Template talk:Did you know nominations/Environmental damage of Gaza caused by the Israel–Hamas war

Query from nominator
Ive fixed this issue, I was using them to encourage others to expand them. Please can you reassess the request? I understand from Did you know/Reviewer instructions that articles should only receive the rejected tag when "Article is either completely ineligible or otherwise requires an insurmountable amount of work before becoming eligible". Thanks very much, John Cummings (talk) 08:48, 10 April 2024 (UTC)  Schwede 66  08:56, 10 April 2024 (UTC)


 * , do I understand this right that you nominate incomplete articles at DYK, encouraging other editors to complete the article for you by placing citation needed tags? Ping to who closed this.  Schwede  66  08:59, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Hi, thanks for sorting out the formatting and putting my reply in the right place :) I added all the information I was able to find, since its a current event its very likely to change I was just trying to encourage others to contribute. Thanks again, John Cummings (talk) 09:02, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
 * In such a case it would very much be better to submit the article in a rather complete state, albeit meeting WP:DYKCOMPLETE. DYK isn't for unfinished articles or for those that are currently undergoing major changes, as stability is important.  Naruto love hinata 5 (talk · contributions) 09:04, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Hi, thanks, I'm not sure what you mean by complete, I can't find the term in Did_you_know/Reviewer_instructions. I've created as full article as possible given the sources. Could you explain what the next steps are for the nomination? I can't seem to find any documentation on it in Did_you_know, I assume it was rejected due to Did_you_know/Guidelines 'presentability' but it wasn't explained in the review and needing additional work on 'presentability' seems like it would have been classified as a 'maybe' per Did_you_know/Reviewer_instructions. John Cummings (talk) 14:15, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
 * I think the comment on the nomination was accurate. I do think it might have been harsh to close this that early. The article is not in great shape - there should not be a blockquote in the lead and that's from a skimread - but I wouldn't have closed this that quickly.-- Laun chba ller 09:37, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Hi, thank you very much for your reply, can you tell me what the next steps are to reopen it? The block quote has been removed (thanks ) so the issue you raised and the issue the original reviewer raised have been resolved. John Cummings (talk) 15:19, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
 * By going into the history, finding a preclosure edit, and restoring to that version. I've done this for you, but you will need a QPQ for this.-- Laun chba ller 15:29, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
 * thank you very much :), I think I've already done the QPQ with Template:Did you know nominations/KDCD-TV but happy to do another one if I added them up wrong. John Cummings (talk) 15:46, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
 * So you did, it just wasn't where a reviewer would expect to see it. Moved.-- Laun chba ller 15:49, 20 April 2024 (UTC)

Hi sorry for all the pings, I didn't want to leave this to chance in case someone else adds the hook to the queue. I've realised that the hook which is the accepted one (please forgive me if I've missunderstood something) isn't actually listed as an alt, its just in the prose

... that Israel's systematic destruction of 38–48% of trees and farmland in Gaza using bulldozers and bombs has been described as an ecocide? Source: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2024/mar/29/gaza-israel-palestinian-war-ecocide-environmental-destruction-pollution-rome-statute-war-crimes-aoe

I didn't want to make changes to the discussion after you closed it, could I ask you to please make this clear where ever someone will look to grab the hook? The process of how DYK works is still a bit of a mystery to me

Thanks again for your help, I appreciate it been a bit of a long road with this one

John Cummings (talk) 12:59, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
 * That hook is not the accepted hook, I thought I was clear I wouldn't approve a hook with percentages in it. An approved hook is in Prep 1.-- Laun chba ller 13:07, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Hi, yes you were clear, I'm sorry, I made a mistake, I copied in the wrong quote into this page (comes from trying to find the right version in a wall of wikitext), I had understood that "that Israel's systematic destruction of trees and farmland in Gaza using tanks, bulldozers, bombs and herbicides has been described as an ecocide?" was ok, since it was all properly referenced and didn't include percentages. Is there a way to have the image used if we went for a later prep area? I feel like its an pretty clear demonstration of what is happening and helpful for people to visualise the hook. John Cummings (talk) 13:19, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Aside from the fact that the image isn't currently in the article, there's only one image slot per set, and it's a lottery as to what gets it. "tanks, bulldozers, bombs, and herbicides" may well check out, but would come under WP:DYKTRIM.-- Laun chba <u style="color:#00F">ller 14:48, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I've added the image to the article since it's a useful illustration.
 * I think it would be useful context to retain mention of the methods of destruction (though I would say that as a researcher of destruction) and the hook with that detail still comes in at about 146 characters which seems to be in an acceptable range per WPDYKTRIM. Richard Nevell (talk) 19:30, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I realised I didn't include a ping in my previous comment, so this one's to rectify that. Richard Nevell (talk) 20:31, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Is it useful? Some of them are the most generic ways things get destroyed in war. As for herbicides, the article suggests that its use relates to the Gazan strip perimeter since 2014, ie., not as part of this war (can't see it in the source to verify). Anyway, given the hook is meant to reflect a specific part of the text, it is yet another example of SYNTH in this nomination. CMD (talk) 01:20, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi good point that there is no current source available for the use of herbicides during the current conflict, the ones I have are ambiguous on dates. I think its very important to include the methods of destruction, its not a clear picture with enough context without it. The hook I would like is this, which is 131 characters, well under the guidance given in WPDYKTRIM.

"that Israel's systematic destruction of trees and farmland in Gaza using tanks, bulldozers, bombs has been described as an ecocide?"

do you agree this now fits within WPDYKTRIM? If you could include the image in the queue I would really really appreciate it :)

Thanks again

John Cummings (talk) 10:01, 26 May 2024 (UTC)


 * The hook is not meant to be a fully contextualised summary of the article, it is meant to be "a surprising or intriguing fact" that does "not attempt to cover multiple facts". Ideally, it will relate to a single easily found part of the article that comes with a source supporting the hook. CMD (talk) 11:38, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
 * In fact, a hook is exactly the opposite of a summary. A good summary gives you all the most important information, relieving you of the need to read the original item yourself.  A hook intentionally tries to entice you into reading the article by giving you just enough information to get you interested. RoySmith (talk) 13:26, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
 * OK, thanks, I understand your perspectives, I feel like if the image was included with the hook this would provide enough of a context if its breaking the rules to include the methods even if it is in within the length guidelines to include the methods. Thanks again, John Cummings (talk) 12:56, 27 May 2024 (UTC)

thanks for flagging the issues in the article you need fixing and for resolving the issue with the newly added text, I beleive they are now all resolved. John Cummings (talk) 12:56, 27 May 2024 (UTC)