User:Wikid77/Police

Why U.S. police kill more whites than others
After many questionable claims of U.S. police "bias" against blacks (not proven by facts), there has been a growing collection of wp:RS reliable sources (on the Internet) to remind people how police, for decades, have killed far more whites than others (hello?). However, due to racial tensions in the U.S. (and related regions), we need more encyclopedic text to provide a fuller view of the issues, such as "why" U.S. police have killed more whites than others, plus comparisons of anecdotal evidence to show how unarmed people of other races have also been killed by U.S. police (similar to the rare black shootings), while also emphasize how many police are killed by suspects rather than the other way round. One of the sources of confusion has been the inclusion of Latinos (under "Hispanics") as termed "white" when reporting confrontations with law enforcement officials. This whole subject needs careful study, to avoid the dismal public conclusion, "Hey, Wikipedia seemed to attract informed people, but how sad the racists have taken control" (let's avoid that result). Meanwhile, one source began to illustrate the dangers of claiming "police bias" as with the 2015 data showing 990 shootings (Washington Post: 2015, or 2016), with 948 male but just 42 female in 2015 (as 22-to-1, 948/42), as if the police have an imagined anti-male hatred bias to target men 22x more than women (not true), when actually other factors affect why men are confronted by police much more than women (not as gender bias). Previously, there had been few sources to cover these conclusions, but now in 2016 more sources are being published to dispel such myths of U.S. police bias, and WP will be able to give fuller, encyclopedic coverage tied to sources, plus include how many police officers are killed in comparison. -Wikid77 (talk) 16:20, 18 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I don't know why you are posting this here, but I very strongly encourage you NOT to POV push on Wikipedia entries.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 17:08, 18 July 2016 (UTC)
 * It is a difficult topic, with potential for slanted views but for different reasons than annexation of Crimea; however I will beware POV-pushing and avoid it where it surfaces. -Wikid77 (talk) 10:58, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * (EC) Its also rubbish. The actual claim (easily proven) is that minorities are killed by the police at a higher rate than white people. Pointing out that (more white people in total numbers) is just a way of attempting to minimise the impact of the grossly out of proportion rate of death-by-police amongst minorities. Wikid appears to have fallen (like many others) for the statistically unsound pseudo-logic put out there by people like Jay Stalien. The simple reason why more white people are killed, is there are more white people. Only in death does duty end (talk) 11:06, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Well perhaps more white people are killed by U.S. police because they couldn't reach a hospital in time, or the minorities were shot earlier with more doctors available. I think a key issue might be the count of shot-and-lived (unless gunshots almost always fatal), where perhaps more minorities were shot-and-lived. Otherwise, if half the U.S. population is white and half of killings are white, then minorities are the other half as same difference. Beware false calculations which claim a difference, because women are 50% of U.S. population, but in 2015, police killed men 22x times more than women (948/42 of 990 reported in 2015). In previous years, the actual killings by police were severely under-reported (as less than half) to the point that the proportions are almost meaningless when trying to count minorities in those years. Perhaps we need to wait until the 2016 counts are near year-end or organizations retro-count 2010-2013 by scanning news reports for those entire years. Meanwhile to answer the question, "Why are women shot less?" can help answer why white people are shot more. -Wikid77 (talk) 12:41, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * This is not the place. It is a serious subject and deserves serious discussion, but using Jimbo's page simply because it is highly visible is simply wrong.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  12:58, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Except neither of those questions require answering. The fact men are shot more than women is *not* a serious subject for the simple reason (much like the increased numbers of white vs black deaths) men commit violent (often armed) crimes significantly more and are more likely to be armed in general than women. More white people as a total number are shot because there are significantly more white people. You might as well ask why more pork is eaten in Europe than the middle-east. Only in death does duty end (talk) 13:20, 19 July 2016 (UTC)

As many people have said, this isn't really the right place for this discussion. The only thing that I'll note is that a serious analysis needs to compare like-for-like by controlling as many confounding variables as possible. But this is difficult and certainly beyond the scope of our work as encyclopedists and well into the realm of original research. Other than as a generally well-informed member of the general public, this is not a question of particular interest to me, so I'd appreciate that if there aren't any specifically Wikipedia related dilemmas for us to puzzle over, this discussion move elsewhere (including, perhaps, off-wiki).--Jimbo Wales (talk) 18:31, 19 July 2016 (UTC)

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