Talk:Via ferrata/Archive 1

Major Revision
I have been undertaking a major revision of this article to make it higher quality, nearly complete:

Revised the intro.

History section has been updated and broaded - so not just about first world war. (Could even be argued the wartime history is almost irrelevant to how via ferrata have developed today) Used German WP article and other sources.

Inserted a section on grading (and deleted from Austria and France sections)

Trying to strengthen and make more consistent the country sections:


 * Revised Italy (changed Brenta para, added several more dolomite routes, fleshed out other Italy section).
 * Added Austria, except for some references - Difficult as impossible to find a good summary to cite despite a lot of guides.
 * Added Switzerland - helped by a little online summary which gave a good start
 * Revised France
 * Germany needs expansion.
 * With much of the rest of the world there is arguable far too much (commercial interests?) - I moved them into two broader sections I've edited Canada section to remove off topic text, but the middle of that is a mess and needs attention. Also Moved the highest VF to a new Kenya subsection from the intro - not really about what VF are about, probably commercial

rearranged and refine the equipment section ( lanyard and shock absorbers put together) but could do with wome more work. (could also be brought forward to before the countries).

Also want to look at pictures and references more.

A minor point, I changed all the plurals to ferratas - it sounds more appropriate to an english ear, and as via ferrata has been pretty much anglicised it is arguably more correct. More common in the literature too.

Also odd is the use of "stemples" doesn't tie in with the use of definition in WP or elsewhere but is used (without definition) by the Smith and Fletcher guidebooks

This is my first major edit of an article, and if anyone has any comments or pointers for me would I welcome them. Marqaz (talk) 00:04, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

History
There is a much better article about via ferrata history in German wiki. Someone more fluent in German may be able to improve this section. BambelB (talk) 16:47, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

Equipment
I have changed the equipment section, but it may need some polishing. BambelB (talk) 16:43, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

I just did a little polishing, and added pictures of lanyards. Ismith (talk) 13:55, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

Dolomites via ferratas
BambelB (talk) 16:12, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
 * It would be good to list route names with grades
 * Routes should be divided into regions
 * Some links are dead and have to be found again or removed

Other via ferrata outside the Dolomites
There are absolutely loads of via ferrata (klettersteig) springing up in Austria, Switzerland and especially France. Mostly, these do not have any historical precidence like the Dolomite ones, but are especially designed for sport use. Many ski-resorts have realised that adding one or two ferrata in the region is a way of attracting new summer visitors and making work for guides. There are now quite a few online and book resources which detail the non-dolomite routes. Re-balancing the scope of the article beyond the dolomites is more representative of the real state of the sport.

I am sure you are correct. Would you like to add a section to the article? I am afraid I know very little about via ferrata outside the Dolomites. R Pollack 21:19, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

R Pollack, you reverted to a preceding edit declaring that Italy "declared war on the Axis, in an opportunistic attempt to seize extra territory". First, in WWI there was no Rome-Berlin Axis, second, historical interpretation (and a shaky one at that) has no connection at all with the topic here. Regards, --Tridentinus 08:41, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Having done several of the French via ferratas, of which there are now some 120 with more appearing all the time, I agree that the article could do with being restructured so that ferratas in other countries, their grading schemes etc can be added. I'm sure much of the historical information in here should remain as-is, Italy being where they started, but certain sections need to be changed to allow more information to be added. I'm not sure what is the best way to do this. I also think a prominent section on equipment, safety and good practice is needed, given that these routes are often seen as easy risk-free climbing which in many cases they are patently not. Regards, --Ismith 21:08, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

It would be nice if somebody could add some photographs of via ferrata kit, and of sites outside the dolomites. --R Pollack 20:10, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

'Personal website about via ferratas in the Dolomites, including geo-tagged pictures and detailed trackmaps' - a nice site and a good resource. Thanks for adding it. Mrslippery 10:44, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Excessive gallery - what's the point?
For some reason (none given) keeps adding images that add nothing to the article and are of poor technical quality as well to the gallery. There is a small gallery to illustrate various vie ferrate and link to commons, which suffices.--Svetovid (talk) 12:38, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Incorrect and misleading. The images, links and text were added over a period of time by a number of contributers. You are attempting to remove them for some reason [none given]. I am correcting your vandalism. Mrslippery (talk) 19:34, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

If Svetovid wants to delete content he should give his reasons here. Not act unilaterally. Mrslippery (talk) 19:36, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Links to commercial sites
There seem to be several links to commercial websites that do not have a place in Wikipedia. They should be removed, and replaced if possible with simple information about the via ferratas involved.

Specifically:

The Mountain Torq website

The Nelson Rocks website

The Torrent Falls website

The Sacred Valley website (Natura Vive)

The High Coast Center website

The Honister Slate Mine website

The Hola Andorra website

The Collets holiday website

The BorderX website

The Aventurs website

I will also remove the Viafer website as it adds nothing that is not already covered in the other french reference sites. Any objections, anyone?

Ismith (talk) 23:21, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

I see that links to Mountain Torq and High Coast Center have reappeared. This is not permitted in Wikipedia. They need to be removed again.

Ismith (talk) 19:33, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

Further commercial links removed. There was also a link to an article about a Canadian via ferrata accessed by helicopter as part of a holiday package. This might well be interesting, but it doesn't belong here - either in the Canada or the USA sections, into both of which it had helpfully been placed.

Ismith (talk) 17:54, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

Is it a via ferrata or not?
In the list of vias by country there are sometimes entries that are not via ferrata at all.

I just noticed one in the UK section, the Elie Chain Walk in Scotland. I'm very familiar with this chain walk, and while it is similar in concept to a via ferrata is isn't a via ferrata. There is no cable, only chains that you hang on to to aid scrambling, and there has never been any notion of using climbing equipment to access it. If you want to judge for yourself take a look at this set on Flickr. I think it should be removed.

Ismith (talk) 14:05, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

Canada
The section in the article dealing with Canada is presently something of an advertisement for several private via ferratas. This has happened repeatedly, and I have on several occasions removed links to commercial sites. At the moment the section needs to be rewritten, not just for the content either, the structure is nonsense. When I get round to it...

Ismith (talk) 17:59, 15 September 2012 (UTC)

Which form of plural?
The article states: "A via ferrata (Italian for "iron road", plural vie ferrate or in English via ferratas)". Can we please agree whether we are using the Italian or the English plural, and then be consistent within the article? For what it's worth my guess is that we should use the English one, "via ferratas" (and "vias" where "ferrata" is omitted) but I'm less worried about which we choose than that the article should be internally consistent. Views please? DBaK (talk) 11:21, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Well, this has hardly attracted frenzied discussion but the only opinion indicated so far is here where another editor likes the Anglicized "via ferratas" as the plural. Any more for any more?? Best wishes DBaK (talk) 10:27, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * strongly support via ferratas, as we are dealing with an anglicised word - the Italian version sounds pretentious and all guidebooks use via ferratas. When I revised the article I thought I changed all the plurals but if I missed some feel free to change.Marqaz (talk) 23:56, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks! DBaK (talk) 21:09, 26 July 2015 (UTC)