Template:Did you know nominations/Albert W. Hicks

{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|Talk| 
 * The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by 97198 (talk) 08:20, 5 August 2019 (UTC)

{{DYK conditions}}

Albert W. Hicks

 * ... that pirate Albert W. Hicks was New York City's first underworld superstar?  Source 1: "He was the city’s first underworld superstar" . Source 2: The Last Pirate of New York
 * ALT1: ... that the last pirate of New York Albert W. Hicks originated the gangster clothing style, according to biographer Rich Cohen? Source: The Original Gangster Style Guy
 * ALT2: ... that P. T. Barnum's wax museum displayed axe-murderer and last pirate of New York Albert W. Hicks? Source: Cohen, Rich (June 4, 2019a). The Last Pirate of New York: A Ghost Ship, a Killer, and the Birth of a Gangster Nation
 * ALT3:... that the The Twilight Zone episode "The New Exhibit" features axe-murderer and last pirate of New York, Albert W. Hicks? DeVoe, Bill (2008). Trivia from The Twilight Zone. Albany, GA: Bear Manor Media. ISBN 978-1-59393-136-0.
 * ALT4:... that historian Rich Cohen considers gangster clothing fashion to have originated with the last pirate of New York, Albert W. Hicks? Source: The Original Gangster Style Guy
 * Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/10th millennium BC

5x expanded by GreenC (talk). Self-nominated at 16:25, 11 June 2019 (UTC).


 * I rewrote most of the article's previous text and added new text, pictures and sources. -- Green  C


 * Symbol voting keep.svg length and sources all look okay, the only issue I see is that a couple of the paragraphs in the article are unsourced, but I think that the citation just needs to be spread out through out to the article to make it clear where the information is coming from. Other than that everything looks ready to me Inter&#38;anthro (talk) 00:36, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
 * If you mean the section titled "Murder on the A.E. Johnson", the first line "Source: [1]" is the source for the entire section, which is better than the same cite after every sentence or paragraph. -- Green  C  01:40, 28 July 2019 (UTC)


 * Symbol question.svg and  A DYK nomination can't have this floating source line at the head of a section. Per Rule D2, every paragraph must contain at least one inline citation. And the hook fact must be immediately followed by an inline citation, even if it's the same citation that appears at the end of the paragraph. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 23:39, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
 * I've spread out the citation to the paragraphs I was concerned about. I understand GreenC's comment that using the same citation so many times in the same section might not be as ascetically appealing to the viewer, but hopefully it fixes the issue you've brought to our attention. Thanks you Inter&#38;anthro (talk) 00:06, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Thanks. The last 2 paragraphs under "Murder on the A.E. Johnson" and the last paragraph under "Legacy" still lack cites. Yoninah (talk) 00:17, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * There is no inline cite for the ALT1 hook fact (which I'd like to promote). And I wonder if a New York Times reporter is really the definitive source on Hicks establishing the "original gangster style"? Can this fact be verified by a more scholarly source? Yoninah (talk) 00:21, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * I've added more inline cites. It is an original idea sourced to Rich Cohen. I'm not aware of any journal sources. He is not a NYT reporter but a syndicated journalist, is best known for non-fiction books and does some screenwriting and collaborations with modern-day pirate Keith Richards.  --  Green  C  01:05, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * OK. So that idea should be credited to Cohen in the hook, just like you did in the article. Thanks for the extra cites. Yoninah (talk) 01:10, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * I updated ALT1. If that is what you mean. -- Green  C  02:11, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, although it's necessary, that "according to Rich Cohen" just clutters up the hook. I'm wondering if you could suggest a different hook based on some of the colorful (sourced) information in the article? Yoninah (talk) 20:31, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * added ALT2->4 --  Green  C  21:38, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
 * thank you for the alts. Since I'm now doing a review of the article, I read it through and don't see anywhere the hook fact that he was "the last pirate of New York". All I see is he was "one of the last persons executed for piracy in the United States". It seems this is another colorful tag given him by Rich Cohen. I think ALT3 will appeal to a lot of our readers, but eliminating that "last pirate of New York" bit. Yoninah (talk) 20:47, 30 July
 * Yoninah, Cohen spent 10 years researching the book, and it is the only book-length treatment of Hicks it is the most authoritative source we have. New York charged and executed a number of pirates in its history, the last was Hicks. He was charged under piracy laws because they had a better chance of securing a death penalty, but even by that time it was rare to charge anyone as a pirate. Nevertheless, the press and everyone was calling him a pirate, and Hicks played it up dressing in a pirate-like outfit on the day of his execution. Piracy is a central aspect of his 'legend' and identity. And he did in fact commit crimes on the sea and was convicted as a pirate. If you know of anyone else in New York who was later convicted as a pirate, I'm certain Rich Cohen would be interested in that information. --  Green  C  22:00, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Symbol confirmed.svgSymbol voting keep.svg OK. Thank you for such a detailed explanation. I'm approving ALT3 as AGF for an offline ref, cited inline, and ALT4 as verified and cited inline. My preference is for ALT3. Rest of review per Inter&#38;anthro. Good to go. Yoninah (talk) 22:07, 30 July 2019 (UTC) |}}