Talk:Wurlitzer electronic piano/GA1

GA Review
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Reviewer: The Rambling Man (talk · contribs) 10:33, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

Comments
 * There was an infobox on the last musical instrument GAN I reviewed, is it not pertinent here?
 * As Gerda says, the infobox wars are over, so done. I think the original reason there wasn't one is because the lead wasn't long enough to introduce layout issues with a reasonably-sized infobox, but that no longer applies. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  13:59, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "Wurlitzer electronic piano" why is the article at "electric" if it's called "electronic"?
 * WP:COMMONNAME - "electronic" is the name on the front of the piano and what Wurlitzer officially marketed it as, even though it's technically wrong. PS: Now moved. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  13:59, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "sound is generated by striking a metal reed with a hammer" isn't it generated by striking the keys on the keyboard??
 * Not directly. The key triggers a hammer (just like an acoustic piano) which hits the metal reed (instead of strings) Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "specifically engineered towards teaching" could you allude to how that was achieved, just a quick insight in the lead?
 * Okay, had a tinker Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "different modules were" do you mean modules or models?
 * Fixed (see above) <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "popular with several popular" "repetitive.
 * D'oh, must have been a "let's quickly redo the lead before nominating it for GA" evening :-/ <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "digital keyboards" what are they? (as you've linked electric piano....)
 * Gone with electronic keyboard. It's basically any keyboard you're likely to see on stage in the last ten years where somebody's playing rock, pop or covering conventional piano sounds (in order words, you wouldn't expect the Wurlitzer sound to turn up on a Kayne West album, though I guess all things are possible.....) <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "meant it is stable enough to be used in the 21st century" I don't really get this. Are you saying that conditions in the 21st Century are different and tougher?  Or are you saying the instruments, if maintained, can still be used?  Wouldn't that be the case for anything?  Harpsichords?  Theremins?
 * I originally wanted to say "stable enough to be used today", but what "today" is changes with time. Basically, a 50+ year old Wurlitzer is built like the proverbial brick privy (like a Hammond) and requires little maintenance. Does that clarify things? <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * As long as you clarify it in the article, it makes sense. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 14:54, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I've reworded this. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:27, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "170v" V and normally we see a non-breaking space between values and units.
 * Okay <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * I would also link Direct current.
 * Done <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * Can link those musical notes.
 * Done


 * "Compared with the (Fender) Rhodes electric piano, the ..., compared to the Rhodes " saying the same thing twice.
 * Done (also copyedited a bit)


 * And why would one compare it to the (Fender) Rhodes piano?
 * Because the two are by far and way the most commercially successful and popular electric pianos, featuring on numerous hit records, but are difficult to tell apart by the casual listener. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  14:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I didn't know that and most readers won't so the comparison is somewhat wasted on most of us. Needs explanation. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 14:50, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I've gone with "equally-iconic" since that's the exact term the source uses. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:29, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "baby grand" link.
 * Done <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "National Association of Music Merchants (NAMM) show" show appears to be in the link.
 * Didn't know that, okay, tweaked


 * "quarter-inch" convert.
 * The problem with that is "0.25-inch (6.4 mm) steel reeds" doesn't scan as easily for the reader <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * But it's the only measurement that's not converted, so it looks odd, you can always say "quarter-inch (6.4 mm)" if it's the numbers that's making you sad. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 20:37, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I've gone with "quarter-inch" (6.5mm), as that's a recognised industry standard (Google for "6.5mm jack"). <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  21:56, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "as on an acoustic" in rather than on?
 * Changed to "as found on" <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "using headphones" why pipe that to headphone?!
 * Fixed <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "for Wurlitzer in Chicago" the invention was in Chicago or Wurlizter were in Chicago? Is it relevant?
 * Changed to "co-developed in Chicago by...." which makes a bit more sense <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * Would Wurlitzer model 110 and Wurlitzer model 112 etc be reasonable redirects to this article?
 * Are there are any articles that have that link? If not, I don't think so. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:32, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "increase profitability with the emerging digital synthesizer market" was it considered part of that market or are you saying costs were reduced to compete with that market?
 * Copyedited <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:32, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "The last 200A"" you haven't mentioned 200A up to this point.
 * That's the problem with writing backwards .... fixed <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "are portable models with" is models needed here?
 * Copyedited <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "the unit in later 1956" no need for later.
 * That does look a bit odd, done <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "electric shielding" might want a link/explanation as to what/why.
 * Changed to electromagnetic shielding (and linked), as that's what it is <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "in trade magazines, such as Count Basie" this reads like Count Basie is magazine, altogether feasible if you've never heard of them.
 * Copyedited <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "solid state classroom hyphenate
 * Done <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * Given all the shoutouts to various model numbers, I think a list would be in order along with their principal features.
 * I'm not sure where that would go - infobox perhaps? <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Perhaps or you just create a section with a table called "variants" or "models". There's a lot of them to consume in this article. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 20:37, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * While it's true there are a lot of models, I'm concerned a straight list would be lop-sided, as it would lose the context elsewhere that clarifies the 200 / 200A models are by far and away the most well-known and popular, while others are pretty obscure. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  22:02, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * The problem is, the model numbers and their features are dotted around the article so widely that it's practically impossible to see them in one place. As this is the only article on the instrument and no model articles appear to exist (or need to exist) then the article ought to provide a clear description of all the available models and their features.  The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 22:06, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I had a look at some other GAs - Hammond organ, Rhodes piano and Mellotron, and none of them have this. I'm not saying this to be awkward; rather that if any of the did have a list like this, I'd find a precedent/ consensus and copy the format over to this article, and have a good idea to how it's structured (eg: column header names, formatting, position in article etc). <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  22:09, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * First question, before worrying about how to format a table, is do you have a list of model numbers? Even just collating those mentioned in the article you'd get to, what, a dozen?  The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 22:18, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Looking at sources, there are the 200 / 200A (most popular), 112 / 112A (second popular), 100, 110 and 111 (third popular), 140, 145, 146 / A / B, 106P, (all obscure) then there's the 2xx and 7xx series (really obscure) .... would it not be simpler to create an equivalent of List of Hammond organs and put the information there? <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  10:38, 25 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Yeah, sure, that fixes the point I made that this is the only article about the Wurlitzer electronic piano, as if you had a list article with the models, it wouldn't be. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 10:56, 25 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "the plastic-lidded" pretty sure we don't need to link plastic, especially as that's so generic.
 * Done (don't think I did that, or if I did it wasn't memorable) <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "talk to them without others hearing them" did the students also have a microphone to talk back?
 * No - I guess the analogy is if you're in class, and saying "Write down 2x2", having 15 children shout "done", "what", "come next playtime you're it" etc etc isn't practical. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "headphone niche" overlinked, and why singular?
 * It's an adjective. See phone connector (audio) (which in an ironic twist, was originally used for phones, then for other things, and is now known for phones again, unless manufactured by Apple). <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "207/207VA/205V, etc.)" I don't think "etc." applies here, what others?
 * I've changed this to examples, qualified with "such as". There isn't much information on the teacher / student models, they were far less well-known than the stage instruments. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "a full size" hyphen.
 * Done <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "has played a customised" sure, but I guess you explicitly mean as part of the act or in recording?
 * I'm not sure what you mean, but the "customisation" here is at least to add an output jack so it can be plugged into a keyboard amp and / or PA system, which the stage instruments can just do anyway. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Sorry, that was confusing. What I mean is presumably you mean he used it in performances or recordings, not just that he simply played it. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 20:37, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I'm not actually sure, the source doesn't say one way or the other. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  22:02, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * Maintenance section is bordering on a WP:HOWTO guide.
 * It's a reliably sourced HOWTO guide, though ;-) .... I used to own a Wurlitzer and the information about tuning the reeds is pretty damn useful, in my experience. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "Wurlitzer patches" what's a patch in this context?
 * As a longtime Nord user, it means you have a choice from the Piano library from a number of different Wurlitzers, though I only ever use the 200A programme on stage ... anyway, copyedited <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * "a VST software" what's VST?
 * As linked, Virtual Studio Technology. It's a type of plugin interface that gives you custom UI controls for an instrument in a digital audio workstation. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Explain it before abbreviating it. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 20:37, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Ah right, done. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  22:02, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * gig and riff can be linked.
 * I think we discussed this in a recent review, but in my opinion these are as common as "plastic" <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * No, definitely not. Everyone on earth above the age of 8 knows what plastic is, that's not true of gig or riff. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 20:37, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Maybe I've just grown up thinking terms that are very common, in fact aren't. *shrugs* Anyway, done. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  22:02, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * ""and "Dreamer".[45][46][19] " order.
 * Done (it needs all three sources to properly verify all the song titles as having the Wurlitzer as a key sound) <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)


 * What's a "flanger"?
 * Linked. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

That's all I have, so it's on hold. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 12:27, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * "97,99" etc etc, space after comma.
 * Gone through everything now, some issues have further questions. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  20:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Responses to the major queries before I re-review above. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 20:37, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Image list
I made a start on an image list, but didn't get very far. I included the best-selling models in a table, and two of them we don't have pictures for. Commons:Category:Wurlitzer electric pianos does include some shots of the 206, a student model reappropriated by pro musicians, but I don't have a source for what years it was produced. This makes producing a list that is complete and verifiable somewhat problematic. Here's what I've done so far:


 * Looks good so far. An incomplete table is better than none.  The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 15:07, 25 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Shall I just bung this in the article? It's not big enough for a spinoff. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  15:33, 25 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Certainly. I'd expect to see 110, 111, 200A, 200B, 205V, 207, 214/215, 203, 203W, 210, 300, 106P, 700, 720, and 270 mentioned too... The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 15:40, 25 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I've gone with a compromise and called it "key models" <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  15:49, 25 March 2021 (UTC)



Excellent, I think I'm happy to promote now, this is a very good piece of work. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!&#33;!&#33;) 20:46, 25 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks. It's a shame we don't have free images of some of the other important models for the list, but we can only use what we have. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> <sup style="color:#7F007F">(talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  22:05, 25 March 2021 (UTC)