Talk:Waorani people

Five American Missionaries
None of them was with SIL: Nate_Saint was with Mission Aviation Fellowship. Jim Elliot, Ed McCully, Pete Fleming were with Christian Missions in Many Lands. Roger Youderian was from Gospel Missionary Union. See Talk:SIL_International or http://justus.anglican.org/resources/bio/74.html and http://www.plymouthbrethren.org/page.asp?page_id=545 --Jabala

What is the source of the death of the 2 Huaorani aspect of the story?
I have read many accounts of the death of the 5 missionaries, and this is the first one that stated (or at least implied) that somehow the missionaries either were the cause of 2 Huaorani deaths or directly.

I'm trying to find out what the source of this other version is, can anyone help? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 12.34.246.35 (talk • contribs).

Rival's account (2002) states that Dayuma's brother was shot by a missionary (Nate Saint, I think) and died of the wound later. Ill post details soon. --Carwil 20:54, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Original question-asker here.. The book you are using as a source (which I assume is 'Trekking Through History' of 2002) isn't listed in sources below. In that book, which I don't own and have no easy access to, how is the source of the information presented? In other words, in Rival's account, what is her source as to the sequence of events? Having a fun time comparing reports of first hand accounts. Thanks! Once I Make a permanent account, I will be Gryfalia, but am not yet..;-) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 12.34.246.35 (talk • contribs).


 * Rival says
 * [Rachel Saint and Betty Elliott (and 3-year-old child valerie) arrived at Tihueno with Dayuma.] To this day, the Huaorani trace the legitimate presence of evangelical missionaries within their communities to the lifelong relationship between Dayuma, the Huaorani woman who had lived for many years with the cohuori [outsiders]—and hendce taken for dead—and the North American missionary Rachel Saint, a relationship sealed, as they see it, in the death of their two brothers. Dayuma's brother speared Rachel's brother to death and was injured by a bullet Rachel's brother shot before dying. He died from the injury about a month later. (Rival 2002:158)--Carwil 18:24, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

The article cites "(Saint, 2005)" as a reference for the tribe's violence, but there is no such reference in the list below. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Feline1 (talk • contribs).


 * There's discussion of this in Operation Auca as well (see the Attack section). --Spangineerws (háblame)  19:17, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Axxn 11:31, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Taromenane and Onamenane are Tucanoan tribes, by nomeans related to Huao. Nothing is known about Huinatare. This was told by the contacted Tagaeri in 1990s. There have been no peaceful contacts with the Taromenane and nobody knows which language they speak. Then how you can say that Taromenane are Huao?

Axxn 11:34, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
SIL is now perpetuating ethnic cleansing of Huao. Although it is nice to convert as many as they can, destroying a culture should not be tolerated. It takes just one Rachel Saint to destroy a culture. But a destroyed culture can't be rebuilt by one million Rachel Saints.
 * Well said, Axxn. I've visited the Oriente and met some Quechua, and I've read Jone Kane, Randy Smith, Yost, and other accounts. I haven't read Colby yet (don't know if my blood pressure could take it now.) This type of cultural destruction was one factor in past calls for a moratorium on foreign missionaries. Most evangelical groups have resisted all such calls.


 * I've also read a lot about the impact of the oil industry and its very sloppy pactices. This has compounded the destructive pressures on rainforest native peoples. I was just putting a few bits about this into the Petroecuador stub page, then I remembered this whole subject and came over here.

Yea I'm sure it would be so much better for Huaorani if they were again living lawlessly and spearing each other at will. I mean seriously going back to living like a pack of animals would probably be better, right leftist fanatics? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.109.151.197 (talk) 16:11, 19 July 2009 (UTC)


 * If I get some free time I should check if I have any further sources to add on this page, although on first glance this looks very well referenced.Birdbrainscan 18:03, 4 March 2007 (UTC)


 * You're aware, I suppose, that SIL hasn't been in Ecuador since the early 1980s? And that Rachel Saint is long dead?  How then are these people "perpetuating ethnic cleansing of Huao", particularly "now"?? Mcswell (talk) 03:06, 6 April 2009 (UTC)


 * I believe that the Christian missionaries saved the Huao from being obliterated by the Ecuador military. The Huao are now able to function as reasonable ordinary useful citizens.  Doesn't sound like "ethnic cleansing" to me.  Just sayin . . . Santamoly (talk) 05:48, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

This isn't a forum to parade your opinions and biases folks, no matter how much you hate "missionaries". Please read the talk page guidelines, "The purpose of an article's talk page is to provide space for editors to discuss changes to its associated article or project page. Article talk pages should not be used by editors as platforms for their personal views on a subject." Philip72 (talk) 00:30, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

Sources for 'contribut[ing] to the national good'
I went looking for a cite for this statement. I found several other pages that include this text nearly verbatim, and in particular I found a longer text in which these lines are contained. That site is anthropology.net. Unfortunately, (a) their longer text does not give a source for this statement, and (b) our article copies basically verbatim from their article, without sourcing them.

I think this needs to be cleaned up, both to give a proper citation for the material, and to avoid a charge of plagiarism of the anthropology.net text (even if they are a Wiki possibly under a GFDL, we still need to cite them!)Birdbrainscan 18:11, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Page move - Waodani vs. Huaorani
I just moved the talk page from Talk:Huaorani to here, to agree with the (apparently undiscussed) move of the article itself. While Waodani is the more common term in evangelical circles, I believe that Huaorani is the preferred term in academic ones, and thus I don't agree with the page move. I'm willing to be convinced, however. Please give rationale for preferring Waodani over Huaorani. --Spangineerws (háblame)  15:28, 8 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree it should be renamed back to Huaorani. Google Scholar hit counts:

I rest my case.Birdbrainscan (talk) 01:41, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Huaorani: 1,100
 * Waorani: 627
 * Waodani: 18
 * I just moved both the article and talk page back to Huaorani. --Spangineerws (háblame)  02:34, 23 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Since you find more hits for Deutsch than for German, shouldn't you move the English wikipedia article on the German language to Deutsch? Huaorani is a Spanish spelling, Waodani/ Waorani is an English spelling.  IMHO, Huaorani is fine for the Spanish wikipedia, but Waodani or Waorani would be more appropriate for the English wikipedia.  Sigh...


 * BTW, in case someone says the native spelling should be used instead, that's waod&atilde;di. Mcswell (talk) 03:13, 6 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Interesting&mdash;any ideas then why scholars like Laura Rival refer to them as the Huaorani in books written in English? --Spangineerws (háblame)  04:05, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Actual name
The actual name for this people group is Waodani, not Huorani. --Tribe12 (talk) 16:27, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Would the book written by Joe Kane called, 'Savages,' be a good reference? He lived with the Huaorani in 1996 for I believe three months. Mylittlezach (talk) 21:37, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

Picture of dancing tribe
It seems to me that the picture about the "Huaorani ceremony" is from other indigenous group. Huaorani do not dress with colorful straps neither do they paint their faces red. The body paint (i.e. tattoo-like patterns on thighs and arms) the folks in the picture are using is not usually seen in Huaorani people. Huaorani men never use such colorful bands around their waist; instead, they use a string of cotton to hold their penises. I recommend changing this picture to something more representative of their culture.Daimi (talk) 15:46, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

Recent radical changes
The article was completely re-written on June 15, 2010 by another editor. The new version A) is poorly referenced (once, for the whole articl), B) shows a narrow view of the subject, and C) removes a lot of detail that enriched the earlier article. Attempted restorations of the earlier version were turned back, possibly by the aforementioned user under different names. While this may represent vandalism, I would like to think that it is merely the work of an inexperienced and probably biased editor. While the version previous to the re-write wasn't perfect, it was clearly superior to what we have been left with. Unless someone has strong and reasonable objections, I will revert the article to an earlier version, perhaps making a few edits myself to try to improve it. If edit warring over the article continues, I will seek to have offending users blocked, or the page protected. DoctorEric (talk) 21:43, 29 June 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree, and have reverted to that version. I hope interested parties can work to incorporate new material, but wholesale replacement without discussion was unwarranted. --Spangineerws  (háblame)  22:44, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 18:22, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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Dubious
I just read Through Gates of Splendor, and it doesn't mention that the photographs were why the Waorani attacked the missionaries. This was the first edition, published shortly after Operation Auca, so it might have been determined since then that the photos were the reason, but someone more familiar with this topic should probably check. 184.21.204.5 (talk) 19:19, 25 January 2023 (UTC)


 * (I wrote the above comment) I have since read Jungle Pilot as well, and it also does not mention the photographs as the reason for the attacks. 206.204.236.102 (talk) 23:01, 14 October 2023 (UTC)