User talk:Alaney2k/Archive 6

Those darn dios
Thanks goodness nobody is pushing to add diacritics to the NHL template roster's player names. GoodDay (talk) 23:24, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * We've nothing to fear but fear itself. (and maybe Dj, who seems to be making some people mad) But then he has taken on the role of the enforcer, it seems. He does seem to be on your case. Alaney2k (talk) 23:33, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Giggle giggle, I'll never let him forget about the 30 NHL roster template 'birthplaces'. GoodDay (talk) 23:38, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, it may be satisfying in a sadistic kind of way ... but I don't think it is opening his mind. The guy who is arguing at wt:mos has a basic point about using the dios without sources. But the dio eds can find them. I am quite ok with dios on the player articles. You know, it's a bit of info we have here at Wikipedia that is not found elsewhere. What bothers me is finding them all over the place. And you do. I am working on the team season articles and I am constantly finding them. I don't have the time to hunt down the perps, though. Alaney2k (talk) 23:43, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yep, those dios are eye sores. Keep up the hiding/deleting of 'em. GoodDay (talk) 23:47, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Someone has to counter act the zeal that GoodDay attacks the subject with. :P Besides I enforce both sides of the agreement, even GoodDay I believe has a comment somewhere in my archives thanking me for removing dios. :) And as I have said before, ironically I never create an article/sentence using dios. I just revert people who I see changing them when they shouldn't. -Djsasso (talk) 03:50, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

FWIW, I like your idea, Al. Keep dios off NHL player articles & latter add them when player leaves NHL. GoodDay (talk) 13:40, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Yeah I think we are of the same opinion for the most part. Never thought you would hear that eh? ;) -Djsasso (talk) 15:21, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Either you or I are more reasonable than the other thinks we are ... Alaney2k (talk) 15:40, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah I agree. I just think people need to be a bit more open minded. As someone mentioned in that thread. We are an encyclopedia first and foremost prior to being an english one. So I think we should just try our best to get the most relevant information out. I have no problem with our current compromise. Sure I wish it were a little more towards one side than the other, but there is never going to be total agreement on either end of the spectrum so I wish people would just step away from the topic itself and/or find a middle ground both sides can live with if not like. -Djsasso (talk) 15:46, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Hey that's why the close-minded are cat 1 and cat 2. I was at a beach cafe, where you order some food and you are given a number and the cook calls out the number. My young son and I were waiting in line to order, and a plate of poutine was put out for someone to pick up and the server yelled out "number two". My son and I could not help but giggle at that one. The gravy was very brown.... Alaney2k (talk) 16:24, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I think you open minds by providing bridges that people want to take. Give them a reason to want it. Not just 'this is correct'. How many kids have refused food that was correct for them? Alaney2k (talk) 16:24, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

The latest on Hockey's diacritics
Will the latest proposal, allow me to 'remove' diacritics entirely from the NHL team rosters (-including the birthplaces-)? GoodDay (talk) 19:07, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, I see one problem. The birthplaces are only listed once or twice without diacritics (NHL&NHLPA). That would be a common usage problem. The player names are used in many places without diacritics. But, if I was bargaining, well I don't know what others would be giving up. The idea is to allow diacritics on the QMJHL. That would be positive for dio use. But if we took a policy of following league or tournament policy (which would in general disallow diacritics) then we would not have something to barter for the place names. Alaney2k (talk) 19:46, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I'll agree with allowing dios on QMJHL articles, if dios are entirley deleted from NHL team articles. Anyways, I suppose it's all out of my hands. GoodDay (talk) 20:18, 29 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I shall (stay in the loop). GoodDay (talk) 22:01, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Ya know something Alaney, editors like myself, Djssaso & Krm500 may have 'outlived' our usefullness on the dios topic. We may have to follow RGTraynor & Masterhatch's lead & allow yourself & others to try and work things out. You younger folk, seem less rigid on this subject. GoodDay (talk) 17:05, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

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Toronto Port Authority Whitewashing vs Politics
Alaney2k you have spent an incredible amount of time and effort editing this article, you have rewritten a document authored by more than a dozen people. Unfortunately your political slant is showing through and you seem determined to denigrate the Port Authority at the cost of your integrity. You incessantly repeat and move to the forefront statements that have been disproven time and time again through endless government investigations, audits and court judgements. You are an extremely good writer and should be well aware of the slant your rewrite has taken. Wikipedia does not have any rules about whitewashing, it does have rules about obtaining consensus and maintaining a neutral point of view. Your writing has gone past the NPOV status and your complete rewrite of everyone elses entries has removed that hard fought consensus.If you wish to make changes, do so as part of the team, regardless of which side you are on. You are not the historian for the Toronto Port Authority and there are facts others know that you do not. If you continue on this path the article will again be marked as disputed and locked.Kdickson (talk) 14:02, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

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1914–15 NHA season
I was looking at 1914–15 NHA season which you worked extensively on. It looks great, but I had one comment about the "Results" section. There seems to be a Blueshirts vs. Ontarios game missing (presumably on January 27?) as both teams only have 19 games listed. I haven't been able to find an online source on this information, so if you still had access to your sources it would be much appreciated if you could add this info. Thanks! Danlaycock (talk) 20:13, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for noticing. I'll stop by the library later. I'll be happy to work on a hockey article. Alaney2k (talk) 20:54, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for taking care of that. I'll propogate those corrections onto the appropriate Canadiens seasonal article.  Danlaycock (talk) 18:50, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

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1914–15 NHA season again
Sorry to bother you about this again, but there still seems to be a small problem with the results section. I believe that one of the three Ontarios @ Blueshirts games should instead be Blueshirts @ Ontarios. Same for one of the Canadians @ Wanderers games (should be Wanderes @ Canadiens). Reason being is that the NHA schedule was typically home and away x2 during this era, but the Ontarios play at the Blueshirts three times, while only host them once. (Same for Canadians @ Wanderers). Also, these four teams all have unbalanced home-away schedules (9-11 or 11-9 instead of 10-10). If you still have access to your source, it would be much appreciated if you could check this out. I'd take care of it myself, but my small town library has no adequate sources. Danlaycock (talk) 19:02, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I'll be happy to look into that. The Ontarios and Blueshirts played at the same arena, so maybe it's unclear in the newspaper results that Coleman followed which was the 'home team'. Does your library have access to the "Globe and Mail" online archives? You can view PDFs of pages back to 1841. Alaney2k (talk) 16:58, 23 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh really? That would be very handy.  I'll have to check into that.  Danlaycock (talk) 17:58, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

List of current NHL captains and alternate captains
Howdy Al. Would you happen to have a frontal image of Daniel Alfredsson, which could go at the top of the article? Sakic has retired & so Alfredsson is now the 'longest serving current NHL team captain -with one team-. GoodDay (talk) 19:48, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
 * No, sorry. Alaney2k (talk) 03:30, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

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triple crown
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The 2 Fighting Saints franchises
I've found some mistakes on the 1975-76 Fighting Saints season & 1976-77 Fighting Saints season articles. The '75-76 team folded, where's the '76-77 team is a contiuation of the Cleveland Crusaders. Baseball had the same phenomenom with the 2 'Washington Senators' (now the Minnesota Twins & Texas Rangers). GoodDay (talk) 20:43, 5 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Don't know what was wrong, but thanks for fixing it. :-) Alaney2k (talk) 21:14, 5 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't know how to 'delete' the '76-77 Fighting Saints season link from the Infobox of '75-76 Minnesota Fighting Saints article. Would do the deletion, as the original Saints folded in '76? GoodDay (talk) 22:05, 5 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I figured out a way. Had to put some more code in the template. Never know when to expect code to work (it's a weird language but it worked). Alaney2k (talk) 22:28, 5 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks Al. GoodDay (talk) 22:44, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

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Template: Florida Panthers roster
I believe Salek has been returned to the minors. I'm not certain why they gave him #4, though. GoodDay (talk) 18:35, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * The number 4 was a typo. Should have been 34. CBS Sportsline reported him sent to the minors on the 4th. On the Panthers site, they report him as recalled from the minors on the 6th. He is listed on the roster page. So I'd say that it's more likely that he is with the Panthers than the minors. I think there were some problems with the page on the Panthers site last year. It could be the case again. Alaney2k (talk) 19:21, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Okie Dokie. I've restored him to the Template. GoodDay (talk) 19:25, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

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Dear Alaney: I would like your advice/help in assessing what is going on on the Politics of Gatineau Park/Gatineau Park files. I have been blocked from editing for 24 hours because I broke the 3R rule. However, the reason I broke it was that two editors (Ahunt and M.nelson) were changing my contributions and edits, in a manner I feel to be arbitrary. Although it is clear that I broke the letter of the 3R rule, I feel these two editors have violated its spirit, by together reversing my work. Their changes do not affect the neutrality of the article. They have changed simple wording, and have removed a quote attributed to a reliable source.

Moreover, they claim I am in a conflict of interest because of my link to the "Gatineau Park Protection Committee." However, this is only an informal, on-paper group with no funding, no web site, no "personal" interest in the matter--in the sense that we are not in it for ourselves. Our interest is purely public, historical and factual. We have tried to provide all references requested.We consider ourselves to be experts on this issue, and as the COI Wiki rules say, "experts on trees are not discouraged from contributing to articles on trees," or some such formula.

Anyhow, any advice, help you might provide in defending/commenting this article, and/or the edits for which I have been "benched" would be appreciated.

And as you said in your contribution to the issue's talk page, the NCC is notorious for withholding information. Our contribution has been motivated by providing the balance required to allow the public to understand some of what is really going on.

Best.--Stoneacres (talk) 18:29, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

I appreciate your prompt response. Will try to follow through. Though I firmly believe the two editors mentioned are ganging up on me to suppress verifiable facts.--Stoneacres (talk) 18:54, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Check it out
Check out the IPs (now reverted) post at my talkpage, for a good laugh. GoodDay (talk) 22:42, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Other than sounding somewhat creepy, he's got a good point. Someone probably should follow you around and revert your edits. ;-) Alaney2k (talk) 03:26, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Giggle giggle, I'll second that. GoodDay (talk) 14:00, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

Flemingdon Park
Thank you for adding information on Valley Park Middle School to the Flemingdon Park article. I have made some changes, and more are needed. I have removed some peacock terms to make the entry look less like an advertisement, and more like an encyclopedia entry. I wikilinked "ESL" and "ESD", but am not certain the latter acronym is intended to represent the linked article; please check it. I also put a tag on other undefined terms. I couldn't find a Wikipedia article for TIME, and although I could find one for LEAP, I'm not sure it's the right article, because this appears to be a program that only exists in England. You should look for other terms which are not explained, and for which there may be Wikipedia articles that could be linked to, for clarification. If a Wikipedia article cannot be found, look for external sources, and expand acronyms. I didn't put in a link for "Tsunami relief", but the term should link to an article which describes the specific Tsunami disaster, or even better, an article about its relief program, if one exists. I took out "other humanitarian ventures"; if there are specific programs worth mentioning, say what they are, otherwise it looks like a vague advertisement. Claims and awards should be backed up with citations, so I tagged the "biggest middle school in all of Canada" claim, and the Ontario Human Spirit Award, for which there is no Wikipedia article. If the award is not notable enough for an article, it may not be appropriate to mention it here. Hoping you can address the outstanding problems. --A Knight Who Says Ni (talk) 11:08, 19 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Just copied it over from its own article for now. There were a whole bunch of these school articles with problems, so they are now just redirects to neighbourhood articles. I did not want to make a mess of Flemingdon Park. If something can't be sourced, we can just remove the sentence. Alaney2k (talk) 14:47, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

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Warning
Please refrain from making unconstructive edits to Wikipedia, as you did to 1997 NHL Entry Draft. Your edits appear to constitute vandalism and have been reverted. If you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. There is no such club as Djurgarden HC, the club's name is Djurgårdens IF Hockey, sometimes shortened only to Djurgården. Please stop distribute false information. Thank you. lil2mas (talk) 22:07, 3 November 2009 (UTC)
 * As I mentioned, I am using the NHL spellings. Not mine. This is not vandalism. That's silly. You are over-reacting. Alaney2k (talk) 22:09, 3 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Those spellings are wrong, and Wikipedia is not the place to spread incorrect information. You can use the references to source information, but that information should be adjusted to Wikipedia articles where applicable (as in this case). When you're listing hockey clubs, you can leave out the abbreviation, as it is clear they are talking about the club, not the place. Just as Yahoo! Sports does here. I can give you more examples if you like. BTW: By using your logic, we should alter all the NHL clubs to Tampa Bay HC, Philadelphia HC, Detroit HC, San Jose HC, and so on... Is that what you want? lil2mas (talk) 22:20, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions on a single page within a 24-hour period. Additionally, users who perform several reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. When in dispute with another editor you should first try to discuss controversial changes to work towards wording and content that gains a consensus among editors. Should that prove unsuccessful, you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection. Please stop the disruption, otherwise you may be blocked from editing.
 * Just seeing if we can nip this in the bud. You would all be best to take the discussion to the talk page of the article. Please also note that none of the changes are vandalism, no matter which spelling you prefer. Talk about it please. Thanks &mdash;Duae Quartunciae (talk · cont)  22:24, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

Disambiguation
Hi again, sorry about us getting off on the wrong foot, last time around. My choice of template last time was maybe uncalled for; I just wanted to let you know that I thought your edits were unconstructive and that they had been reverted, before you made the changes to further articles. Since you were rapidly implementing these changes, I had to find a template fast. So I chose one with a low degree, and skimmed through it to see if there were any harsh messages on it. (I only wanted to give a friendly shout-out!) I thought there weren't any, so I used it. Unfortunately, the edit was called vandalism, something I didn't want to call it, as it clearly wasn't. Hope you accept my apology, and I will try to clarify some of the issues at Talk:1997 NHL Entry Draft during the weekend. I hope we can put the past behind us, and focus more on the subject of matter.

Back to your question: The use of nicknames in the Nordic countries (actually Europe as a whole) is a rather new phenomenon. Some clubs have them, some clubs don't. Some clubs use them, some clubs don't. It is, unfortunately, not like the NHL where it always is (toponym)(nickname). I can give you a good example, by looking at a list of ice hockey teams in Norway (I'm Norwegian by the way). That list is a complete list of all senior competitive ice hockey clubs in Norway. I want you to mainly focus on the teams in GET-ligaen, as it is the only professional league in Norway. (If you look at the First Division, you already find several B-teams (similar to NHL's minor league affiliates, but here administered by the club itself), like Vålerenga 2.) I will now present the different structures of team names:
 * 1. Departments of a multi-sports club – Most ice hockey teams in Scandinavia are formed as departments of a multi-sports club.
 * a. Clubs with sports suffixes – Look at Vålerenga Ishockey: It is part of the multi-sports club Vålerengens IF, and have departments for several sports. The club have chosen to call their two largest deparments; Fotball (football) and Ishockey (ice hockey), after their. (The club also have an American football department, which actually have a nickname: Vålerenga Trolls.)
 * Other teams like this: Furuset Ishockey (Furuset IF)
 * b. Clubs with nicknames – Look at Frisk Tigers: It is part of the multi-sports club IF Frisk Asker. The club has chosen to give the elite hockey team an English nickname.
 * c. Clubs with nicknames and sports suffixes – Look at Manglerud Star Ishockey: It is part of the multi-sports club IL Manglerud Star. Since the multi-sports club already have a nickname, the club chose to add a sports suffix.


 * 2. Pure ice hockey clubs – Some teams break out of their original multi-sports club (or never been part of one at all), to start a pure ice hockey club.
 * a. Clubs with abbreviations – Look at Lillehammer IK: IK is here short for Ishockeyklubb (ice hockey club). IHK is sometimes also used to abbreviate this term. The abbreviaton could also be in front of the team name, but then as a proper noun. (see point 2.d)
 * Other teams like this: Lørenskog IK, Rosenborg IHK
 * b. Clubs with nicknames – Look at Stavanger Oilers: The club's official name is Stavanger Ishockeyklubb (Stavanger IK), but they market their club with the English nickname Oilers. (Like the Edmonton Oilers)
 * Other teams like this: Storhamar Dragons, Trondheim Black Panthers
 * c. Clubs with a fictional name, and a nickname – Look at Sparta Warriors: The club started out as a ice hockey department under multi-sports club IL Sparta, but the club got bankrupt, and the ice hockey team started their own club. The major difference between Sparta and the earlier clubs I mentioned, is that there is no place(toponym) in Norway called Sparta. Which means this club now uses a "made up" name followed by a nickname. (You could actually draw parallels to the NBA-team Golden State Warriors.)
 * d. Clubs with only a fictional name and an abbreviation – Look at IK Comet: This club has the abbreviation in front of the team name, which is quite common (although after is the most common usage). When IK is in front of the club name, it uses its proper noun, Ishockeyklubben (The ice hockey club). Comet is similar to Sparta, a fictional name, no places in Norway called by that name.

Summary: I think you got more information than you could have asked for, but there's no such thing as too much is there? =) I will try to categorize some Swedish and Finnish teams under the different sections during the weekend. But the short answer to your question is that the standard rule is (toponym)(nickname) when it is using English nicknames, but as you see from my reasoning above there are also clubs who only uses a fictional name. Which mean they do not use a toponym in their team name. Like the Finnish team Jokerit: I noticed you made a redirect yesterday Helsinki Jokerit, this would be right if it were English: Helsinki Jokers. But since you just insert a toponym to specify where it comes from (not part of the official name), it should be written like Jokerit Helsinki. This would also apply for the Frisk Asker, Comet Halden and Sparta Sarpsborg. Hope this gets you somewhere! Please give me feedback on what you are planning to do. I can be at your assistance, but it would certainly help to know which case you are referring to? lil2mas (talk) 03:51, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Howdy Alaney. Normally, I'd side with you on this, but I've chosen to be neutral. I feel lucky enough, just having the player-names spelt correctly. GoodDay (talk) 20:44, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Dang them hot-blooded Scandinavian vigilantes ... (oh -- the word is -spelled- -- not spelt !!) And since when did you become mature about all this? I was expecting something from you to raise the temperature even more. (now if they wuz Scandinavian Amazonian vigilantes, (if you know what I mean) I might feel different) Alaney2k (talk)
 * The possiblity of getting blocked, has a way of modernizing one. GoodDay (talk) 20:58, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * You want to preserve the good name of 'GoodDay'? Alaney2k (talk) 21:02, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Concerning dios, my moniker/reputation has been damaged. Besides, the last thing I want to get blocked for, is dios. GoodDay (talk) 21:05, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I think the Scandinavian tar and feathers crowd is after me now. Can't you come back to the party? Alaney2k (talk) 21:08, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I've already had my warnings from a WP:HOCKEY administrator, to cool off. GoodDay (talk) 21:13, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, good that you are not going postal about it... It is only hockey, after all. The articles are listed under every-day in Wikipedia, not something real serious. I wonder if the warring gets real serious over some points of molecular structure, coincidentally, small in size like diacritics... ("no that's HC3, not C3H -- now why does that seem like IF versus HC? ) Alaney2k (talk) 21:24, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Giggle giggle. GoodDay (talk) 21:27, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

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TCCA
Yes, reads much better now after your copyedits. Thanks. Canterbury Tail  talk  18:37, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport
At the moment both the new and old names are "official". See Talk:Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport for an explanation. Cheers. Enter CambridgeBayWeather, waits for audience applause, not a sausage 20:35, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

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NHL standings tie breakers
Hi. To start off: I'll mention that I didn't like it when the numbering was first introduced in the templates early this season (I don't remember who did it)... I thought they were pointless. I've since then come to realize that they serve as a valuable sort key if you are playing with the templates. That function fails if we decide that teams are tied in seedings. That's my main argument.

Secondly: yes there are no ties in seeding. All I have to do is reference http://www.nhl.com/ice/standings.htm?season=20092010&type=CON Today there are 5 teams in the East with 25 pts, but the league itself has them seeded 7 through 11. It also very conveniently outlines its tiebreaking procedure on that page. I would argue that the presence of tiebreakers indicate that the end results will be absent of ties, and evidence shows that the league agrees. ccwaters (talk) 14:10, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

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Orphaned non-free image File:Jagr-stats.jpg
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Original Senators article ...
I was just looking it over and suddenly had a thought strike me; do you have any interest in plumping it for FA status? I was thinking that while I created the article and seem to be the 2nd leading contributor, you've outdone me about 20-1 on it, and it's the excellent article it is now solely because of your hard work. What do you think?  RGTraynor  12:32, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, I was wondering about the article recently, what to do, what might be needed. I wasn't sure if the next step was peer review, or nominate for FA. I you think it is ready for nomination, I guess I should do it, since I did work on it a lot. Alaney2k (talk) 15:17, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

2003-04 Detroit Red Wings season
Howdy Al. Do you know how to fix the infobox of that article. The Calgary Flames were the 2003-04 Western Conference Champions. GoodDay (talk) 17:31, 10 January 2010 (UTC)

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File source problem with File:Ottawa Convention Centre.jpg
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Re: Ice Hockey at the Olympics Main Page status
I would, but the admins prefer to leave TFAs unprotected for as long as possible, though it will likely be protected eventually. -- Scorpion <sup style="color:black;">0422  16:33, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

A new look
Ya done a moniker make-over. Does it change colour with the time of day? GoodDay (talk) 21:18, 10 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Don't give me ideas. Just fooling around. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 21:27, 10 February 2010 (UTC)
 * It looks cool. GoodDay (talk) 21:41, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

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Gatineau Park Protection Committee
Check us out at http://www.gatineauparc.ca/home_en.html --Stoneacres (talk) 02:35, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

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Frank Nighbor
Just a point of interest as you work with the Senators articles alot; his jersey racked in over 33000 dollars. I dont know if any additional media will be generated from this but would be helpful if it did. Happy editing Ottawa4ever (talk) 19:19, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Wow. I wonder if Melnyk bought it. That's a lot of money for a jersey and it's the one after the Stanley Cup year too. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 19:22, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

NHL playoff series
Hello, Alaney2k. We've worked well in the past, if you'll remember, mainly on the Stanley Cup Finals list/appearances articles. I'd like to enlist your help on a new project, if you'd like to. I'm creating an article based on http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=30994 (although just loking at the Anaheim/Detroit record, they list 4 series, while there were 5. Please take a look at my sandbox for an example of what I have in mind. Jmj713 (talk) 16:15, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

WP:Hockey Navbox policy
Since you spoke up in my recent thread, I ask that you please check User:TonyTheTiger/sandbox/Hockey mafia issue and make sure that I am representing WP:HOCKEY correctly.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 17:16, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I have crossposted at WP:SPORT, WP:MLB, WP:NBA, WP:WPCBB, WP:NFL, WP:CFB and WP:FOOTY. I am considering having some sort of sign up of people interested in unifying policy across team sports. Is that Kosher?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 15:55, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, great plan. Lets have people who don't care about anything but their own sport trying to force feed their viewpoint onto everyone else. . Resolute 16:12, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * There are no doubt more navboxes than is really desirable and the most elite athletes sometimes have a few dozen as a result, I think giving the reader more information than he may want is better than less. I think in general football, basketball and baseball have it right though.  For every Peyton Manning, Barry Bonds, Kobe Bryant with a ton of templates there are a half dozen Kevin Grady and David Sime with just one that is appropriate for their article as a result of the abundance of templates.  I am just not sure how to get a full consideration of the issue from a broader audience.  You are right that if I find 10 guys who care and 8 hockey guys oppose it is going to go no where.  It would take dozens of voices to offset a unified hockey voice.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:21, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, I already gathered your canvassing other projects was intended to create that voting bloc you are looking for. I really wish you would learn to accept that not everyone thinks like you and not everyone wants to do things the way you do.  I don't go butting into how the MLB, NFL or NBA projects format articles under their banner.  I wish you would show some courtesy and stop trying to force your viewpoint down the throat of a project you don't care about. Resolute 16:26, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * What happened to 'assume good faith'? Lower the flame level, please. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 16:29, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * AGF tends to lose its value in the face of canvassing and point pushing. That said, my apologies.  I'll move the discussion to Tony's or my talk page if he wishes to continue. Resolute 16:35, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Tony's point of making things consistent across sports is not without some merit. And I think asking for a wide range of opinions is always ok. I think that Tony and you would be on the opposite side of the spectrum of opinions. As for canvassing, Tony was stating what would appear to be fact, that any push for navboxes under the WP:SPORT banner would not achieve consensus due to the opinions of the WP:HOCKEY editors. So any discussion would be pretty safe to proceed, would it not? Maybe we can make WP:SPORT more relevant? (sometimes I think it takes some heated opinions, no?) How else could we move forward on the clutter which you have pointed out and move forward to some better navigation which Dj thinks is 'out there'? &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 16:47, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I've been involved in plenty of discussions in the past that leave me with little doubt that the MLB and NFL projects are equally as entrenched in their positions. Thing is, I am fine with that.  I dislike how they do a lot of things, but I accept that the view of the local majority does not match my own. I think that attempting to have editors of one sport project trying to force their standards upon another sport project is ridiculous.  It's no different than having the Military History project step in and tell us how to organize hockey or baseball articles. Resolute 17:03, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * There are more sports than those two. There's no reason to be a 'jaded cynical old bastard' :-) about it. Some people, and I agree with it, that we have to work to prevent Wikipedia from collapsing into itself. That sounds more serious than what i mean. If only local project editors rule, then it's a barrier to usefulness for the non-editors out there. And if those people lose faith in the usefulness of Wikipedia, then it would disappear. After all, this project works on donations. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 17:16, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * There is a big difference between WP:MILHIST getting involved in a WP:SPORTS policy that may change activities at WP:HOCKEY and other sports who have a lot of common concerns. All sports where there is a successful professional major league system will have common concerns regarding indications of notability and encyclopedic relevance.  Personally, I think all sports should agree on whether first overall draft choice templates, Olympic teams, International competition teams, etc. should have templates.  The templates represent the same type of information for the five sports I have presented.  Personally, I would like to see all five of the sports produce Consensus All-American templates and remove any high school (or Junior Hockey) templates that are not national awards such as AP Indiana All-Century HS Basketball team navbox.  I think consensus All-Americans for example are people who demonstrate professional potential in any of these sports with developed professional leagues.  However, I think it is more important for all five of the sports to develop a common policy.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 17:29, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

It's not going to happen though. WP:HOCKEY has already established consensus on the value of these templates, and that consensus is different than that of WP:MLB. As far as I'm concerned, attempting to bring editors not involved in the project whom you are attempting to force your views upon to vote your way is tantamount to meatpuppetry. Resolute 17:41, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * We've not all agreed to be stupid about it, though. The issue is the proliferation of crappy ones, not succession boxes vs. navboxes. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 14:40, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

Porter
Good Evening Alaney2k,

I understand that it was an error by CBC that Porter is Canada's 3rd largest scheduled airline? I'm going to look in to that because I've had it said to me from people in high places that it's true. I'll get back to you if I'm able to find better references. If it's true then I beleave it should be posted. If possible could you send me the link stating otherwise? Thanks for your time Alaney2k.

Cheers - I just want to confirm it. http://www.flyporter.com/en/press2010.aspx?id=113

POE-YTZ  talk  02:33, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Bill Taugher
Hi. I've been going over the Montreal Canadiens' early NHL season articles, adding stats and transactions as I go, but when I got to 1925-1926 I ran into a quagmire: Bill Taugher. Now, I know that after Georges Vezina collapsed in their first game against the Pirates "Frenchy" Lacroix took over in relief and played in the next few games until the Canadiens signed Herb Rheaume on December 13, 1925. The thing is, I can't find any record of Bill Taugher ever having played for the Canadiens that season. Or in the NHL at all. I know he played for the Fort Erie/Buffalo Bisons of the International League, and that he had tried out with the St. Louis Eagles in 1934, but as far as I know Bill Beveridge played every game for the Eagles.

I've scoured The Globe and Mail, which kept fairly good records of who played in what game at the time, and I can't find Taugher ever having been on the Canadiens' roster, even as a substitute. I'm just curious what your source was. If it was added by some anon. editor I would have just changed it, but I give you benefit of the doubt.

I also noticed in the Canadiens season article and the overall NHL season article that you noted Vezina as having a goal scored against him. The Globe article from Nov. 30, 1925 says: "At the beginning of the second period Lacroix, former United States Olympic goalkeeper, went into the Canadien net in place of Georges Vezina; the veteran goalkeeper started the game with a high temperature. At the rest interval it was decided to replace him. It was Lacroix in net when Pittsburg [sic] scored their winning goal, but he could not be blamed for the tally." I'm going to change the stats accordingly.

Thanks. 93JC (talk) 18:54, 1 May 2010 (UTC)


 * I don't have it in front of me, but I am sure that the stats are from Coleman. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 15:28, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

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Don Valley Bridges
The detailed information you are gathering together for the Don Valley Bridges is nice. I think the biggest concern here is there are editors that simply do not like lists and I have seen some useful and interesting pages deleted. So, the question is how to best present this such that it provides better information? I would use the List of oldest buildings and structures in Toronto as a guide (Disclaimer: I created that page). Try to add several columns of summary information that may be of interest to someone looking at this page. This information could include year built, number of lanes (or tracks), type (which you already have), etc. A question will come up by some about the notability of some of these bridges and they may have a point. This has come up with the List of oldest buildings and structures in Toronto page, but it has never been formally resolved or dealt with. As a result, the list keeps growing.

The second issue is to combine or split. My feeling on this is to include the Don Bridges information into the existing List of bridges in Toronto page. This would improve the odds of others helping to expand and improve the bridge information you now have and to include the other river systems in the city. If the list grows, the content 'settles down', and a number people have made edits you would then have a 'user base' to discuss future splits if warranted. For now just get the list into the main space.

Two good examples by city: List of bridges to the Island of Montreal, List of bridges in Calgary showing the lists are city-based and each has a number of fields of supporting information. Hilmar (talk) 14:46, 12 May 2010 (UTC)


 * Here's a good source for the Half-Mile bridge as well.. -  ʄɭoʏɗiaɲ  <sup style="color:#3AAA3A;">τ <sub style="color:#3AAA3A;">¢  15:31, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

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Thanks
Quick thank you for the advice about getting the Teeder Kennedy article renamed. I'll try it. BashBrannigan (talk) 01:15, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

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Season by Season
I noticed you changing the layout of the season by season section of the Senators page. Have you suggested this at the project page? As if its done on one it will need to be done on all of them as this was something we standardized in the past. (This isn't an opinion one way or the other on if it should be changed) -DJSasso (talk) 15:34, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Actually now that I look I am surprised the Senators had an overall record in there so long. We stripped them from all team pages a long time ago with the idea that that was information we placed in the List of team season pages instead and the season by season record was just to be a snapshot. -DJSasso (talk) 15:38, 2 June 2010 (UTC)


 * I haven't read it for a while, so I was doing a clean-up. Two many sections; headers, etc. causing too much white space. I can move the listing. I'll look at the wp:hockey page. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 15:41, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Yup, have a go however you think works best. Just wanted to see what you were up to since we should be matching the current team FAs or if we are going to make changes do it to all of them. :) You have kept this article pretty good over the years. -DJSasso (talk) 15:48, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

1927 Stanley Cup Finals
Wowsers, my wordmanship has been slipping. GoodDay (talk) 21:05, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

No probs, I just had an anxeity attack. GoodDay (talk) 21:22, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Left-aligning TOCs
The practice of left-aligning TOCs in articles is strongly discouraged. Please see Template:TOC_left, Help:Section, User_talk:Anthony_Appleyard#Floating_TOCs_to_the_right, and User_talk:Pepso2#Why_are_you_left-aligning_or_right-aligning_the_table_of_contents_in_articles.3F. In particular, the left-aligned TOC in Ottawa Senators squishes text between the TOC and the thick infobox, especially for people with monitors of 1280 pixels or less in resolution, which is very common. Gary King ( talk ) 21:40, 4 June 2010 (UTC)


 * Find out something everyday &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 02:15, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

An apology
It appears that I have poisoned our debate with my comments. My "whiny editor" referred to a different user because back when I was first improving the page, there was another user who kept reverting me because he didn't like the fact that I had the audacity to remove his favourite table. That user was not you. My comment did not refer to you in any way shape or form, and I fully apologize for any harm my comment may have caused. So can you please stop with the immaturity? All I want to do is make the main list as good as possible, and I feel that having the appearances table seperate lowers its quality. Having both in one place will make navigation easier (splitting them is content forking), and it makes easier to find (one IP brought this up on the talk page). I put together a quick sample of what the merged page would look like here, and it's length is more than manageable. -- Scorpion <sup style="color:black;">0422  15:23, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes you did. You should simply say sorry. I simply and honestly disagree with you. Leave it at that. It's not immaturity to point out your hacking at the page, and then pointing out your comments about enjoying being called a vandal. That's childish behaviour and it's a big detriment to any good points you make. There are alternatives to your suggestion. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 15:34, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
 * But I DO enjoy the irony of being called a vandal, it's quite funny. As for my "hacking at the page", I saw a bunch of unsourced statistics, and I removed them. I've found that adding a fact tag usually leads to nothing, it just gets ignored for months on end. Anyway, what are some of the alternatives, maybe we can find a compromise. -- Scorpion <sup style="color:black;">0422  15:38, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, (maybe?) you'll grow out of that. :-) It impresses no-one. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 23:36, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I've created a sample version here. It's length is manageable; it includes the appearances table with the years; and it has a pre-1915 table. Does that address your concerns? -- Scorpion <sup style="color:black;">0422  22:16, 14 June 2010 (UTC)


 * I've outlined my alternative on the wt:hockey page. I hope you are willing to consider it. The List of Stanley Cup champions page is too long to support a Stanley Cup Finals page. My alternate proposal is to create a Stanley Cup Finals page, and I've made a start of it at User:Alaney2k/Stanley Cup Finals. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 23:33, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer
Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, will be commencing a two-month trial at approximately 23:00, 2010 June 15 (UTC).

Reviewers can review edits made by users who are not autoconfirmed to articles placed under flagged protection. Flagged protection is applied to only a small number of articles, similarly to how semi-protection is applied but in a more controlled way for the trial.

When reviewing, edits should be accepted if they are not obvious vandalism or BLP violations, and not clearly problematic in light of the reason given for protection (see Reviewing process). More detailed documentation and guidelines can be found here.

If you do not want this userright, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. Courcelles (talk) 18:14, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

The Wikipedia Signpost: 14 June 2010
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The Wikipedia Signpost: 21 June 2010
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Discussion about Infobox road
Hello. There is a discussion at Template talk:Infobox road about the addition of customizable colors to the template. It would likely lead to Infobox Ontario road being replaced by Infobox road. Any comments regarding Ontario in this discussion are greatly appreciated. Thanks! &mdash;Fredddie™ 05:58, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

1891 AHAC season
Hey alaney, just a quick note i dont know how much changing you have planned for that article., but it looks like one of your edits (i think the first one) deleted some of the games added. Disregard this note if your still working on them for sourcing (just checking). All scores Ive added are from Dan diamonds total hockey book im using. Thanks Ottawa4ever (talk) 15:27, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Sorry, must be a cut and paste error. I'm going to add sources from Google news archive. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 15:29, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Sounds good, happy hunting. I had been planning to add the dates shortly to 1892 if you want to check those as well later. cheers Ottawa4ever (talk) 15:33, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

The Wikipedia Signpost: 28 June 2010
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Team page template
Since if I recall correctly you were semi-interested in maybe updating the team page layout. I thought you might be interested in this discussion. -DJSasso (talk) 16:41, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

The Wikipedia Signpost: 5 July 2010
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Corey Locke
Hey, I wasn't trying to mess with the page, the way I've been doing free agents former teams was listing their NHL team if they had appeared in any NHL games the previous season. That's why I changed Locke to New York Rangers, because he did play in 3 games with the Rangers last season. But if you think it should be listed as the Wolf Pack, no problem. Just wanted to tell you I wasn't trying to be an a$$ LOL


 * No biggie. I was prepared to argue it. He played almost the whole season for Hartford. And the signing doesn't seem to be listed as a real UFA signing. &#x0298; alaney2k  &#x0298; ( talk ) 22:37, 7 July 2010 (UTC)