Talk:Women in medicine

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Peer reviewers: Mahlberg333.

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Morgang331. Peer reviewers: Tristencollins, Morgang331, Hawk5002.

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Frontegasauce.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 13:07, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Plans and needs
Plans and needs for the article Other ideas? --Lquilter (talk) 22:00, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
 * History of laws and trends around the world restriction women's access to medical education and working as medical professionals; pathbreaking women physicians Yoshioka Yayoi, Elizabeth Blackwell, etc.)
 * Women working in allied health professions; traditional female practices of medicine (midwifery)
 * Sociology within modern-day medical professions: glass ceiling for management; specialty distinctions (surgery versus family practice)
 * Restrictions on male/female relations with patients (for example, religious restrictions affecting women's access to male patients and male access to female patients; this has a significant impact on healthcare for women where women's access to medical professions is limited)
 * women's medical education - struggle to get into medical colleges; setting up separate women's medical colleges


 * I'd prefer if the historical information be moved into History of women in medicine and the current information (from Women in medicine and Men in nursing) be moved into Gender disparities in medicine. JCDenton2052 (talk) 11:49, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

I find this article highly US-centric, particularly the section reflecting 20th century experiences. Also, the ground-breaking struggles and achievements of women in the 19th century in entering medicine (notably in the UK) is utterly lacking with, again, the exception of the American Blackwell. Not a balanced picture and not up to Wikipedia's usual standards. Englishbriar (talk) 03:16, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

Possible link to "Women in Medicine" items on “Himetop – The History of medicine topographical database”
I suggest that somebody, interested in this page, could insert an external link to the following page describing, with pictures, some notable "women in medicine"’s memories: http://himetop.wikidot.com/system:page-tags/tag/women-in-medicine

I don’t do it myself because I’m also an Administrator of this site (Himetop) and it could be a violation of the Wikipedia Conflict of Interest policy. Thanks for your attention.

Luca Borghi (talk) 14:45, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Reflist issue Fixing style/layout errors
- need help with coding issue - added Reflist template but message at very bottom of page still appears asking for Reflist tag to be placed. Thanks. - AnakngAraw (talk) 19:17, 10 November 2013 (UTC)
 * The problem was that the page had a tag after the, in the external links section.  The reflist only looks for tags before it in the article, not after.  I removed the tag, and the problem is fixed.  Howicus (Did I mess up?) 19:23, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

Women doctors from India
Information about notable Indian medical doctors can be added in this article. -- Abhijeet Safai (talk) 07:33, 23 September 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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I have just modified 4 external links on Women in medicine. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20151016090221/http://lib-nt2.hkbu.edu.hk/cil-image/theses/abstracts/b15564174a.pdf to http://lib-nt2.hkbu.edu.hk/cil-image/theses/abstracts/b15564174a.pdf
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160303200216/http://www.womensmemorial.org/H&C/History/historypr.html to http://www.womensmemorial.org/H&C/History/historypr.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150704171404/http://www.enel.gob.ni/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=317:concepcion-palacios-herrera-1893-1981-primera-medica&catid=35:biografias-heroes-nacionales&Itemid=65 to http://www.enel.gob.ni/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=317:concepcion-palacios-herrera-1893-1981-primera-medica&catid=35:biografias-heroes-nacionales&Itemid=65
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150707154213/http://archives.ith.sinica.edu.tw/collections_con2_en.php?no=130 to http://archives.ith.sinica.edu.tw/collections_con2_en.php?no=130

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Education Roles
I've added some data in regards to women holding positions of power/authority within medical school. These positions include faculty and chair positions, in order to display the gender disparity that is very much prevalent in this professional field. I am working on finding more information on how gender affects educational opportunities within medicine as well. Frontegasauce (talk) 23:25, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi Frontegasauce. Thank you for the contribution. Could you please correct the mass noun modifier incorrectly applied to a count noun referring to women in leadership positions at Modern medicine? You can see Mass noun and Count noun for clarification. Jagrif02 (talk) 16:27, 28 September 2017 (UTC)


 * , maybe you can just WP:Be Bold, here, and fix what you think is appropriate to fix. --Lquilter (talk) 19:33, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks ; you are so right. Just now however, I"m hoping to encourage this student writer in my course to follow up - better than me fixing things.Jagrif02 (talk) 19:36, 3 October 2017 (UTC)


 * Ah -- got it. I didn't realize you were the teacher. (-: Sorry about that. --Lquilter (talk) 10:37, 6 October 2017 (UTC)


 * Hi Jagrif02. I don't know how I missed your comment until just now. I looked into count and mass nouns, and I believe I corrected the mistake you were talking about! Frontegasauce (talk) 04:35, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

Addition of subsection titled "Glass Ceiling"
I have noticed that this article contains statistics that show the gender gap between the amount of male and female doctors. Under the subheading “Modern Medicine,” the article states that the “…practice of medicine remains disproportionately male overall.” This statement, followed by data that reveals this disproportion, fails to address what is causing it. Because of this, I am planning on adding a subsection to this article titled “Glass Ceiling.” By doing so, the information that I will add in this section will help to better explain the cause and effect relationship that gender has in the medical field. More specifically, my contribution will utilize findings from surveys of female medical students and physicians, in relation to sexual harassment and gender and ethnic discrimination in the field.

So far, the section I am planning on adding will look something along the lines of what I've posted below. I am open to any criticism and or suggestions in order to help make this contribution a worthwhile addition to this article. It should also be noted that I am still trying to work out formatting kinks, as I am aware that the large quote I want to implement should be indented. This is the general outline for what my contribution will include, as I am still collecting my research to complete it further.

Glass Ceiling
The glass ceiling is used as a metaphor to convey the unspoken obstacles that women and minorities face in the workplace.

One study conducted a survey on physician mothers and their physician daughters in order to analyze the effect that discrimination and harassment have on the individual and their career. This study included 84% of physician mothers that graduated medical school prior to 1970, with the majority of these physicians graduating in the 1950’s and 1960’s. The authors of this study stated that discrimination in the medical field persisted after the title VII discrimination legislation was passed in 1965.

"In medicine, women and minorities continued to be systematically excluded or restricted from medical schools until the National Organization for Women (NOW) filed a successful class action suit in 1970 against every United States medical school, compelling compliance with the civil rights legislation. By 1975, the numbers of women in medicine had more than tripled and continued to climb, so that by 2005, approximately 50% of entering medical students and over 25% of physicians were women.3 The percentages of women from racial/ethnic minority populations (African American, Latina, Asian/Pacific Is- lander) entering medical school and practicing as physicians have increased over the past 30 years but remain below their percentages in the general population.4"

According to this study, one third of physician daughters reported experiencing a form of gender discrimination in medical school, field training, and the work environment. This study also stated that “There were no significant differences between the generations in gender bias or obstacles experienced in their practice/work environments.”

I think that the Glass Ceiling metaphor is too long compared to other aspects of this page. I believe that the other parts of the essay should be elaborated to make this section seem less excessive.

Adding Sections "Midwifery in 18th Century America" and "Competition Between Midwifery and Obstetrics"
For my U.S. Women's History class, we are supposed to make contributions to wikipedia articles. I wanted to add in sections to this article to pay tribute to midwifery, since it contributes to women in medicine. If there is anything anyone would like to help me edit about this contribution, please let me know.

Below is my proposed addition:

Midwifery in 18th Century America
As per the documentary “A Midwife’s Tale”, historian of 18th century America, Laurel Thatcher Ulrich, follows the diary of Martha Ballard, which proves to be a telling source of women’s roles as medical practitioners. Out of the different occupations women took on around this time, midwifery was the best paid of them all. In the 18th century, households tended to have an abundance of children largely in part to have a helping hand in responsibilities and to combat high mortality rates. Despite the high chance of complications in labor, Martha Ballard, specifically, had high success rates in delivering healthy babies to healthy mothers.

Competition Between Midwifery and Obstetrics
A shift from women midwifery to male obstetrics occurs in the growth of medical practices such as the founding of the American Medical Association. Instead of assisting labor in the basis of an emergency, there were doctors such as Dr. Benjamin Page who wanted to take over the delivery of babies completely; putting midwifery second. This is an example of the growing sense of competition between male physicians and female midwives as a rise in obstetrics took hold. The education of women on the basis of midwifery was stunted by both physicians and public-health reformers, driving midwifery to be seen as out of practice. Societal roles also played a fact in the downfall of the practice in midwifery because women were unable to obtain the education needed for licensing and once married, women were to embrace a domestic lifestyle.

NPOV
I added an NPOV. The article is both highly ideological in content and, conversely, poor in referencing, with claims that for the most part are political. Furthermore, an encyclopaedic article on women in medicine is by no means a subsection of "gender studies" but must be listed as history and, as such, it must be accurate. The present article does not meet Wikipedia quality and bias criteria. Do not remove the NPOV until such criteria are met. --109.112.207.216 (talk) 11:58, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

I find the lack of any EXAMPLE of supposed quality failure or bias to very telling EmeritusProf (talk) 01:38, 22 April 2022 (UTC)

I find the first comment here to be extremely suspect in nature and indicative of the well-known general misogynist bias on wikipedia. It especially does not come from a named account, and as noted above there are zero examples of any quality failure. As such, I will be removing the NPOV template. Lcdrovers (talk) 22:46, 2 June 2022 (UTC)