Template:Did you know nominations/Nirmala (novel)


 * The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as |this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 22:58, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Nirmala (novel)

 * . .. that The Second Wife is the English translated title for the Hindi novel Nirmala meaning "virtuous"?



Created by The Herald (talk). Self nominated at 15:34, 5 April 2014 (UTC).


 * Symbol possible vote.svg Removed the image, as non-free files are not allowed in DYK. Also, please rewrite the hook to comply with the format requirements. (Note to future commentators: I did not review the article itself). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sven Manguard (talk • contribs) 16:10, 5 April 2014‎ (UTC)
 * Made the change..The Herald 16:37, 5 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Full review needed. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:35, 30 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Symbol question.svg Right, size and age ok. This line - "The novel is centered around a young girl Nirmala, who is forced to marry a man of his father’s age. " ...should be her father's age"? more to come. Ref 3 and Ref 5 are blogs and not by notable people, hence should be replaced. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 09:19, 3 May 2014 (UTC)


 * - can you see this source on google books? I can in Australia - it adds some background and might be more useful in sourcing. Also this Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 09:28, 3 May 2014 (UTC)
 * , Sorry, I can't view it in India. But for with 2nd the cites are useful. Sorry for the typo up there. Thank you..The herald 12:03, 3 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Minor correction made to hook: "virtuous" should be in quotes rather than italics. BlueMoonset (talk) 18:02, 3 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Symbol confirmed.svg good to go then. Non RS sources replaced Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 21:10, 3 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Symbol question.svg Are you sure about that? Ref2 (used to support the hook) appears to be a random reader review.  Ref3 (used to support entire plot section) is a wordpress blog. --ThaddeusB (talk) 03:41, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Plot sections often don't have references. So we can just remove that. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:20, 4 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Symbol delete vote.svg Unfortunately the Theme section is—almost in its entirety and with only the slightest paraphrasing—from FN6 (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sachi.nirmala_premchand_hindi.AOUCEFZDJMLDYOKD). Without Theme—given the extent of the copying involved, I've had to delete it—all that's left of this is a Plot section, which is confusingly written, and even some of that is copied from FN4. (I don't have time right now to determine the full extent of it.) Under the circumstances, I don't see how this can be considered for DYK; I'd like someone who is experienced to determine whether this article should be removed entirely. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:35, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Damn - didn't see that. I'll have a look later - middle of Sunday here and RL chores beckon.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:20, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
 * FYKI, I have made some changes..The herald 12:00, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
 * are you able to fix the spelling and grammar errors? Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:33, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Sure, how now..??..The herald 05:24, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Sorry, have been distracted elsewhere. Reference 2 should not be used as it is a blog. More later. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:35, 10 May 2014 (UTC)
 * And rephrase "Bhuvanmohan tries to woo Nirmala which sent him to commit suicide after his wife Sudha, Nirmala's friend, scolds him" Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:24, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
 * ..How now.?? Please can you complete the review before 15th (IST). I am going for a vacation and won't be back before June 24. I am gonna enforce wikibreak and may not edit too. Thank you. The herald 08:50, 13 May 2014 (UTC)
 * I am not sure why you are using this book published by Evergreen Books (which I can't find online) as a source. I pointed out some online material which would make a more detailed summary. If you feel that you are unable to write it, then say so and I will have a go, but after the previous copyvio I think we really want to see a book and how it is used. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:10, 13 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Here in India, you may not find an online book for Evergreens (may be). It would be better if you could have a go. But I have made some refs to it. Thank you. The herald 08:32, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

I suppose as I've copyedited it a bit and removed and rewrote the theme section, someone else better review the hook (?) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:51, 15 May 2014 (UTC)
 * ..I have provided a reference to the hook. Is that fine..? The herald 14:17, 15 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Symbol possible vote.svg While I appreciate that the article is now free from issues of close paraphrasing and the like, the fact remains that this is an extremely unbalanced article: out of 2099 prose characters, 1562 are devoted to the plot, and only 221 to one sentence each about publication and theme. As it says in WP:DYKSG, Articles that fail to deal adequately with the topic are also likely to be rejected. There are no reviews, nothing about reaction when it was published, nothing about influence on Indian fiction (if any): in short, it's lacking information about why it might be important or notable. Unless the article's body is expanded significantly in non-plot areas, I don't believe it should be approved for DYK. (Question to Cas Liber about the hook: how do you source a translated word? The fact that "Nirmala" means "virtuous" is not in the given source; if it's a direct translation of the word, then I'm not sure how that's done, and if that's just what the name means, as in how baby name books explain what various names mean, then I think a source would be required.) BlueMoonset (talk) 02:38, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Have expended commentary to five sentences (hard work!), which gives some indication of signficance. Actually there must be more interesting hooks, such as:


 * ALT1 ... that the 1928 Hindi novel Nirmala uses fiction to promote social reform of the dowry system in India?
 * ALT2 ... that Munshi Premchand's novel Nirmala first appeared as a serial in the magazine Chand?


 * will see if I can find anything else Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:50, 16 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Cas Liber, it's been a couple of weeks. Any luck in the search? (I've struck the original hook.) BlueMoonset (talk) 02:12, 1 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I've expanded the commentary a little but not a huge amount. After looking, if you think it is still too unbalanced then by all means can the nom. I spent some time looking so what it is is what it is. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 11:43, 1 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Symbol confirmed.svg New full review  for ALT2 for ALT1. Article created on 4 April, so it is new enough (for 5 April) and it is long enough. Image in article is fair use. This editor does not need to do a QPQ. No disambig links, external links OK. ALT2 ALT1 checks out online with citation #3, and offline with citation #7 (accepted AGF). I understand that issues raised in response to this nomination are now resolved because the article has since been corrected. Although the plot section is proportionately large, there is sufficient material now in the header and in the publication and theme section to confirm notability. Good to go. --Storye book (talk) 11:57, 1 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Symbol confirmed.svg Adding approval for ALT1, which is supported by the inline source given, and which I found more interesting than ALT2. YMMV. BlueMoonset (talk) 18:22, 1 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Now that Storye book has corrected ALT2 to ALT1, striking ALT2 as it has not been approved. Also added a URL to citation 7 in the article, so it's now online. BlueMoonset (talk) 18:48, 1 June 2014 (UTC)