Template talk:Infobox book/Archive 9

Preceded_by, followed_by for a series of revisions or editions
The articles Sixtine Vulgate and Sixto-Clementine Vulgate use these parameters to refer to the preceding and following books in a series of differently named Latin translations of the Bible. Is this acceptable? It differs from the currently documented use to indicate (different?) books published as a series. {cc: ) Jmar67 (talk) 12:04, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
 * No, that's not the intended use of those parameters. Nikkimaria (talk) 12:51, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I believe it does the job very well for those pages. Also, they are less a revision than two separate editions of the Vulgate used officialy one after the other by the Catholic Church. Veverve (talk) 14:03, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
 * It might be better to introduce previous_edition and subsequent_edition. Jmar67 (talk) 09:21, 3 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Other articles use the Preceded by, followed by parameters in the info box for chronological order of works by an author (e. g., Charles Dickens works, all the writings by Agatha Christie) that are not in a series as defined for the parameter. In my view, it is a handy way to learn the next relevant publication, even if the novels were not written as part of a recognized series. That is, various editors found other logical uses for the parameters. My suggestion is to broaden the intended uses of the parameter.As I use a smart phone more often in reading Wikipedia articles, I like the many ways it is used, in particular because those handy navigation boxes at the bottom of an article are not present in the mobile Wikipedia. Plus what you are describing sounds like a series. --Prairieplant (talk) 15:52, 4 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The more different things you try to shove into a parameter, the less useful it becomes. If you want to address the non-display of navboxes on mobile I'd be quite happy to support that; this isn't a good solution for that particular problem. Nikkimaria (talk) 01:41, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The template documentation states "do not use to connect separate books chronologically". No reason is given, but this conflicts with the usage noted above. Does anyone know why this is prohibited? Jmar67 (talk) 04:04, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The note was added to clarify that the parameter is intended to be used for series rather than for chronological publications. Nikkimaria (talk) 11:31, 5 March 2020
 * There is a lot of confusion, as many editors don't read the documentation and don't realise that the preceded_by and followed_by should not be used to connect separate books chronologically. This repeatedly comes up, and having parameters with multiple inconsistent uses is not ideal. I'd suggest the following:
 * Add previous_edition and subsequent_edition to cover separate editions/versions
 * Add previous_chronological and subsequent_chronological to cover books published by the same author that are not in a specific series
 * For clarity, change preceded_by and followed_by to previous_in_series and subsequent_in_series. (Perhaps the new parameters could be added immediately, and preceded_by and followed_by in due course deprecated and re-named by bot).
 * How could one would go about doing this? Is it enough to get consensus on this page? any thoughts? MichaelMaggs (talk) 13:29, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Consensus on this page is sufficient to make changes to this template, as long as they don't violate broader consensuses, such as policy and guidelines. Nevertheless, I'm not keen on adding extra parameters to suit a small number of exceptions. How many times would the new parameters be used? What is the reason why preceded_by can't be used to show previous books not in a series? If that's useful information, then it should be included. Is it just that it's considered "inconsistent uses"? It would need a bot to change the 29,632 instances of preceded_by to previous_in_series, but unfortunately that wouldn't allow checking that the book mentioned would actually be the previous one in a series. What you suggest is feasible, but there's a lot of work involved. --RexxS (talk) 15:41, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I'd definitely expect regular use for the second two, as there's often a conflict between next in series and next publication chronologically. They would apply (at least) to any author who has published both series and non-series books, which would include the majority of established genre authors such as crime, historical fiction, science fiction, popular fiction. It's not either/or as both would often be used. Not sure about previous_edition, but perhaps others could jump in with comments. I wouldn't expect any bot rename (if decided upon at a later stage) to fix existing errors, of course, such as preceded_by used in a way that's contrary to the template documentation, and I don't think that should be an issue. MichaelMaggs (talk) 16:09, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay. So if we implemented previous_chronological and subsequent_chronological, we'd have to also implement previous_chronological_quotation_marks and subsequent_chronological_quotation_marks for consistency with the current parameters. If consensus is reached for adding preceded_by_plain above, then we'd also need previous_chronological_plain and subsequent_chronological_plain. We can do it of course, but I'm getting a bit overwhelmed with requests right now, especially when there's been virtually no support for even the italic title so far. --RexxS (talk) 18:55, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Any news? Veverve (talk) 13:28, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Any news? Veverve (talk) 13:28, 1 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Not that I'm aware of. A consensus to change whould be needed, and although you and I think that change would be useful we don't have a consensus at the moment. MichaelMaggs (talk) 13:34, 1 May 2020 (UTC)

Photographer category
Is there a way to create a new category for this template? I want to add the photographer for a book to the infobox, but I'm not sure how. --Kaodigua (talk) 20:32, 23 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Possible workaround: "illustrator=John Smith (photographs)". Jmar67 (talk) 21:29, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

"Infobox book" listed at Redirects for discussion
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Infobox book. The discussion will occur at Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 June 29 until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Gaioa (T C L) 12:34, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

Alternative image
Is there anyway to use this template to add an alternative book image to an article ? Such as if the hardcover is different to the paperback image ? QuintusPetillius (talk) 13:55, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
 * No, because two non-free images for the same book is considered excessive under WP:NFCC #3A. Thanks!— TAnthonyTalk 14:00, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
 * If you simply want to add a non-free paperback image, I agree that that would probably not be allowed under WP:NFCC. But that will not always be the case: Section 3A says "Multiple items of non-free content are not used if one item can convey equivalent significant information", which does not necessarily ban multiple cover images. Sometimes the images may be free-use or out of copyright; an alternative cover may have been used for a significant noteworthy publication event in its own right; or the article may cover several books in a linked series. In any event, the technical answer is "no": the infobox can't handle multiple images. Any additional image, if allowed, would need to be added outside the box. MichaelMaggs (talk) 14:23, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Optionally, you could create a compound image (or I could do that for you) and use that. If you wanted to modify the infobox to take two images, I could do that, but you'd need to get consensus first, and I suspect that the general applicability of NFCC#3 would be a concern. --RexxS (talk) 14:35, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm pretty sure we outlawed this; it's still two separate images and an obvious attempt to subvert NFCC. I think there are very few instances where using two images of the same thing is appropriate.— TAnthonyTalk 16:59, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
 * I think you need to read my suggestion in the light of the previous comment. --RexxS (talk) 18:17, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm pretty sure we outlawed this; it's still two separate images and an obvious attempt to subvert NFCC. I think there are very few instances where using two images of the same thing is appropriate.— TAnthonyTalk 16:59, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
 * I think you need to read my suggestion in the light of the previous comment. --RexxS (talk) 18:17, 5 July 2020 (UTC)


 * Two cover images are included in several of the articles on novels by Agatha Christie. The image in the infobox is the first cover, whether published in the US or the UK first. The second image is placed in Publication history, when the cover or even the title in the other nation was different. Two examples are here and here, where title and images differed in the US and UK publications. --Prairieplant (talk) 05:43, 9 July 2020 (UTC)

Author entry for pseudonym books
Is there a consensus that books published under a pseudonym should like the actual author? For example, Agnes Grey lists Anne Brontë even though it was published under Acton Bell. The Plague Ship article listed Andrew North, which is a redirect to Andre Norton. (I just updated Plague Ship article.) If there is a consensus, we should update the documentation to say that. NE Ent 11:52, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Autogeneration
Any chance that this can be autogenerated from google books. Talpedia (talk) 14:21, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

Merge the current sandbox
Template:Infobox book/sandbox should be merged I believe, because it has more options than the current infobox. Please have a look at the conversation which took place one year ago. I ping, ,. Veverve (talk) 15:06, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the ping. Doing anything about the discussion is outside my capabities I'm afraid. But isn't consenus still lacking anyway? MichaelMaggs (talk) 15:31, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Are you linking to the intended discussion? The new parameters proposed there don't appear in the sandbox linked AFAICT. Nikkimaria (talk) 15:50, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
 * indeed, however the sandbox version allows for having a non italic title inside the infobox, e.g. at Sixtine Vulgate. Veverve (talk) 16:42, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Moreover, it has "preceded_by_plain" and "followed_by_plain" Veverve (talk) 16:52, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

Work identifiers
We should allow an parameter and pull from Wikidata if not specified. and are for specific versions of a book, are they not? Wikipedia should not be curating book editions in place of libraries, which use e.g. OCLC work ID to identify their curated works. int21h (talk · contribs · email) 15:34, 10 March 2021 (UTC)

Location
The parameter and its value do not display in the resulting infobox. Kindly fix the issue. Idell (talk) 10:28, 26 March 2021 (UTC)
 * There is nothing in the template's documentation to suggest there is a location field. I suppose you mean "location of publication". If you think it is important to be displayed, please start a discussion about it. &mdash; Martin (MSGJ · talk) 11:11, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Module
Hi

Would there be a possibility of adding a module to this infobox so that you can merge two infoboxes into one? I'm thinking of the module in Template:Infobox officeholder. In the Kim Il (politician) the Infobox Officeholder is merged with the Infobox Korean Name... Could we do something similar with this infobox? It looks like less clutter if its one infobox. --Ruling party (talk) 12:37, 13 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I don't think that would be controversial at all. The other infobox will need to add support for the yes feature if it isn't already. &mdash; Martin (MSGJ · talk) 11:12, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

OpenLibrary identifier
Can we add a 'OpenLibrary identifier' parameter? ShreyasMinocha (talk) 21:56, 30 March 2021 (UTC)

Illustrated novellas
I have just changed the Infobox in Smith of Wootton Major from infobox novella to infobox book, because although an 'illustrator' parameter was supplied, it doesn't exist within the former template so was not being displayed. There appears to be very little difference between the templates; a change in the order of displayed items, and fractional changes in width seems to be all. Is there any significant difference between the two, other than novellas getting fewer items?

I placed this comment here, because infobox novella seems to be a derivative subset of infobox book, and there is no activity at Template talk:Infobox novella.--Verbarson (talk) 16:38, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

Native Wikisource and MOS:BADITALICS
The title_orig parameter correctly avoids italics in the original title if zh is set. However, the same treatment is missing for the Wikisource text. See Book of Southern Tang (Lu You book) for an example: the Chinese in the "original text" should not be typeset in italics, per MOS:BADITALICS. —Kusma (talk) 20:13, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 22 July 2021
Change the tnfobox to add those changes. I would need them for Sixto-Clementine Vulgate and Sixtine Vulgate. Veverve (talk) 23:09, 22 July 2021 (UTC)
 * ❌ It's not clear what changes you want to be made and for what reason. The diff you linked to is between older revisions of /sandbox. Nardog (talk) 09:36, 23 July 2021 (UTC)
 * I need a "followed by" and ad "preceded by" which will not italicise the data. I need that, because the titles of the official Latin Catholic Bibles should not be italicised. I also need a new parameter for the title of the infobox not to be italicised, as the titles of the official Latin Catholic Bibles do not need to be italicized. See the articles in my first post for examples. Veverve (talk) 14:22, 23 July 2021 (UTC)
 * I suggest you use noitalic. I for one find removing the automatic italicization to be a more sensible option, but either way we need a consensus to implement any change. Nardog (talk) 14:28, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 9 August 2021
Add a short description of the form or something similar. - Qwerfjkl  talk  09:19, 9 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: Open the edit request when you have consensus for the change and the code ready. Nardog (talk) 11:12, 11 August 2021 (UTC)
 * @Nardog The code would be something like . Why does this need consensus? &#8213;  Qwerfjkl  talk  11:34, 11 August 2021 (UTC)
 * From this second post it looks like your request is not about the infobox for books. Rather you want to create a new Short description. You might try posting there or at the WP:VPT. If I am missing something my apologies. MarnetteD&#124;Talk 11:49, 11 August 2021 (UTC)
 * @MarnetteD I am asking about adding an automatic short description. &#8213; Qwerfjkl  talk  11:55, 11 August 2021 (UTC)
 * I see . Thanks for clarifying. If you don't get any responses here you might still try the VPT. MarnetteD&#124;Talk 11:58, 11 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Because bold changes to such a widely used template could have unintended consequences and other users could have objections you didn't anticipate. That's the whole point of template protection. You don't necessarily need other people to explicitly support the change you want to make, but just propose it and let it sit for at least a few days. And thoroughly test your code on the sandbox and testcases before opening a request. As for the code example you gave specifically, it doesn't account for the need for delinking or for when author isn't specified or includes a list. Nardog (talk) 12:21, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

Add a comment about series to the template?
After a conversation at Wide Sargasso Sea, I was thinking about how often I see the wrong kinds of links put in the "preceded by" and "followed by" fields. These are intended to link works in a series, but I often see links to unrelated books by the same author. Since the parameter name is unclear about this distinction, I think the template would encourage more consistency if a comment was added to the template itself, like so:


 * preceded_by      =


 * followed_by      =

Would this be an improvement of the template worth making? ~ L 🌸 (talk) 03:08, 24 October 2021 (UTC)
 * The documentation is not protected, so you are welcome to add this guidance to the blank example that is provided there. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:57, 24 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you for letting me know! I am not familiar with template editing and wanted to err on the side of caution. In the absence of objections for now, I've added the comment to the documentation. ~ L 🌸  (talk) 00:03, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

Automatic Wikisource link via Wikidata sitelink
I have attempted an automatic addition of the Wikisource link based on the presence of an English Wikisource sitelink: sandbox diff: Special:Diff/1049724504. This can still be overridden by the parameter. Wikidata sitelink returns empty string if the sitelink is not found, so it will default to omitting the field for pages without a Wikisource sitelink.

Does this seem acceptable, and if so, could it be implemented? Inductiveload (talk) 13:42, 13 October 2021 (UTC)
 * I don't see any instances in the testcases; how have you tested this addition? Nikkimaria (talk) 01:19, 14 October 2021 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure how it could be integrated into testcases, since it depends on the page itself to provide the entity. I tested it by changing the template in Jane Eyre to Infobox book/sandbox, removing the parameter and seeing that the link still appeared. And also for some other books, including books that do not have WS links (like Harry Potter), which showed no WS link, as expected. Inductiveload (talk) 11:55, 14 October 2021 (UTC)


 * I do support such addition. However, the Wikisource text is not always directly linked to the work's item in WD. Sometimes it is linked to the item of a particular edition which is linked to the item of the work, while the article in Wikipedia is linked only to the item of the work. This should imo also be taken into account. --Jan Kameníček (talk) 10:49, 14 October 2021 (UTC)


 * Indeed, it should be, but that will require a much more complex template. For a first step, just using wikidata sitelink will be a start. Eventually, the template used should follow the "has edition" property if a WS sitelink is not found. Inductiveload (talk) 11:58, 14 October 2021 (UTC)


 * This has been tested by using in in other infoboxes and it works. Can this code be merged? Languageseeker (talk) 05:42, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * What others? Nikkimaria (talk) 12:37, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Infobox medieval text, Infobox poem, Infobox short story, see The Adventure of the Blue Carbuncle for an example. Languageseeker (talk) 13:03, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * That example demonstrates an error - doubled "at". Nikkimaria (talk) 17:52, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Sorry about that. Fixed. Languageseeker (talk) 19:07, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Problem with foreign-language works linked with "native_wikisource" parameter
There seems to be an issue with the  parameter in that whenever   is marked with a particular language using lang, the autogenerated link does not display correctly: compare Special:Diff/1074309169 with Special:Diff/1074339152, for instance. Would someone be able to look into this? Shells-shells (talk) 19:14, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * This edit was correct. Because pt and Os Lusíadas,  calls  internally.  Hover your mouse-pointer over the title in the infobox and you should see the tool tip: 'Portuguese-language text'.  When you write Os Lusíadas, title_orig gets the rendering produced by  which contains html and category wikilinks.  That rendering is given to the code that creates the link to wikisource.  When you do that, the template creates this kind of a mess:
 * Os Lusíadas  at Portuguese Wikisource
 * And MediaWiki just doesn't know what to do with that.
 * So, don't wrap non-English titles assigned to title_orig in templates.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 20:06, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * I see now. Thank you for the quick assistance! :) Shells-shells (talk) 23:58, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * I see now. Thank you for the quick assistance! :) Shells-shells (talk) 23:58, 27 February 2022 (UTC)

italic title = no should affect infobox header the same as title
That’s the comment. —Michael Z. 23:55, 4 March 2022 (UTC)

Academic articles
Is this template supposed to be used for articles about academic articles? It does not seem completely suitable, but not sure if a template fork would be appropriate. One might want an attribute named "journal" instead of publisher, because journals themselves also tend to have a publisher. 'pages' might be ambiguous, since it can refer to the total number of pages of the article or the page numbers within the journal. PhotographyEdits (talk) 13:14, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Do you have examples of academic articles that have Wikipedia articles in which infoboxes are needed? "What Is It Like to Be a Bat?" doesn't have an infobox and may not need one. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:59, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
 * @Jonesey95 For example, The Use of Knowledge in Society, where I added the "short story" infobox, but that one is even less appropriate than the book one. I started a draft in my namespace at User:PhotographyEdits/sandbox. Currently Petty's Place in the History of Economic Theory is using the book template and The Complexity of Songs could make use of one. See also Category:Academic journal articles, there are quite a lot of articles about papers. PhotographyEdits (talk) 11:24, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
 * It looks like Infobox journal article (I chose this wording to match Cite journal) would be useful in these cases. I agree that there does not appear to be an appropriate infobox yet. If you create it, or a sandbox version of it, let me know and I will help you. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:02, 26 April 2022 (UTC)

Short description
The infobox should provide a default Short description. The basic pattern would/could be "&lt;year from &gt; &lt;lowercase plus space (if genre is set)&gt; book by &lt;&gt;"  — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 17:42, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Genre is not a particularly good choice for an automated short description - book by is sufficient. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:49, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
 * WP:SDEXAMPLES recommends "[year] [type of publication] by [author or director]" (Example: "1983 novel by John Irving"), but that's not easy to create from an infobox. Novel genres can be quite variable, sometimes including the word "novel" (eg Whose Body?) and sometimes not (eg The Buried Giant). "Book" alone would be safer. MichaelMaggs (talk) 08:36, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
 * See this previous discussion, in which changes were implemented and then rolled back, and this discussion for another attempt. Anyone adding proposed SD code to the sandbox is advised to account for the situations noted in those discussions. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:20, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Well spotted. To me, this one seems more suitable for a bot. MichaelMaggs (talk) 13:53, 3 May 2022 (UTC)

Italic title and name parameter conflict?
If both the italic title and name parameters are filled in with the title of the article, it renders the article title unitalicised. It feels somewhat counter-intuitive the way these parameters are meant to be used... Regards, Goldsztajn (talk) 15:07, 20 June 2022 (UTC)
 * See Module:Infobox which says that if italic title is assigned nothing or assigned  or assigned , then the article title will be italicized.  Any other value assigned to italic title will render the article title in an upright font.  So, at Infamous Scribblers (permalink), Infamous Scribblers disables italics.  name plays no part in this.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 15:31, 20 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for clarifying name is not involved. However, I'm coming from a concern over ease of using this template, for me, being aware of a line of Lua code doesn't make general use easier (and while I'm somewhat beyond a general editor after 15+ years, I'm at very best only vaguely familiar with Lua).  This is a fairly widespread infobox; it should be relatively easy to use without counter-intuitive parameters. The intuitive reading of italic title would be, "what should appear italicised in the title". Do you think there is use in  clearly indicating that Foo will disable italics from the article titled Foo? Regards, --Goldsztajn (talk) 00:33, 21 June 2022 (UTC)
 * I only intended my post to explain why you were seeing what you were seeing. What is done with that information is up to you and other editors.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 14:05, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

Audio included in the infobox
Hi all, I was wondering if it was possible to include an audio reading of books within this infobox template? For example, something like: "Audio Republic at Wikicommons". There are a number of public domain readings of books that would help readers if placed alongside the text. This would help create a central and uniform space for audio recordings of public domain books to be located for readers to wayfind consistently across articles Jamzze (talk) 06:03, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * This seems like something that would be better placed in External links. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:09, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * As I outlined above, it would be a audio recording based within the Wiki project, much like the text is based within Wikisource and linked there. This would help people with disabilities and better wayfind to resources within the Wiki project itself. Jamzze (talk) 17:21, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Links to sibling projects are usually placed at the end of the article. See Template:Commons and Template:Sister project and Template:Commons category and Template:Wikinews for examples. – Jonesey95 (talk) 17:46, 3 October 2022 (UTC)

Copyright / license parameter
I think this infobox should have some parameter for the license. Maybe listing it as 'copyrighted' is not very useful, but for works in the public domain or some Creative Commons variant I think that would be useful. PhotographyEdits (talk) 13:10, 1 November 2022 (UTC)

Multiple ISBN
Many books have multiple ISBNs — hardcover, paperback, reprint, different countries, etc. For example: What people are doing now is tacking on extra stuff in the  field, but that's kinda messy. Could we get an  and   parameter, please? Eievie (talk) 22:55, 20 December 2022 (UTC)
 * The Forbidden Game has "trade" vs "mass market"
 * The Book of Night Women has North America publication and a UK/Australia/NZ publication
 * The documentation explains that the ISBN of the first edition goes in isbn. That instruction prevents infobox bloat. If it is important to list multiple ISBNs for a book, they can go in the body of the article. – Jonesey95 (talk) 17:39, 21 December 2022 (UTC)

"Template:Doctorwhoaudiobook" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Template:Doctorwhoaudiobook and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 22:44, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

"Template:Doctowhoaudiobook" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Template:Doctowhoaudiobook and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 22:45, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

"Template:Doctor Who audio book" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Template:Doctor Who audio book and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 22:45, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

"Template:Torchwoodaudiobook" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Template:Torchwoodaudiobook and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 22:48, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

"Template:Torchwood audio book" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Template:Torchwood audio book and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 22:48, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

native_wikisource and italics
In The Compendious Book on Calculation by Completion and Balancing infobox there is currently (permalink) a broken link for the Arabic Wikisource link. This seems to be due to the usage of the  wrapper. This wrapper (or equivalent) is needed for some languages, per the accurate code-comment in the page there ("non-Roman alphabets shouldn't use italics").

Another example of the problem was also mentioned (but not answered) in the archives here at Template talk:Infobox book/Archive 9, and they appear to have resolved it by simply removing the wrapper, and thus displaying a non-optimum italicized title.

Does anyone know how to best resolve this general issue? Thanks. Quiddity (talk) 00:24, 17 February 2023 (UTC)


 * As native_wikisource (and native_external_url) requires orig_lang_code, the best way would probably be to use a module that checks whether this language code supports italics for its script or not. I don't know if any module like this currently exists; the folks at WP:VPT might be able to advise! &#8209;&#8209; Yodin T 14:16, 17 February 2023 (UTC)
 * From MOS:BADITALICS:
 * However, titles of major works that should be italicized are italicized in scripts that support that feature (including Latin, Greek and Cyrillic); do not apply italic markup to scripts that do not (including Chinese, Japanese, and Korean).
 * Because internally applies  to the value assigned to title_orig, the assigned value at The Compendious Book on Calculation by Completion and Balancing is malformed; it should be:
 * كتاب المختصر في حساب الجبر والمقابلة
 * title_orig is also used in the rendering of the value assigned to native_wikisource this way:
 * so you can see that assigning the rendering of a template to title_orig will confuse MediaWiki when it tries to render the value assigned to native_wikisource.  In this example case, MediaWiki is further confused because the value assigned to native_wikisource has an extraneous language tag: ar:الكتاب المختصر في حساب الجبر والمقابلة.
 * The fix to all of this is to remove the template from title_orig and remove the extraneous language tag from native_wikisource.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 15:21, 17 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Yup. I'd tried that in a preview, but the problem remained.
 * I've now redone the edit and saved it (permalink), but the book's "original title" and the link to Wikisource are now improperly italicized.
 * How to fix that (for all infoboxes where this may be applicable), is the essential question. Quiddity (talk) 01:21, 18 February 2023 (UTC)
 * MOS:BADITALICS only says that CJK scripts must not be italicized. Where does MOS say that book names written using Arabic script must not be italicized?  I'm happy to adjust Module:Lang/utilities is there is such a proscription.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 01:31, 18 February 2023 (UTC)
 * How to fix that (for all infoboxes where this may be applicable), is the essential question. Quiddity (talk) 01:21, 18 February 2023 (UTC)
 * MOS:BADITALICS only says that CJK scripts must not be italicized. Where does MOS say that book names written using Arabic script must not be italicized?  I'm happy to adjust Module:Lang/utilities is there is such a proscription.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 01:31, 18 February 2023 (UTC)

Undiscussed changes reinstated after revert, contrary to WP:BRD
implemented an undiscussed change to bypass intentional redirect links in this template. I reverted those good-faith but erroneous changes, adding comments that explained why the redirects are there. then reinstated their erroneous change without discussion or an edit summary, contrary to WP:BRD and to good practice in template space. I am not interested in an edit war, but the original version, or my version with comments, should be restored. See this explanation (and this older discussion; there may be more) for why redirects are intentionally used in this and other templates. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:18, 27 February 2023 (UTC)
 * restored.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 15:19, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

ISBN
Is there ever an advantage in including both ISBN-10 and ISBN-13? If so, does the template support and ? I ask because The Dream of Enlightenment includes a second ISBN as a value for. This is flagged as an error by WP:WPCHECK. 76.14.122.5 (talk) 22:13, 4 April 2023 (UTC)
 * In that case, the 10-digit ISBN was completely redundant, since it was the same as the 13-digit ISBN, just without the prefix. – Jonesey95 (talk) 23:58, 4 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I completely missed that! Thanks. 76.14.122.5 (talk) 01:41, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

image parameter: only bare file name?
The docs says to use bare file name, but example image file is given in square brackets. Which of the true:


 * .djvu file extension, we can use various options within square brackets
 * .jpg, .png file extensions; only bare file name?

రుద్రుడు చెచ్క్వికి (talk) 15:09, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

preceded_by/followed_by for prequels?
Are these parameters based on publication order or internal series chronology? If the former, can someone update the descriptions to 'Title of [prior/subsequent] book in series, by order of publication', or similar, for clarity? I became confused after seeing a debut novel 'preceded by' a book (prequel) published years later. Thanks! Random fixer upper (talk) 19:04, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Full name?
Should the name parameter be the book's common name or full name? Usually the book's subtitle isn't included in the article title so I've always removed it from the infobox title as well. If it's too much for the article title, I don't see why it would be needed atop the infobox. Looking to update the documentation after consensus. czar 17:36, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

preceded_by/followed_by for prequels?
Are these parameters based on publication order or internal series chronology? If the former, can someone update the descriptions to 'Title of [prior/subsequent] book in series, by order of publication', or similar, for clarity? I became confused after seeing a debut novel 'preceded by' a book (prequel) published years later. Thanks! Random fixer upper (talk) 19:04, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Full name?
Should the name parameter be the book's common name or full name? Usually the book's subtitle isn't included in the article title so I've always removed it from the infobox title as well. If it's too much for the article title, I don't see why it would be needed atop the infobox. Looking to update the documentation after consensus. czar 17:36, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

"Infobox book" listed at Redirects for discussion
The redirect [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Infobox_book&redirect=no Infobox book] has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at  until a consensus is reached. Frietjes (talk) 18:18, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

Italicizing non-Latin original titles
...is a no-no, as per MOS:FOREIGNITALICS, esp. for Chinese-character titles:
 * 道德經 at Chinese Wikisource

There should be a flag that checks if the native-language uses a non-Latin script, and disables the relevant italicization if so. Remsense 聊  02:14, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
 * When reporting a problem, always link to an example page where the problem can be observed. Thanks. – Jonesey95 (talk) 03:55, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Oh, my bad! I copied the above example directly from Tao Te Ching. Remsense  聊  03:56, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Got it. I think I have fixed it after modifying the sandbox and checking a couple of variants on the testcases page. The infobox is wrapping the native title in the lang template, which applies italics intelligently, so I have removed redundant italic markup that was around the lang template. Everything appears to work properly at both Tao Te Ching (no italics around Chinese characters) and Don Quixote (italics around Spanish characters). Post here if I broke anything. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:07, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
 * oh wow, that was quick @Jonesey95, thank you very much! i feel bad for not just doing it myself if it was that quick. Remsense  聊  04:07, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Adding anchor tags to parameters in documentation
Template:Cite news implements this nicely! I'd be happy to make the change, but don't want to proceed without checking whether this might be a disservice. – spida-tarbell ❀ (talk) (contribs) 22:27, 3 November 2023 (UTC)

Full name?
Should the name parameter be the book's common name or full name? Usually the book's subtitle isn't included in the article title so I've always removed it from the infobox title as well. If it's too much for the article title, I don't see why it would be needed atop the infobox. Looking to update the documentation after consensus. czar 17:36, 18 August 2023 (UTC)


 * I agree that the infobox title doesn't seem the right place for the full title/subtitle, etc. -- Yodin T 11:29, 19 November 2023 (UTC)

preceded_by/followed_by for prequels?
Are these parameters based on publication order or internal series chronology? If the former, can someone update the descriptions to 'Title of [prior/subsequent] book in series, by order of publication', or similar, for clarity? I became confused after seeing a debut novel 'preceded by' a book (prequel) published years later. Thanks! Random fixer upper (talk) 19:04, 30 June 2023 (UTC)


 * Not sure there's a consensus on this (beyond the fact that it is only for books in the same series, not across an author's works) but probably a good idea to establish one. The example you give makes sense, but I'd also be confused if the infobox of a prequel said it was "preceded by" a book that follows it chronologically (it might also be fighting an uphill battle to try to force it to be publication order only). There's a good case for the wording of the infobox itself to be changed to make it clearer which one is meant, maybe along the lines of Infobox album, which has a header over the preceded/followed by links, stating " chronology" (or in our case, maybe something like "series name chronology" or "series name publication order"), in cases where the publication order differs from the series chronology (when they're the same, I don't think there's any need for a header). -- Yodin T 11:29, 19 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Infobox television episode also has "Episode chronology" above the previous and next links. -- Yodin T 12:26, 3 December 2023 (UTC)


 * Thanks Yodin. Yes, having something visible in the infobox to clarify would be better than changing only the documentation. Though perhaps the parameter should just be used when a publisher or reliable source clearly specifies that the book is part of a particular series and it's order within it...
 * For a specific example, see The Hate U Give -- Random fixer upper (talk) 21:35, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

Index terms in subject parameter
The documentation says:

It appears that added the subject parameter in 2006 as a nonfiction analogue to genre.

I think the documentation should be changed, removing all notion of using formal index terms. Specifically, I don't think Library of Congress Subject Headings should be displayed to users. Rather, they're for librarians and computers. I think we should prefer "14th-century Europe" as a subject, rather than "Civilization, Medieval--14th century".

What do others think? Are their consumers of the information in subject field beyond article readers that we should consider? Daask (talk) 13:44, 5 April 2024 (UTC)


 * I don't see that it specifically recommends LOC headings for that parameter? Nikkimaria (talk) 04:25, 6 April 2024 (UTC)
 * The documentation doesn't specifically recommend Library of Congress Subject Headings, but that is the most widely used controlled vocabulary system listed at . Perhaps what needs improvement is not so much the Template:Infobox book/doc documentation but rather the index term article. I understood the subject of that article to be a controlled vocabulary based on the statement, but later the in the article it says Daask (talk) 16:50, 8 April 2024 (UTC)


 * I don't recall ever seeing anything in this parameter that was recognizably not freely assigned - my suspicion is that people are just following the general meaning of "subject" in going with free assignment. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:38, 9 April 2024 (UTC)