Talk:William Cicero Allen

Photo
The photo added to the infobox is from a 1952 newspaper and, therefore, is prohibited under copyright. Assuming it will soon be nominated for deletion by a bot, I will look for a pre-1927 photo. I found one from 1930, so getting close. In the meantime, if someone else finds a usable photo, please replace the copyright vio image. Thanks, Rublamb (talk) 15:57, 10 November 2023 (UTC)


 * Is there an aspect of the non-free use rationale included with the current image that you expect will be rejected? I understand it is generally accepted for images of now-deceased people. Of course, any available free-use image would be better. —ADavidB 05:51, 11 November 2023 (UTC)
 * The copyright of a photo is with the photographer and publisher, not the subject of the photo. Therefore, whether or not the subject of the photo is deceased does not matter. This page from WikiCommons does a good job of explaining copyright and public domain. Basically, 1928 is the magic date for items in published/copyrighted sources. Sometimes images can be used under fair use; however, newspapers are always subject to copyright. My advice is to always add images through WikiCommons because the process there helps you evaluate copyright. Rublamb (talk) 13:21, 11 November 2023 (UTC)

Scotland Neck Military Academy
I am moving the following discussion from User talk:FloridaArmy as it is about this article. Rublamb (talk) 11 November 2023 (UTC)


 * One other thought: I am not convinced William Cicero Allen established Scotland Neck Military Academy. The military academy there seems to date to 1809? Did he re-establish it? Establish the girls academy? See Draft:Vine Hill Academy. FloridaArmy (talk) 17:14, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I will take a look. I am working on Lillian Day (Draft:Lillian Day) right now. Rublamb (talk) 17:22, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * The first mention of "Scotland Neck Military Academy" in Newspapers.com is in 1891. Looking at footnote #5 in Draft:Vine Hill Academy, page 359 lists them both as "accepted schools" so they appear to be unrelated (search for "Scotland Neck").  S0091 (talk) 17:37, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Interesting. Thanks to you both for having a look! Two military academies in Scotland Neck? Seems hard to believe.. And neither mentioned in our entry on the area.. So many questions still to answer.. I have clearing my list of done drafts and archiving stuff from this page on my to-do list.. You could consider a super long talk page a tribute to.. (forgetful moment but I assume y'all know who I al talking about..) FloridaArmy (talk) 17:44, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I was thinking of the legendary David Goodman a.k.a. User:DGG. I know dealing with me was exhausting for him but I hope he's smiling wherever he is! FloridaArmy (talk) 18:21, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Doing a google I find only sources for it starting in 1891 and a newspapers.com search also has the earliest hit for 1891. this is the oldest hot for "Scotland Neck Military Academy". There appear to be references to other Academies at Scotland Neck before that. this would back the 1891 founding. KylieTastic (talk) 17:39, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * And this published in 1893 says its beginning its third year. S0091 (talk) 17:46, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I am see references to Vine Hill as "Vine Hill Female Academy" in 1894 (i.e. "there are two schools Vine Hill Female Academy and Scotland Neck Military Academy.") S0091 (talk) 17:53, 10 November 2023 (UTC)
 * We have yet to find a source that says he founded the school. None of the ads I found say that. aAlso, if it was his school, did it close when he left? I didn't find articles indicating that it closed, but also no ads after he left. I think for now, it is best to remove that content from the article. I am going to copy this discussion to the article's talk page for future reference. Rublamb (talk) 00:42, 11 November 2023 (UTC)
 * This source about the Scotland Neck Historic District includes a paragraph on SNMA that says it closed less than three years after opening in 1891. Vine Hill Male Academy re-opened there for a few years, then the structure served as storage space before converting to apartments. —ADavidB 06:14, 11 November 2023 (UTC)
 * That's a good find. However, the evidence that he founded the school and left when it closed or because it closed is still guesswork. However, it looks like there might be enough to creatae a short article on the school itself. Rublamb (talk) 13:12, 11 November 2023 (UTC)