Template:Did you know nominations/John Ronald Shafto Adair

Close paraphrasing

John Ronald Shafto Adair

 * ... that in 1928, Australian aviator and businessman John Ronald Shafto Adair managed to safely land an Avro Avian airplane even after its engine had fallen out?
 * Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/1956 Alabama Crimson Tide football team

Created/expanded by Bonkers The Clown (talk). Self nom at 13:05, 25 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Symbol question.svg Sources are OK, length is (just about) OK and date is fine, but what I'm not getting from this article is what makes this guy notable. This source talks about him being an "aviation pioneer", which I don't see reflected anywhere in the article. What did he do that was pioneering? I'd suggest fleshing the article out a bit more to cover that and to come up with a revised hook that would be, if I may say so, a bit more interesting. Prioryman (talk) 00:34, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Guy got an OBE, founded an airline, served the Great War, surely that's notable. I wouldn't mind if you suggest a more interesting hook. You're welcome to do so. But thanks for the advice, I'll try to "flesh" out more. Cheers. Bonkers The Clown  (Nonsensical Babble) 03:56, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Revised hook. Does it sound more interesting now? Bonkers The Clown  (Nonsensical Babble) 06:26, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Symbol confirmed.svg Yep, looks good to me. (How the heck does an engine manage to fall out of a plane??) Prioryman (talk) 12:53, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks! Hmm, good question. I don't know...? Haha. Cheers. Bonkers The Clown  (Nonsensical Babble) 12:56, 27 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Symbol question.svg I like the revised hook a lot, too, but the key sentence (about the engine falling out) does not have an inline source immediately after it, which is a DYK requirement. Can you please add the source citation to the end of that sentence? Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 04:57, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Sure thing, done! I didn't cite it immediately after as I thought it would be understood that one source cites two sentences. But since its a requirement, its your call then. Cheers. Bonkers The Clown  (Nonsensical Babble) 05:09, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Pictogram voting keep.svg Thanks! Gave it an AGF tick since the source is offline. Do you happen to know whether the engineless landing occurred while he was still working for someone else, or was it after he founded his airline? Since both happened in the same year, one wonders whether the landing made him decide to work for himself, or if he managed to save himself and his new airline... BlueMoonset (talk) 05:25, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Good question, unfortunately I'm not very sure. The source does not specify, but I'm guessing during that period of the engineless landing (c. 1928) he was already working for himself. Bonkers The Clown  (Nonsensical Babble) 05:44, 28 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Symbol question.svg Citation needed tag. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 12:25, 31 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Gone. Cheers. Bonkers The Clown  (Nonsensical Babble) 16:22, 31 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Symbol possible vote.svg While the citations have been supplied, I'm concerned with the closeness this article has to the Australian Dictionary of Biography source ("was cremated with Anglican rites" is the exact same wording), which I believe should—in its inline citations—offer the online link that is given in the External links entry of the same bio (and shouldn't be listed under External links since it's cited in the article body). Another (still uncited) example from the dictionary: "He married a divorcee Bertha Ella, née Savery, late Kither, on 16 January 1937 at St Andrew's Presbyterian Church": the date is displaced in the article here and parentheses added, but it's otherwise identical. There are other instances of close paraphrasing elsewhere, and looking at this source also points up that the article is inaccurate in a few places: in context, it reads as if Adair left the AIF in 1918, when it was 1919, and Queensland Airlines was not another airline, but a later name for Aircrafts Pty, Ltd., a fact made clear both in the above dictionary and in the Airways Museum web page. Some of the sourcing is odd: the word "Lieutenant" is sourced to his childhood school's website and the picture of him found there; the fact that he was an aviator and businessman sourced to a questionable "Adair family crest" commercial surname/heraldry site. Using one of the far more authoritative secondary source sites would be more appropriate in these cases. BlueMoonset (talk) 16:44, 31 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Symbol delete vote.svg Author has been quite active on Wikipedia, yet has not addressed the issues above in over a week. Reluctantly closing this, as I liked the hook, but this is simply not in the necessary shape to appear on the main page. BlueMoonset (talk) 19:42, 9 January 2013 (UTC)