Talk:Viola Liuzzo

Unsourced claim that man in picture is George Argyris
On 28 October 2005, someone at the IP address 172.133.175.214 inserted this text into the image description file Image:Viola-liuzzo.jpg:
 * This is a picture of Viola Liuzzo and her second husband George Argyris. The picture of Vi was taken in the late fifties or early sixties and the picture of George was taken in the 40's. The pictures were later put together to look like one photo either by the press or someone in the family. I am the sister of Viola and know it isn't Anthony (Jim) Liuzzo.

Even if this comment is true (it is the only edit to date from that IP address), it violates two of Wikipedia's three content policies, namely Verifiability and No original research. Therefore, I have reverted the edit to the last prior version.

On 11 November 2005, someone at the IP address 65.212.160.76, which had been blocked before for obvious vandalism, changed the name "Anthony" to "George Argyris" in the caption accompanying the image in the Viola Liuzzo article. The edit summary was:
 * I am Viola's oldest daughter Penny. The man in the picture with her is not Anthony but George Argyris, my father.

Even if this were a good-faith edit, it would still violate the Verifiability and No original research policies. Therefore, I changed the name in the caption back.

--Bwiki 04:46, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

White
Is it necessary to say that she was a 'white civil-rights activist'? I think the picture is pretty clear. Allthecoolnamesweretaken 18:09, 4 December 2007 (UTC)


 * What picture!? There are no pictures in this entire article. Speaking of which, why hasn't somebody put one up here yet? 71.205.92.127 (talk) 21:49, 3 December 2008 (UTC)


 * I am reasonably convinced that she was white, but pictures can be deceiving. See, e.g., Walter Francis White, former Secretary of the NAACP.  As noted in the article, he had white skin, blue eyes, and blond hair, but was a negro.  Five of his 32 great-great-great grandparents were black, and the other 27 were white, but under the laws of most Southern states, this would cause him to be classified as a black.  See, e.g., Fla. Stat. s. 1.01(6) (1967) (repealed 1969) (one-eighth or more).John Paul Parks (talk) 16:27, 30 April 2011 (UTC)

Smear Campaign?
I was just curious about the supposed 'smear campaign' by the FBI that is mentioned in the intro. I'm not saying this is untrue or anything, I have no idea. But when I read that bit I wanted to read about it but for some reason it's not in the body of the article. The FBI smear campaign is just thrown out there is the opening and never touched on again. I mean if they really did smear a woman when one of their own informants was there at her murder, I would think that this aspect of the story deserves expounding upon. Does anyone have any more information to add to this and actually make it apart of the story itself? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.166.23.62 (talk) 21:58, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I grew up in the Detroit area, and I remember reading about her murder in the Detroit Free Press at the time. As I recall, there were news stories, either in the newspaper, or elsewhere, suggesting that she took it upon herself to introduce young black men to the experience of having sexual intercourse with a white woman.  At the time, that was an odious insult to level at a white woman and would have caused severe harm to her reputation.John Paul Parks (talk) 16:31, 30 April 2011 (UTC)

Photo needed
Saw that the photo used was removed, not only from the page but from Wikipedia. Does anyone have a usuable photo for the page? Thanks, Randy Kryn (talk) 19:20, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

Hoover defamation
J. Edgar Hoover started a smear campaign against Liuzzo to distract from the fact that one of those connected to the killings was an FBI informant; see http://encyclopediaofalabama.org/face/Article.jsp?id=h-1377 etc. AnonMoos (talk) 12:44, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

No page on Gary Thomas Rowe?
I was searching for a Wikipedia article on Gary Thomas Rowe Jr and was surprised to not find one. There's one on an "alternative" site #Metapedia, which Wiki rules prohibit linking to# but remarkably, it seems, nothing here. Here's a thoughtful take on him: http://jkkelley.org/2011/09/13/the-strange-story-of-gary-thomas-rowe-jr I don't think I'd be as charitable as the author there but anyway I wanted to bring this to the attention of people watching this page, if someone wants to create a page on Rowe it would be obviously relavant to the story. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ssc (talk • contribs) 00:01, 8 December 2012 (UTC)

FBI smear material missing
There is an article in CNN today which talks about an FBI smear campaign. I see an editor above in 2010 also mentioned that such material is missing. It needs to be added to this article (I dont have time now). Apparently the CNN article is based on John Blake's 2004 book "Children of the Movement". --Noleander (talk) 23:03, 28 February 2013 (UTC)
 * It looks like the lead used to contain a sentence about the smear, but it was removed in 2009 . Yikes, what about WP:FIXTHEPROBLEM? --Noleander (talk) 23:07, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Car advertisement
"During this period, the January 15, 1966, edition of the Birmingham News published an ad offering Liuzzo's bullet-ridden car for sale. Asking $3,500, the ad read, "Do you need a crowd-getter? I have a 1963 Oldsmobile two-door in which Mrs. Viola Liuzzo was killed. Bullet holes and everything intact. Ideal to bring in crowds.""

Did this have some effect on the trial? Because it looks like an interesting tidbit that someone could find no other place to put into the article, and stuck it in the trial section solely because it happened at around the same time. 174.77.79.173 (talk) 21:23, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

Emotive language
There are too many emotive references to ordeals, racist scorn, horrific incidents etc. Wikipedia articles needs to be more objective and less obviously POV.Royalcourtier (talk) 06:29, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Amen. Which is why I put the POV tag on the article.John Paul Parks (talk) 04:04, 21 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Modification does not necessarily equal 'emotive' (whatever it is you think you mean by that.)  It is possible to find something objectively horrific, for example. TreebeardTheEnt (talk) 08:12, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Details of privilege
The vague reference to "afforded social privilege and amenities denied to African Americans under the Jim Crow laws" requires some details. What privileges exactly? Jim Crow laws were about segregation, not affording "social privilege and amenities".Royalcourtier (talk) 06:31, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_privilege — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.151.24.161 (talk) 20:16, 31 August 2017 (UTC)

Religious Affiliation, and Memorial services
The description of Liuzzo as a Unitarian Universalist has been tagged for clarification, with the question, "Then why was her funeral held at a Catholic Church?". As noted in the section titled "Michigan", she had begun attending First UU Church of Detroit, and in truth had formally joined the congregation: see her biographical entry at Dictionary of Unitarian & Universalist Biography. I think it is her funeral that needs clarification, rather than her status as a UU. She had become a Roman Catholic when she married her second husband, and I surmise that her requiem at Immaculate Heart of Mary Catholic church was due to her former affiliation with that church; or perhaps her husband was still a member there, and they still thought of her as one of their own. That is speculation, however, which I haven't been able to confirm so obviously can't use in the article. For now, would it be helpful and appropriate to say "former Roman Catholic" in reference to her funeral, since her history as a Roman Catholic, and her later becoming a UU, are both documented?

An open question for me is, how much narrative of her faith history is needed and appropriate here? I have no doubt her work for the NAACP and for the civil rights movement as a whole went hand in hand with her faith journey, but I'm not sure the reference I cited above would be sufficient for that, and I don't have other sources to hand.

Finally, as noted in the biography I reference above, she had a memorial hosted by the NAACP which had twice as many attendees as her requiem mass. I think it would be appropriate to mention that memorial in the article.Josepheh (talk) 18:00, 2 July 2017 (UTC)
 * The template is meant as a request to clarify text that is difficult to understand. The text where the tag was placed is by itself perfectly clear, so it does not belong there. The template is definitely not intended for addressing such issues as why Liuzzo's funeral service was held at a Catholic Church. Therefore I have removed it. --Lambiam 11:01, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Uncited material in need of citations
I am moving the following uncited material from the article to this talk page until it can be properly sourced per WP:V, WP:NOR, WP:CS, WP:PSTS, WP:IRS, etc. To see where in the article each piece of this material was previously located, the relevant diff showing its removal is here. Nightscream (talk) 03:17, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

Alabama mistrial and acquittal
Defense lawyer Matt Murphy quickly attempted to have the case dismissed on the grounds that President Johnson had violated the suspects' civil rights when he named them in his televised announcement. Murphy also indicated he would call Johnson as a witness during the upcoming trial.

On May 3 an all-white jury was selected for Wilkins' trial, with Rowe the key witness. Three days later, Murphy made blatantly racist comments during his final arguments, including calling Liuzzo a "white nigger," in order to sway the jury. The tactic was successful enough that the all-white jury could not come to a decision (voting 10–2 in favor of conviction) and a mistrial was declared. On May 10, the three accused killers were part of a Klan parade which closed with a standing ovation for them.

Another all-white jury was selected on October 20. Before the re-trial got under way, defense attorney Murphy fell asleep while driving an automobile and was killed when his car hit a gasoline truck on August 20. The former mayor of Birmingham, Alabama, Art Hanes, agreed to take over representation for all three defendants one week later. Hanes was a staunch segregationist who served as mayor during the tumultuous 1963 period in which police commissioner Eugene "Bull" Connor used fire hoses on African American protesters. The attorney attacked the credibility of the informant, Rowe, stating that he fabricated information. The two-day trial ended when the empanelled jurors took less than two hours to acquit Wilkins.

Federal civil trial
After all three defendants were convicted of the federal charges, state murder cases proceeded against Eaton and Thomas. Eaton, the only defendant who remained out of jail, died of a heart attack on March 9. Thomas's state murder trial - the final trial - got under way on September 26, 1966. The prosecution built a strong circumstantial case in the trial that included an FBI ballistics expert testifying that the bullet removed from the woman's brain was fired from a revolver owned by Thomas. Two witnesses testified they had seen Wilkins drinking beer at a VFW Hall near Birmingham, 125 miles from the murder scene, an hour or less after Liuzzo was shot. Despite the presence of eight African Americans on the jury, Thomas was acquitted of the state murder charge the following day after just 90 minutes of deliberations. State attorney general Richmond Flowers, Sr. criticized the verdict, deriding the black members of the panel, who had been carefully screened, as "Uncle Toms."

FBI cover-up and leaks
Hoover further insinuated to President Johnson that Liuzzo was a drug addict, that she had sex with Moton, and that her husband was involved with organized crime. The FBI leaked the allegations to the media, and several newspapers repeated the claims. Liuzzo's husband attempted to defend his wife's reputation; his daughter Penny states that the disinformation campaign "took the life right out of him .. he started drinking a lot."

In 1978, investigations revealed that Rowe, the FBI informant, may have been involved in the 16th Street Baptist Church bombing in 1963 where four black girls were killed. In November 1978, a grand jury indicted Rowe for the murder of Liuzzo, but he fought the extradition proceedings against him. In 1980, an FBI file revealed that Rowe had clubbed Freedom Riders and that the FBI had paid his medical bills and given him a $125 bonus.

Legislation and subsequent lawsuits
Civil rights activists and Liuzzo's children believe that Liuzzo's death helped the passing of the 1965 Voting Rights Act, which removed barriers to voting such as literacy tests and poll taxes. President Lyndon B. Johnson also ordered investigation immediately after the death.

On December 28, 1977, the Liuzzo family filed a lawsuit against the FBI, charging that Rowe, as an employee of the FBI, had failed to prevent Liuzzo's death and had in effect conspired in the murder. Then, on July 5, 1979, the American Civil Liberties Union filed another lawsuit on behalf of the family.

Legacy
An episode of the CBS TV series Cold Case, entitled "Wednesday's Women," was loosely based on her case.

In 1991, Liuzzo was honored by the Women of the Southern Christian Leadership Conference with a marker on the highway (Highway 80) where she was murdered in the Ku Klux Klan attack in 1965.

Editing
I am doing extensive editing on the Lede, which is too long and has too much detail on the killers, the trials, and the aftermath. This is supposed to be a bio of Liuzzo. I'm putting the names of the killers in the body of article rather than giving them publicity in the Lede, which is supposed to be a summary of important points. Have also made efforts to organize some of the material which does not relate to her activism and death. Parkwells (talk) 19:06, 16 March 2024 (UTC)