Talk:Zeta Reticuli/Archive 1

LV-426
Hi,

Just wondering from the Alien series, is LV-426 actually a real planet in the Zeta Reticuli system?

Thanks,

J.A --- 22 June 2005 --- 18:20 BST/GMT ---


 * No, it is purely fictional. --Jyril 17:54, Jun 22, 2005 (UTC)

A perfect example of why this sort of thing should be kept strictly on the pop culture page, if anywhere at all ever. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.142.152.128 (talk) 21:07, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Slimmed down the Ufology section
I find ufology interesting (and I have respect for the effort people put into it), but I don't think this is the right place for an extensive excursion into it. I removed a lot of weasel words from this section and slimmed it down a bit. Really, though, I think it should be one or two lines pointing readers to a broader standalone article on "Star systems prominent in ufology." Joseph N Hall 10:07, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Someone has been adding this back. I concur with Joseph with regards to the length of the section, so please explain in detail why the ufology section should be expanded, and provide relevant citations for any claims. Michaelbusch 23:36, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * If it were better cited and maybe trimmed down (e.g., the specific Astronomy magazine article with contributors), would you have a problem with expanding this section a little bit, to clarify more Fish's and other arguments about the Betty hill star map linking it to Zeta Reticuli? (Or do you think maybe just save that for the Hill abduction article?) Also, for better or worse, this whole Project Serpo stuff has been linked to Zeta Reticuli.  Maybe just a line saying that it has, with link, and leave the arguments pro & con for that article?Dr Fil 22:32, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I would leave this article as it is, and the ufology material can go on the Hill 'abduction' article. Michaelbusch 22:40, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * How about this version, with the Fish-Hill rewritten, I think more clearly expressing the arguments in very abbreviated form and balanced I think (though summary arguments pro and con in italics could be chopped and reader can just go to reference for details), with unnecessary material on the "Greys" removed (to tighten it up a little bit more), and with a citation to relevant Astronomy magazine article. Also a shorter summary (only ~50 words) and link to Project Serpo, which again, for better or worse, is the latest in attempts to link Zeta Reticuli to alien visitation. (I don't believe it myself, but for completeness it should be there in the section.)  All this adds very little to the length of the article, only about 140 reading words or maybe 20 seconds reading time in an already short article.  It isn't exactly going to strain the reader and it does make the section more complete and up-to-date.  If you chop out suggested stuff in italics, the length is increased by only 25 reading words.  Length really isn't the issue here.Dr Fil 00:28, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Zeta Reticuli in ufology
The Zeta Reticuli system has gained significant popularity because of its connection with ufology. Some ufologists allege that Zeta Reticuli is home to an alien civilization referred to as the Greys that has been visiting Earth, studying and abducting humans, citing the 1961 Betty and Barney Hill abduction as support for their claim. Several years after the purported abduction, under hypnosis, Betty Hill drew a star map showing the relative positions of the aliens' home star and the Sun plus other nearby stars, as she said was shown to her by her abductors in a 3-dimensional projection. UFO researcher Marjorie Fish constructed a 3-dimensional model of nearby solar-type stars using the Gliese Catalog in an attempt to match the positions of these stars to the Hill map. She argued she got a good match when the stars were viewed from Zeta Reticuli. The Hill map and Fish's alleged match were extensively argued by Fish and various scientists in the December 1974 edition of Astronomy Magazine. Skeptics like Carl Sagan argued that the map was too vague to accurately pinpoint any particular star at all. Others more favorable to the map argued that two of the stars on the star map were not even known until the 1969 Gliese Catalog came out and that all the stars on the map connected by lines (said to be trade or frequently-traveled routes) fell in a plane, and thus very unlikely to happen by chance.
 * The section I've bolded is bollocks - for many reasons.

In an interview with George Knapp for a television documentary, Bob Lazar, the man who first described Area 51 as a secret UFO research facility, suggested that the UFO that he claimed to have helped reverse-engineer may have come from the vicinity of Zeta Reticuli. He claimed he learned this from United States Handbooks of E.B.E's (extra-biological entities) codes and conduct and from his superiors inside S-4. ''However Lazar also admits that this information may have been given to him in an attempt to misguide him. Critics point to many inconsistencies in Lazar's claims and he remains a controversial figure in the ufology world.''

More recently, starting in 2005, some alleged intelligence insiders have made highly controversial claims that Zeta Reticuli was instead home to a race of more benevolent aliens than the Greys and engaged in an exchange program involving human volunteers who went to and studied their planet, named Serpo. (See Project Serpo)


 * I don't think the Serpo stuff needs to be in this article at all. It isn't terribly notable.  At some point, I may review the entire Project Serpo article per my userpage. Michaelbusch 01:35, 7 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I think it's garbage myself, but that's not the point. It's the latest attempt to link Zeta Reticuli to alien visitation, and therefore should be briefly mentioned (just like Bob Lazar) and cited just for completeness.  But if you want to drop Serpo for now as you review it, I'm not going to fight with you, but please think about it.  What about the other changes to the Hill/Fish star-map paragraph? I think they make certain points clearer (also correct some minor errors) and are presented very matter-of-factly.  The more abridged version of my edit could be used, which would add only two lines to the overall article, even with Serpo in there, and two lines less long if Serpo was dropped.  There are already sufficient hedge words like "alleged" and "purported" to indicate various claims are disputed, so detailing the controversy to some extent is redundant and could be dropped.Dr Fil 02:50, 7 November 2007 (UTC)


 * One more point--notable just means just means being noted, i.e., widely known or discussed, not necessarily factual. Santa Claus and his flying reindeer are nonexistent but still notable because they are so widespread and deeply imbedded in the culture.  Joe Claus and his flying reindeer, maybe a well-known story in some neighborhood in Tulsa but not anywhere else, would probably not be notable in an encyclopedia.  Project Serpo has been widely discussed on the Net and in Ufological circles (mostly negatively), therefore notable in the present context.  Noting something does not mean one is giving it authenticity, just saying it is worthy of mention or discussion.Dr Fil 03:09, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I understand notability very well. My question is as follows: will anyone other than a die-hard ufologist give a damn about Project Serpo in a decade?  If you really want it in there, add a one-or-two sentence mention to the bottom of the section, but don't change what is there now - I've modified it for validity. Michaelbusch 03:53, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Greys Home world.
Zeta 2 Reticuli IV is the possible home world of the greys, I found it on these webpages.--Sonicobbsessed 18:51, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
 * There is no such thing as "Zeta 2 Reticuli IV". The pages are crap.— JyriL talk 22:01, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Have you been there ? Maybe you were there, but were not allowed near a window, screen. 65.163.112.225 07:41, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Extrasolar Planet
I have seen on a website about estrasolar planets that one has been found, then it was removed at the insistence of the govt. I googled "Extrasolar Planet/Zeta Reticili" and seen that on a site. 65.163.112.28 (talk) 06:23, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

ufology
just thought you should add that this system was discovered AFTER the drawing of it by abductees