User talk:Alarob/Archive 7

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Removed two redundant templates posted by EdwardsBot. — ℜob C. alias &Agrave;LAROB  22:03, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Mamma Haidara Commemorative Library
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 16:04, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

For the record, the article had 961 hits on 29 May. — ℜob C. alias &Agrave;LAROB  22:38, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

TemplateData is here
Hey Alarob

I'm sending you this because you've made quite a few edits to the template namespace in the past couple of months. If I've got this wrong, or if I haven't but you're not interested in my request, don't worry; this is the only notice I'm sending out on the subject :).

So, as you know (or should know - we sent out a centralnotice and several watchlist notices) we're planning to deploy the VisualEditor on Monday, 1 July, as the default editor. For those of us who prefer markup editing, fear not; we'll still be able to use the markup editor, which isn't going anywhere.

What's important here, though, is that the VisualEditor features an interactive template inspector; you click an icon on a template and it shows you the parameters, the contents of those fields, and human-readable parameter names, along with descriptions of what each parameter does. Personally, I find this pretty awesome, and from Monday it's going to be heavily used, since, as said, the VisualEditor will become the default.

The thing that generates the human-readable names and descriptions is a small JSON data structure, loaded through an extension called TemplateData. I'm reaching out to you in the hopes that you'd be willing and able to put some time into adding TemplateData to high-profile templates. It's pretty easy to understand (heck, if I can write it, anyone can) and you can find a guide here, along with a list of prominent templates, although I suspect we can all hazard a guess as to high-profile templates that would benefit from this. Hopefully you're willing to give it a try; the more TemplateData sections get added, the better the interface can be. If you run into any problems, drop a note on the Feedback page.

Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 21:13, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

Incomplete DYK nomination
Hello! Your submission of Template:Did you know nominations/Bernard Gregory at the Did You Know nominations page is not complete; see step 3 of the nomination procedure. If you do not want to continue with the nomination, tag the nomination page with db-g7, or ask a DYK admin. Thank you. DYKHousekeepingBot (talk) 02:40, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Bernard Gregory
Hello! Your submission of Bernard Gregory at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! --Allen3 talk 18:30, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

September 2013
Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=571866936 your edit] to Iss Pyaar Ko Kya Naam Doon?...Ek Baar Phir may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry, just [ edit the page] again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?action=edit&preload=User:A930913/BBpreload&editintro=User:A930913/BBeditintro&minor=&title=User_talk:A930913&preloadtitle=BracketBot%20-%20&section=new my operator's talk page].
 * List of unpaired brackets remaining on the page:

Thanks, BracketBot (talk) 03:20, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Monday to Friday at 6 PM on Star Plus. It is a second season of [Iss Pyaar Ko Kya Naam Doon?]  with a new plot. The previous soap opera left the air on November 30, 2012.
 * D'oh! — ℜob C. alias &Agrave;LAROB  03:27, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Stauffer
Thanks for help with Johann Georg Stauffer. --Design (talk) 01:41, 24 November 2013 (UTC) I've finished my edit & rewrite and have posted the article back in the main space! Thanks again--Design (talk) 05:53, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

File:Cree language.png listed for deletion
A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Cree language.png, has been listed at Files for deletion. Please see the to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. The Undead Never Die (talk) 06:21, 5 January 2014 (UTC)

Fraktur template
Hello Alarob,

I'm using your template on my user page but have one problem: it does not seem to be possible to make a break after it as the following shows. I'm completely new to templates and wondered if it would be difficult to change this feature?

Fairflow (talk) 20:21, 26 January 2014 (UTC)


 * Hi, Fairflow. You can use the '''

''' template to force text to flow beneath a template or image, or any other "block element" on a page. Like so:
 * which gives you:
 * which gives you:

More text.
 * Another option is to put the infobox inside a larger box of templates, or a table. See WP:BABEL for one example, involving language templates. For a table, see the code on my userbox page, User:Alarob/Userboxen.
 * HTH. — ℜob C. alias &Agrave;LAROB  17:58, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Oh, I see you already know about the Babel template! — ℜob C. alias &Agrave;LAROB  18:04, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much! That sorts my original problem: now my next wiki tutorial task is to add the /frak template inside Babel, if/when I find the time! Fairflow (talk) 20:46, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Chickamauga Wars article title
You previously discussed the title of Chickamauga Wars (1776–94) on that article's talk page. There is a move request discussion on the issue at Talk:Chickamauga Wars (1776–94) if you care to participate. —  AjaxSmack  03:51, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks. You may not welcome this, but after lengthy consideration I've recommended moving the article to userspace and improving Chickamauga Cherokee instead. I appreciate your raising this issue, as the misnamed article has caused some harm by coining the neologism "Chickamauga Wars." — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 18:37, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

3O
Hi Rob. I've looked over your request for a third opinion on the Cherokee-American wars, but was curious if there's a more specific question that you would like input on. Or is it just that you'd like someone to review the discussions to date and provide another voice on general sourcing issues? Either way I would be happy to try and help, though I might not be very well qualified to discuss references and books that I've never read myself. Keihatsu  talk 22:20, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Hi, Keihatsu, and thanks. It would be great if you could review the discussion. I know this is an informal process, but I don't want to pose a more specific question that may seem like fishing for a favorable answer. The discussion at Talk:Cherokee–American wars refers back to the move request at Talk:Cherokee–American wars, which may provide helpful background.
 * I'm afraid it's more than 6,000 words (including WP boilerplate), but you can safely skip the table and bullet lists. I think they are summed up in the other comments. — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 01:09, 16 June 2014 (UTC)


 * I've read through these discussions a couple times now. Let me first say that I'm impressed by the commitment to serious scholarship. I don't have any acute concerns about conduct for either of you; Chuck Hamilton may display a sense of ownership, but also demonstrates a willingness to engage in discussion and certainly has reasons for his point of view. I can't offer much more insight unless the parameters of the dispute are clarified. If you want to propose a name change, for example, then It would be useful to have a concrete proposal with rationale for different names clearly spelled out.  If you have a question about whether certain additional sources should be used, same thing. If you're looking for general feedback on your discussion though, I can only say that you both seem like decent folks who, based on your obvious intelligence and commitment to the topic, should be able to do a lot of good work to enhance the encyclopedia's coverage of Cherokee history. Sorry I can't be of more help.  Keihatsu   talk 13:59, 23 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Your comment is quite helpful, Keihatsu. I appreciate your time and thoughtfulness. — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 18:46, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for February 5
Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Diglossia, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Wannabe. Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ* Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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 * The link to the dab article seemed appropriate in this case. Perhaps a link to Wiktionary would be better. — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 17:37, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

MUSE Project
Hey! I got a problem: I need the book 'The Fan Fiction Studies Reader' for my studies, but the point it I can't find it on-line anywhere (no ebook, even non-free, just offers to buy a paper copy). I found the link at MUSE project site to download it, but the problem is it is available only for those who study in just few university (there is no single university in my country on the list at all!). Could you be so kind and download the book for me? I'm ready to give the necessary payment if needed. My e-mail is (DELETED). Thank you so much in advance! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Grib100500 (talk • contribs) 18:12, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Hi, thanks for contacting me. It is a bad idea to post your email address online, so I took the liberty of removing it from your message.
 * Are you sure that an entire e-book is available through Project MUSE? I'll search for it, but I have only been able to get access to articles, not books.
 * I'll also check the licensing rules to see whether it is OK to simply forward a copy. It would help to know more about the research or study you are doing, and what school you are studying at. But don’t answer here; I will contact you by email. — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 03:10, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

Ok, thank you for the reply! Yes, the whole book is available, I have a link to several pdf files which are separate chapters of the book, but the files themselves are not available. I can send you the link via email when you contact me. Looking forward to your message! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Grib100500 (talk • contribs) 06:43, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

Chief Namakagon is John Falcon Tanner
Thanks, Rob, for your interest in Chief Namakagon. Though I'm not the least bit skilled w/ Wikipedia processes, I was able to post his 1886 obituary on the page. It came from the Ashland Press, about 20 miles north of Lake Namakagon. He probably did not call himself Chief Namakagon. That name was most likely used by the lumberjacks who came to northern Wisconsin to cut white pine in the 1880s, as Mikwam-mi Migwan was harder to say and remember. The name means Ice Feathers and, according to George Francis Thomas, author and newspaperman back then, it was given to him by Native Americans who saw ice in his beard on a cold winter day. In Ash Press articles (available in microfiche from the WI State Historical Society in Madison) and in one of Thomas's books on the area, he said Chief Namakagon told him he was born in 1780 and that while working in Sault Ste. Marie, MI, he had a dream that there would be a fire, a murder, and he would be blamed and executed unless he fled west 13 days where he would find a lake abundant with fish and game and there would make a new home. This interview took place in 1883. Thomas sought him out for several interviews because he was the only English-speaking person in the Namakagon area. (This should have made Thomas curious as there would be absolutely no reason for a Native living way out in the woods--two days from any other English-speaking person.) Based on that interview, I traveled to the Soo. Research at the Bayliss Library, Lake Superior Univ Library, and the Chippewa Co (MI) Historical Society revealed that John Tanner fled after having his home burned and being accused of the murder of James Schoolcraft, a city elder and brother of Judge Henry Schoolcraft. Authorities searched Canada and the US and eventually, assuming he died out in the wilderness while in hiding, declared him dead. He did not die. He went to Lake Namakagon to live the next 40 years as a hermit. Upon my return to Wisconsin, I went to the Ashland Co Land Records Office where I found his name on a 40 acre homesteaded parcel. NOT Chief Nam, Ice Feathers, or Mikwam-mi Migwan. The Tanner name also appears on the transfer of ownership, this time by his nephew, James. My theory is that Tanner used his own name on the parcel, knowing he could not legally transfer it if under an alias. The US Army and RCMP gave up the search for Tanner, declaring him dead in 1846. I found his name on official court documents in 2014, solving a 168-year-old cold case. All of the above is just the tip of the iceberg, Rob. The facts surrounding the early and late lives of John Falcon Tanner are quite amazing. Again, thanks for your interest in the subject. If you have any questions, please do not hesitate to ask. James Brakken, Author. Lakeleader (talk) 12:11, 28 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your reply. I apologize if the comment by another user on the deletion discussion page seemed harsh. Comments on articles are not meant to be taken personally, and you are not being accused of bad faith. (Assume Good Faith is one of the few cardinal rules of Wikipedia.) I know it can also be discouraging to see an article you have worked on be nominated for deletion, but even deletion is not permanent.
 * I would love to accept your story about the late life of John Tanner. But extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and there are no reliable sources that document these claims about Tanner/Namakagon. Having been a newspaperman myself, I like to think that we are mostly truthful in what we publish. But 19th-century newspapermen were often guilty of publishing fiction under the guise of fact. (Sometimes their readers were in on the joke, but the context that signals the fictitiousness of the piece is not easy to discern 100 and more years later.) And the name "John Tanner" on a property deed or similar document does not prove that the property was owned by the same John Tanner who was captured as a boy by Shawnees and left us a memoir. It's a common name.
 * Wikipedia does not publish original research for several good reasons. It's an encyclopedia, so it simply summarizes the consensus view of any given subject. And as you say, the article Chief Namakagon describes your theory. But even if you have extraordinary facts about John Tanner that will revolutionize our understanding of his life, they still won't belong in the encyclopedia until most experts have accepted these facts as true. Or, if some accept them and others don't, Wikipedia will strive to accurately represent both sides of the controversy, without undue emphasis on extraordinary theories.
 * A corollary of this important ban on original research is that Wikipedia does not always contain the truth. Maybe you are right and the experts are wrong. In that case, Wikipedia has to be wrong too.
 * I mentioned that deletion is not permanent. It may turn out that the topic of Chief Namakagon (or variant spellings) might be notable enough for a Wikipedia article. In that case, in my view, the article should describe the legend, not a theory that this chief named after a lake was a real person. Older sources that record the legend would be helpful. The "Ice Feathers" theory also requires stronger proof. American literature is full of bogus translations of names derived from Indian languages. Most of these languages are still spoken, and many have good translation dictionaries. So there is no excuse, in my opinion, for perpetuating invented meanings for Indian names.
 * WP:FIRST is a helpful page on writing an article from scratch. You know how to contact me. My user page also has an email link, if you don't mind sharing your address. I've found that Wikipedia does reward the time and energy you put into it. — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 19:41, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Marengo Silver Fields were Real
Though I don't know how to send it or post it, I have a JPEG of a page from the May 20, 1880 Ashland (WI) Press that shows over 30 mineral claims being requested. All are within a 6 square mile area southwest of Marengo and about 10 miles northeast of Lake Namakagon. The Marengo trail, an ancient historic route used by Natives was the trail Ice Feathers walked for several decades before the miners arrived. It is also close to the 40 homesteaded by John Falcon Tanner. His name appears in the first Ashland Co. plat book. Several of these claims made their owners rich. The most notable Sam Vaughn who came to WI from Colorado when the newpapers said there would be a gold rush there. Vaughn had several mines. Today, one can drive down Vaughn Ave, past the Vaughn Library which is across the street from the huge, brick Vaughn Building. The largest monument in the Ashland Cemetery is a towering monolith with the name Samuel Vaughn etched near the bottom. IMHO, Vaughn new John Tanner but only as Chief Namakagon or old Ice Feathers. Thanks again for your interest and the work you do to keep Wikipedia a great source for accurate information, even though the centuries seem to have a way of burying the facts. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lakeleader (talk • contribs) 12:27, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

What coupling means in horses
Hey, I saw where you were asking Montanbw about the meaning of 'coupling' as used in the Tennessee Walking Horse article. It means how a horse is put together; a horse with a short back (short distance from its withers to its croup) is a horse with strong coupling. On the other hand, a horse with weak coupling is one that has a long distance from its croup to its withers. I just thought I'd let you know. It has nothing to do with machine couplings, and in fact usage of the term there probably came from using it for horses. White Arabian mare (talk) 20:46, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks, WAM. That info needs to go in Wikipedia somewhere, with a reference. Do you have a suggestion? I'm out of my depth here. — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 21:05, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Probably the best place would be somewhere in equine conformation. I can find a reference and add it later, hopefully. 🐎White Arabian mare (talk) 21:36, 9 September 2015 (UTC)White Arabian mare

We do reference it in Back_(horse) as well as the (not very good) equine conformation article. to refine WAM's explanation; the coupling is basically the loin, or the area of the lumbar vertebrae, between the last rib and the sacrum (the sacrum region on a horse is called the croup)  Montanabw (talk)  02:56, 10 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks, you two. I was having trouble because I have been laboring under the delusion that the word was "confirmation" with an I. Now I know how to spell it. My sister the horse doctor tries to educate me, but I'm a slow student as well as a lousy rider. :) — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 16:28, 11 September 2015 (UTC)


 * You should haunt the "horses for sale" section of your local Craigslist for really cringe-worthy stuff: "Well-bread mare with nice confirmation"  Hello?  The horse takes communion or what? LOL!    Montanabw (talk)  03:25, 12 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Hmm, wine or grape juice? Neither is probably good for horses.
 * I just added a link to Conformation (disambiguation) at the Confirmation (disambiguation) page. — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 16:31, 12 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Thanks! As for beverages, I think this is in order  Montanabw (talk)  23:48, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

LOL, you should see the horse section of Yahoo Answers. These people are asking questions like, 'Why does my of the track thorbread run wen I ride him?' 'I've had saddlebreeds for 7 years, but I lost my ladt show, why?' 'Why do people hate on atabian horses?' 'Don't you just love my morgan/appalooza/thorobred/shetland cross, I think he can win the olympics, wat do you think?' and then they claim to have 'thirty years experiance'. I always come off that website singing Brad Paisley's "Online" ("I'm so much better online..."). And don't forget equine.com and the ad for a light-framed buckskin being sold as a "Friesian"--for $10,000. White Arabian mare (talk) 14:51, 13 September 2015 (UTC)White Arabian mare


 * I used to hang out at Yahoo answers a little bit, got tired of the "what should I name my imaginary horse" questions. Those and the "my horse is rolling on the ground after he got into the grain bin what should I do?" questions  (answer:  Get off the %@$#! computer and call a vet, idiot!).   Montanabw (talk)  22:49, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

Yes, I quit going on there too; I think now that whole website (the dog section is even worse) is nothing but a hangout for young kids and trolls. I got tired of the "don't you hate this, don't you hate that" on there, as well as the fact that most of them seemed to think that an obnoxious horse blogger hung the moon. And then there were all the "oh, Jessica Forsyth was so perfect. Her death was so tragically romantic..." I'm thinking, ''She basically killed herself by not using common sense, people! How is that a good example for other young riders?'' White Arabian mare (Neigh) 15:24, 15 September 2015 (UTC)White Arabian mare
 * Hmm, I assume you mean this Jessica Forsyth of Herbert Henry Dow High School. How is it that we don’t have a Wikipedia bio of this illustrious figure? (Sadly, being shot to death at school in the USA has long since ceased to be a WP:N occurrence.) — ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 20:08, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

No, not her; I was referring to another person by the same name who died in a very freaky horse riding accident in 2008. She was a horse YouTuber. Her horse was known to have major issues (he would randomly turn and run out at the base of a jump rather than go over it, and would often take off in a wild gallop upon landing after a jump), yet she went out riding alone, jumping him over a homemade jump about 3'6" high. She was found dead at the base of the 5-foot arena fence several hours later; her helmet and skull were crushed and her neck was broken. She was about 14 or 15, and her parents were the ones who found her. Her horse was loose in the pasture maybe a thousand yards away from her body. She always took her camera with her to record videos to upload later, and there were several videos on it from that day. None showed her actual death, but they did show that the horse was acting even worse than usual. It's believed that she jumped him over the homemade hurdle, and he galloped away upon landing; she tried to run him into the fence to stop him, and he jumped it. She evidently suffered what eventers call a rotational fall and landed beneath his hooves. What is stupid about the whole thing is that after it happened, a lot of people started making up lies and saying things like 'she didn't have on a helmet' or 'her horse was standing over her body when they found her'.White Arabian mare (Neigh) 20:44, 16 September 2015 (UTC)White Arabian mare

Books and Bytes - Issue 13
 The Wikipedia Library Books & Bytes

Issue 13, August-September 2015 by, , ,

 Read the full newsletter The Interior via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:29, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
 * New donations - EBSCO, IMF, more newspaper archives, and Arabic resources
 * Expansion into new languages, including Viet and Catalan
 * Spotlight: Elsevier partnership garners controversy, dialogue
 * Conferences: PKP, IFLA, upcoming events

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:33, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Books and Bytes - Issue 14
 The Wikipedia Library Books & Bytes

Issue 14, October-November 2015 by, , ,

 Read the full newsletter The Interior, via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 19:12, 10 December 2015 (UTC)
 * New donations - Gale, Brill, plus Finnish and Farsi resources
 * Open Access Week recap, and DOIs, Wikipedia, and scholarly citations
 * Spotlight: 1Lib1Ref - a citation drive for librarians