Template:Did you know nominations/Metropolis of Ephesus

Metropolis of Ephesus, Metropolis of Nicomedia, Metropolis of Pergamon, Metropolis of Philadelphia, Metropolis of Smyrna, Metropolis of Chalcedon
Created/expanded by Alexikoua (talk), Cplakidas (talk). Nominated by Alexikoua (talk) at 22:32, 13 November 2012 (UTC)
 * ... that from the Orthodox metropolises of the Ecumenical Patriarchate in western Anatolia and once early centers of Christianity of Ephesus, Nicomedia, Pergamon, Philadelphia, Smyrna and Chalcedon, only the last remains active today?


 * Nice to see how many new articles you nominated in just one hook. Now, you owe us the corresponding number of QPQs. Quid pro quo means a more-or-less equal exchange. There are six submissions here, and no reviews yet. Let's get a party going. Poeticbent  talk  20:23, 15 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Reviewed (6):
 * Great Colonnade at Palmyra
 * Harbaqa Dam
 * Great Colonnade at Apamea
 * The Father Christmas Letters
 * Christmas pickle
 * Kappa Andromedae &mdash; The preceeding, unsigned additions were made by  15/26 November 2012
 * Symbol redirect vote4.png Full review needed. Any takers?  Poeticbent  talk  17:18, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

A check on Metropolis of Ephesus shows copying from the main source. For example (article then source):
 * in the second half of the 9th century when the autocephalous archbishopric of smyrna was promoted to a metropolis ephesus was deprived of
 * in the second half of the 9th century when the autocephalous archbishopric of smyrna was promoted to metropolis ephesos was deprived of
 * Metropolis of Nicomedia also shows copying, although not so bad. But still too close.  For example:
 * the population increase and economic growth of the Orthodox Christians, the institutionalized elevation of the metropolitans to top representatives of the Greek-Orthodox communities in the provincial administration, and the flowering of education
 * population increase and economic growth of the Orthodox Christian communities, as well as the institutionalized elevation of the Orthodox metropolitans as representatives of the Greek-Orthodox communities in Ottoman provincial administration, and the thriving of education
 * Metropolis of Pergamon again had copying. For example,
 * however it soon ceased to exist due to the turkish conquest of the region in the 1310s the subsequent decline of the local christian element
 * however it soon ceased to exist because of the turkish conquest of the region in the 1310s and as a result the decline of the christian population
 * I have not done a complete or detailed check. I suggest the authors take a shot at reworking the phrasing of the articles, then ask for a fresh review. Facts can be copied, no problem, as can technical jargon like "the autocephalous archbishopric of smyrna", but phrases that may be considered creative expression such as "institutionalized elevation" cannot be copied, since that would violate copyright. Aymatth2 (talk) 16:39, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
 * I' ve just did a carefull check and made all necessary corrections. It appears that the above issue is fixed now.Alexikoua (talk) 14:10, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

This set of articles relies heavily on corresponding articles in the Encyclopedia of the Hellenic World. I would be more comfortable if the content were assembled from a broader set of sources. The narrow sourcing is not an absolute roadblock, but does mean that special care is needed to avoid anything that could be considered copying. Even where only facts are being presented, changes in the choice and sequence of words would be advisable. Checking Metropolis of Nicomedia, there are still problems. A - Article. S - Source
 * A. The population ... was relatevely [sic] small, compared to that of the other dioceses of Asia Minor due to its limited geographical extent.
 * S. Its population was smaller than that of the other dioceses of Asia Minor due to its small geographical extent
 * A. The precise limits of the metropolitan area can be accurately drawn only from the late Ottoman period
 * S. The precise limits of the Nicomedia province can be accurately reported only for the late Ottoman period
 * A. it incorporated its immediate hinterland, the kaza of Izmid and Adapazarı, Yalova, Karamürsel and Kendere
 * C. it incorporated only the immediate hinterland of Nikomideia, the kaza of İzmid and the kazas of Adapazarı, Yalova, Karamürsel and Kendere
 * A. The section of Apollonias virtually included the kaza of Mihaliç, part of the kaza of Mudanya, but not the city itself, as well as the island Kalolimnos (modern İmralı)
 * S. The section of Apollonias virtually included the entire kaza of Mihaliç, part of the kaza of Mudanya (excluding the city itself), as well as the island Kalolimnos (Imralı).
 * A. ... the institutional incorporation of the Patriarchate of Constantinople into the Ottoman structures
 * S. ... the institutional incorporation of the Orthodox Patriarchate into the Ottoman structures.

A partial check on Metropolis of Chalcedon also show issues:
 * A. From the mid-19th century the diocese of Chalcedon prospered thanks to the significant demographic growth and economic development of the local Orthodox population.
 * S. From the mid-19th century onward the diocese of Chalkedon prospered thanks to the significant demographic growth and economic development of the Christian Orthodox population of the province
 * A. However, the subsequent decline in the Greek population of Constantinople, especially from 1964 on, has left the diocese of Chalcedon with a very small congregation today
 * S. However, the subsequent decline in the Greek population of Constantinople, especially from 1964 on, has left the diocese of Chalkedon with a very small congregation today
 * A. The first known metropolitan of the time, Joseph, is recorded in 1477
 * S. The first known metropolitan of the time, Joseph, is recorded in 1477.
 * A. had immediate access to the Sultan, to whom they announced the election of the new Ecumenical Patriarch
 * S. had immediate access to the Sultan, to whom they announced the election of the Patriarch

This is still just spot-checking, not a full review, but indicates a high level of copying that has not yet been addressed. I am reluctant to continue with comparison until I am confident that a more thorough overhaul has been done. Maybe another editor can handle the next round... Aymatth2 (talk) 20:25, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

.

I give up on this one. A duplication check on the Ephesus article still shows very substantial similarity. I do not see serious progress. Two examples: I spent most of this afternoon tinkering with the Ephesus article, basically tracking down other sources for the statements and replacing copied text with information from those sources, so it is better. There is no shortage at all of sources and information. But there are still many areas of close copying as in the examples above. It would take a fair amount of additional work to straighten this one out, and then there are five more. I do not have the energy. And once that had been done, the task of a thorough review of all six articles would be utterly intimidating. But I am not sure what should be done with the articles. Copyright violations should be deleted. I am tired and am going to leave this for another editor to make the final decision. Aymatth2 (talk) 22:11, 9 December 2012 (UTC)
 * A. the council convened in Ephesus, which dealt with the issue of accepting the Monophysite circular of Basiliscus. Patriarch Akakios of Constantinople (472-489) refused to accept these decisions and forced the Emperor to annul them. The bishops of the Diocese of Asia had to renounce the decisions of that council, while the metropolitan of Ephesus, Paul, was deposed during the reign of Emperor Zeno.
 * S. the council convened in Ephesos, which dealt with the issue of accepting the (Monophysite) circular of Basiliscus (475). Patriarch Akakios of Constantinople (472-489) rejected the decisions and forced Emperor Basiliscus to abrogate them. The bishops of Asiana had to renounce the decisions of that council, while the metropolitan of Ephesos, Paul, was deposed under the reign of Zenon (474-475, 476-491)
 * A. Monophysite metropolitan John was a significant missionary, who preached in the city of Ephesus as well as in the nearby valley of the Meander River and Sardis. By permission of Emperor Justinian I he converted about 80,000 pagans to Christianity.
 * S. The Monophysite John was a significant missionary, preaching inside Ephesos as well as in the valley of the Meander River and in the city of Sardis. By permission of Emperor Justinian I he converted about 80,000 heathens to christianity.