Talk:Xuyun

Richard Hunn letter
Dear Members

Richard Hunn passed away on the 1st October 2006, in hospital, in Kyoto, Japan. He was suffering from cancer.

He spent much of his adult life propagating and preserving the spiritual essence of life, in its many guises, and myriad forms. Part of this immense task, was the practice of Ch'an Buddhism - the method of which was very close to his heart. He had met Charles Luk (Upasaka Lu Kuan Yu), in Hong Kong in the 1970's, and tirelessly worked to keep the 'Ch'an And Zen Teaching Series 1, 2, & 3', in print. Together of course, with Charles Luk's other texts, translated from the Chinese, into a good and reliable English format. Texts such as the Surangama Sutra, The Nirdesa Vimalirkirti Sutra, Taoist Yoga, Secrets of Chinese Meditation, Practical Buddhism and the very important autobiography of Master Xu Yun (1840-1959).

This biography, entitled 'Empty Cloud' (the literal translation of 'Xu Yun'), was edited by Richard in the 1980's. This was during the time that he lived in Thorpe Hamlet, Norwich. The forword, written by Richard, eminates a peaceful compassion, and reflects, I think, a deeper, underlying perfection and tranquility, that permeates across many planes of being. And at this time, the 'Norwich Ch'an Association' was functioning. Richard held Ch'an weeks, (times of intensive meditation), and kept in contact with many people around the world, through the written word. 'Ancient China had a postal system.' as Richard once pointed out to me, and with that example in mind, he kept a varied and extensive written communication. There is a Ch'an tradition of instruction via letter, as many Ch'an masters lived in the remote hills, and were dificult to find. And it was initially by the written word, that I came to know him.

In the late 1980's, and early 1990's, Richard and I exchanged a number of letters. I enquired about the 'true essence' of mind', and he gently but firmly showed me my 'Mind'. Then, suddenly, (and for almost a decade), we lost touch with one another. His life changed rapidly, and so did mine! I never stopped thinking about him however, and eventually, I managed to track him down! He was re-married, immensely happy and living in Kyoto, Japan. From about the year 2000, he would bring groups of Japanese students to visit England for about a month or so, and after the students had returned to Japan, he would visit his parents in Norwich, and then come and spend a week or so at my home in Sutton, south London. During these blissful times, we would discuss life, laugh alot and meditate intensely!

This situation continued more or less up until 2004. From 2005 onwards, Richard's health started to decline, slowly at first. He was diagnosed with cancer in August 2005. From 2000 to 2004, we met, and when apart, wrote to one another quite extensively, and this, at times included emails, which Richard disliked for being too inpersonal. We also talked on the 'phone.

Richard's wife, Taeko, and his son, Charles, have asked me to convey the sad news of Richard's passing, to those who may have known him, or who may have known of him. To the last, he kept his Mind bright and clear.

Thank you for reading.

Adrian chan-Wyles (Upasaka Heng Yu)              6.9.2006 Sutton, London

Age Confirmation
Is there any actual confirmation of Xu Yun's age at the time of his death? Longevity myths, particularly about religious figures, are very popular (Methuselah, etc). Wilybadger (talk) 02:39, 10 February 2011 (UTC)


 * I'd like to add that a lack of proper sourcing for the birth date calls into question the veracity of the biography, which is already hindered by unnecessarily flowery language that might cross into mythologizing. Paul F Villerius (talk) 01:35, 11 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Xuyun was born at a time period where there were no birth certificates. Moreover in Qing Dynasty China, there were no document equivalents to baptismal records. His birth year can only truly be verified through the paternal family history books - a set of books kept by his clan and updated periodically within a set timeframe for male members of the Xiao clan.  Whether these books still exists is unknown as many of these books were destroyed during the Cultural Revolution. The controversy with Xuyun's  birth date is due to his remarkable longevity and the fact that he was not a public figure (i.e. politician, etc.,)  There are lots of scholastic speculation as to his actual birth year.  But they remain speculative. Hanbud (talk) 17:13, 13 August 2020 (UTC)

POV warning
What in the article may violate the Neutral Point of View Rule of Wikipedia? As there are no hints here, I will remove the warning in the article; it may be set again when the cause is explained here. --Bernd.Brincken (talk) 16:28, 12 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Just read through the article, and does have a number of what might be called WP:NPOV issues - the consistent referral of Xu Yun as "the Master", etc. - which need to be edited into an encyclopedic style. I might work on this more.   White Whirlwind  咨   17:21, 12 October 2011 (UTC)
 * are you even serious? the article is non-stop BS from start to finish, how can you even doubt it? 86.129.204.178 (talk) 20:43, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

Cleanup Help Request
To any editors who read this, please consider helping out in the improvement of this article on an interesting individual. The article currently has numerous issues, including:
 * 1) It originally had "the Master" throughout, instead of the subject's Buddhist name Hsu Yun (Xu Yun). I've fixed nearly all of these instances, but some may remain.  If you see one, please correct it per WP:NAMES.
 * 2) It is largely copied from a single biography published on a certain website. This creates a significant WP:1R problem.  Please either:
 * 3) Add more sources, or
 * 4) Delete some of the current material.
 * 5) Because the article is copied from a Buddhist source, it contains significant language that is reverential and praising of the subject. This violates encyclopedic_style and WP:NPOV, which states that articles' styles "should always remain formal, impersonal, and dispassionate."
 * 6) The article used Wade-Giles for place-names within China. These need to be converted to Hanyu Pinyin.  I got most of them, but if you see any, please fix them.  For personal names, Wade-Giles is ok as long as they're cited as such in a reputable source.

Thanks in advance.  White Whirlwind  咨   03:24, 13 October 2011 (UTC)

Hsu Yun to Xu Yun
I propose that it would be better to use the Pinyin version rather that the Wade Giles version of the name and therefore call the article Xu Yun — Preceding unsigned comment added by Guttormng (talk • contribs) 11:43, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

Still has glaring POV problems
For one example, the use of "defiled" and "undefiled" to describe individuals. Such copy reads like a sermon, not an encyclopedia article. Laodah 20:53, 13 November 2015 (UTC)