Talk:Z-Boys

Wall o'Text
In desperate need of structural break up. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.87.224.65 (talk) 16:26, 9 December 2011 (UTC)

Propaganda?
I think a lot of this could be skateboarding industry untruthful propaganda. I think this should be removed unless you can find any non-industry verifications. -Skrayl —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.43.236.142 (talk) 01:51, 6 September 2007 (UTC) sweet

Will all due respect to the Z-Boys, the real pioneer in pool riding was Brian Parry, who lived in Playa del Rey and rode the abandoned swimming pools in a neighborhood that had been condemned by the LAX authority for airport expansion. His inspired skating was unique and reflected his skill as a terrific surfer. If credit is to be given to the Z-Boys, as it certainly should, there should be recognition of Brian Parry and his group of skaters in Playa del Rey who were skating swimming pools at least a little bit ahead of the Z-Boys.

Aloha.


 * With regard to the 'propaganda', it is a non-issue, being that the whole thing was lifted by some lazy editor who merely cut and pasted the entire section from the Z-Boys official website. I've removed it, as it isn't a public (.org) site and doesn't have the express written consent of the website to use the info, and us therefore violates Wikipedia copyright guidelines. Of course the actual passage isn't even written to the standard of a WP article, but that's another issue entirely. Ryecatcher773 (talk) 22:57, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Documentary movies not mentioned here?
There were two movies commemorating the dogtown skateboarders, one narrated by Sean Penn in 2001, and another done in the 1970s.

Perhaps those should be linked here? CodeCarpenter 15:59, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Go for it; it's all you my friend. J-Dog 16:17, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't like to mess with copyright stuff yet, so I figure I let an expert do it. I can add the links to the movies, but that's about it. CodeCarpenter 16:22, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Ahh, they are mentioned in the Renaissance section, I am just a bit blind today... CodeCarpenter 16:25, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Fact checking
Some of the dates and facts need sorting out better, including when the team first formed and who was on it. Is there a source that these skaters were "top surfers"? That's news to me, they didn't have that reputation among surfers. Also there's a lot of POV that needs to get fixed. They were great skaters and revolutionized the sport, but saying a single skater like Adams was the "most naturally gifted skater" is a bit too subjective for an encyclopedia without a good source to back it up. Professor marginalia 19:28, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Nathan Pratt is not the Sid in the "Lords of Dogtown" who had cancer and reunited Alva, Adams and Peralta in his dad's backyard pool. "Lords of Dogtown" is fictionalized. IRL Nathan had the job pushing broom, but in the film that angle was written for the character Sid. IRL Nathan Pratt was alive and went to the movie's premier. Professor marginalia 17:18, 25 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Who is the kid in the wheelchair at the end of Lords of Dogtown when they show the home footage? It did not look like the actor that played Sid. Also, who owned the dogbowl? I'm not doubting that fictionalized things for the movie, I am just wondering the details. Maybe it should be in the article. Ryratt 02:34, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Original Members?
Joe Finney and Cody Williams are listed as original members of Z-Boys. Apart from the fact that I've never heard of them (not that that means anything, but I'm an aficionado of all things Z-Boys), they're not listed on the Z-Boy web page that serves as the source for the list of original members. Remove them? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.130.133.201 (talk) 15:11, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

This article is completely biased. Facts are'nt close to being true. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.87.5.53 (talk) 03:53, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I would suggest to remove the whole list of "And, as for the 12 original Z-Boys:". it reads like something at the end of a movie, or a fanzine.--Narayan (talk) 18:24, 20 June 2011 (UTC)

External links modified
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Content Revisions: Lead Section
Hello fellow Wikipedians!

This first editing post focuses on the minor revisions made to the style, content, and references of the lead section of the article. While it was not flagged by Wikipedia, I believe that the article's lead section does not adequately summarize the contents of the article. Furthermore, in regards to WP:NOR issues, the introductory section lacks proper inline citations. In terms of revisions, while I retained the basis of the original content, I supplemented the introductory section with both additional information and references. Overall, I believe that my revisions not only provide a clearer depiction of the article, but they certify that the article adheres to the guidelines set by WP:NOR and WP:NPV I have provided the revised lead section as well as a list of sources below. The additional references are incorporated within the article.

Revised Lead Section

The Zephyr Competition Team (or Z-Boys) were a group of skateboarders in the mid-1970s from Santa Monica and Venice, California. Originally consisting of 12 members, the Z-boys were originally sponsored by the Jeff Ho Surfboards and Zephyr Productions surf and skate shop. Their innovative surfing-based style and aerial moves formed the foundations of contemporary vert and transition skateboarding. The story of the Z-boys and Zephyr shop have been popularized in feature films such as Lords of Dogtown and Dogtown and Z-Boys.

Sources:

- The Z-Boys: The Skateboarding Pioneers of Dogtown

- The History of Dogtown and the Z-Boys

- The boys of Dogtown — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jackrenaud33 (talk • contribs) 04:30, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Jackrenaud33 (talk) 07:04, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Structural Revisions: "History" Section
Hello fellow Wikipedians!

This specific editing post focuses on the structural framework, or lack of, that is evident in the article. Specifically, the majority of these revisions focus on the "History" section of the article. The original version of this section is presented in a continuous fashion; however, the lack of sub-sections contributes to a decline in the clarity and literary flow of the article. Furthermore, the lack of sub-sections showcases a lack of adherence to the guidelines defined in the WP:MOS. Thus, I have introduced 5 sub-section titles to more accurately guide the chronological timeline of the history of the Z-Boys. I primarily relied on The Z-Boys: The Skate Pioneers of Dogtown for this separation. I have listed the edited sub-section titles (in order) below.

- Initial Beginnings

- Formation of the Zephyr Competition Team

- The Del Mar Nationals

- Backyard Pool Skating

- Later Years

While I believe that these sub-section titles accurately summarize their corresponding information, I am open to suggestions and comments regarding my revisions. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jackrenaud33 (talk • contribs) 04:46, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Jackrenaud33 (talk) 07:04, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Content Revisions: "History Section"
Hello fellow Wikipedians!

This specific editing post centralizes around the WP:NOV snd WP:NOR issues that exist throughout the body content of the article. The original version of this article was flagged by Wikipedia for being, "...written like a personal reflection, personal essay, or argumentative essay" as well as "...not [reflecting] the encyclopedic tone used on Wikipedia". These issues are primarily evident in the "History" section of the article; moreover, I analyzed the entire article with a specific focus on an objective tone. I have provided the revised "History" section below for reference.

Revised "History" Section

Initial Beginnings

''The Z-boys began as a surf team for the Zephyr surfboard shop in Santa Monica. Jeff Ho, Skip Engblom, and Craig Stecyk opened the shop, titled Jeff Ho Surfboards and Zephyr Production Team, in 1973, and they soon begin recruiting young locals to represent them in surfing competitions. 14-year-old Nathaniel Pratt was the first member of the team; he originally had worked in the shop as an apprentice surfboard shaper under Ho, Engblom, and Stecyk. In an interview with Juice Magazine, Pratt notes the following:''

"Within our world, the surf team was primary and the skate team was secondary. Allen Sarlo, Tony Alva, Jay Adams, Stacy Peralta, Chris Cahill, and myself were on the surf team before there was a skate team. We were junior members of the surf team along with John Baum, Jimmy, and Ricky Tavarez, and Brian Walker. Guys like Ronnie Jay, Wayne Inouye, Wayne Saunders, Pat Kaiser, Barry Amos, Jeff Sibley, Bill Urbany, and Adrian Reif were the top dogs. The history, skill, and accomplishments of all the team members was represented in those shirts. Then we added Bob Biniak, Wentzle Ruml, Paul Constantineau, Jim Muir, Shogo Kubo, and Peggy Oki to the skate team so that a team shirt represented a decent number of people."

''In 1974, Allen Sarlo, Jay Adams, Tony Alva, Chris Cahill, and Stacey Peralta joined the Zephyr team; these local youths were street style and aggressive mannerisms both on and off the surfboard. The majority of the team lived in the "Dogtown" area of California; their primary surfing spot was the Cove at Pacific Ocean Park. However, thanks to the invention of urethane wheels, the Z-boys began to transition their surfing style to skateboarding.''

Formation of the Zephyr Competition Team

''In 1975, Cahill, Pratt, Adams, Sarlo, Peralta, and Alva became the first members of the official Zephyr skateboarding team. Soon after, the Zephyr shop gained the final members of their team, making the total number 12 in all. These additional members were: Bob Biniak, Paul Constantineau, Jim Muir, Peggy Oki, Shogo Kubo, and Wentzle Ruml. The team began to practice in the backs of four schools in the surrounding area; it was at these asphalt banks that the Z-boys showcased their ability to transition surfing style to skateboarding. Taking inspiration from surfer Larry Bertleman, the Z-boys would skate low to the ground, dragging their hands against the concrete as if they were riding a wave.''

The Del Mar Nationals

''The Z-Boys' first appearance at a skateboard competition occurred at the 1975 Del Mar Nationals; the contest was the first major skateboarding competition since the mid-1960s. Their low, aggressive style in the freestyle section of the competition, though innovative, was critiqued by the older establishment of skateboarding. However, half of the finalists at the end of the competition were members of the Zephyr Competition Team. The performance of Z-Boys such as Jay Adams marked the beginning of a national change in the style of skateboarding.''

Backyard Pool Skating

''From 1976 to 1977, Southern California experienced a major drought that contributed to the 1st and 4th driest years in Californian history. In an effort to conserve water, neighborhood homes were draining their backyard swimming pools, leaving empty bowls of smooth concrete. The Z-boys took advantage of the sloping walls of the pools to push the boundary of innovation when it came to aerial skateboarding. Craig Stecyk's photographs of the Z-Boys' aerial maneuvers appeared in Skateboarder Magazine under a series titled "Dogtown Articles"; Stecyk's collections aided in the spike of skateboard popularity in the late 20th century''

Later Years

''Following the success of the "Dogtown Articles", the Z-Boys witnessed an exponential rise in public popularity. Due to growing interest from rival companies, many Z-Boys left in favor of more lucrative sponsorships. By 1977, the Zephyr Competition Team had ceased to exist. While the existence of the Zephyr team was short-lived, the Z-Boys are still widely regarded as one of the most influential teams in skateboarding history.''

Furthermore, this article was also flagged by Wikipedia as "...[needing] additional citations for verification." In order to mitigate this issue, I incorporated several additional sources into each sub-section as inline citations; I believe that this inclusion allows the article to more closely follow the guidelines specified by WP:NOR. The inline citations have been incorporated into the article, and I have listed the additional sources below:

Sources:


 * The History of Dogtown and the Z-Boys
 * When skateboarding shook the world
 * The Z-Boys: The Skateboarding Pioneers of Dogtown
 * How the 1970s California Drought Helped Invent Bowl Skating
 * Dogtown Chronicles: Nathan Pratt — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jackrenaud33 (talk • contribs) 06:35, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Jackrenaud33 (talk) 07:04, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Content Revision: "Members" and "See also" Sections
Hello fellow Wikipedians!

This editing post focuses on the removal of excess information that cannot be verified in accordance with WP:NOR standards (primarily evident in the "Members" section). The removal of the information promotes a more visually-appealing and clear aesthetic for the article. I have included both the original and revised lists of the members to showcase my revisions.

Original


 * Tony Alva
 * Bob Biniak (June 2, 1958 - February 25, 2010)
 * Chris Cahill (December 5, 1956 - June 24, 2011)
 * Aspers Aspinall (only member of Z-Boys who started surfing and skateboarding on Scarborough's seafront)
 * Jay Adams (February 3, 1961 - August 15, 2014)
 * Jim Muir (older brother of Suicidal Tendencies' Mike Muir)
 * Nathan Pratt
 * Paul Constantineau
 * Peggy Oki
 * Shogo Kubo (September 19, 1959 - June 24, 2014)
 * Stacy Peralta
 * Wentzle Ruml IV
 * Allen Sarlo

Revised


 * Tony Alva
 * Bob Biniak
 * Chris Cahill
 * Aspers Aspinall
 * Jay Adams
 * Jim Muir
 * Nathan Pratt
 * Paul Constantineau
 * Peggy Oki
 * Shogo Kubo
 * Stacy Peralta
 * Wentzle Ruml IV
 * Allen Sarlo

I also have changed the title of the "See also" section to "Representation in Media". I believe that this revision more accurately represents the contents of the section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jackrenaud33 (talk • contribs) 06:52, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Jackrenaud33 (talk) 07:04, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Final Copyediting Revisions
Hello Fellow Wikipedians!

This final editing post focuses on the final syntactical revisions made to the document. The article was originally flagged by Wikipedia for issues regarding the guidelines set by WP:MOS. Thus, I analyzed the document to make sure that the titles, references, and syntax of the article adhered to the Manual of Style. I am not going to discuss every minor change that I made; however, I have listed the larger revisions below.


 * Restructuring of "Members" section to adhere to WP:MOS guidelines regarding sections and sub-sections
 * Corrected punctuation, capitalization, and other syntactical errors in the body content.

I have also incorporated an invisible comment regarding both the References and External Links of the article. Following the revisions made to the document, some of the original references and links are no longer applicable to the article; however, rather than deleting them, I have simply commented on this issue. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jackrenaud33 (talk • contribs) 06:57, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Jackrenaud33 (talk) 07:04, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Other member claims
Have heard it asserted by his son Capron, that Robert Funk was a member or associate of this crew. Is there a way to get this corroborated? - knoodelhed (talk) 20:24, 10 July 2021 (UTC)