Template talk:Infobox martial artist/Archive 1

Discussion from WT:MMA

 * Good start. Most of the fields should be made optional (ie, it doesn't show up if it doesn't have a value). I would remove the "other information" section, listing of family members has WP:BLP issues and much of that other stuff is irrelevant. Also, isn't stance implied within style? It's redundant for boxers, that's for sure. hateless 21:35, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I like it, and will make most of it optional. I also believe "stance" refers to orthodox/southpaw.  east . 718  at 22:12, 10/23/2007
 * All of it is optional. I had stance and reach in for boxers and style (fighting style) for MMA and kickboxing guys who come from various backgrounds. About the familiy section, it was meant for only the notables, likes of Laila Ali, Klitchko brothers, Gracies etc. thx for your feedback. (Marty Rockatansky 01:44, 24 October 2007 (UTC))
 * Could you please refrain from adding it to any pages for now? Let's perfect the template first, then I'll have my bot sweep through all instances of MMAstatsbox, Infobox Boxer, and Infobox Kickboxer.  east . 718  at 03:08, 10/24/2007
 * This looks awsome Eastside. you definitely know how to tweak it. it starts looking like the most complete infobox i've seen here in WikiP. How do you "pot sweep" if you don't mind if i ask?(Marty Rockatansky 07:23, 24 October 2007 (UTC))
 * I have a WP:BOT that can replace all instances of the old templates by itself.  east . 718  at 12:21, 10/24/2007
 * ...and I've taken Ray Sefo live.  east . 718  at 16:04, 10/24/2007
 * i think height, weight and reach should use the same conversion tool. don't see a reason why not. ... oh ok i saw what u did. got confused little bit coz the weight wasn't registering.(Marty Rockatansky 08:07, 25 October 2007 (UTC))
 * Whats your thoughts about including Olympic Medals in boxing or wrestling. it belongs under amateur career section. example Wladimir Klitschko, Rulon Gardner. i like their short template what they have right now, but visually wu be cool to add that up as well. make it like the last little section under amateur career. (Marty Rockatansky 09:57, 25 October 2007 (UTC))
 * The Olympic medal templates are far more profilic though... and the only I see with this is that all boxers will have to have their articles updated by humans (for the Olympic templates at least). If it were up to me, I'd first phase out the other four martial arts templates, then work on this.  east . 718  at 13:55, 10/25/2007
 * i wouldn't add on k-1sport.de as an official rec. source. they are one of the most conclusive for K-1 fights but not for fighters full kickboxing record. unfortunately there is none compared to sherdog and boxrec. at the end of the day K-1 is still only a company, like UFC, not a sport itself. (Marty Rockatansky 20:03, 25 October 2007 (UTC))


 * Thoughts about adding Ethnicity: Maori. for Ray Sefo example. i'd place it next under Nationality.
 * OK, I'll remove k-1sport.de. Also, I'd avoid ethnicity, I have no doubt that it would cause forest fires on every page where it is remotely contentious.  east . 718  at 01:51, 10/26/2007

Integrating mixed martial artist/pro wrestler statboxes?
Should this template be expanded to include the pro wrestling statbox information? Right now, some MMA/pro wrestlers have the mma box ([Brock Lesnar]) and some have the pro wrestling box ([Giant Silva]). On the other hand, perhaps integrating them is inappropriately implying some kind of parity between legit fightsports and pro wrestling. I dunno. Thoughts? gnfnrf 17:25, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The only difference I see is that Infobox Wrestler has two extra fields for billed weight and height. I'll get in touch with WP:PW.  east . 718  at 20:32, 10/26/2007
 * yeah why not if theres only two fields different. I wud like to add real wrestling too, along with various different styles, like sambo, these are all amateur circuits and would fit under Amateur career section. Maybe we need to make amateur section a little more specific. I don't know... But for sure some arts like sumo, (see Akebono Taro) or karate have very specific stats and should stay separate. (Marty Rockatansky 21:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC))
 * Talk about an overly bloated infobox. I think the wrestling infobox should stay seperate as they don't really share much common info (it would be like wanting all athletes to have one infobox rather than having one for the NFL, one for the NBA, etc). As for Brock Lesnar, he should have a wrestling infox primarily since he's been a wrestler for about 6 years and only recently got into MMA (and has only had 1 fight) and have a mini-MMA infobox elsewhere in the article. TJ Spyke 21:41, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
 * pro wrestling is not a martial art itself, more like a "Sport entertainment". i think as well it's about time to draw the line somewhere. (Marty Rockatansky 22:10, 26 October 2007 (UTC))
 * (ec) I don't think it's bloated, it only seems that way because of the vast number of fields available. Take a look at Template:Infobox martial artist/testcases for an example of how lightweight it is: it presents the same amount of information with less formatting and clutter.  east . 718  at 22:16, 10/26/2007

Personally i think this template is pretty much complete, just wanted to know whats the update can we start adding it on (Marty Rockatansky 07:08, 4 November 2007 (UTC))
 * Nah, I think some intangible elements are kind of ugly and squished together... I'm going to try playing with the formatting in the next couple of days. <small style="background:#fff;border:#4682b4 1px solid;color:#000;padding:0px 3px 1px 4px;white-space:nowrap">east<big style="color:#090">. 718 at 07:10, 11/4/2007
 * Alright you're the boss. (Marty Rockatansky 11:09, 4 November 2007 (UTC))

line of title
Hello, I'm User:Watermint who've participated in WP:Boxing. I feel this template is very suitable and very convenient. I'd like to use when it can use. BTW, if possible, how about adding the line of an acquisition title? -- W/mint <sup style="color:#2a6e6b;">-Talk- 14:59, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Unification?
There are at least three other templates with similar purpose and overlapping features: Infobox Boxer, Infobox martial artist, Infobox MMAstats. I think that this one is the most powerful of all, while still not being unnecessarily complex to use. (One can simply fill in the applicable fields and leave the non-applicable ones empty.) While there is no real harm in using all four, ideally, perhaps, there should be only one infobox. However, in this matter I'm going to defer to whatever WP Martial Arts members and other editors think is the best. GregorB (talk) 17:41, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm liking this one as well and have been thinking about initiating a switch to it for some time. Is there any reason to hold off or should we bring it up at WT:WPMA/WT:MMA? --<b style="color:black">aktsu</b> (t / c) 22:12, 7 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I was perhaps a bit too bold and merged Template:Infobox Martial artist with Template:Infobox martial artist. I have since reverted this move, but I think it's a bit crazy that we have Infobox Martial artist and Infobox martial artist. Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk)  03:47, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I didn't notice any huge visual changes and though it looked fine (didn't really get a chance to compare though)... The infoboxes are indeed a mess and a merger of those two seems only logical to me with Infobox Martial artist having all the fields of Infobox martial artist plus more. Hopefully we can get rid of Infobox MMAstats sometime in the future as well, as I mentioned above. --<b style="color:black">aktsu</b> (t / c) 04:13, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm all for the merger as well. I see the boxers infobox is changed as well lately. Some changes Plastikspork did actually improved the overall look closer to the most widely used infobox Template:Infobox Person. Mind as well merge that as well Template:Infobox Kickboxer. Marty Rockatansky (talk) 05:38, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Merge as many if them as possible. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 09:25, 22 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I prefer merging as many as possible as well. I have proposed a first step below. Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 19:34, 22 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Infobox Kickboxer is now orphaned and up at TFD. Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 21:26, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Move or merge
To start a discussion of ways to resolve the naming mess, I thought I would put a couple options on the table. Note that to keep things as simple as possible, I thought I would start with resolving the infobox martial artist vs. infobox Martial artist problem.

Merge the two templates and make this the primary template. To preserve color scheme used in the current infobox martial artist, I have added a color option to this template. There is also a box_width option, to achieve the same width. I believe that all the options used the current infobox martial artist are supported by this template. After the merger, I propose using infobox martial artist as the unified name.
 * Option 1
 * To see this option in action, you can check out the testcases page.

Move this template to say Template:Infobox fighter. Since the current infobox martial artist does not include any professional/amateur fighting statistics, reach, weightclass, etc. Hence, it seems to have the primary purpose of representing information about a martial artist who does not participate in boxing, kickboxing, or MMA.
 * Option 2


 * Note, I personally prefer the first option, since there are already too many infoboxes which basically achieve the same purpose. I will post a pointer to this discussion over on the other talk page as well. Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 19:34, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd be happy with that; the aesthetic issues leave me uninterested. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 21:39, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Option 1 sounds good, if there are no objections I'm going to start switching over prominent MMAstatsbox pages to Martial artist biography to deal with the "Belt Level" box problem of the edit function text obscuring article text (see Kenny Florian for example). Phospheros (talk) 20:29, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Option 1 is good although though the width and colour options seems totally unnecessary to me (at least until someone actually complaints). --<b style="color:black">aktsu</b> (t / c) 20:39, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

As there seems to be consensus, the templates are now merged, with the old one saved as infobox martial artist/old and the old infobox Martial artist now named infobox martial artist. Redirects will make sure both references use infobox martial artist. Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 01:42, 26 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Note also Infobox MMAstats (Apparently for "Mixed martial arts"). Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 20:36, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * The backend of that one is now converted, and can be substituted (probably by a bot or AWB given over 500 transclusions). Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 15:48, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Requested. Thank you. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 17:41, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Years active
The "yearsactive" field seems problematic since it requires continuous updating each year for an active fighter, see for example Peter Graham (kickboxer). It would seem that it would be better to have this automatically calculated. I know there is which basically does what you want, but I don't think making a new template like this is the best idea. I think the main problem is that there is mismatch between how this field is used in this template vs. say infobox actor. This field should list the span of years active, not the actual number of years. Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 15:58, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * The example in this template's documentation is "2001–present". Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 14:17, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I know, that's because I changed the documentation :) It used to say indicate "the number of years the person has been a fighter" or something like that. The main problem is that if you actually go to see the uses of this field in article space, you will see many instances of "10 years" or "7 years (since 2000)", which is almost certainly wrong given that the box on the article was last updated over a year or two ago (in many cases). Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk)  15:46, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Martial art style or Style of martial art or ?
I merged the "martial_art" and "style" sections, so that they appear under the same label. I don't think people should necessarily be specifying both, but it's good to keep both there for backwards compatibility. My question is if Style is the best label for this field or if it should be Martial art style or Style of martial art, or if it's fine the way it is. Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 15:58, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

promotion
theres should be a spot for the fighters promotion? similar to NBA and NFL infoboxes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.228.91.25 (talk) 03:20, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

BLPintro
I noticed that when you are going to edit an article about a living people that utilizes the template Infobox martial artist (IMA), the template BLP editintro doesn't appear, for example Dan Hardy (with the IMA template) and Patrick Makau Musyoki (without the IMA). Also I noticed that when you are going to edit a living people article, at the url appears " ", for example
 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Patrick_Makau_Musyoki&action=edit&editintro=Template:BLP_editintro With Musyoki
 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dan_Hardy&action=edit With Hardy

And if I add the code  to Hardy's url, the BLP notice appears:
 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dan_Hardy&action=edit&editintro=Template:BLP_editintro

This error apparently comes from this template, but I have no idea why it ommits this important notice (sometimes ignored, but still existing for legal issues). Any idea? Tb hotch .™ Grammatically incorrect? Correct it! See terms and conditions.  03:47, 30 September 2011 (UTC)


 * I just tried Dan Hardy and Emin Boztepe, and I get the "BLP editintro". I am wondering if it something else?  Perhaps a temporary server problem?  Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk)  01:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)
 * With Boztepe it appeared but with Hardy still not working, even there are more pages. The only constant is this template: Raphael Assunção, Erick Silva, Dan Miller (fighter), etc. I hope it is just me. Tb hotch .™ Grammatically incorrect? Correct it!  See terms and conditions.  03:39, 1 October 2011 (UTC)
 * It looks like you are using the http server and I am using the https server? There have been some recent changes to the various servers, so I suppose it could be a caching problem?  I have no idea otherwise.  Thanks! Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk)  19:35, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

2 extra parameters
I would like to request the inclusion of 2 parameters: Both have worked when I tested them in the template, I'm just asking to formally include them. ~ InferKNOX (talk) 21:44, 29 December 2013 (UTC)
 * "native_name" — (below "name") — for martial artists with Chinese/Korean/Japanese/etc script names
 * "teacher" — (below "stance") — useful for martial arts that mention lineages.
 * there is already a teacher parameter, I will add native_name. Frietjes (talk) 17:19, 2 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Oops, seems I missed teacher somehow.
 * Also, please may the templates be changed to Template:BirthDeathAge by birth and death, and Template:URL by website by default? They are simple and comprehensive for the respective tasks.
 * Off-topic, but lastly, are the headers within the template, such as "Other information", meant to show automatically by default? I have never seen them show on the template on article pages. Thanks. ~ InferKNOX (talk) 14:17, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
 * you can add birth date and age and URL to the article directly, which is the same as infobox person. the other information header does appear automatically if there is a need for it.  Frietjes (talk) 18:49, 3 January 2014 (UTC)

Height in centimetres
The Ultimate Fighting Championship's official website uses feet and inches plus centimetres to express height, as is the norm, not metres. Could this template be changed to allow for centimetres?--Gibson Flying V (talk) 21:32, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
 * done. Frietjes (talk) 22:09, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

Stance Bug
The stance part of the template points to "Orthodox stance" when "orthodox", but points to "Handedness" when "southpaw". It should point to "Southpaw stance". Tghw (talk) 18:32, 20 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Tghw, fixed. Frietjes (talk) 19:06, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

box_win/loss: DQ fields needed
For boxers, I request separate fields for DQ wins and losses, below KOs. Mac Dreamstate (talk) 19:35, 18 February 2017 (UTC)

Other names and Nicknames
if you use the parameter other_names, the label will be displayed as "Other names". if you use the parameter nickname, the label will be displayed as "Nickname(s)". this is intentional and how one would expect the template to function. Frietjes (talk) 17:08, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I'm pretty sure we end up with an end result that is the same between the two versions.
 * my version: nickname is used, so Nickname is shown. Anything else shows Other names
 * your version: othernames is used, so Other names is shown. Anything else shows Nicknames
 * So really, they do the same thing, just with a different "default". I really don't care, but I also don't see why the second change was necessitated, especially since the latter change ends up calling another template instead of just using the default parameter handling. Primefac (talk) 17:18, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Primefac, the difference is when you use both other_names and nickname. the ordering used in the label and data should be the same. Frietjes (talk) 17:49, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Because...? Also, is functionally equivalent to , so it would have been easier to swap those instead? Primefac (talk) 17:55, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Primefac, is not functionally equivalent to  for two reasons (1) othernames is not the same as other names, and (2) you get different results when both are used (or when one is blank vs. omitted). Frietjes (talk) 18:07, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Primefac, I put your version in the sandbox, you can see the results here. Frietjes (talk) 18:08, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * who might find this educational. Frietjes (talk) 18:10, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I'm sure you could have seen that I made a typo. You are of course correct in that the order does matter, but my point was that the old version of the template (before I changed it) defaulted to "Other names", which is what I wanted to keep. Given that someone is actively trying to change every instance of "other names" to "nickname" I figure that we should keep the old style until a consensus can be reached to do otherwise. Primefac (talk) 18:12, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * yes, I could see that you made a typo, which is why I pointed it out. if you want to change the precedence, that's fine, but it should be consistent per errors I have pointed out above. and, as you can see from [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template%3AInfobox_martial_artist&type=revision&diff=815568915&oldid=791161728 this diff], the version before your edit used other_names before nickname if both were specified.  that is still the case after my change.  Frietjes (talk) 18:22, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Ah, yes, I see the flaw. Thank you. Sorry for being thick. Primefac (talk) 18:26, 15 December 2017 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 25 February 2018
To avoid an Obsolete HTML tags lint error, please change  →   — Anomalocaris (talk) 09:17, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 09:21, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
 * JJMC89: Thanks! —Anomalocaris (talk) 09:41, 25 February 2018 (UTC)

Weight conversion
A non-trivial portion of the world's population uses stones & pounds for a person's weight. Therefore if the "weight_lb" or "weight_kg" field of this template is used, the output includes a conversion to st & lb:

However if the "weight" field is used, it does not:

For consistency could output in st & lb be enabled for the "weight" field as well?--76.10.180.45 (talk) 00:46, 6 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Should be fixed now. Thanks! Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk)  23:47, 8 April 2018 (UTC)

Redundant native name
This infobox shows the native name both under their main name and as a "Native name" pair under that. One of these should be removed. (also, for the top name, the lang attribute gets incorrectly put inside the class attribute) Opencooper (talk) 02:06, 9 April 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm not seeing where the lang was put inside a class, but I've removed the redundant "native_name". Primefac (talk) 12:54, 9 April 2018 (UTC)
 * It was in the original but that's taken care of now. Thanks. Opencooper (talk) 00:37, 10 April 2018 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 19 October 2018
I would like to be able to add a link to each athlete's 'Official Record' on MixedMartialArts.com which is the Official Record Keeper for the Association of Boxing Commissions. For example: https://www.mixedmartialarts.com/fighter/Anthony-Pettis:05D159EAF4712C7C

The profile includes additional information not included in other sites profiles, including active suspension information and the recording of 'official' bouts on their record. PqMMA (talk) 15:43, 19 October 2018 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the template. The template already gives the BoxRec and Sherdog profiles of athletes, why do we need a third? Should we remove one of the other two? Is there evidence that MMA.com is the "official" record? This will need discussion first. Primefac (talk) 15:57, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

I don't know if either of the other's should be removed or not, but the record on MixedMartialArts.com is the official record as mandated by the Association of Boxing Commissions. It also includes which bouts are considered official for each athlete and includes information not available anywhere else (active suspension).

The selection of these records is easily verified through the ABC promoter's handbook and through various news outlets.

https://www.dos.ny.gov/forms/athletic/en/Promoters%20Manual.pdf

The team at MixedMartialArts.com has presented at the annual ABC conference for the last ten years. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PqMMA (talk • contribs) 17:03, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

I would like to suggest that athlete's official records be linked from here. Mixed Martial Arts LLC which owns and operates mixedmartialarts.com is the Official Record Keeper for the Association of Boxing Commissions. It is the only database for which event results are required to be submitted by state, tribal, and provincial commission to be included as official.

For example: https://www.mixedmartialarts.com/fighter/Fabricio-Werdum:584DB7540A5C83D4

It also has an active suspension state for athletes currently under medical or administrative suspensions. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PqMMA (talk • contribs) 23:10, 19 October 2018 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the template. As I said, I have no opinions on whether or not this gets changed, but there are questions that need answering (via a discussion of some sort) before this can proceed. Please do not re-open this request unless a week has gone by without any other significant input (and, obviously, if a consensus is reached). Primefac (talk) 23:31, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

Per your instructions, I have re-opened this request. I am not sure what to do at this point. I have created a topic to discuss and it has not received any discussion in past ten days. How do we proceed?

I am not sure if you noticed, but the Association of Boxing Commissions last week released a nod of support for this effort as well

http://www.abcboxing.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/abc-support-mma-wiki.pdf

11:51, 29 October 2018 (UTC)pqmma


 * Pictogram voting question.svg Question:, I see no activity at WT:WPMA (the talk page of the project tagged at the top of this page) since June. Where did you try to build a consensus or invite participation in this discussion? Cabayi (talk) 12:02, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

I had created a new topic on this talk page, as I believed it was the correct way to have a change made to the martial arts info box and I had seen other suggestions made and discussed here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PqMMA (talk • contribs) 12:08, 29 October 2018 (UTC)
 * There is now a discussion at WT:WPMA, and given that the first reply was in opposition I am going to close this until such time as a "supporting" consensus is reached. Primefac (talk) 14:40, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

Adding Official Record
I would like to suggest that athlete's official records be linked from here. Mixed Martial Arts LLC which owns and operates mixedmartialarts.com is the Official Record Keeper for the Association of Boxing Commissions. It is the only database for which event results are required to be submitted by state, tribal, and provincial commission to be included as official.

For example: https://www.mixedmartialarts.com/fighter/Fabricio-Werdum:584DB7540A5C83D4

It also has an active suspension state for athletes currently under medical or administrative suspensions.

Happy to answer any questions.

PqMMA (talk) 00:47, 20 October 2018 (UTC) pqmma

The Association of Boxing Commissions recently released a vow of support on their website for this effort as well:

http://www.abcboxing.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/abc-support-mma-wiki.pdf

19:32, 23 October 2018 (UTC)pqMMA — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.252.19.83 (talk)

Ethnicity
Is there a reason there's still an ethnicity parameter here when it's been removed from other infoboxes? Nick Number (talk) 00:14, 8 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Likely because this template has been around since 2007 and no one noticed before now. But we have, and it's gone. Primefac (talk) 13:16, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

Stances other than orthodox or southpaw
Can there be an option for "Switches" or "Both" or "Opposing Stance"? Or is it possible to have clarifications in brackets? For example Anthony Pettis is technically Orthodox, but he switches stances depending on who he fights, it would be inaccurate to list him as orthodox, since he usually fights southpaw when he is fighting another orthodox, it would be more accurate to list him as Switch or Switches, or as Opposing Stance. As another example, Max Holloway would not accurately be listed as either orthodox or southpaw, since he switches stances at will and it's part of his fighting style. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lemanakmelo (talk • contribs) 01:26, 27 April 2020 (UTC)
 * The content in an article needs to be backed up by reliable sources. I see nothing in either article stating their stance preference, so it should not be included in the infobox. Primefac (talk) 17:51, 27 April 2020 (UTC)

Reliability of Sherdog
There is a discussion at Reliable sources/Noticeboard regarding the reliability of Sherdog. Thank you. <b style="font-family:Georgia;font-size:105%;color:#FA0"> Cassiopeia</b>(<b style="#0000FF">talk</b>) 11:39, 16 October 2020 (UTC)

Stand
Hi Good day. The parameter "stand" seems not showing in the infobox - example Tim Elliott and other fithers' pages. Could you able to you fix it. Thanks in advance. Stay safe and best.<b style="font-family:Georgia;font-size:105%;color:#FA0"> Cassiopeia</b>(<b style="#0000FF">talk</b>) 00:23, 28 March 2021 (UTC)


 * FYI: Issue solved by other editor. Thank you.<b style="font-family:Georgia;font-size:105%;color:#FA0"> Cassiopeia</b>(<b style="#0000FF">talk</b>) 02:05, 28 March 2021 (UTC)