Talk:Western (genre)/Archive 2

Conquest of wilderness was not often the theme of cowboy movies.
''The Western genre, particularly in films, often portrays the conquest of the wilderness and the subordination of nature in the name of civilization or the confiscation of the territorial rights of the original inhabitants of the frontier. '' Actually the vast majority of western or cowboy movies usually had a hero with one or two side-kicks (one comic) who were protecting the weak, righting a wrong or solving a crime. The bad guy usually lived in town and plotted to steal: cattle, land, a mine, or plain money from an older man or a young pretty woman. A search for vengeance was the other main plot. Nitpyck (talk) 05:35, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * The article is not in quality shape, and the passage you're referencing is uncited. It should be modified.  I don't know if your argument is correct, though... do we know of any references that could explain the themes of a Western? Erik (talk &#124; contribs) 11:43, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Don't know about references but as a child of the 50s I saw hundreds of them - maybe thousands. Back then they were all called cowboy movies and the good guy drifted into town and the bad guy quite often wore a suit. In these films the good guy would occasionally get wounded - always in the shoulder. The bad guy would either take one in the hand when the good guy shot the gun out of his hand; or if it was a serious wound he took one in the stomach (and fell off a porch roof or a huge rock). Nitpyck (talk) 04:42, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Views of Native Americans
Is there such a thing as Category:Westerns that are sympathetic to Native Americans? If so, I'd like to nominate "Broken Arrow" and maybe "Duel At Diablo". I bet there's at least a dozen more.

COI disclaimer: I myself am sympathetic to both sides in the "Cowboys vs. Indians" conflict. I think it was a good idea for "civilized men" to settle in the West, but I don't think the way they drove out (decimated?) the Native Americans was right. The largely Christian settlers brought a new spiritual dimension to America, but the "Indians" who were already there had (and still have) a valid spirituality that can inform even modern Christianity (concern for nature, for example).

That said, is there any point in making a new category, and any way to do it without bias? --Uncle Ed (talk) 16:46, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

(untitled)
"Influences" section "Many Western films after the mid-1950s were influenced by the Japanese samurai films of Akira Kurosawa. For instance The Magnificent Seven was a remake of Kurosawa's Seven Samurai, and A Fistful of Dollars was a remake of Kurosawa's Yojimbo, which itself was inspired by Red Harvest, an American detective novel by Dashiell Hammett. Kurosawa was influenced by American Westerns and was a fan of the genre, most especially John Ford." I find this to be a rather dubious claim. This is the supposed cited article. I found nothing to support this claim. http://archive.sensesofcinema.com/contents/cteq/00/9/kurosawa.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by Razarax (talk • contribs) 17:52, 3 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Which part of the claim did you find unsupported? The article clearly mentions Kurosawa's reverence for Ford's work. (If that's not enough, Kurosawa wore those little glasses of his to emulate Ford.) I did not insert that passage into the article or source it, but if you like I can supply corroborating sources for whichever claim you find dubious. The only part I find dubious is the claim that Red Desert inspired Yojimbo, as there seems to be some dispute on that (Kurosawa said he was inspired by a different Dashiell Hammett book).Everybodyever (talk) 20:06, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Types of westerns listed in the article
The list of types of westerns (classic western, acid western, contemporary western, etc.) seems arbitrary and lopsided to me. It seems to skew toward discussion of quirky (and relatively recent) riffs on the genre while it glosses over types of westerns produced in Hollywood in the 30s through 50s that helped to define the genre's conventions and preoccupations. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the bulk of American westerns were produced then.

Perhaps a discussion of other subtypes or of major directors (Anthony Mann, Delmer Daves, John Sturges, William Wellman, etc.) and their contributions is in order...? And maybe some mention of genre-expanding movies by big-name directors (High Noon, Johnny Guitar, Sergeant Rutledge)? The article's current discussion of the evolution of the western protagonist is grossly oversimplifying and could be quite a bit more nuanced. Everybodyever (talk) 20:20, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

'Criticism" section?
Why is there no criticism section elaborating on the Western being an attempt to romanticize the ethnic cleansing committed by the settlers against the indigenous population? &#9798; CUSH &#9798; 15:52, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Because no one has created such a section. Feel free to do so.  However, be careful of WP:NPOV and WP:OR. Monkeyzpop (talk) 21:24, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Space Western/science fiction Western
I edited this article to differentiate between these two related subgenres and to clarify examples of each. The appropriate definitions/references can be found on each genre page. Hopefully this is acceptable to everyone! Savagediana (talk) 01:15, 9 July 2011 (UTC)

Is radio a "visual art"??
English is not my first language. Would you really class radio as a "visual art" as this article does in the first sentence? -- 92.226.93.250 (talk) 13:08, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Mad Max is not a western movie
"An offshoot of the Western genre is the "post-apocalyptic" Western, in which a future society, struggling to rebuild after a major catastrophe, is portrayed in a manner very similar to the 19th century frontier. Examples include... Mad Max series." Unless this can be cited it should go. Some people with Mohawk haircuts does not make a film a western. Nitpyck (talk) 07:22, 6 August 2012 (UTC)

WorldCat Genres
Maximilianklein (talk) 00:02, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

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Borsch Western / Red Western- Soviet films
I think this film should be added to the list, alongside Soviet Westerns such as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostern https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Sun_of_the_Desert — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:18E8:2:28DD:F000:0:0:227 (talk) 01:12, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

add languages links
make wikidata (Q21590660)=(Q172980)

Thanks

31.154.8.98 (talk) 10:27, 13 September 2016 (UTC)

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Proposed merge with Gimmick weapon
Page appears to be non-notable by itself but contains facts about Westerns. Information could potentially be merged with the article on Westerns. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 15:33, 16 September 2017 (UTC)

Red Dead Redemption
This article could benefit greatly from acknowledging the Red Dead Redemption video game maybe? Any thoughts? --Scottymoze (talk) 05:02, 4 June 2010 (UTC)


 * A sentence or two about it would be fair. It might be good to mention how much of it is a pastiche, and how much is original.73mmmm (talk) 22:38, 6 January 2018 (UTC)