Template talk:Did you know/Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107

Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107

 * ... that in Bach cantata Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107, he composed "all seven stanzas of a rather obscure chorale"?
 * Reviewed: Julia Voss

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self nom at 22:13, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
 * The 7th Sunday after Trinity is 7 August in 2011, therefore good to appear between 6 August and 15 August. The cantata will progress some more. I may come up with the "obscure" chorale also (as last week), but if, probably separately. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:17, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Please add a comment and signature (or just a signature if endorsing) after each aspect you have reviewed:

Hook
 * Length, format, content rules: Marrante (talk) 09:56, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Source: Marrante (talk) 12:03, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Interest: moderate to low - maybe we can spice this up? Marrante (talk) 12:03, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Image suitability, if applicable:
 * ALT hooks, if proposed:
 * ALT1: ... that Bach cantata, Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107, moved British conductor John Eliot Gardiner to write, "only Bach is prepared to make life consistently difficult for himself"?

Article
 * Length: Marrante (talk) 12:48, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Vintage: new Marrante (talk) 12:48, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Sourcing (V, RS, BLP): Marrante (talk) 12:48, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Neutrality: Marrante (talk) 12:48, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Plagiarism/close paraphrasing: spot check: no probs Marrante (talk) 13:27, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Copyvio:
 * Obvious faults in prose, structure, formatting:

Comments/discussion:
 * Is the apostrophe-s template needed, since the word is piped? Marrante (talk) 09:56, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * I would not think so, but see the - unresolved - talk of that page. Some people think that "Bach cantata" is not a term but sloppy language as in "Tchaikovsky symphony". Therefore I have been careful on the Main page. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:27, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Ahh, I actually meant the template, not the apostrophe-s. Can't that just be written (since it's piped) without the template? Myself, I prefer "Bach cantata" without the possessive, but certain battles are not worth fighting. Marrante (talk) 11:42, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * You are so right about the battles! - The template produces a different little thing which is wanted and I don't have on my keyboard. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:06, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Do you mean a "curly" apostrophe? I had thought it was for the color. On my browser, they always come out black, although other letters outside the brackets will come out blue. No idea what's up with that. I can make the curly quotes and such, though. I never bothered for DYK. Should I be doing that? ‘ ’ “ ”  How do these read for you? Those are all curly, as I'm typing them here. A template maybe works better cross-platform, though. Marrante (talk) 12:48, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks for ALT1, good but rather on Bach than on the cantata. I came to try something specific:
 * ALT2:... that Albert Schweitzer likened the bass line of an aria mentioning Satan in Bach cantata Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107, "to the contortions of a huge dragon"? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:47, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Now, that I came to know more about that chorale, I think the reason for keeping the text could simply be that it is good. (Beware, OR.) Therefore, I strike hook and ALT1, and suggest as an alternative to ALT2 (going for the catchy) an ALT3, which - if taken - should appear after the chorale:
 * ALT3... that Bach cantata Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107, is the only one in his 1724/25 cycle on the unchanged text of the chorale, Heermann Was willst du dich betrüben? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:51, 4 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry for being so late to get back to this. I am afraid that ALT3 is too estoeric and has too much German for a hook. You can do it if you want, but I don't think you will get many hits. I would even avoid putting the German title of the main article in the hook because it's so many words (for a hook), plus ends in a cryptic (for some) abbreviation and number. Hooks are about selling, they are little pitches and you have competition and very little time to make your case. I hope you won't think this undignified:
 * ALT4:... that John Gardiner's remark, "a vivid pen-portrait of Satan and his wiles, delivered with typically Lutheran relish" referred to the music of Bach cantata, Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107?
 * — Marrante (talk) 18:17, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the suggestion of ALT4, but I have slight reservations, #1 "the music" is wrong, just one half of one of seven stanzas, #2 "typically Lutheran relish" can be misunderstood by today's Lutherans. - The German title with the BWV# is by now my trademark, more than one a week for more than a year, they get hits, not like the N-word, but enough. Reducing German, and simpler - and ALT2 is still on:
 * ALT5... that Bach exceptionally kept the poetry of Johann Heermann chorale unchanged in his cantata Was willst du dich betrüben, BWV 107? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:44, 6 August 2011 (UTC)


 * This ALT5 hook is not quite right (syntax), but I think rather than try to fix it, let's just take another of the hooks. I had thought about the Lutheran remark, but figured it's an opinion and it's funny, so I put it in. However, I don't have the time or inclination to tweak ALT4 till it's satisfactory, so I've stricken it. I'd say ALT2 is probably my best choice in terms of having the broadest interest. My comments about the cryptic notations were just a comment, not a criticism. I know you've been using them for a long time and you get hits. I'm just trying to help you get more. (And we both know the best way to do that.) My feeling is you should take your pick of the hooks and strike the rest and then this thing can be moved to prep. Therefore.....
 * Symbol confirmed.svg This nom is good to go with nominator's final choice for hook. I'm leaving it up to her, they're all fine with me. Marrante (talk) 20:32, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
 * ALT2 preferred, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:37, 6 August 2011 (UTC)