Talk:ZeniMax Media

Untitled
So does ZeniMax do anything more than exist to parent Bethesda? Deleuze 20:45, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Yes; there are/were other divisions, but Bethesda is currently the most important. They used to be into web design and 3D animation; they also do mobile games. Whether or not ZeniMax is currently worth a separate entry, instead of a redirect, is debatable. Josephgrossberg 22:16, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Now that they own Bethesda AND id, they certainly are. Ausir (talk) 17:37, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

This article has some distinction issues with Bethesda Softworks and Bethesda Game Studios, at least in the intro. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.100.250.250 (talk) 07:04, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

This article reads more like an advertisement or end of year profit report for the company. I doubt the impartiality of most of its content. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.45.25.87 (talk) 04:22, 4 October 2016 (UTC)

History Section Needs Rewrite
The current history section is just a list of activities. I plan on rewriting it into a new Overview section. I'll try to preserve most of the information, but will remove things that look unnecessary. If someone wants to make a revision to reinsert things they deem essential to the article, feel free to do so. Shaded0 (talk) 21:28, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Merger proposal
I propose that Battlecry Studios be merged into ZeniMax Media. I think that the content in the Battlecry Studios article can easily be explained in the context of ZeniMax Media, and the ZeniMax Media article is of a reasonable size that the merging of Battlecry Studios will not cause any problems as far as article size or undue weight is concerned. Battlecry Studios is not independently notable enough to have its own article per WP:GNG. Batard0 (talk) 06:41, 12 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Seems like this went no where so I have removed the merge note as being out of date. -- ferret (talk) 14:29, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Name
Does the ZeniMax name have anything to do with Zenithar, the god from the Elder Scrolls series? Perhaps one was named after the other. --BDD (talk) 19:41, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Not impossible, but to have anything worthy of entry into the article, we'd have to ask them whether this is the case. I think it's quite likely - Zenithar in Elder Scrolls is a God of profit and commerce. ZeniMax makes Elder Scrolls, and does have profits and commerce. ;) --BurritoBazooka (talk) 12:55, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Studio ownership
Need some help untangling which parent company owns which studios. ZeniMax owns Bethesda Softworks, but both are listed as owning the various studios. I believe ZeniMax owns them all, with the possible exception of Bethesda Game Studios. It seems that because Bethesda Softworks handles the publishing for all the studios, it's been attributed as the parent company as well. Easy example though, sources seem to be clear that ZeniMax bought id Software, and Bethesda Softworks simply is responsible for publisher. Will research further later today but if anyone has other input before I dig into all the sources. :) -- ferret (talk) 12:27, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
 * If you look at the very bottom of this link, it will say that Bethesda Softworks is "a ZeniMax Media company" - 86.165.237.101 (talk) 17:03, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Correct. That is not in doubt. The problem is that just because Bethesda Softworks is publisher, doesn't mean that the developer is owned by Bethesda Softworks. -- ferret (talk) 17:06, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I never ever said the Bethesda Softworks was owned by Bethesda. I said that the link clearly says Bethesda Softworks is "a ZeniMax Media" company. Not once did I ever say it was owned by Bethesda themselves. 86.165.237.101 (talk) 21:58, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I don't think you are understanding me.... For example, Arkane Studios. Both this page, ZeniMax Media, and the publisher, Bethesda Softworks, list Arkane Studios as a subsidiary. It can't be a subsidiary for both. Arkane Studios currently lists Bethesda Softworks as the parent company, but their website says that it's copyrighted by ZeniMax and links back to ZeniMax, not Bethseda Softworks. -- ferret (talk) 23:03, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

I've cleaned this up, since it keeps being switched around. The various studios are owned by ZeniMax Media. ZeniMax is the parent company. Bethesda Softworks is simply the publisher for the games, being publisher does not denote corporate parent-ship. I've also removed the "owner" field from all of the infoboxes again. This is not the correct usage of this field, which is intended to denote the ownership percentages of privately held companies. -- ferret (talk) 14:43, 17 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Since this is being changed again, please again note that being publisher for a studio does not mean that the publisher owns the studio. See ZeniMax's legal page which clearly does not list the studios as being under Bethesda Softworks (But does show Bethesda Game Studio as under Bethesda Softworks). -- ferret (talk) 17:55, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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Question regarding ZeniMax's Advisors
There is some confusion regarding this http://www.bloomberg.com/research/stocks/private/board.asp?privcapId=27422911 https://twitter.com/bogorad222/status/423536173739290624

ZeniMax Business Advisory Board Page on the official ZeniMax's website was removed back in 2009(to be specific the names that were displayed there like Terry McAuliffe,Tony Coelho etc were removed),but the Outside Advisors page existed until ZeniMax's website redesign in 2014,but it only listed the legal counsel,outside auditors but none of the advisors.

http://web.archive.org/web/20140510035847/http://www.zenimax.com/ http://web.archive.org/web/20131006133853/http://www.zenimax.com/bab.htm

So if anybody is reading this,i ask what should i do regarding this.Should the page remain the same? Or should i update the page,mentioning something like ZeniMax's Business Advisory Board existed between 1999-2009? Timur9008 (talk) 10:29, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
 * The lack of a webpage does not indicate whether or not the advisory board still exists. They may simply have stopped publishing the information to the public. I would reword the section to note that the board has (past tense) included the following individuals over time. We don't have a way to determine the present advisory board, but if its important enough to note at all we can still list who has been on it in the past. -- ferret (talk) 14:43, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply! Yes i agree with you,so i did as you suggested.I do think this should remain this way until there is concrete info on the Current State of ZeniMax's Advisory Board.Timur9008 (talk) 23:18, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
 * On a side note apperantly i was blind the Outside Advisors page has always been on ZeniMax's website,just the names that were there, were removed in late 2009.So you maybe right in your assumption that they may simply stopped publishing the information to the public.Timur9008 (talk) 21:22, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

Legal cases
Weaver case: ZeniMax tried to have the case dismissed, claiming Weaver had gone through emails of the other employees to find evidence for the case. (case cited). Weaver appealed and won the appeal. The lack of public discussion since then ==> settlement.

Oculus case: there's a section suggesting there is an ongoing Facebook case separate from the Oculus case, but the cite suggests it's all one suit (the one that was settled). Guardlifer (talk) 05:02, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

Other
Financials - Don't know why these financial data are featured so prominently on this and related articles. Someone wanted the details of those investments to be known... A single source like a filing would be a better source than these zine pieces.

Hostile takeover controversies - Bethesda_Softworks has a whole section on hostile-takeovers which seem to be as relevant here. Human Head, Arkane, &c. Either suspect and should be removed, or worth mentioning wherever subsidiaries come up? Guardlifer (talk) 05:28, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

3rd largest gaming company in America
I found this today. This is according to Robert Walsh the now-former technical director of enterprise business intelligence at ZeniMax. Can this be included in the lead? (at 0.52) Timur9008 (talk) 10:41, 16 February 2020 (UTC) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDtvx0DXYVM&list=PLenh213llmcb-fKw9goO-NX7VaTikJTuy&index=14
 * I wouldn't include this for several reasons. Firstly, this is a primary source as the statement comes directly from an executive of the company. He also does not explain in what way they are the biggest—revenue, employee count, net profit? Lastly (though probably less pressing), he doesn't seem to be that sure about what he is saying given the way he presents the information. If there is a secondary source that can explain why and how ZeniMax is the third-largest anything, it could be included of course. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 09:33, 20 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply. I"l try to find a secondary source if possible. Timur9008 (talk) 21:20, 20 February 2020 (UTC)

Can this be included? https://wesfiles.wesleyan.edu/courses/syllabi/1161-cweaver-014490-7275.pdf From the source: cofounder of Zenimax Media—the largest private Videogame company in the Americas. Timur9008 (talk) 14:16, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
 * , unless I missed it, I couldn't find any mention of how it is the largest--revenue? Assets? Employee count? The document also appears to have been written by Weaver, a founder of the company. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 14:27, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

Employee Count
I think this needs an update. According to Linkedin(I know, not the best source but we don't have to list it specifically because here we don't list one either), ZeniMax employs between 1000-5000 people. This seems to be accurate. The same applies for Warner Bros. Interactive Entertainment at least according to one interview I've read. Timur9008 (talk) 15:55, 7 March 2020 (UTC)

Logo
Shouldn't this be updated? The old logo can be put in the history section to improve the article's quality. Timur9008 (talk) 21:49, 15 May 2020 (UTC) The one on ZeniMax's website is a black one. https://www.zenimax.com/

Board
Is mentioning who is on it irrelevant? Ferret? 92.20.135.243 (talk) 16:44, 13 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes. A clearly politically motivated edit to mention that a Trump family member is on the board, while not listing the rest of the board members, is irrelevant and POV pushy. Reliable secondary sources have not commented on it, so it's not relevant to the article to track the many and often changed board members. -- ferret (talk) 18:28, 13 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Changed how often? It's usually years. Also, this lists them, using a primary source too... 92.20.135.243 (talk) 01:48, 14 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Board of trustees is different, but either way completely irrelevant to this article. We do not typically list the board of directors, especially non-notable ones, without secondary coverage. -- ferret (talk) 02:03, 14 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Are they so different, isn't the former for charities, latter for for-profits? Also, there are secondary sources... 92.20.135.243 (talk) 09:50, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
 * That source is false though. Robert Trump has been a ZeniMax Board member since the company was founded(1999), same with the rest of the Board members except for Cal Ripken, Jr, Michael Dominguez and Jerry Bruckheimer who all joined the ZeniMax board back in 2007. Timur9008 (talk) 13:39, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

Rob Walsh Interview&one other question
1)Can contents from this article be incorporated into this one?  Timur9008 (talk) 12:57, 28  June 2020 (UTC) https://siliconangle.com/2017/10/13/big-data-leads-transformation-pc-gaming/

Specifically this quote. "At ZeniMax, in-game transactions are increasingly the focus of its business."

2)Can ZeniMax's advisors be mentioned again given there are secondary sources covering this?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/gaming-company-zenimax-receives-99-million-funding/

https://thefederalist.com/2013/10/16/terry-mcauliffe-best-used-car-salesman-world/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/business/2005/08/15/out-of-the-dark-and-into-the-spotlight/01e11d6e-e6a0-4c5a-8a6a-435c16e4fee8/

Per the recent ZeniMax website update
ZeniMax updated their website today. Every mention of the Board of the Directors&management has been removed. What should we do with the Wikipedia page, given now we don't know if Altman is still CEO or not. https://www.zenimax.com/about

Timur9008 (talk) 12:24, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
 * We will probably not need perpetual confirmation of this. Since ZeniMax is a high-profile company, it will be known when Altman steps down. Otherwise, we can still rely on the credits in Bethesda's games for confirmation. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 10:19, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
 * what should we do with the template then?  Timur9008 (talk) 21:49, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:ZeniMax_Media
 * More or less the same situation, although I found it unnecessary to list every studio head for every ZeniMax studio ever (which is also not quite the point of the template). I cut it down to the founders, which is future-proof. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 09:48, 10 August 2020 (UTC)

Owner?
Since Microsoft confirmed that it was acquiring this company, wouldn't it make sense to put something in their title card saying "Owner: Microsoft (Pending)". I remember when Sprint had the same thing happened when they were in the middle of being bought by T-Mobile Bruh32123 (talk) 05:29, 8 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Microsoft/Xbox Game Studios should not be listed in the infobox until the acquisition is completed. The acquisition is not definitive, so listing it preemptively violates WP:CRYSTAL. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 11:17, 8 October 2020 (UTC)

Regarding James L. Leder and Cindy L. Tallent
ZeniMax Europe list both as as replaced by other people. Can we remove them from key people from this article? or should we wait for confirmation. Timur9008 (talk) 00.20, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Division vs. subsidiary?
According to ZeniMax's "about" page, Bethesda Softworks is a division, not a subsidiary. https://www.zenimax.com/about - "Its Bethesda Softworks division, founded in 1986, has a long history of success as a publisher of award-winning video games." — Preceding unsigned comment added by FoyaBeninax (talk • contribs) 03:33, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Companies do this a lot for various reasons but mostly as a buzzword. In reality, BethSoft is a LLC and therefore a subsidiary. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 08:04, 19 June 2021 (UTC)

$7.5 billion or $8.1 billion
Per Microsoft's most recent annual report. Should we change this? (page 39) Timur9008 (talk) 10:58, 7 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Yes. The source also provides more details, like cash equivalents acquired. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 10:50, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

About P7S1
I feel that the reader needs to see that "ProSiebenSat.1 Media (a former Kirch Group subsidiary, now 26.58% owned by MFE - MediaForEurope, which is majority-owned by the Berlusconi family's Fininvest Group)" would be good for readers, because it gives some insight, and IS relevant. So, it would be "In October 2007, after ProSiebenSat.1 Media (a former Kirch Group subsidiary, now 26.58% owned by MFE - MediaForEurope, which is majority-owned by the Berlusconi family's Fininvest Group) purchased SBS Broadcasting Group and inherited its stake in ZeniMax Media, now 9% of the shares, ProSiebenSat.1 Media announced it would intensify its relationship with ZeniMax. ProSiebenSat.1 Media launched SevenGames.com, the international edition of its German-language game platform, in December and worked with ZeniMax to develop online games." Doesn't this sound good to you? 2603:6011:AFF0:2CF0:90CC:EFB5:570A:5124 (talk) 17:09, 15 June 2024 (UTC)


 * How is it relevant to ZeniMax? ProSiebenSat was the one interacting with ZeniMax. It's long chain of ownership is irrelevant. If someone wants that detail about ProSiebenSat, they click the link to that article. -- ferret (talk) 17:13, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * It IS relevant, not irrelvant, as you said. It's not long, though. So, no clicking to that article is needed. It's all there, and no need for removal.2603:6011:AFF0:2CF0:90CC:EFB5:570A:5124 (talk) 17:14, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * It's not relevant to ZeniMax, which is what this article is about. If you care about ProSiebenSat, you click to its article. -- ferret (talk) 17:17, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * I don't care if they click on an article to ProSiebenSat, it's pretty boring to them. That's why I added them to avoid the hassle of getting them to ProSiebenSat. In fact, you want me to remove the link to ProSiebenSat.1? 2603:6011:AFF0:2CF0:90CC:EFB5:570A:5124 (talk) 17:20, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * ProSiebenSat.1 sold its stake in ZeniMax in August 2016. Mediaset, before merging into MFE, bought its first shares in ProSiebenSat.1 in May 2019 -- 3 years later. Beyond the fact that ProSiebenSat.1's ownership situation at the time of its ZeniMax stake ownership (98.1% in free float) had no noticable impact on ZeniMax, Mediaset/MFE was never anywhere near a ZeniMax stake. We do not use this article to list off random, unrelated facts about some other topic; if the reader wants to know more about ProSiebenSat.1 (say, its ownership structure after May 2019), they can and should head to that article. IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 17:23, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * There. I removed the link. Now they can search for P7S1 instead. 2603:6011:AFF0:2CF0:90CC:EFB5:570A:5124 (talk) 17:25, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Why are you removing the link? Are you being deliberately disruptive now? -- ferret (talk) 17:43, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * No. I'm redirecting them to use the search bar instead. 2603:6011:AFF0:2CF0:90CC:EFB5:570A:5124 (talk) 17:45, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Blocked for pointy disruption. At this point essentially vandalism. -- ferret (talk) 17:49, 15 June 2024 (UTC)