Talk:Xiao'erjing

Origin of term
Seems like it's phonetic? Not sure on this. The TUFS page notes other ways of referring to Xiao-Er-Jin like 小經, which is more transparent (it contrasts with 大經, i.e. the use of Arabic to write the Arabic language, as in the Koran). Also the term for Xiao-Er-Jin differs regionally. cab 22:07, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Arabic for Arabic is called 本經/本经. --Shibo77 11:10, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Tone marking
See this sample (the bilingual one). It's a fully vowelled script (like the modern Uighur orthography, but unlike Arabic, Persian, Urdu, etc.). I'm guessing the straight diagonal strokes above and below the actual letters are tone marks, but I don't know what the tones should be in that dialect (which looks close to Mandarin, but some of the vowels seem weird, along with the tones --- for example, 性 should be the same 4th tone as 分 or 六 in Mandarin, but it has a double tone mark while the two others have only single tone marks.) cab 22:07, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Tones are not marked, those are vowel marks. --Shibo77 11:10, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
 * So how do those who read xiaoerjin know which tone to pronounce things with? Fascinating. -- InfernoXV (talk) 20:35, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Current usage
What is the extent of usage of Xiao-Er-Jin among the Hui today? cab 22:07, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Very rare. --Shibo77 11:10, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Cyrillicization
What's the cyrillicization scheme called?
 * The Dungans use the Cyrillic script, so it is called the Dungan Cyrillic alphabet. --Shibo77 11:10, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Unique letters
At least some of the letters listed as "unique to Xiao'erjing" are not. 6, for example, is used in Sindhi for. --Ptcamn 04:55, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

[s]- and the entering tone
In the Initials and consonants section, the notes for number 17 (, [s]-) say, "only used for entering tone or formerly entering tone syllables." However, it gives the example 思 sī, which is not an historically entering tone syllable. However, number 19 (, also [s]-) gives the example 色 sè, which is an historically entering tone syllable. Is it possible that the note went on the wrong row? &mdash;Umofomia (talk) 01:02, 20 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I noticed this issue still exists in the article, even though I raised it 13 years ago. I marked the note for discussion so that someone with more knowledge can look into it. My knowledge of Xiao'erjing is lacking, but I know for certain that 思 is not a historically entering tone syllable. &mdash; Umofomia (talk) 16:58, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
 * I saw it mentioned on this talk page that much of the content of this article was translated directly from the corresponding article in the Chinese Wikipedia, so I took a look there to see what the corresponding note said. It looks like the note ("仅限于入聲字") used to exist there too, but was removed in this edit in 2013. No edit summary indicating the reasoning was given though, nor was there any discussion on that talk page. The note that remains in that entry is also rather vague ("小儿经特有字母" - "Xiao'erjing special use letter"). &mdash; Umofomia (talk) 17:44, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

image of tombs removed
I've removed the image of the tombs at the Niujie Mosque since it is not actually an example of xiaoerjing. The Arabic script in the image is simply Arabic and the Chinese being a transliteration from that, not vice versa as would be the case w/ xiaoerjing, e.g. the first name艾哈麦德　布尔塔尼 would be "َاىْ هَا مَىْ دْ بُوْ عَر تَا نِ". Yung Wei (talk) 06:28, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Xiao'erjing help
What would be the Xiao'erjing equivalents for the following words?:


 * 1) 昂 áng = ءْاݣ‎ or ءْا ?
 * 2) 擦 cā = ?
 * 3) 純 chún = ?
 * 4) 綽 chuò = ?
 * 5) 粗 cū = ?
 * 6) 但 dàn = دًا‎ or دً ?
 * 7) 的 de = دْ or دِؤ‎ ?
 * 8) 額 é = عـَ‎ or عَ?
 * 9) 非 fēi = ﻓُﻮِٔ or فِ‎?
 * 10) 附 fù = ﻓُﻮْ or حْ ?
 * 11) 更 gèng = قْعݣ‎ or ﻗْﻊ?
 * 12) 何 hé = حـْ‎ or حْ?
 * 13) 紅 hóng = خْوݣ‎ or ﺡْﻮ?
 * 14) 解 jiě = كِئ‎ or دِﻰٔ?
 * 15) 卡 kǎ = ?
 * 16) 看 kàn = ?
 * 17) 考 kǎo = ?
 * 18) 肯 kěn = ?
 * 19) 坑 kēng = ?
 * 20) 空 kōng = ?
 * 21) 跨 kuà = ?
 * 22) 虧 kuī = ?
 * 23) 拉 lā = ?
 * 24) 來 lái = ?
 * 25) 蘭 lán = ?
 * 26) 浪 làng = ?
 * 27) 勞 láo = ?
 * 28) 樂 lè = ?
 * 29) 類 lèi = ?
 * 30) 冷 lěng = ?
 * 31) 力 lì = لِر‎ or لِ‎?
 * 32) 倆 liǎ = ?
 * 33) 料 liào = ?
 * 34) 林 lín = ?
 * 35) 流 liú = ?
 * 36) 柳 liǔ = ?
 * 37) 攏 lǒng = ?
 * 38) 樓 lóu = ?
 * 39) 路 lù = ?
 * 40) 旅 lǚ = ?
 * 41) 卵 luǎn = ?
 * 42) 論 lùn = ?
 * 43) 邏 luó = ?
 * 44) 呣 ḿ = ?
 * 45) 滅 miè = ?
 * 46) 那 nà = ?
 * 47) 耐 nài = ?
 * 48) 難 nán = ?
 * 49) 囊 náng = ?
 * 50) 腦 nǎo = ?
 * 51) 呢 ne = ?
 * 52) 內 nèi = ?
 * 53) 嫩 nèn = ?
 * 54) 能 néng = ?
 * 55) 年 nián = ?
 * 56) 娘 niáng = ?
 * 57) 鳥 niǎo = ?
 * 58) 捏 niē = ?
 * 59) 您 nín = ?
 * 60) 寧 níng = ?
 * 61) 農 nóng = ?
 * 62) 努 nǔ = ?
 * 63) 暖 nuǎn = ?
 * 64) 虐 nüè = ?
 * 65) 挪 nuó = ?
 * 66) 喔 ō = ?
 * 67) 爬 pá = ?
 * 68) 拍 pāi = ?
 * 69) 判 pàn = ?
 * 70) 旁 páng = ?
 * 71) 跑 pǎo = ?
 * 72) 配 pèi = ?
 * 73) 朋 péng = ?
 * 74) 皮 pí = ?
 * 75) 片 piàn = ?
 * 76) 票 piào = ?
 * 77) 品 pǐn = ?
 * 78) 平 píng = ?
 * 79) 剖 pōu = ?
 * 80) 普 pǔ = ?
 * 81) 洽 qià = ?
 * 82) 千 qiān = ?
 * 83) 強 qiáng = ?
 * 84) 巧 qiǎo = ?
 * 85) 請 qǐng = ?
 * 86) 球 qiú = ?
 * 87) 區 qū = ?
 * 88) 全 quán = ?
 * 89) 缺 quē = ?
 * 90) 群 qún = ?
 * 91) 然 rán = ?
 * 92) 讓 ràng = ?
 * 93) 繞 rào = ?
 * 94) 認 rèn = ?
 * 95) 仍 réng = ?
 * 96) 容 róng = ?
 * 97) 柔 róu = ?
 * 98) 入 rù = ?
 * 99) 軟 ruǎn = ?
 * 100) 瑞 ruì = ?
 * 101) 潤 rùn = ?
 * 102) 若 ruò = ?
 * 103) 傻 shǎ = ?
 * 104) 曬 shài = ?
 * 105) 善 shàn = ?
 * 106) 上 shàng = ?
 * 107) 少 shǎo = ?
 * 108) 社 shè = ?
 * 109) 身 shēn = ?
 * 110) 手 shǒu = ?
 * 111) 書 shū = ?
 * 112) 刷 shuā = ?
 * 113) 帥 shuài = ?
 * 114) 雙 shuāng = ?
 * 115) 睡 shuì = ?
 * 116) 順 shùn = ?
 * 117) 說 shuō = ?
 * 118) 台 tái = ?
 * 119) 談 tán = ?
 * 120) 躺 tǎng = ?
 * 121) 討 tǎo = ?
 * 122) 藤 téng = ?
 * 123) 提 tí = ?
 * 124) 天 tiān = ?
 * 125) 跳 tiào = ?
 * 126) 貼 tiē = ?
 * 127) 挺 tǐng = ?
 * 128) 透 tòu = ?
 * 129) 兔 tù = ?
 * 130) 團 tuán = ?
 * 131) 腿 tuǐ = ?
 * 132) 屯 tún = ?
 * 133) 陀 tuó = ?
 * 134) 脫 tuō = ?
 * 135) 習 xí = ?
 * 136) 下 xià = ?
 * 137) 現 xiàn = ?
 * 138) 謝 xiè = ?
 * 139) 醒 xǐng = ?
 * 140) 雄 xióng = ?
 * 141) 修 xiū = ?
 * 142) 需 xū = ?
 * 143) 選 xuǎn = ?
 * 144) 雪 xuě = ?
 * 145) 尋 xún = ?
 * 146) 陽 yáng = يْاݣ‎ or ݣْاݣ‎?
 * 147) 業 yè = لٍ or اِئ‎?
 * 148) 一 yī = ىِ or ءِ‎?
 * 149) 雜 zá = ?
 * 150) 贊 zàn = ?
 * 151) 贓 zāng = ?
 * 152) 造 zào = ?
 * 153) 這 zhè = جـْ‎ or جْ?
 * 154) 住 zhù = ﺟُﻮْ or ﺟُﻮ?
 * 155) 總 zǒng = ?
 * 156) 走 zǒu = ?
 * 157) 租 zū = ?
 * 158) 鑽 zuān = ?

Thanks. --JackonLee54 (talk) 22:32, 30 December 2015 (UTC)

Difference between certain Xiao'erjing letters?
I have some questions regarding some letters used in Xiao'erjing.

- ث can refer to "q-" or "x-" in Hanyu Pinyin. In what contexts is it "q," and in what contexts is it "x-"? Are there cases where it should be used instead of ٿ for "q-"?

- د can refer to "d-" or "j-". In what contexts is it "j-"?

-س can refer to "s-" or "x-". In what contexts is it "x-"?

- What's the difference between س, س with dot, and ص for "s-"?

- ش can refer to "sh-" and "x-". In what contexts is it "x-"?

- What's the difference between ط and ظ for "z-"?

- In what contexts is م "n-"?!???!

I find Xiao'erjing beautiful, and I want to start writing in it. My issues with it so far are shown in the above questions. Does anyone have the answers??? OmegaGmaster (talk) 21:29, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

I know it's been four years lol BUT, the letters overlapping, as you point out, is the outcome of the fact that the writing system didn't have a single standard version (it still does not). It had two generic standards, one from Xining, another Lanzhou, and another from the NE. Also, some writers took the liberty to just do whatever. Anywho, since you're interested in writing in Xiao'erjing, I am currently working on a project, that you would appreciate a lot. I have been studying the old manuscripts and how they wrote, also have been reviewing the works of a few Chinese teachers of the language online, asking them questions if need be. I am compiling a list of Chinese characters and their corresponding Xiao'erjing writing. The modern accepted way of writing is: so .... while there's a lot of variations on what's the correct consonant, and it can be a headahce, it's nothing compared to the headache the vowels, diphtongs, triphthong, front nasal ending, back nasal ending, all of that, and their variations among various ways people write. I am working on the package that will organize chinese characters and address this. BasilLeaf (talk) 06:57, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * ث is "x-"
 * ش is "sh-"
 * ٿ or ٹ is "q-"
 * د is "d-"
 * ڭ is "j-" (and not "-ng" as explained in the wiki page. No historic manuscript used this letter as -ng)
 * both س and ص are "s-", and there are rules for when to use which. Generally if the letter is followed by "_o" or "_u", you use ص
 * both ت and ط are "t-", same rule as "s-" applies
 * both ح and خ are "h-", same rule as "s-" and "t-" applies
 * both ز and ظ are "z-". I've seen some standards use ذ instead of ز, your call. same rule as "s-", "t-", "h-" applies
 * apparently س with a single dot was used for a specific tone that no longer exists in most dialects of Mandarin, and especially the NW dialects, so, just treat it as a س
 * idk what context uses م for "n-", my guess is that it was something carried over from Middle chinese's NW dialects.


 * "apparently س with a single dot was used for a specific tone that no longer exists in most dialects of Mandarin, and especially the NW dialects, so, just treat it as a س"


 * Curious: do you have more sources on this? For a while I have been searching far and wide for the single-dotted seen: I haven't really found actual examples of this (except *maybe* one but I think the dot is a sukun). If you have some sources for the historic orthography with the single dot I think that might be quite useful to me. Manish  Earth Talk •  Stalk 19:36, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

Arabic and Persian in Xiao-er-jing
I assume Arabic and Persian loanwords are written the same, but how are they pronounced? א. א. אינסטלציה (talk) 06:46, 11 October 2020 (UTC)

The image posted on the page itself is an appropriate example: here The arabic words are written as they would in Arabic, so I assume they're pronounced however they would be in Arabic, as best as possible. For example this line, 3rd line, right hand side page: «فِْی جَمِیع اِلاَوْقَاتِ وَالْاَحْوَالِ قًازًا وِیدُ نَقَه جُو», the first half of the phrase is Arabic, and gone a bit overkill with the diarectics lol, and it basically means "all in all", and the chinese bit, my guess was that it is "感赞唯独那告诸"? anyone else wanna correct me? 17:37, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Image of Tomb
Image of the tomb is not Xiaoerjing, It's an actual typical arabic, so it's not approporiate to present it as Xiaoerjing. BasilLeaf (talk) 17:38, 25 August 2021 (UTC)


 * I noticed it was first removed by in 2009, who cited the same reasoning previously on this talk page, but was later added back in 2019 in this series of changes by . I removed it again in this change. I encourage you to be bold and make such changes if you see similar issues in the future. &mdash; Umofomia (talk) 17:21, 2 August 2022 (UTC)