User:LoveThieves

LoveThieves (born September, Age of Fire) is a Soulsborne gamer and Dark Souls contributor. He has completed all souls games including Demon's Souls, Dark Souls 1, Dark Souls 2 (SOFS), Dark Souls 3, along with Bloodborne and Sekiro. He is also an avid seeker of Italian espresso and fine American bourbon.

He is native in English and also speaks Japanese fluently.

Summary and Analysis
The underlying theme in Dark Souls is about immortality and producing a proper heir. So we know that Gwyn anointed Seath as Duke to do research/experiments and he discovered immortality. Seath discovered the Primordial Crystal that would bring immortality to any soul. Unfortunately, Seath's heart was filled with envy and wanted a heir just like Gwyn. Who would Seath's heir be? One theory is that Crossbreed Priscilla is an illegitimate child of Seath the Dragon and Gwynevere (daughter of Gwyn). Some argue that Seath never had any children and it was Gwyn who had an affair with Crossbreed Priscilla and thus Gwyndolin was born from this case. I think some of this is true, but not all.

After "the age of the Ancients", Gwyn wanted an heir to be immortal but not his first born, "God of War". The eldest son (Nameless/Anonymous King) had an affinity for the Dragons when he discovered that the dragons were peaceful and lived in harmony (Ash Lake). Gwyn attempted to destroy any remembrance of his first born son.

Seath offered a solution after years of experimenting on various creatures and characters. The two Pisaca's at the bottom of Duke's archive's prison tower seems shows that he was involved with the maidens.

Gwyndolin
My theory is that Gwyndolin is a bastard child of Gywn and the maiden that served Gwynevere, most likely the younger sister in the timeline. Gwyn's pursuit to produce an heir that would be immortal was tempted by Seath's research.

What Seath and Gwyn didn't know was that the primordial crystal that brings immortality can also curse their subject as well, SEE Big Hat Logan's questline. Another reason to make this claim is revealed in miracle drops by the last two non-hostile Pisaca's in Duke's prison tower. Both being sisters, they had some pretty dark secrets and some pretty bad shit happen to them. You can also hear them crying. They were maidens of Gwynevere and were later kidnapped by the Chaneller and transformed into Pisaca's explained in the lore.

Getting into some deep theories but your first encounter with the Pisaca's octopus shaped bodies doesn't support the claim but if you look at the bottom of their bodies, they look more like tails from a snake or dragon. The Pisaca's feet look similar to Gwyndolin legs but smaller and thinner as he was "repulsive, frail". You also notice that the two Serpent soldiers flee upstairs from the Pisacas. They probably abused them or worse, rape but that would be some deep shit for a video game. You have to remember, if you follow Rhea's questline, she's hollow and locked up in the prison so who knows what Seath would have done to her.

These maidens didn't turn into creatures overnight but slowly mutated over time. Gwyn's affair happened during the early stages of Seath's experiment without any knowledge of his wife or Gwynevere.

It's also noted in Japanese mythology that the lord's children inherit serpent-like features due to having secret affairs.

Priscilla
So now we need to discuss how Priscilla comes into picture. Same story with Gwyn but Seath had a child with the elder maiden from a previous time. That makes Crossbreed Priscilla first cousins with Gwyn and also her uncle.

The maiden's younger sister would be the mother of his bastard children, Gwyndolin and Yorshka (appears in Dark Souls 3). Gwyn was angered by his own mistakes and the Gwyndolin as theonly remaining deity left in Anor Londo. When people started to question the relationship of Crossbreed Priscilla and Gwyn, he locked her up in the painted world along with all the other creatures that were failed experiments from Duke's Archives.


 * Here's an Image of their illegitimate family tree

Anor Londo was in complete turmoil, only a few silver knights and painting guardians stayed with Gwyndolin. The birth of Gwyndolin was an obvious sign to the world of his affair. Eventually causing Gwyn's wife to leave Anor Londo but she meets with Anastacia of Astora and tells her about the affair and the peculiar doll. Gwyn's wife disappears soon after. It was Velka, Goddess of Sin that tells the crow to drop the peculiar doll back in to Northern Undead Asylum but accidently drops the key back on the roof at Firelink shrine. Gwyn fearing that this information would leak, Gwyn's black knights find Anastacia, cut her tongue and lock her up.

When Gwynevere left Anor Londo to marry Flame God Flann, she knew but didn't want to get involved since the entire kingdom was practically doomed. She was definitely kind to everyone, especially Gwyndolin but leaving was the best thing for her.

Gender roles also play are theme in Anor Londo. As you notice that the second Fire Keeper and knight you meet in Anor Londo is a female (Darkmoon Knightess), she's also wearing armor that is similar to Dragonslayer knight Ornstein, while most female npc in the game are wearing (dress, skirts, robes). We have a knightess that becomes hostile only if you attack Gwyndolin or Gwynevere but not Ornstein & Smough. Also the fact that Gwyndolin was raised female instead of male raises more questions. In dark souls 3, we also have the reversal ring behind the Darkmoon tomb.

This might be a stretch and getting into some deep controversial subject matter with the Japanese imperial family but the writer could be discussing some minor controversies within the imperial family, although I'm probably wrong on this one. Gwyn as Akihito and his two sons and daughter. Except they changed the

order of their age to avoid controversy: Gwyndolin as Naruhito, and Nameless King as Fumihito. Important to note that Hisahito (Fumihito's son) will be the next Emperor of Japan when Naruhito steps down. There were rumors in Japan in the late 90s that the eldest (Naruhito) was in the closet but went to private gay bars according to the staff members that worked there, this would be a major controversial subject matter especially in traditional Japan but there is no confirmation.

So going back to Dark Souls, the part of illegitimacy has nothing to do with the Japanese imperial family but the part of producing an heir might have been a touchy subject when rumors came out that Naruhito had a difficult time conceiving cause of that issue, let alone producing a male heir.

Gwyn's first born (Nameless king) left his ring to his brother Gwyndolin so one day it would boost his faith even though Gwyndolin wasn't even half as strong and being in the shadow doesn't help, but he can find his own strength to do good. He used Gwynevere's illusion at Anor Londo instead of Lord Gwyn because he believed in his sister's message had more substance and importance to the world by spreading healing miracles instead of his father's legacy for complete domination.

The Statues
So we know Gwyn tried to destroy all traces of his first born that can be seen in the Sunlight altar but what about the mysterious mother holding a baby. We can assume it's Gwynevere but if we go further down to the Undead parish, we see the same statue but instead it's a lot brighter, largest of all the baby mama statues, and guarded by the Balder knights and the Berenike Knights. If you kill Gwynevere at Anor Londo, they appear again but in the human form. Also the statue at Undead Parish has birds, doves, lions, and animals worshipping it. Rhea of Thoroland (miracle/healer) also prays before that one and offers mostly healing miracles that are similar to the Princess, while the closer one to the Sunlight altar offers two lightning miracles and size is closer to the Nameless King. The last clue is that the dragon defends the Sunlight altar. We see the Nameless king riding a a similar dragon-like creature, a wyvern. If you played DS3, you know it's almost the same set up but at a different location although the dragon is optional in DS1.


 * SEE the Statues

So what about Gwyndolin? The tomb where you find the Darkmoon ring also has the statue but also a coffin. This leads me to believe that Gwyndolin (aka Kage no Taiyo Guwindorin (陰の太陽グウィンドリン in the Japanese version translated as "Shadow of the Sun") makes it clear that he was always in the dark so New Londo or the Catacombs would be the most ideal place.

What makes it possible that the statue is not baby Gwyndolin's and his mom is that the feet in the statue. They seem to look normal and there's no disfiguration as far as I can see in the video angles. It's possible that Gwyndolin could have transformed into a creature as he grew up or he was cursed because of another unknown lore, possibly New Londo. The coffin could possibly be the mother who died during childbirth and the sculptor made it before he was born.

Finally Crossbreed Priscilla, the statue with the biggest clues are found in the painted world of Ariamis. Once you get the Annex key, the statues open the gates and lead you to Pricilla. Also the face of the mother appears to have blood running from her face and the child (appearing older) in the statue appears deformed. Most of the creatures in the painted world are experiments of Seath.

The Painted world is the part that gets really deep and has so much lore. There's a lot of clear evidence that ties Gwyndolin and the painted world. The crows randomly drop the Souvenirs of Reprisal which could mean those crossbreeds were guilty of a crime but turned in to half crows for a reason. Were they sinners in the outside world that got sucked into the painted world by accident?

Artorias
This one is pretty obvious but he was fighting his own demons. I think Friedrich Nietzsche explains him best in a quote:

"He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby become a monster. And if thou gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will also gaze into thee "

I'm also suspicious that he might have killed somebody innocent in the story. The reason behind this is the fact that you can trade in Sif's souls to the Giant Blacksmith and ascend it to a cursed weapon, the only one who drops curse weapons are the ghost.

Maybe when he was cursed and killed one of the innocent victims in New Londo, a ghost?

A lot of Japanese lore believes that a sword has a soul. Although we have a Western style greatsword, Miyazaki maybe referencing classic ideas in folklore. Samurai sword to his soul

Solaire of Astora
A tragic hero who couldn't find love. The Icarus story seems to be the most accepted symbolism to describe the downfall of Solaire but I think it's something deeper: True Love. He was loyal to you and helped you fight some of the main battles including the finale in the game but what about the other npcs? Wasn't Kirk loyal to his love, Quelaan (White Spider in Daughter of Chaos) just like Garl was for Astrea for Demon's Souls and Eygon with Irina in DS3. Greirat was loyal to Loretta (his mom? maybe) and Vilhelm to Sister Friede. The list goes on...

I'm sure his quote before the end of his questline, "After all this searching, I still cannot find it…" was about love. He couldn't find love, so he kept searching for something tangible and external while it could have been something internal that brought him peace. He even jokes around about having a companion in Anor Londo by saying "If I didn't know better, I'd think you had feelings for me!"

Kalameet and Oolacile
This is a stretch but if Miyazaki can create a Crossbreed then I can believe that Ocelotte (DS3) might be their child (Kalameet and Oolacile). After the Abyss with Manus, she appears crying, disoriented, and its possible that she crawls out to the garden where he lives unless of course you kill them.

Another possibility is Seath and Rhea could be the parents of Ocelotte, since we know that the dungeon is a place of experiments and torture as we see it Demon's Souls tower of Latria and also Irithyll dungeon in Dark Souls 3.

Pregnant Ghost of New Londo
One speculation I have about that the pregnant ghost could be the spirit of the mother of either Gwyndolin or Crossbreed Priscilla. First off, we don't know much about the wife of Gwyn. All we have is the statues with lots of clues.

Since Gwyndolin was named shadow of the Sun (JP version), we can see that New Londo would be the best place for him until it was cursed by the 4 Kings and Ingward decided to lock it up for your safety.

Was Gwyn having an affair with the maidens? Was Gyndolin's mother cursed? The cursed ghost that appears to hold a child and wields a knife? Was she trying to kill her own baby? Did she go mad? In Dark Souls 3, we can hear Mad King Oolacile with a child in his arms but the child is missing, is it his imagination or did he kill the baby? The ghost are telling us something that we should know about the truth of what happened in New Londo. Were they killed when they were human?

Oscar of Astora and Witch Beatrice
During the the age of the Ancients, Oscar of Astora fought the dragons at valley of the Drakes, he lost his shield and sword during the battle. He became undead and Velka, the crow was able to carry him back to the Northern Undead Asylum but finally turned hollow when he fought the asylum demon. Witch Beatrice was trying to save him but failed as an undead, that's also why you never see her in a human form. She took his armor when he became undead and disguised herself as Oscar and dropped his corpse and key to you so you can save Lordran. She realizes that Oscar is never coming back as human so she drops his armor at the Forest and leaves her white sign hoping that another hero (or Oscar)will help her fight these moonlight butterflies that keep swarming in from the Crystal cave.

I don't think she cares about victory but only loves Oscar and her questline was to kill the 4 kings. After the 4 kings are defeated, Oscar turns hollow and wants to kill you. When she helps you defeat the 4 kings and realizes that Oscar goes hollow, she loses her mind and decides to jump to her death at the Valley of the Drakes while leaving her gear behind. She never wants to hurt you because you are new chosen undead and thus, she's a good witch.

so much lore to discover but that's it for now.

Synopsis and Analysis
There's enough content and lore provided by many youtubers but I think there's a lot of underlying messages about nihilism, existentialism, major religions including Christianity, Catholicism, Buddhism, and some parts of Shintoism. Some major themes include social class, elitism, royal intermarriage, feudalism, tribalism, fundamentalism, fate, and of course chivalry and romance.

Queen of Lothric
I don't believe Queen of Lothric and the wife of Gwyn are related, but very similar in the story. They both had husband's that made poor decisions that ultimately led to their own destruction. Queen of Lothric left the Ashen Estus ring for you in the Untended graves for a good reason. It was a gift for her but she was afraid that Oceiros might take advantage of it since the crystalline in the ring was the reason for his madness. The crystal, when abused could curse the user as seen in DS1. Queen of Lothric's holy maiden, Gertrude also known as "Daughter of the Angels" in the Japanese version knew that her Crystal chime had a combination of Faith and Intelligence, which could result in dangerous recipe for the King. She dropped the chime from the top of the cage in Dukes Archive before she was killed by the King's men and possibly Daughter of Crystal Kriemhild, who was a favorite pupil among the Scholars.

Daughter of Crystal Kriemhild
You'll also notice that Kriemhild is wearing a Firekeeper's outfit because she was one in the past.

In Lothric, she has eyes so that means she knows that the world goes dark and wants the world to go dark again but not because she is aligned with Yuria. She is doing it for love and wants Gundyr's soul to rest in peace.

In her past life, she became undead after jumping off of the edge in the tower at Firelink shrine. Before she jumped and became hollow, she dropped the Estus ring because she lost hope and also because "she never met her champion" even though Gundyr was suppose to save her, It was an important ring that she wanted to give to him. She knew he was the chosen one that would save her, unlock the tower door, and rekindle the flame but he died at the Cemetery of Ash because of an unknown person, probably you.

She invades in Untended Graves as a dark spirit because she wants to take revenge against you and prevent you from killing Gundyr because he was the "Champion". They could be together in the afterlife for eternity if he doesn't die in battle. Her undead body continuously looks for that ring but can never find it because she is in the darkened version of Firelink shrine from the past which is in the age of Dark. The ring and her souls is located at the Firelink Shrine tower after the lit version of Cemetary of Ash but having eyes without a soul misguides her purpose of true love and direction.

Cyrstal Kriemhild
Not much is mentioned in the lore but he was a powerful sage. Kriemhild also becomes cursed by the crystals, he goes mad and disappears.

They had a daughter who was a Firekeeper.

King Oceiros decides to lock up his daughter at a young age at the tower of Firelink Shrine. She leaps to her death and becomes undead.

The Master then releases her the tower and she travels to Duke's Archives to study under the Crystal sage to become one of their best pupils.

Shrine Handmaid
Obviously grandmother of Sirris and possibly wife or ex-wife of Holy knight Hodrick, a knight who went hollow but was a great knight in his past life.

Oceiros
Oceiros, the Consumed King actually killed and possibly ate his own son because of his own insanity. There is information Cut audio that still remains somewhat unclear and crosses the line of ultra violence and video game censorship. Japan has looser censorship laws and rules when it comes to video game violence as its culture does not see it as real versus other countries with stricter rules, viewpoints, and real life consequences.

The reason Oceiros became insane was because of the primordial crystals mentioned in DS1 that curse their subjects.

**Shrine Hand Maiden is the Queen of Lothric.
Some speculation but the Shrine handmaid could be the Queen of Lothric if you look at the clues. So let's get some items that are the biggest clues to my theory.

3 items and two illusionary walls. The Eyes of a firekeeper, the tower key, the prison key., illusionary wall to get to Untended graves and the eyes on the ground.

Is it possible that she left Lothric when the King went mad and possibly had an affair with Knight Hodrick. Since we don't know who exactly Sirris's father and mother is, we can assume its Prince Lorian but that wouldn't make any sense because she's loyal to the Darkmoon and there's nothing that ties them together.

So we can assume Sirris' father and mother died by the hands of King Oceiros and her grandfather and grandmother went on to hiding. Why is Hodrick hiding and why is he hidden in the pit of hollows and the only way to get there is by hopping to the cage of one of the Hollow manservants? Who do they serve?

It makes sense that Sirris says "I finally found you" suggesting he is constantly hiding or just hard to track. It makes sense that Sirris would join the Darkmoon since it's the most honorable covenant outside of Lothric since the Warrior of sunlight altar was hijacked along with the three pillars of rule: Knight, Scholar, and Priestess.

The ring and illusionary wall after the Consumed King's Garden was her way of trying to protect the truth.

If Shrine maiden was the Queen of Lothric, it would make sense for her to create the illusionary walls to prevent people from getting the eyes to the Firekeep to see the truth of the world. That it's a Dark place and all the Kings and heroes in a story eventually go mad or get lost into the Abyss. When you beat Halflight, Spears of the Church and touch Filianore's cracked shell, you realize what the real world looks like, well at least in the Dark Souls Universe. Even Gwynevere has the full egg shell in Anor Londo that represents hope, even though she's an illusion, and maybe hope is along with faith? There's a theme of nihilism but that subject might be too taboo, deep, and discussion for another time.

Also remember, Patches can be summoned to help you fight against the church. Once again, you have to question the reason why he is helping you and ask yourself if the church is creating some sort of an illusion. You'll see there is no heaven or hell at the end of the story but a complete void like the one at the end of the ringed city.

Maybe Miyazaki was telling us something about Slave Knight Gael and the of blood of the dark. Why is he a slave, and also a knight? Also your first encounter with him is at the Cathedral of the Deep, a place that was once holy turned vile.

Solaire is Holy Knight Hodrick
This leads me to believe that Holy Knight Hodrick might have been Solaire and the Shrine maiden decided to trade it in his equipment with Snuggly the crow because the Lothric was under a mad King and wanted to preserve Solaire's legacy incase he destroys it.

Also remember that Solaire had the Sun armor and Hodrick had the Sunset armor so it might suggest that there was a slight change only to hide his identity. Also note the Warrior of Sunlight item is located at the undead settlement where you first encounter Hodrick, instead of near the Sunlight altar, that suggest a lot. The Lothric castle can be seens a royal place that abuses power instead of the true purpose of the warrior of sunlight in guiding others.

Although Hodrick has no lightening attacks, he has a miracle that heals anyone that gets close to it. Almost similar to that of the sunlight maggot and also the fact that Solaire goes mad towards the end of DS1.

We know Solaire's a charming man from DS1 and can assume that he met the Queen of Lothric before she was a queen and they got busy before she met the Mad King Oceiros.

Finally we know we know that the Curse-rotted greatwood is enough evidence to show that even if Soliare or Hodrick stayed at the undead settlement, they would go mad. There is not safe place or sacred ground in Dark Souls except for a few locations.

Prince Lothric and Lorian
Oh boy...so I got this idea from a clip from the Happy Hob but never really thought it can be this sick and dark. But then again, royal families and lords in the past have some dark history. Historically, royal intermarriage was common. We see it in history, (Charles of Spain II ), France (John V, Count of Armagnac), UK, and there's a lot of accounts. So yeah, if the piggy back ride that Lothric doesn't give you an idea of where this is going and the result of his genetic disorder from maybe his parent/sister/brother!? There's a reason why it's called dark souls. not happy souls.

Religious Critique in Dark Souls Lore
The lore and settings in Anor Londo, Cathedral of the Deep, Farrons Keep, and Archdragon Peak are based on the hypocrisy of organized Religion, deals with Tribalism and overt individualism.....this is going to be updated soon...

Soul of Cinder
The Soul of Cinder is an amalgamation of all dark souls characters from previous games including the ninja (backflip) and his knight set looks similar to the Elite set although the colors are red. After extensive lore analysis, the Soul of Cinder could be reincarnated version of Oscar of Astora*, and spirit of Gwyn. The firelink greatsword as quoted as "existed long before the throneless lords themselves.". The timeline would suggest that he might have had the greatsword before the Dark Souls 3 lore and timeline or he pulled it from the bonfire. He learns magic and spells from Big Hat Logan and the Sage, along with Daughter of Crystal Kriemhild but suggest she might have followed Champion Gundyr. There's a strong suggestion that Crystal Kriemhild may have been a firekeeper as she is wearing the firekeeper set and her best reincarnation was her first love with the Soul of Cinder. She ends up at his final resting place when you kindle the flame and end the game. Time is convoluted.

Demon's Souls 1:
Maiden Astrea was born religious, turned Agnostic when she met Garl, and finally became an Atheist at the end of the game. She was the most moral and benevolent npc in the game.

She kept the Demon souls to herself to prevent others from becoming corrupt with the world tendencies.

Locations in Real Life
Real life locations that inspired the dark souls universe.


 * Lothric Castle/New Londo ruins - (Le Mont Saint-Michel, France)
 * Dukes Archives (Royal Portuguese reading room. Brazil)
 * Inner Anor Londo (Chambord Castle, France)
 * Undead Parish (Nuevo San Juan Parangaricutiro, Mexico)
 * Undead Berg  (Craco ghost town Italy)
 * Deacons of the Deep (St. Peter's Basilica, Italy)
 * Pontiff Sulyvahn (Westminster Abbey, UK)