User:Robert Daoust/Ralph Siu

This page was for preparing the recreation of the article about Ralph G.H. Siu, from various material.

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Panetics

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was Delete. No sources, notability not established, even in the stubified form.Cúchullain t/ c 02:28, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Panetics

 * – (View AfD) (View log)

Incoherent nonsense. John (talk) 23:06, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete I made an effort to clean this one up, but after finding virtually no significant sources unconnected with the founder or the organisation, slapped a cleanup on it and left a note on the talk page. As in its current form it seems un-clean-uppable (as per the note on the talkpage, I had to go to the organisation's own website to even work out what this page was supposed to be about), delete unless radically improved by the end of this discussion. Also at present fails to demonstrate that it has any notability outside of its own membership. —  iride  scent  23:11, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Siu's work is in the Library of Congress and the volumes are sold by his Panetics Society. So the question is "who can find another expert and can we afford anesthetics of and piecemeal wisdom. Another question would be to revisit groupthink and clanthink. (Warfield - another member and collegue of the late Siu's ISP society) --Benking and inform the original author  - like me - when people like Siu are deleted without any information or discussion. I met Jimmy Wales when he was in Berlin some years ago - maybe he should revisit the "Deletionism" exercised at his "WIKIPEDIA" - as I feel there are many people with much sympathy but feel discussions like above look strange. This are my 5 cents - maybe some more and diverse reviewers are needed with WIKIPEDIA and laws like requisite variety should be applied, and if the typically user can not judge "a new science" and so stays on the surface and hide so statements can not be seen in context. --Benking —Preceding comment was added at 13:25, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete fundamentally unverifiable form independent sources, everything I could find tracks back to one man and one website. Virtually nothing on Google to work from, either. Guy (Help!) 23:13, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment Regardless of the way this article is written, if the consensus decides that the subject matter isn't notable enough to warrant a cleanup attempt, we should probably consider Ralph G.H. Siu for deletion as well, as he doesn't seem to have any assertion of notability outside of this field. I will await the decision on this before starting a debate on him...or alternatively we could just lump it in with this one. Tx17777 (talk) 23:21, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment Although Siu's article isn't up to much, his military record looks interesting enough that it could probably pass WP:N. It would probably take someone with specialist knowledge to write it, as Googling his name would probably be swamped with hits from this pseudoreligion. (Of course, expanding the article on him would mean mention panetics... which would create a redlink... which would be filled...) —  iride  scent  23:26, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete per iridescent and JZG - and delete the other article too.--h i s  s p a c e   r e s e a r c h 23:22, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete -- essentially one person's theory with very limited reception. --Pjacobi (talk) 23:48, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep While much of what the Humanistic Psychology movement generated sounds like nonsense to the average reader, it was a huge deal in the 70s and is hardly obscure. Perhaps an edit with further explanation should be suggested. —Preceding unsigned comment added by ByronHudson (talk • contribs) 23:50, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete per all above; also very, very hard to understand for someone who has no experience in the field to understand. If that could be remedied and sources could be found, sure, let's recreate it... Master of Puppets Call me MoP!  00:13, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete no apparent assertion of notability Dlabtot (talk) 00:27, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep. See here for example concerning notability. But of course the article has to be improved. &lt;K  F&gt;  01:26, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete: as it currently stands, the article is nonsensical because it is totally confusing and because it is attempting to discuss what appears to be a psychological, political, physical & philosophical subject with unsubstantiated religious-based implications. If someone can fix this article, I am willing to change my mind to keep.  One article that I found that seemed relevant is here: http://ming.tv/flemming2.php/__cat/_c1836/Culture, but I am not an expert in this subject matter.  Mh29255 (talk) 06:20, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment Strangely, some who vote "keep" and others who vote "delete" want the same thing: a good article on the subject. Could we, as a sort of compromise, reduce this article to a stub, add this deletion discussion (which includes some sources) to its talk page and wait for someone knowledgeable to come along and expand it? &lt;K  F&gt;  12:44, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - This topic appears to be notable, but needs to be stubified. If no-one will do it, I will have to say it ca not be fixed and thus must be deleted. Bearian (talk) 16:23, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment one man and one website ?? pseudoreligious ?? Siu wrote in 1964 "TAO OF SCIENCE" with one of the top established scientific publishers: Whiley: The Tao of Science: An Essay on Western Knowledge and Eastern Wisdom http://www.amazon.com/Tao-Science-Western-Knowledge-Eastern/dp/0262690047  - or SAGE as mentioned in the refernces - maybe someone can look outside of the box or certain jargon or concepts and bridge concepts and cultures - I feel lost as I have added some links and refences - to well known people like Johan_Galtung   - who spoke at Ralph Siu's grave an eulogy.
 * Delete if someone finds sources that show the topic is notable and uses them as the basis of a referenced, coherent article that is 100% verifiable and contains no original research I have no objection. However such an article would have nothing in common with the headache inducing mess that currently inhabits the page.Guest9999 (talk) 13:18, 4 January 2008 (UTC)]]
 * Delete. The only independent source seems to be the citation noted by User:KF, which is a mention in one chapter in a Ph.D. thesis. If the article is not deleted, it should definitely be stubified. Hal peridol (talk) 04:15, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep and improve and find native editor. The Delete entries above seem strange to me. The PhD Thesis of Goppold is nice but not on the level of life-time contributions of Ralph- GH Siu. Have you ever tried A9 (by AMAZON) or Google Scholar or academic repositories ! References to Publishers like Wiley, Sage, MIT, ... and national sources are included in MY CONTRIBUTION and in entry of Ralph_G_H_Siu but that looks like being deleted last night. Strange procedures and conduct you maintain here in such discussions.  I am awfully sorry that i am not a native speaker and have normally no time for exercises such as this !- how should i call it "Deletionism" ??  my advise would be:   1. explicitly display the evidence and reasoning that justifies a particular point of view; 2. refrain from using ad hominem attacks, slogans, epithets; 3. Suspend judgment until after having read the relevant texts, ....
 * Comment I did inform you of this article's listing here. --John (talk) 21:01, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete Looks like nonsense to me Pilotbob (talk) 17:35, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep as a stub and Improve. As prominent people like secretaries of state and Peace Studies founder Johan Galtung speak at Ralph Siu Memoriam lectures, this cannot be considered valueless. Comp.: Individual(!) "Human Rights" was introduced to the UN by Mrs. Roosevelt http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eleanor_Roosevelt, and is well known but not well established today. China (focussed on collective service) and Arab world denounce it as being a western idea only, based on values of Humanism and Christianity; there is no "natural" deduction of human rights. Would you therefore consider the philosophical http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism as a pseudo-religion? In the "west", the "new" credo of individual human rights of self-development, incl WOMEN and CHILDREN, is so new that Human Rights education is still in its beginnings and the first curricula are now only being tested in European schools. UNESCO's special rapporteur recently complained about human rights daily being abused in german schools and a coalition of 100+ large german organisations is now promotion a change in elarning culture http://www.national-coalition.de/ -- In the East, the reduction of suffering is a central issue, and it was for example a central teaching of the young, future Chinese Emperor to reduce the people's suffering (this was NOT the case in Europe!). In this tradition, we can see Bhutan's governance principle Gross National Happiness, which measures not only economical, but also ecol., spir. and cult. wealth (the Queen held this speech as opened of the "Global Dialogue on Poverty and Wealth" at Universal World Exhibition expo2000 in Hannover, 2000), and thus decided for ecol. protection measures in the constitution. This is discussed as a good practice example in eco-socially responsible governance for sustainable development, internationally - easy to the eastern worldview but not to the western, which is why Siu developed this approach to be further developed in humanist studies and education. A similar "thinking model" is the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecological_Footprint, which is also only a general idea (an NO WAY a scientifically viable detailed approach) that indeed functions to nurture perception for global reosurce cycle issues and adopt more sustainable consumption patterns. -- Panetics are a step to "visualise" and "quantify" suffering (for example of Iraqi people vs benefits of getting rid of Saddam Hussein); suffering (not profits) is yet neglected in political decision-making neglected just because it is "out of sight, out of mind". Panetics is an approach to develop such thinking models. -- A problem here is that amateurs without knowledge of deep knowledge of cultures, religions, ethics, values, humanities, worldviews and their VERY concrete implications for governance are judging things inappropriately: pseudo-religion etc., which reminds me of the racist South African government 20 years back. -- My job usually is to bridge cultures and translate between ideas to make things understandable: which is - I absolutely agree - the purpose of an encyclopedia entry. I offer to get involved in developing this STUB into a legible and comprehensible article. I think it makes sense in the world today, to at least get the word and step towards reduction of suffering into the WEST's encyclopedia. Deleting it is quite a symbol! -- SUGGESTION: Give it a month, since this requires research for sources and links to other wikipedia entries dealing with related Eastern philosophy etc issues, and I can work towards an article, - with 1 wikipedia expert to have a look now and again on improvement concerning wikipedia ecycl. code: someone who has appreciation for the article and to see it developed, with some basic competence in intercult., humanities, cultures - not someone denouncing such as babble and nonsense (while admitting not having understood a thing; come on, people...). Well, there are in fact people that understand it. The thing is to rewrite it so people without academic education understand it. I offer joining in, but not tonight. Patience, please, and a contact. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Weltgeist (talk • contribs)
 * Delete As written, it's pretty much nonsensical. The problem with the reasoning of (paraphrasing) "let's keep it, we'll clean it up someday" is that, historically, it rarey if ever works.  Wikipedia is a top-10 website with the eyes of the world upon it.  There's no excuse for keeping articles this poor. Andrew Lenahan -  St ar bli nd  15:39, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete as outlined numerous times above, this article is just so much nonsense. --Crusio (talk) 23:30, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep There is a misunderstanding about this article. User:Benking should be forgiven for having created rather clumsily a valid entry on a difficult topic. Panetics, despite its exotic terminology, is not a fringe science but a proposed discipline in social science: as such, it is just an idea among others. Is it an idea 'notable' enough to be included in this encyclopedia? The answer can only be a resounding YES, not because a lot of people know about panetics, but because dozens of highly qualified people have, quite independently, subscribed to it: suffice it to name Kenneth Boulding, Johann Galtung, Anthony Judge, and Ralph Siu himself who is a highly respected author deserving an entry for himself. In addition to Professor Goppold's work mentioned here above, there is a 1997 Ph.D. thesis by Russell Doyle Amerson entitled The universal duty to alleviate suffering: an ethical grounding for Siu's new discipline of panetics. The International Society for Panetics has been founded in 1991 by some sixty scientists, physicians, business leaders, scholars, artists and writers from several countries. The Society is more or less dormant by now, but it was quite active in the nineties. As showed in the article Suffering, panetics is still nowadays one of the few approaches that are proposed in the social sciences for dealing with the phenomenon of suffering in a specialized, specific, or systematic manner. User:Weltgeist volunteers for improving the article. I will help this person (contact me on my user page). And I will 'stubify' the entry immediately. Others contributors are welcome, of course. Robert Daoust (talk) 00:26, 8 January 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suffering#Social_sciences_approaches
Ralph G.H. Siu, an American author, urged in 1988 the "creation of a new and vigorous academic discipline, called panetics, to be devoted to the study of the infliction of suffering." The International Society for Panetics was founded in 1991 to study and develop ways to reduce the infliction of human suffering by individuals acting through professions, corporations, governments, and other social groups.

From http://www.laetusinpraesens.org/bio/wikibios.php
In Memoriam

Subsequent reflection following the "deletion" of Ralph Siu (January 2008) (reproduced in a P2P Foundation Wiki entry by Michel Bauwens: On the deletion of scholar Ralph Siu by the ‘Wikipedia lynch mobs)

The entry on R G H Siu has just been deleted from Wikipedia, despite references to his name in connection with panetics (the study of suffering) which was the preoccupation of a research program and organization that he instigated (the International Society for Panetics). The entry on panetics is also marked as being considered for deletion. Siu continues (for the moment) to be mentioned in the Wikipedia entry on suffering.

'''Siu was an early pioneer in creating a bridge between Eastern and Western cultures, notably in his work on taoism and science (published by MIT Press). These,with other publications on taoism and management (published by Wiley), he subsequently framed as a 12-volume collection (The Quantum and the Tao: an unified East-West psychophilosophical synthesis toward harmonious living). The volumes, with an indication of their contents are listed by a project of the Special Integration Group (SIG) -- of the International Society for the Systems Sciences (ISSS) originally Society for General Systems Research (SGSR) and the International Institute for Systemic Inquiry and Integration.''' (highlighted by me, r.d.)

Siu is an exemplar of lifelong dedication to complex issues having fundamental humanitarian implications. The unseemly haste with which an honourable scholar has been "deleted", by what amounts to a rabid editorial lynch mob, is a sad commentary on the democratic dynamics which many had so hopefully associated with Wikipedia as an alternative model. The intellectual quality of the dialogue relating to the proposed deletion of panetics is also a sad commentary on collective ignorance and the "unwisdom of crowds" at a time when suffering is simultaneously a preoccupation for many that experience it and of relatively little interest to the research community.

The removal of Siu focuses attention on historical revisionism and censorship as it effectively results from criteria of editorial quality and haste. Clearly, the bias favours the crowd and that which is known to the crowd; hence the extent to which currently favoured bands and groups, using the names of fundamental human values, displace those values in any web search facility. Wikipedia and Google (or their future competitors) could therefore usefully consider a longer time span in weighting relevance of web content presented through their services -- or find that they serve increasingly to obscure larger contexts in favour of the fashionable present even when it is later only of historical significance (if any). For how many decades, for example will the Wikipedia entry on the NY band Mindless Self Indulgence continue to be retained as an authoritative indication of modern global preoccupations -- obscuring the absence of any entry on self indulgence that is the cause of so much suffering (as studied by Siu)?

And yes...

like the founder of international peace research, I am indeed one of the people who has specifically written on R G H Siu, most recently in a lengthy review, with numerous references to panetics research:

Varieties of Terrorism: extended to the experience of the terrorized, 2004

and prior to that in the enrichment of the Encyclopedia of World Problems and Human Potential for which I was responsible. Of relevance in that respect are the criteria, and dilemmas, for inclusion and exclusion of "world problems" (notably in terms of their subjective importance to those constituencies identifying with them, and motivated to action by them). The challenge was to enable a framework for interrelating incompatible perspectives.

Curiously one of the assertions of the Wikipedia editors advocating "deletion" was that the contents of the entry text on Siu were "nonsense". Unfortunately in a complex world, the perspectives of most with whom we disagree are necessarily (if not by definition) "nonsense" -- whether politically, theologically, from another disciplinary framework, or in terms of level of expertise.

And no...engaging with the democratic dynamics of a lynch mob editorial process is something I did not seek to do -- for the reasons indicated above.


 * Added by me, r.d., following references to Judge's texts on Siu's work: http://www.laetusinpraesens.org/docs00s/varterr.php and http://www.laetusinpraesens.org/musings/implresp.php --Robert Daoust (talk) 20:48, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

From http://www.qmfound.com/Dr_Ralph_Siu.htm
Dr. Siu was born 24 February 1917, in Honolulu, Hawaii. He earned his Bachelors and Masters degrees from the University of Hawaii (in 1939 and 1941, respectively) and a Ph.D. degree as a biochemist from the California Institute of Technology in 1943. During the last two years of World War II, Dr. Siu served as a scientific and technical consultant for the U.S. Army, and became one the premier researchers assigned to the Quartermaster Corps.

As the Allies shifted focus from Europe to the war in the Pacific, Dr. Siu headed a team of researchers that designed, tested, and helped field a vast array of new "jungle type" fabrics, clothing and equipment that helped protect soldiers and save lives in the harsh tropical environment. As the Quartermaster Corps’ Director of Laboratories and Chief Scientific and Technical Director for more than a decade (1948-62), Dr. Siu spearheaded numerous critical projects, including pioneer efforts on irradiated food – a key component of President Eisenhower’s Atoms-For-Peace program. He was also one of the key planners involved in establishing the Quartermaster Research and Development Center in Natick, Massachusetts (today’s Soldier Systems Command).

Throughout his long and productive career and service to the nation, in his pioneering research, countless scholarly publications, administrative duties, and lectures around the world, Dr. Siu represented the very best interests of the American soldier and the United States Army Quartermaster Corps.

From http://www.uni-ulm.de/uni/intgruppen/memosys/desn26.htm
Siu (1993,II: 5) has made the proposal for a science of Panetics, the integrated systematic study of all the aspects of suffering inflicted on humans by humans. (Pali: paneti, to inflict). The International society for Panetics has compiled in its three volume set Panetics (Siu 1993, I-III), a list of the major incidents and causes, together with an encyclopaedic register containing several thousand bibliographical references of inflicted human suffering. In the context of the present study, these various forms of inflictions represent extremely stable and contagious cultural patterns, that have afflicted humanity since millennia.

From http://ming.tv/flemming2.php/__show_article/_a000010-001906.htm
Ming the Mechanic: Megadukkhas - quantifying suffering The NewsLog of Flemming Funch Megadukkhas - quantifying suffering 2007-12-03 22:40 5 comments

As a sub-theme in an article about Root Irresponsibility for Major World Problems, Tony Judge touches on the strange unit of measure called a "dukkha": The most extensive and insightful methodological approach to the incidence of suffering is that developed through the research of R G H Siu and the International Society for Panetics. They developed the concept of the "dukkha" as a measure of suffering. For the panetics community, the dukkha is a measure of the intensity and duration of pain and anguish adapted from the 9-point hedonic scale used to provide subjective judgements in market research. Dukkha is also a central concept in Buddhism.

According to this approach, one dukkha expresses the amount of suffering endured by one person experiencing one intensity unit for one day (roughly the equivalent to the amount of suffering felt by one person with a moderate toothache for eight hours). A "megadukkha" represents the order of magnitude of suffering sustained by 1,000 persons for about 10 hours a day, for a year, with severe stomach ulcers and without medication. The approach has been explored further by Johan Galtung (Panetics and the Practice of Peace and Development, 1999). Wow. dukkha is of course a traditional Buddhist term, which is probably somewhat mis-translated and mis-understood from its original meaning, but which is typically translated as "suffering". Read more about dukkha as a unit of measure here.

I never heard about dukkhas or megadukkhas before. Of course it would be tricky to measure in any precise way, but just the concept that one could quantify suffering opens a bunch of doors. See, stuff that can't easily be accounted for tends to become somewhat invisible in our kind of society. Particularly if it can't be counted in dollars, but also simply because it is difficult to count, or it isn't counted.

In the many years I've lived in L.A. I've had hundreds of hours to sit in bumper to bumper traffic and ponder the outrageous and unnecessary waste of time and resources that is going on, not to mention the anger and suffering from people sitting in their cars going nowhere. The suffering is relatively minimal if we compare to the hundreds of millions of people in other parts of the world who starve, who're tortured, who's family members are killed, who don't have health care, etc, but if we add it up it wouldn't be all that minimal. But just think about the cost to start with, if it actually were accounted for.

Say I could get to work in downtown L.A. in 15 minutes, if the traffic actually was flowing, but it takes me an hour. That means I spend 1.5 hours per day doing nothing useful, while burning gasoline and sitting being frustrated. If we only looked at the time aspect, then me and the other 2 million people who're doing the same will waste around 3 million hours that day. Multiply that by the $20 or so we get paid by the hour for working, and you have $60 million in a day, or around $18 billion per year. You could buy a hell of a lot of freeway for that. Tripple-decker underground freeways would be perfectly feasible if you accounted for the time and money that would be saved. Or think of it on a daily basis. There's a stalled car in one of the lanes 2 miles further along, and thousands of people suddenly waste thousands of hours when the traffic grinds to a halt. If you account for that cost, even drastic measures would be perfectly economical. You could keep a Sikorski crane helicopter hovering over every section of freeway 24/7 ready to lift any stalled vehicle off the freeway, and the cost would be completely negligable in comparison.

But I'm getting distracted. This was about suffering. Imagine that we could find ways of reducing the overall suffering on the planet. That's what the Institute for Panetics is working on. They propose principles and awareness campaigns for different sectors of society. Law and order, media, health, religion, government, etc. Here are some definitions and objectives: WHAT IS PANETICS?

Panetics is an integrated discipline to study and help reduce the INFLICTION of suffering by humans upon other humans. It was founded upon the conviction that a growing international consensus supports the right of people to be relieved from suffering inflicted by other people when they act through governments, institutions, professions and social groups. To that end, Panetics is an evolving, "pan-ethical" approach to research, policy analysis, decision-making and management."Panetics" is a term coined by Ralph G.H. Siu from "paneti" which means "to inflict" in Pali, the language of the Buddha.

PANETHICS

Combining the Greek word for "all" ("pan") with "ethics", Panethics is an attempt to synthesize thinking from both East and West into a readily understandable and agreed upon system of ethics for a world community. It is based upon the fundamental principle that no one has the right to unjustly inflict distress, pain and anguish on another. The semantic and synergistic relationship between the two terms "panetics" and "panethics" is intentional.

The term "panethics" was first coined by Professor Rudolph Krejci during a lively discussion in April 1986 at the University of Alaskas Geophysical Institute with its director Syun-Ichi Akasofu and the Visiting Lecturer in Panetics, Ralph G.H.Siu. [hihglighted by me. r.d.]

PANETIC OBJECTIVES

The main aims of Panetics are to analyze the sources of inflicted suffering, develop practical ways to help reduce human suffering inflicted by individuals through governments, institutions, professions, or social groups, and encourage their application.

PANETIC PREMISES

People have a right to be relieved from suffering inflicted by other people. The international community has begun to demonstrate a willingness to support that right. We lack both awareness and the tools required for decision-making and intervention to be sure that such actions actually alleviate, rather than increase, human suffering. To prevent such missteps, we must search for measures to assess potential and actual human consequences of actions with the same attempts at precision that we try to use in economic decision-making. Such panetic analyses can help leaders, professionals and managers evaluate the humane consequences of their actions, lessen the suffering they might otherwise cause, and thereby advance the well-being of humanity. That's a wise and noble endeavor. Of course, making words for it, creating units of measure, outlining principles - it makes it something one can begin to think about. Think with in constructive ways, where one can make better decisions, as opposed to just walking around with a generalized gloomy feeling about the world. You can actually to some degree add it up. Does option A or option B best reduce the amount of suffering in the world?

If consequences can be identified, labeled and accounted for, it is so much more likely they will become part of the decision process. There are consequences like pollution, wasted time, wasted money. If the bill could be sent to those responsible, they just might have to make different decisions. And there's the consequence of pain and suffering. Which isn't just a matter of sending somebody a bill. Suffering sucks. A little suffering once in a while might motivate you to make things better. But a lot of continued suffering just makes life suck a whole lot.

So, I'm all for a global megadukkha reduction act. Down with the dukkhas.

Of course we need a unit for happiness too, then. Just sitting around not suffering doesn't automatically make life great. Let's max out the joy and happiness counters while we're at it.

From amazon.com
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_pg_1?ie=UTF8&rs=1000&rh=n%3A1000%2Cp%5F27%3AR.%20G.%20H.%20Siu&page=1 http://www.amazon.com/Craft-Power-R-G-Siu/dp/0471046280/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086369&sr=1-1 http://www.amazon.com/Tao-Science-R-G-Siu/dp/B000K4171W/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086369&sr=1-3 http://www.amazon.com/Man-Many-Qualities-Legacy-Ching/dp/B000WA1JKI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086369&sr=1-2 http://www.amazon.com/Chi-Neo-Taoist-Approach-R-Siu/dp/0262690543/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086369&sr=1-8 http://www.amazon.com/Transcending-Power-Game-R-G-H-Siu/dp/0471060011/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086369&sr=1-9 http://www.amazon.com/Way-Executive-Serenity-Satisfying-Philosopher-Executive/dp/0688050549/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086369&sr=1-12 http://www.amazon.com/Panetics-trilogy-R-G-Siu/dp/1884437001/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086676&sr=1-15 http://www.amazon.com/Microbial-Decomposition-Cellulose-Reference-Textiles/dp/B0000EGLC1/ref=sr_1_25?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200086730&sr=1-2 etc.

From Galtung
http://paneticsworldwide.org/DisplayOneEvent.cfm?i=89

Panetics and the Practice of Peace and Development

by Johan Galtung, Professor of Peace Studies at six universities around the world, Director, TRANSCEND: A Peace and Development Network, and President of the International Humanist and Ethical Union.

1998 Siu Lecture

From deleted Wikipedia page Ralph G.H. Siu
(The following is one version of the page on Siu that was deleted after it was proposed for deletion.)

Dr. Ralph G. H. Siu was born 24 Feb 17, in Honolulu, HI. He earned his bachelor’s and master’s degrees from the University of Hawaii in 1939 and 1941, respectively, and a doctorate degree as a biochemist from the California Institute of Technology in 1943.

His background from his service for the military can be found here: ] See Hall of Fame, Washington 1999

Ralph G.H. Siu is the founder of Panetics. Panetics is an integrated discipline to study and help reduce the INFLICTION of suffering by humans upon other humans. See International Society for Panetics

From deleted Wikipedia page Panetics
(The following is one version of the page Panetics that was deleted after discussion. See discussion here above: User:Robert_Daoust/Ralph_Siu)

Ralph Gun Hoy Siu, the author of The Craft of Power, proposed that a psycho-political study of suffering begin under the term panetics. According to the website of the International Society for the Study of Panetics, "Panetics is an integrated discipline to study and help reduce the INFLICTION of suffering by humans upon other humans." (ISSP, 2007)

Siu calls for this approach in these words: "After analyzing the unceasing mutual inflictions of suffering by practically everyone and the neglect of this pervasive and degenerating human deficiency by the academic community, I urge the immediate creation of a new and vigorous academic discipline, called panetics, to be devoted to the study of the infliction of suffering. The nature, scope, illustrative contents, and social value are outlined. The dukkha is proposed as a semiquantitative unit of suffering to assist in associated analytical operations." (Siu, 1998)

A variety of research papers and online discussions have been written under the banner of Panetics.

The concept of panetics runs along lines similar to other scholars and activists who are attempting to get humanistic agendas into public and political discourse. An example is the idea gross national product neglects the welfare of citizens. Various measures of social welfare are being proposed and explored. These range from analyzing specific measures such as infant mortality, to more whimsical sounding concepts such as gross national happiness. Panetics proposes to adopt a scientific approach to human-caused suffering, and to develop a means of measurement, utilizing a quantifier called the dukkha.

Resources
International Society for Panetics, P.O. Box 142 College Park, MD 20741, USA, http://paneticsworldwide.org/

(The following comment from User:Bobsterz was figuring on the Talk page of the deleted article Panetics.)

I know notability is an issue, but how about this version? Siu, after all, wrote Craft of Power, which is scholarly, compared to some other books on power. And the society has various research articles. Since the term Panetics will come up in someone researching politics who comes across Siu, it seems like a good idea to have an entry. Also, the concept is in line with various scholars and activists trying to get into the public and legislative minds the idea the gross national product neglects the welfare of citizens. Various other measures and ideas are being proposed and explored. It would be good to connect these topics together so that people can put them into perspective and know who is working on these ideas. Part of my interest in this is that it is part of a larger intellectual movement. Robert A. Yourell —Preceding comment was added at 09:07, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

(The following is another version of deleted article Panetics, taken from Google cache)

Panetics is panethical - the semantic and synergistic relationship is intentional - it is a science and field of study and application created by Ralph_G.H._Siu to describe an area of practice concerend with the infliction of suffering and its reduction. The Term "paneti" which means "to inflict" in Pali, the language of the Buddha was selected to look into the dukkha and sukkha for guiding the human path and future lives, or more specific and down to daily conduct for leaders, in decision making, good behaviour or statesmenship (governance). The term "panethics" was first coined by Professor Rudolph Krejci in 1986. Its essence is to synthesize thinking from both East and West into a readily understandable and agreed upon system of ethics. It is based upon the fundamental principle that no one has the right to inflict distress, pain and anguish on another.

The founder of Panetics has studied the inceasing mutual inflictions of suffering by practically everyone and the neglect of this pervasive and degenerating human deficiency by the academic community. He requested a new and vigorous academic discipline, called panetics. This field is devoted to the study of the infliction of suffering. The nature, scope, illustrative contents, and social value are subject of panetics. "The dukkha is proposed as a semiquantitative unit of suffering to assist in associated analytical operations." Siu, 1988 Síu's higher national service, Chinese and cross-cultural transdisciplinary background alowed him not only to revist the Tao or Dao (道 [1], but to look into how we raise and train policy and decision makers. This has much to implications on Peacemaking and Mediation, see also Galtung below [2], or [3] [4]

synonym: Algonomy [5] The opposite of dukkha is sukkha

[edit] References Panetics the Study of the Infliction of Suffering, Journal of Humanistic Psychology 1988 28: 6-22. [6]

PANETICS TRILOGY, Volume I. LESS SUFFERING FOR EVERYBODY, Volume II. PANETICS AND THE DUKKHA; AN INTEGRATED STUDY OF THE INFLICTION OF SUFFERING, Volume III. SEEDS OF REFLECTION; PANETIC WORD CLUSTERS, International Society for Panetics, 1993.

the above Panetics Trilogy comprise of the volumes 7-9 of 12 volumes of THE QUANTUM AND THE TAO - An Unified East-West Psychophilosophical Synthesis toward Harmonious Living. Available at: [7] more details at: [8] [9] Quantification and Suffering: [10]

The Panetics Global Forum [11]

[edit] External links The International Society for Panetics (ISP) [12] [13]

Journal of Humanistic Psychology -- Table of Contents (SUMMER 1988) R. G.H. Siu: Panetics the Study of the Infliction of Suffering ... Ib Ravn: Holonomy an Ethic of Wholeness Journal of Humanistic Psychology 1988 28: 98-118. [14]

quantifying suffering: Panetics and megadukkha: [15]

Religion and the Suffering Body. Bibliography (Selected) Orlitzky, Kerry M. Jewish Paths Toward Healing and Wholeness: A Personal Guide .... Focusing Discipline Called Panetics. Washington, DC: [16]

Review of Articles on Quantification at the ISP. Panetics, Law and Social Exchange: A Proposed Line of Enquiry ..... is not at all to capture the "unsliceable wholeness of feeling and true knowledge" [17]

Panetics and the Practice of Peace and Development, [18], in memoriam for Ralph Siu, Ralph G. H. Siu Memorial Lecture, Washington DC, April 26, 1999, [19] by Johan Galtung, Transcend [20]

Applying Panetics, Embodying, Visualising, and Sharing Positions and Perspectives [21]

Enhancing the Quality of Knowing through Integration of East-West. A major initiative in this respect is the work of R G H Siu on Panetics (1994), Understandings of Synthesis: reconfiguring the challenge of wholeness. [22]

From Japanese Journal of Occupational Mental Health
http://eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPortal/custom/portlets/recordDetails/detailmini.jsp?_nfpb=true&_&ERICExtSearch_SearchValue_0=EJ056033&ERICExtSearch_SearchType_0=no&accno=EJ056033

From Journal of Humanistic Psychology
http://jhp.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/28/3/6

Panetics the Study of the Infliction of Suffering

R. G.H. Siu

Abstract: After analyzing the unceasing mutual inflictions of suffering by practically everyone and the neglect of this pervasive and degenerating human deficiency by the academic community, I urge the immediate creation of a new and vigorous academic discipline, called panetics, to be devoted to the study of the infliction of suffering. The nature, scope, illustrative contents, and social value are outlined. The dukkha is proposed as a semiquantitative unit of suffering to assist in associated analytical operations.

From recreated Wikipedia article Ralph Siu
Ralph Gun Hoy Siu is a distinguished American author, scholar, military, and civil servant. He was born in 1917 in Honolulu, Hawaii, and died in 1999 in Washington, D.C.

Dr. Siu obtained his Bachelors degree (1939) and Masters degree (1941) from the University of Hawaii, and Ph.D. degree (1943) in biochemistry from the California Institute of Technology. He then entered the United States Army Quartermaster Corps and headed a team of researchers that developed new "jungle type" fabrics, clothing and equipment. As the Quartermaster Corps’ Director of Laboratories and Chief Scientific and Technical Director for more than a decade (1948-62), Dr. Siu spearheaded numerous critical projects, including pioneer efforts on irradiated food – a key component of President Eisenhower’s Atoms-For-Peace program.

Around 1968, Dr. Siu was named civil servant of the year, and was thereafter appointed by President Johnson for directing the newly created National Institute of Law Enforcement and Criminal Justice.

From 1957 to 1980, Dr. Siu produced several books, published by editors like MIT Press or John Wiley & Sons Inc. Most notable among them are The Tao of Science, and The Craft of Power.

In 1986, the Journal of Humanistic Psychology published an article by Ralph Siu entitled Panetics --The Study of the Infliction of Suffering. Here is the abstract: After analyzing the unceasing mutual inflictions of suffering by practically everyone and the neglect of this pervasive and degenerating human deficiency by the academic community, I urge the immediate creation of a new and vigorous academic discipline, called panetics, to be devoted to the study of the infliction of suffering. The nature, scope, illustrative contents, and social value are outlined. The dukkha is proposed as a semiquantitative unit of suffering to assist in associated analytical operations. In 1991, the International Society for Panetics was founded by Ralph Siu and some sixty scientists, physicians, business leaders, scholars, artists and writers from several countries, among which such notable people as Kenneth Boulding or Johan Galtung. The Society is dedicated to the study and development of ways to reduce the infliction of human suffering by individuals, corporations, governments, professions, social groups and other institutions. It issues a journal, Panetics, and it sponsors the annual Ralph G. H. Siu Memorial Lecture in Washington, D.C., featuring a prominent speaker on a subject of concern to Panetics. Past speakers have included Peter Caws, University Professor of Philosophy, Richard Shifter, former Assistant Secretary of State for Human rights and Humanitarian Affairs, and Joseph Rotblat, President of the Pugwash Conference on Science and World Affairs and a winner of the Nobel Prize for Peace.

In the words of Anthony Judge, who masterminded and was responsible for the Encyclopedia of World Problems and Human Potential, "Siu was an early pioneer in creating a bridge between Eastern and Western cultures", and "is an exemplar of lifelong dedication to complex issues having fundamental humanitarian implications."

From various sources

 * "Management and the Art of Chinese Baseball by Ralph Siu. Sloan Management Review, 19, no. 3, 83-89, 1978. Quoted in: The Road To Leadership.


 * Seeking Global Justice - The World Equity Court faces an uncertain future by Richard Blum, Cosmos Journal, 2004. It may be noted that Ralph Siu was a member of the private select Cosmos Club from 1965 to 1998.