Template talk:African electronic dance music

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The ordering of the lists and group is off, and there are mismatched brackets. I have tried to fix this but had no luck. Does anyone know what to do? 47.36.25.163 (talk) 18:53, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

Doubtful move
Not an expert, but isn't Mahraghanat basically in the same boat as, say, Singeli? Both are heavily EDM-influenced, but at the same time heavily locally-sourced genres, which are electronic only due to the fact that electronic production became a de-facto standard music production technique in our time, and thus most new dance genres will automatically be categorized as electronic dance music by the virtue of it? I vote for yet another category called "Northern Africa" where Mahraghanat should get into. Most sources I see explicitly say that Mahraghanat is a fusion of EDM/techno with this and that, eg, @Solidest, due to his "not an EDM genre" edit summary 178.121.4.172 (talk) 11:03, 31 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks for notice. I think it can be returned if there are sources for it. My edit was based on that it is not always electronic. Sometimes it's instruments + reggaeton rhythms or trap + autotune. And we don't consider reggaeton or original trap (drum machine alone) to be electronic music on wiki. Solidest (talk) 12:00, 31 July 2023 (UTC)
 * The thing is, they haven't evolved from EDM/techno/house/trance/dnb/whatever, but saying that latest trap subgenres and latest reggaeton aren't electronic dance is not reflective of reality anymore.
 * In some instances trap sounds can be traced back to EDM (rage music <- pierre bourne + f1lthy (<-hit-boy's production of the late 00s) + trap music (<- crunk <- lil jon), where both lil jon and hit-boy were at time impressed by Eurodance and trance), but in some instances we cannot trace such lineage (reggaeton and dancehall became totally electronic not due to EDM, but due to prevalence and ubiquitousness of digital audio workstations).
 * We can take the infamous recent "K-POP" by Travis Scott and argue that it's not EDM, but we cannot argue with the fact that it's 100% electronic, and that it is a 100% dance hit. Another example is moombahton, which is basically reggaeton with a little bit different synthwork than reggaeton. But still both moombahton and reggaeton have the same sluggish dembow rhythm and both are 100% made in FL Studio, only using different VSTI synths.
 * The issue is that EDM, from being an all-encompassing term at start, meaning any electronic dance music(and, to no coincidence, all or most of that music hailed only from the so called Western world of the day), came to mean much narrower 90s-2010s euro-atlantic lineage of electronic dance music, while at the same there are currently many local genres worldwide (from Asia, LatAm/Brazil, Africa, elsewhere) and some of them are quite ignorant of EDM (while others aren't, like, Mahraghanat), but at the same time ALL of those grassroots genres are still "electronic" and still "dance music". I don't know how Wikipedia should deal with this issue though.
 * The simplest framework may be akin to:
 * did genre/subgenre originate before DAWs/hardware synths and there are tracks in the genre which don't use DAWs/hardware(true for hip-hop, reggaeton, dancehall, disco, funk)? -> we cannot say that it is entirely electronic music.
 * did genre/subgenre originate after everyone started using DAWs/hardware and is only made with those DAWs/hardware and no one uses those DAWs/hardware only to emulate much more expensive electroacoustic instruments? (true for rage music, various modern offshots of trap music, mahraghanat, and so on) -> we can say those are electronic music. 178.121.5.44 (talk) 17:31, 31 July 2023 (UTC)