Talk:Wild Tales (film)

Film's nationality
recently changed the film's nationality from Argentine to Argentine-Spanish. While it's true and the article does mention that it is a co-production between Argentina and Spain both in the infobox and in "Production"'s third paragraph, WP:FILMLEAD requires some procedures. It says: "If the film's nationality is singularly defined by reliable sources (e.g., being called an American film), it should be identified in the opening sentence. If the nationality is not singular, cover the different national interests later in the lead section". So, almost all reliable sources call it an Argentine film without no mention to Spain at all (click at random at any of the sources in the article and you'll see it); also, even awards from Spain like Goya and Forqué Awards kind of recognize it as non-Spanish film when they qualify it as "Iberoamerican" and "Latin-American", respectively. I'd like to hear Asqueladd and fellow Wikipedians instance on it. Cheers, Gabriel Yuji (talk) 02:38, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
 * If most sources consider it an Argentine film, then we should go with that in the first sentence, even if it's actually a co-production. We can mention its co-production status later in the lead. —El Millo (talk) 03:50, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't feel that's the spirit in MOS:FILM. which correct me if I am wrong is: do not repeat country details in two places in the lead, and if production details vis-à-vis countries are too messy for the opening statement you can always move them to a place later it the lead leaving the opening statement blank from country adjectives. I don't get that being deliberatedly incomplete when we have quality sources stating reality is more complex than a singular country of production (we can certainly affirm that this film is an Argentine-Spain co-production without committing to any original research) and then ammending your initial statement later in the lead is the way to go. If the film's nationality is singularly defined by reliable sources the film's nationality is not singularly defined as such by plenty of sources going into the details of the production. So, the way I see it, instead of the current revision we can move the country details to a place later in the lead leaving the opening statement blank from the "nationality", but pulling your proposal is not in the spirit of the rule like at all. even awards from Spain like Goya and Forqué Awards kind of recognize it as non-Spanish film Excuse me? If the film were not considered partially "Spanish-produced" by those awards the film would not qualify for any non-Americas-specific category in those awards (which is not the case), but that's besides the point: it's not like we depend on a consideration from certain awards to assert the co-production status, really.--Asqueladd (talk) 07:01, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
 * First, you're wrong about the award qualifying procedure. Second, I've just mentioned them because they are reliable sources. Third, the co-production status is not under discussion. I've said from the start it's clear a co-production and it's was already sourced and treated like that in the article, except for the opening sentence because of MOS:FILM. Anyway, rewrote it after other users commentaries. Gabriel Yuji (talk) 04:15, 19 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Looks good - thanks for doing that.  Lugnuts  Fire Walk with Me 13:36, 19 January 2022 (UTC)


 * The production section states that the budget is 70/30 from Argentina/Spain, and that's sourced back to the Hollywood Reporter article. But it's clearly a film set and shot in Argentina, with an Argentine director and cast. Probably should be just Argentina in the lead, or use the term "international co-production" instead of listing more than one country. I'll drop a note at WT:FILM for more input before I book us all onto the same plane...  Lugnuts  Fire Walk with Me 13:59, 18 January 2022 (UTC)


 * I think it would be consistent with the guidelines to remove the countries from the opening sentence. Two of our most eminent sources (the BFI and the Lumiere database) regard it to be a joint production between two countries. One of the countries may well be a "junior" partner but that is probably true of most international co-productions and is not our call to make. Betty Logan (talk) 15:57, 18 January 2022 (UTC)


 * I also endorse removing the countries, and I would suggest instead to add language. I feel like the idea of having nationality in the opening sentence is to indicate what kind of film it is (like why we include genre when possible). Nationality generally tends to imply language, like French films will be French-language. So perhaps here we can call it a "Spanish-language... film" upfront and explain the contributions of Spain and Argentina later in the lead section? Erik (talk &#124; contrib) (ping me) 18:59, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
 * EDIT: To use an example, Amour (2012 film) is French-language while three countries co-produced. Erik (talk &#124; contrib) (ping me) 19:03, 18 January 2022 (UTC)