User:Luiscotiquicia/sandbox

= Proposal for Visa requirements maps =

Template
The template has outlined each country, allowing to identify it. Most of current maps, have the Schengen Area together, and we cannot distinguish the country, from its Freedom of movement area.

Comments
Hi! Thanks for the kind words! And thank you for working on the articles in Spanish language.

Your proposal looks interesting. The community should definitely discuss it. I think it's too early to discuss things like specific color codes, but there are some obstacles that I would like to point out. First of all I know that many editors prefer to have unique colors sometimes related to their flag colors for the maps. Then there is an issue of interpretation, for example Australia is painted green for the eVisitor because the European Commission rules that it is a visa-free regime but from time to time people complain because they don't see it that way, so it's a good thing that the legend includes eVisitor and ESTA as a part of it. Also I would remove the visa pick up information even from the maps that have it as this tends to be unreliable information that is changing all the time. But much bigger issue is that there are many countries with specific policies. For example I don't think that the ID card travel in Latin America equals freedom of movement. But also just look at options in these maps - File:Visa requirements for Australian citizens.png, File:Visa requirements for Chinese citizens holding ordinary and ordinary passports for public affairs and Two-way and Exit & Entry permits.png, File:Visa requirements for Macedonian citizens.png, File:Visa requirements for Belarusian citizens.png, File:Visa requirements for Azerbaijani citizens.png - it would be extremely difficult to standardize them, without losing any information.--Twofortnights (talk) 11:32, 3 May 2016 (UTC)

→ Hi there, glad to hear your feedback. Based on your comments, I'd like to add: - I believe that coloring the country with Red would be accurate, as it's the most common color in all flags. Also, it highlights its location on the map. - I strongly agree with removing the "visa pick up" info. I saw it on the Finland map, and it'd apply to a lot of maps and countries (specially for African countries). I'll remove it. - I'll also review the Brazilian ID Card info, and if it can be compared with freedom of movement. I guess the main point of freedom of movement is to travel on any mean (air, land, sea) with ID card, and not passport. - I took a look to the maps you provided, and I understand your concerns. I do see that some maps have information for public affairs and diplomat or special passports. I believe this info could be removed, and mostly focus on regular passports, as diplomat passports, for each country, has different reach, and it's a smaller amount of people with such type passport.

So, to continue with the proposal, I'll create the version for the maps you mentioned above so you can compare, and we can keep the conversation.

I'll update you once I have it updated. Regards, Luiscotiquicia (talk) 15:16, 3 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Hi! Freedom of movement does not mean that. It means that you can basically move to another place without a visa or any kind of permit. Most places are visa-free but only up to a certain number of days and usually with limitations such as no work etc. However if you are a Finnish citizen and you want to move to let's say Germany all you need is a plane ticket to get there and from there on you can live there for as long as you like and do whatever you want hence the freedom of movement. Sometimes perhaps you need to register but that only applies if it applies to locals as well (for example the UK has no mandatory registration of own citizens and therefore EU citizens also can live without getting registered in any form). Apart from the EU/EEA, the freedom of movement exists for citizens of the Gulf Cooperation Council and *I think* CARICOM.
 * As for the other maps, as I've said I am strongly against removal of content for the sake of uniformity. Public affairs passports are in many countries ordinary passports endorsed with a sticker. In addition there are special rules like those in Australia and New Zealand which should not be removed and which do not fall under any existing general rules.
 * I think we should also discuss the uniformity of the legend. Should the legend be on the map file itself or should it be part of the map caption? If we do use it on the file -which fonts should we use for the best readability? How should the legend be organized? I must say that both the current versions (many of which created by me) and your version are not satisfactory in terms of readability, proper alignment and spacing.
 * Looking forward to continuing this discussion!--Twofortnights (talk) 18:34, 3 May 2016 (UTC)


 * Hi : Sorry it took me a while to get back to you. I just did some updates to the images based on your comment. I fully understand now the difference between 'freedom of movement' and just traveling with a valid ID (like in South America). I've updated it.
 * Also, I updated the Finland map as well, and remove the labels from the map. It's easier/prettier to update labels on the image caption, instead of updating the image itself.
 * I'll be taking another look at the maps for Azerbaijan, Belarus, China you initially posted, to verify what could be a proposal for it. Visa free for traveling in groups may apply for a lot of countries as well.
 * Please let me know your comments from today's updates.

Luiscotiquicia (talk) 22:00, 20 May 2016 (UTC)