to be to be in Ashurst, W Sussex in England.

This single seater motorcycle was a very advanced design for the 1920’s and it had a wheelbase of 58 in, a length of 90 in and a height of 39 in. It weighed in at 415 lb and featured a duplex cradle frame with coil-sprung twin forks, no rear suspension and no dampers.

The engine was a 4 cylinder square (67mm bore and stroke) unit (945cc giving circa 30bhp @ 3500 rpm) with separate air cooled in line cylinders, aluminium crankcase, 3-bearing 2-piece crankshaft, single carburettor, magneto ignition and 6-volt electrics. Lubrication was by wick to the overhead valve rockers and by dippers on the ends of the connecting rods at the bottom end. The cylinder head was fixed but overhead valves were used with a side camshaft.

A 3 speed box and shaft drive was fitted with a 6 in multi-plate clutch, 7 in drum brakes and 700x80 tyres. The reported top speed was 82mph." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.98.240.60 (talk) 21:25, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Vauxhall Motors Logo.jpg
Image:Vauxhall Motors Logo.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. — Save_Us _ 229  18:25, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Vauxhall logo.png
Image:Vauxhall logo.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. BetacommandBot (talk) 07:20, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

Picture of a big Vauxhall
I've just uploaded this picture. The car was marked at a classic car show as a Vauxhall Big 6. However, I know nothing about the model. If anyone is able and willing to enter a more informative caption, or more information on it here, that would be interesting. Please. And thank you.... Regards Charles01 (talk) 20:08, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

Magna
Is Vauxhall part of the deal that Magna organized to take control of Opel? 70.29.208.129 (talk) 11:06, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes. TastyCakes (talk) 17:25, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Opel - Vauxhall merger
It has been suggesed that Magna plans to merge the Vauxhall name with the Opel name, thereofre making Vauxhall defunct, are they still planing to do so?

Original Vauxhall cars
there is no road timeline for this article which shows cars produced by Vauxhall and not Opel. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.117.79.57 (talk) 11:23, 16 March 2012 (UTC)

Logo through the decades, company press release, compound image and fair use thereof
Vauxhall issued a press release in 2008 regarding their logo. They also released an image, showing how their logo has changed since the 1920's. It can be found here. I'm not either a Vauxhall or fair use expert, but it seems that this press release information and compound image of logos belongs in this article. Anyone want to volunteer to add this? Wikiwayman (talk) 13:04, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Vauxhall in Vernon, British Columbia in 1913?
I am trying to find some information on who represented Vauxhall in Vernon British Columbia in 1913 - 1914, if there is a way to obtain this information, could someone please let me know, thankyou. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.38.44.177 (talk) 19:13, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Company Names
In attempting to clarify the company structure of Vauxhall Motors in relation to Opel and General Motors, the following interesting facts emerged courtesy of Companies House:


 * Vauxhall Motors Limited (company number 00135767), registered 12 May 1914, changed its name to General Motors UK Limited in 16 April 2008. Assets of £889,600,000 in 2010 according to Company Check.
 * General Motors UK Limited (company number 06356274) was established 30 August 2007 and changed its name to Vauxhall Motors Limited on 16 April 2008, basically swapping the GM and Vauxhall names to two different corporate entities. No assets recorded by Company Check. This would suggest that the Vauxhall Motors name, or marque, is a "front" but the real company in operation is General Motors UK Limited. Indeed I note that the Vauxhall website now states the © as General Motors UK Limited.

Other related companies (need to confirm if actual subsidiaries of GM UK or GM Europe, or indeed GM International) include:


 * General Motors Limited (company number 01682792) registered 30 November 1982, assets of over £154m
 * GM Automotive UK (company number 03785354) registered June 1999, assets of nearly £13m but liabilities of over £314m.
 * Millbrook Proving Ground
 * IBC Vehicles
 * Global Tooling Service Company

I shall have to have a dig around to see what company does what... and its formal relationship with Opel (is it a "sister brand" or actual holding company) and General Motors Europe. Any authoritative references or company accounts will be welcome! Warren (talk) 12:30, 5 July 2012 (UTC)


 * This is interesting and hopefully once you have finished your research this can form part of a new (and long overdue) Operations section, which should also detail things like plants, R&D and HQ functions.
 * So far as I am aware the old GM Europe holding company in Switzerland was abolished in 2009 when the HQ of GM's European operations was moved to Germany . As part of the restructuring the parent company of Vauxhall (which is apparently now General Motors UK Limited) was made a subsidiary of Adam Opel, although this had little practical effect on the way in which the business is operated. Trying to find quality third party sources which deal with this is very hard though. Rangoon11 (talk) 23:24, 5 July 2012 (UTC)


 * I will delve into Adam Opel later, but even that is mired in complexities, with both Adam Opel GmbH and Adam Opel AG both being referenced. I did see that Adam Opel GmbH is a subsidary of General Motors Automotive Holdings, S.L. (Spanish based) and will be interesting to see if this is the same holding company for GM UK... (according to Business Week). Adam Opel AG is the company entity used for most of the public facing side of Opel. Presumably by keeping Chevrolet technically separate in Europe by being part of GM International Operations makes it easier for a company split should GM need to offload the Euoropean business in future but without risking the Chevrolet marque. The more I delve the more I wonder why it is such a complex company structure as both Opel and Vauxhall have been part of GM for generations! Is it suspicious, or just poor corporate management? Must be quite a challenge to consolidate their accounts. I wonder do staff know who their actual employer is?!
 * Such nested holding companies are very common -- I found same at SNCF. As to employees -- many of those holding companies do not have employees of their own; they just share their board members with other nodes in the holding chain. Administration is done for a fee by another one. --L.Willms (talk) 16:47, 6 October 2012 (UTC)
 * What does appear to be 'clear' is that the General Motors Europe name is not a corporate entity (as recorded in the wikipedia article) and this is actually Adam Opel AG, according to a GM Europe website. So what I still cannot find, is any reference to say if Vauxhall is directly related to Adam Opel AG or GM Automotive Holdings, or indeed any other GM holding company... Warren (talk) 08:53, 6 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Turns out that General Motors UK, trading under the Vauxhall name, is owned by VHC SUB-HOLDINGS (UK), which itself is owned by GM HOLDINGS U.K. NO.3 LTD, which is owned by GM AUTOMOTIVE UK, which is owned by ADAM OPEL AG. So finally I can confirm Vauxhall is indeed owned by Adam Opel AG. Shame that it is hidden by so many holding companies. Thanks to Company Check for their very helpful search engine.


 * Millbrook and IBC Vehicles are owned by GM Holdings UK No 1 Ltd, which is directly owned by Adam Opel AG. Chevrolet UK Ltd is owned by GM Korea Company. Warren (talk) 18:18, 30 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Well done for doing this research and for finally getting to the bottom of it! I expect only a few GM insiders/lawyers know why such a complicated structure exists!Rangoon11 (talk) 22:34, 4 August 2012 (UTC)
 * The official companies registry for Great Britain is at . That's where companies in England, Wales, and Scotland have to send all their changes to. Single documents are payable at 1 GBP. --L.Willms (talk) 16:47, 6 October 2012 (UTC)