Talk:Westland Sea King/Archive 1

Merge
Support No reason for Westland Sea King ASaC7 to be a separate article. - Emt147 Burninate!  06:04, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Support You either have a page for each variant (which would be stupid) or not MilborneOne 20:09, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

Support For same reason as MilborneOne - consistency Dowlingm 05:17, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Support concur with above reasons ThreeBlindMice 23:22, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Talk page from Westland Sea King ASaC7
Merge taking place. SilkTork 12:03, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Merge
No reason for this to be a separate article. - Emt147 Burninate!  06:03, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

I agree, should be merged. Chwyatt 10:56, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Osprey is an option for AEW on the cvf class? Is that a joke?!

was considered early on, but never a serious contender Chwyatt 10:56, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

counter there's a difference between Westland and Sikorsky Sea King. to top it all, Westland bought the plans from Sikorsky, so I think that Westland and Sikorsky need different pages BAFer 14:45, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Merged
I've merged the two articles as requested. I have done minimal editing to blend the two articles, so editing will now be needed. Go for it! SilkTork 12:09, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Westland HC4 Commando in British service
Folks, In the US there is a lot of confusion when they read the word "Marines" in other nations armed forces. The US Marines are unique in that it is it own self contained military with the exception of warships and medical department -- ie it has its own air force, artillery, armour. Other nations have what are called naval infantry which can be army of a separate marine force (ie the French Marines are army units of all volunteers who then by law can serve outside France -- ie the only infantry force the French Navy have are like our SEALs). And the British Royal Marine are actually a lot like the US Army Rangers and many refer to them as Royal Marine Commandos. Hope this clears up the confusion. Jack --Jackehammond (talk) 16:05, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Westland HC4 Commando in British service
Folks, In the US there is a lot of confusion when they read the word "Marines" in other nations armed forces. The US Marines are unique in that it is it own self contained military with the exception of warships and medical department -- ie it has its own air force, artillery, armour. Other nations have what are called naval infantry which can be army of a separate marine force (ie the French Marines are army units of all volunteers who then by law can serve outside France when France had a draft -- ie the only infantry force the French Navy have are like our SEALs). And the British Royal Marine are actually a lot like the US Army Rangers and many refer to them as Royal Marine Commandos and they have no pilots or air unit. The Royal Navy or the British Army provides the pilots and the aircraft. Hope this clears up the confusion. Jack --Jackehammond (talk) 16:06, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

344 ?
Can someone explain where that number came from ? Variants do not match

Author name for Armistead source
I've used the 2nd item in this page's Bibliography section for a source in wiktionary (entry for FAETUPAC), but from looking at the preview on Google Books it looks like it was written by one author called Edwin Leigh Armistead. This article has that name as being two authors: Is there a particular reason for that? If someone happens to know that this is a collective pseudonym like Grant Naylor then I'll update my wiktionary citation, otherwise this article's Bibliography should be fixed (along with the references to "Armistead and Armistead"). --Qef (talk) 22:03, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Armistead, Leigh and Edwin Armistead. Awacs and Hawkeyes: The Complete History of Airborne Early Warning Aircraft. St Paul, Minnesota: Zenith Imprint, 2002. ISBN 0-7603-1140-4.

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Germany - It's not been decided yet by which helicopter the Sea King is replaced.
"Langfristig wird der „Sea King“ durch den Marinehubschrauber 90 (MH 90) oder den Marinehubschrauber 92 (MH 92) ersetzt."

So, please, if you've got any info on whether the helicopter will be replaced by the NH90/MH90 let us know. However, don't simply revert it to something the source doesn't even say. --Dharion (talk) 20:24, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
 * That source is quite clear about what the selection was down to at that point. Further onto that, however, is that the procurement choice between the S-92 and the NH90 has been terminated - Instead, existing contracts for the NH90 have been reorganized to cover the role, some that were formerly destined for land-based service are to be built as maritime helicopters and used to perform the Sea King's mission. The choice has been closed down to the one option for some time now; the other option has been eliminated due to budget cuts, they're just using what's already on order anyway. Kyteto (talk) 18:06, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Rename to Westland Sea King Commando?
The article title and scope here has the name Westland Sea King, which is reasonable. An alternative name might include the "WS-61" numbering too.

One editor is now pushing  to restore "Commando" in the lead name of the infobox. This is incorrect: not all Sea Kings were Westlands, not all Westland Sea Kings were Commandos. To use the name of just one sub-variant in the infobox lead position is to imply (as is frequently misunderstood, a misunderstanding we could usefully help to clean up) that ''all' Westland Sea Kings were Commandos. The Commando is a different version, lengthened and obviously distinguishable in photos. Only about a sixth of Westland production were Commandos.

If The Wisdom of Wikipedia is now that all Westland Sea Kings were Commandos, should the whole article now be renamed for consistency? Andy Dingley (talk) 10:55, 27 October 2016 (UTC)


 * I've no issue with adding renaming the article Westland WS-61 Sea King, assuming that's a good faith suggestion and not a red herring. However, WS-61 is, to my knowledge, primarily a company name, and so may not be considered by some to be part or the common name. Designations are allowed in aircraft article titles per WP:AIR/NC naming conventions, primarily for countries with military aircraft designations such as Canada and the US, which are quite common.


 * As to adding Commando to the infobox title, I know of no project guideline (WPAIR or Wikipedia) that forbids or requires variants in the infobox title. It is done in a number of aircraft articles, including Airbus airliner articles such as Airbus A320 family. If there is a Wiki-wide guideline against the practice, I've no issue with complying with it. If not, then it's a case by case issue, and I'll follow the clear consensus of other editors here (ie, more than just the OP). - BilCat (talk) 11:08, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
 * The Airbus title is firstly an article clearly labelled as being a "family" and secondly it splits the multiple variants with slashes: it is obviously a list.
 * In this case, "Commando" is simply added as a suffix. There is nothing in the title box to indicate that this only applies to a small group within it. That is misleading. Andy Dingley (talk) 11:23, 27 October 2016 (UTC)


 * The fact that it's on a separate line would be a major clue to me, but I do accept that some of Wikipedia's readership may not be intelligent enough to get that sort of nuance. Still, we don't write solely for the lowest common denominator, so I think most people can figure it out. - BilCat (talk) 11:35, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
 * You can't rely on whitespace for semantics (and this is specifically forbidden in any sensible web design or accessibility guide, including WP's MOS). Is it on another line because there was markup to do it specifically, or simply because a long line wrapped? Andy Dingley (talk) 11:40, 27 October 2016 (UTC)


 * Where in the MOS is this "specifically forbidden"? I've already stated I'd abide by it if it's against Wikipedia's guidelines, which includes the MOS. I'm just waiting to see it. - BilCat (talk) 11:46, 27 October 2016 (UTC)


 * The Commando was originally a Sea King optimised for the task of trans-shipping stores from and to ship and shore for use with the Fearless class amphibious assault vessels, hence the deletion of the Sea King side pontoons in early Commando versions. The Commando had a heavier lift capability than the Wessex which was being used previously. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.172.235 (talk) 11:11, 10 November 2018 (UTC)

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 * Pakistan Naval Air Arm Westland Sea King.jpg