Talk:William McIntosh

Permission request
Request for use of copyright protected material sent to Carole E. Scott


 * Vern Reisenleiter 20:08, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

Received

Original Message Subject: Re: Article on William McIntosh Date:   Mon, 8 Aug 2005 20:27:06 -0700 (PDT) Hi

I am familiar with Wikipedia. In face, I used it today. I had thought of getting involved with it myself, but have not done so. You can use my McIntosh material.

Carole Scott


 * Vern Reisenleiter 17:24, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Hidden reference
Article contains a hidden reference on McIntosh and Weatherford. On order from library. ayyyyyyyyeeee sexxxxyyyyyyyy ladyyy wop wopwop oppa gangnaam style


 * Vern Reisenleiter 21:07, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

McIntosh's father
In my reading, the elder William McIntosh hailed from and returned to Scotland, not Savannah. There was another William McIntosh who lived in Savannah as a contemporary of the subject of this article, but he was a nephew of our subject's father, hence our subject's cousin. Our author confused the two identically named men (which is hardly surprising.) Documentation is in Michael D. Green, The Politics of Indian Removal (Lincoln, Neb., 1982). -- Alarob 00:25, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Point of Reference: William McIntosh and his Brother-In-Law, Lachlan McGillvary, came to America around the same time (maybe in the 1730's), and for a time lived near McIntosh Bluff, north of present day Mobile, Alabama. (Before the American Revolution Georgia included much of Alabama and Mississippi.) (Mobile itself dates even earlier, to the French period, in the early 1700's)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.240.2.125 (talk) 20:36, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

Critique
The article seems concerned with relatively trivial events in McIntosh's life while ignoring the major facts, both positive and negative. In no particular order, here are key points about William McIntosh:
 * McIntosh was evidently a talented orator and diplomat.
 * McIntosh and the law menders helped start the Creek War (which was not an Upper Creek rebellion, as the article currently states). When the U.S. became involved, he fought alongside Andrew Jackson's Tennessee militia.
 * He was a wealthy planter, slaveowner, businessman, and proprietor of the Indian Springs resort hotel.
 * McIntosh was key to bringing missionary educators into the Creek Nation.
 * McIntosh and Creek agent (and former Georgia governor) David Mitchell profited hugely off the federal annuity to the Creek Nation, i.e., they looted the national treasury. (Pres. Madison fired Mitchell.)
 * His wealth and charisma allowed him to form a political patronage network that threatened the authority of the principal chiefs and encouraged whites to treat with him as a national leader.
 * McIntosh promoted Georgia's expansionist aims. The Cherokee Council exposed McIntosh's attempt to bribe members in order to get a land cession.
 * He was celebrated as an exemplar of the "civilized" Indian and toasted in white society.
 * He was a formidable warrior and evidently quite charismatic.
 * He was first cousin of Georgia Gov. George Troup, and on familiar terms with John Quincy Adams, Andrew Jackson, and other prominent Americans.
 * McIntosh was a frequent practitioner of treaty fraud, notably in 1821 and 1825, and earned tens of thousands of dollars in bribes.
 * His corrupt practices led the Creek National Council to expel him and his son in disgrace.
 * His death incited a controversy that involved the U.S. Congress and national press.
 * White writers continued to produce eulogistic literature about him for more than a century, some of it quite fanciful. Often they wrote about him in racist terms, ascribing his accomplishments to his white ancestry.
 * The factionalism he introduced into Creek politics continued to influence the Nation's affairs for a long time afterward -- arguably even after removal to Indian Territory.

He's a great subject for biography, but we haven't even begun to tell his story properly. I'll contribute as I can. -- Alarob 01:08, 20 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Agree, much still needs to be done. In terms of how he was written about, each ancestral group wants to make its own claims of greatness. I've seen similar articles with European Americans having claimed their ancestry made a particular person what he was. Parkwells (talk) 16:22, 11 September 2011 (UTC)

Upper/Lower Creeks
states that McIntosh was a chief of the Lower Creeks; this article currently includes him with the Upper Creeks. Which is it? I'm working on an article about McIntosh Reserve, and I would like to have more information about its history. Thanks, Aylad (talk) 03:35, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

Note transferred from article to this page
I found this note at the bottom of the article where it didn't seem to fit very well. It could be good for something, so I will put it here.

“INIDANS Chester McIntosh Joe Lewis McIntosh Charlie McIntosh Harold McIntosh Gertie McIntosh Leonard McIntosh”

— Bob Burkhardt (talk) 17:18, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

1820 case of illegal African slaves
David Brydie Mitchell, US Indian agent to the Creek, was implicated in the smuggling of illegal African slaves. But, the Royce article does not appear to implicate William McIntosh, the Creek chief. Two other McIntosh men are noted, William J. McIntosh and McQueen McIntosh, who had appointments at the port and customs. Neither is the Creek chief.Parkwells (talk) 21:42, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 10:41, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Mother's name
Please double-check this edit. Staszek Lem (talk) 00:57, 8 November 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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