User talk:Allens/Archives/2012/June

Please could you check ...
... your total word count? I've reduced it by 399 as I imagine the slave health article may have been entered twice on your calculator, but I'd like to be sure I haven't swindled you :) Simon. --Stfg (talk) 10:53, 1 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Oops! Yes, 35,342 is the correct total. Thanks for catching that! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 10:58, 1 June 2012 (UTC)

Barnstars for May 2012 GOCE drive
The checking work you did was especially appreciated. Thanks for doing that. --Stfg (talk) 08:57, 2 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Quite welcome; I'll try to do some more of that. Umm... there was also a 10K article, Global storm activity of mid 2010. (It's not 10K now, after I removed some of the news portions.) Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 14:02, 2 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Oh sorry! I've added it above now. I really need to get this process more accurate! --Stfg (talk) 14:30, 2 June 2012 (UTC)


 * It's OK; thank you for all the labor you put into the drive! I'll try to work on a Perl program for processing the drive page and spitting out at least a preliminary version of the barnstars page. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 14:36, 2 June 2012 (UTC)


 * That would be fantastic if it's feasible. It took most of a day, working half-on-half-off, to do it, and I know I made at least four mistakes. Thanks. --Stfg (talk) 15:31, 2 June 2012 (UTC)

Re: Geography of Croatia
Thank you very much - both for kind words and great help copyediting the article, your contribution really made the difference.--Tomobe03 (talk) 18:27, 2 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Quite welcome, and thank you! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 21:19, 2 June 2012 (UTC)

This article is being considered for deletion in accordance with Wikipedia's deletion policy.
Dear Allen on my article "Nadiya Samdani" there are showing a tag "This article is being considered for deletion in accordance with Wikipedia's deletion policy." Can you please advice me what I need to do now and how can I avoid this deletion.

Taslim ahmed (talk) 06:28, 6 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Please try to locate news or other coverage focused on Nadiya Samdani that is distant in time from the existing sources. In other words, try to find coverage focused on her that is either from well before April 2012, or well after (e.g, in June 2012). It is likely, incidentally, that the article will not be entirely deleted, but will instead be merged with one on the Samdani Art Foundation. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 23:51, 6 June 2012 (UTC)

Tay-Sachs
Hi Allen. Is there a reason why it needs to stay on the requests page? While there it's attracting other editors: apart from Uploadvirus, it has just attracted Rumiton, and provoked Wizardman's action of this afternoon. I've asked Wizardman to clarify that, but ... Cheers, Simon. --Stfg (talk) 14:56, 10 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, I had been holding it because it's in the middle of its GA review, but I suppose I should treat it as (temporarily) done - for one thing, doing otherwise would mess up the statistics on GOCE work and GAs that I've been working on! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 17:22, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

want to delete article nadia samdani
Dear Allen I want to delete my article "Nadia Samdani" please advice me how can i delete it.

Taslim ahmed (talk) 05:33, 11 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, OK, since you're the only one that's done anything substantial with it. (Why?) Put db-author at the top of the page, without removing anything else. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 10:29, 11 June 2012 (UTC)

Reg. edits in the "Most Prominent Persons" section of Dhenkanal, India and similar edits on Dhenkanal district page
Hi, Thanks for intervening. These are regarding the persistent edits done by the series of ip addresses to delete factual contents. I am listing out the information for your reference to make an educated decision.


 * Harmohan Patnaik >> Well known revoltionary from that area... mention present in Dhenkanal (princely_state)
 * Devendra Satpathy>> She was married to Devendra Satpathy who was twice the Member of Parliament(MP) from Dhenkanal.
 * Nandini Satpathy>> Ex. Chief Minister... wiki page exists
 * Brig. Kamaksha Prashad Singh Deo >> Member of Parliament multiple times
 * Baishnab Charan Patnaik
 * Surendra Mohan Patnaik
 * Braja Kisore Dhal
 * Suparno Satpathy >> There is a wiki page for him too. Suparno Satpathy
 * Sudhir Kumar Samal
 * Nabin Chandra Narayan Das (Member of Legislative Assembly)
 * Prafulla Kumar Bhanja
 * Justice D. N. Patnaik
 * Haladhar Mishra (MLA- Member of Legislative Assembly)
 * Kalpana Dash --- has wiki page Kalpana Dash

The activities by the ip address included...deletion of the names of "Devendra Satpathy", "Nandini Satpathy", "Suparno Satpathy" from the list; and removal of wiki links for "Nandini Satpathy" and "Tathagata Satapathy". Changing of name of "Tathagata" to "Tata". And insertion of "Samant Suryanarayan Patnaik", "Prasanna Kumar Patnaik", "Jitendra Kumar Patnaik"; who are of unknown importance.

These changes are coming across a range of ips... and is pretty difficult to single out one to report out. However the origination point is the same.
 * netname:       TATACOMM-IN
 * descr:         Internet Service Provider
 * descr:         TATA Communications formerly VSNL is Leading ISP,

Also to let you know, other editors have pitched in to undo these changes but we have a person who is pretty adamant on doing that.

The criteria listed to be a part of Notable persons about not only having a wiki page is not correct... pages can be created by other contributing editors and a visible invitation may be created by making the links "red"... and some do indeed have wiki pages, possibly this was overlooked for the IP editor also deleted the wiki links... some of them are notable freedom fighters... some politicians (Member of Pariliament or Member of Legislative Assembly)...

I am sorry that I don't have that much time to bring out details for each of them, but the listed names were all proper and valid, whereas deletion of wiki links, names of prominent people being deleted and unknown persons being listed is not good. I have left message on the talk page on those ip addresses seeking the rationale behind those edits but am yet to get a response.

I am putting the information back (with some wiki links) and would request you to please let me know about what can we do to prevent this user from making further changes.

Thanks, --Karan1974 (talk) 20:46, 7 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Currently, IP addresses can't edit Dhenkanal, India and won't be able to until 10 May 2012, although that's not true of Dhenkanal district. I've now watchlisted the latter.
 * In terms of criteria, the difficulty is that calling someone "prominent" or "notable" is something that requires citations from a reliable source (e.g., governmental records or newspapers or whatever for someone who's a politician saying that they're a politician). Otherwise, it's uncited editorializing/POV. (This is to protect against people putting themselves, their friends, and their family on lots of pages.) If the person has their own wiki page, then that's one way to evince their being notable (assuming the person's page has the required two citations). Otherwise (and a redlink is fine for such cases), it generally requires at least one citation for that person saying that and why they're prominent/notable. (If there are two citations on the person, then a page can be properly created for them, of course.) Take a look at WP:NLIST and WP:Source list. (It's also necessary to find something saying that the person is from Dhenkanal (or wherever), but that's generally not too difficult.)
 * Currently, only the names with wiki pages are on those two pages. If other names are added only with the required citation for each, then all that getting long-term semi-protection for those two pages will take is evidence of repeated uncited additions (or other violations of policy) coming from multiple IP addresses, ideally together with warnings on those IP addresses' talk pages; with that, an appeal at Requests for page protection will result in a block - possibly only a short-term one at the start, but if this person comes back after that, it'll get extended. If enough reversions happen within a short span of time, with properly cited reasons (lack of citations) for the reversions, an admin may well notice and put temporary page protection on the pages anyway - that's what appears to have happened with Dhenkanal, India. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 23:17, 7 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks Allens. I will find the appropriate references for the persons who are "prominent" enough to be listed. I am at loss for freedom fighters, where I may not readily get the information but I will give it a shot. I was a bit confused towards the statement "Otherwise (and a redlink is fine for such cases), it generally requires at least one citation for that person saying that and why they're prominent/notable."- So does it mean that having a redlink is fine if I am not providing any citations. Please clarify this.


 * I certainly appreciate the inputs towards the process and how we should go about it. The changes coming from the IP address does not seem to be static, it is a wide range but all seem to come from one service provider. Blocking the service provider completely would be unfair towards other users and I doubt if that could be done. Short term blocks are a good start, and my leaving message on the talk pages have not got me any response. But I will assume good faith edits and work on providing the necessary citations. You have been very helpful. Thanks. --Karan1974 (talk) 23:51, 7 May 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry about the confusion. You need at least one citation for the person; provided that's present, having a redlink is fine, so as to encourage creating an article about the person. Quite welcome on the help! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 23:56, 7 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Hi Allens, I have populated the list citing the external sites and most of them are authentic Govt. of India sites. I would request you to please review them. Thanks.--Karan1974 (talk) 02:38, 8 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Looks good overall! I'm a bit worried about the googleusercache one - it may well disappear at some point. Aside from that, I didn't spot any problems in a brief glance-over; I did some tidying up via automated means and may do somewhat more. Incidentally, these citations may well also help someone put together pages instead of redlinks... Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 03:12, 8 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Hi Allens, I appreciate your time and effort. And you are right, I am also a bit worried about that too... it's just a matter of time till the cache is cleared off. Searching for the individual name (Harmohan Patnaik) turns up multiple pages but they are mostly commercial sites and kind of reflect the info what is there in another article. Most of the historic persons names are normally available in Oriya (vernacular) language and difficult to source content on the internet. I however managed to find a link to another credible source which I will insert. I saw the clean-up work you have done and do commend you for that. Thanks. --Karan1974 (talk) 03:29, 8 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Quite welcome. In terms of availability and language, it's fine if a reference is a book only available offline, or is a language other than English (I've been helping out at an article for which most of the references are in Russian, and it's considered a high-quality article!). It is preferable to have references that are easy to verify for most users, but not required. To cite a book, take a look at the cite book template. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 04:09, 8 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks Allens for this information. I have responded with the required information on Dhenkanal, India talk page based on the suggestion from NeilN. Also, I have inserted 3 additional links for "Nandini Satapathy". Thanks. --Karan1974 (talk) 18:41, 9 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Allens,Some user is posing that Nandini belongs to Dhenkanal, and that is not a fact. Please visit Dhenkanal,India Talk page where there is a series of discussion after you referred to one Karan, who argues in a strange manner.. I dont like certain users of WIKI, because they provide subjective information...Love.Mgsports (talk) 14:16, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

It should be noted that MLAs and MPs are inherently notable persons who should have articles here. If you can find a reliable source which states that So-and-So Thus-and-Such was 1. an MP or MLA and 2. from Dhenkanal, then there is nothing wrong with listing them with the reference, since there should definitely be an article written about them. -- Orange Mike &#x007C;  Talk  15:07, 11 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks - that's a clearer version of what I'd posted above. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 15:11, 11 June 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for blocking harassing editor
Thanks for blocking the editor who has been harassing me on my User and User Talk pages lately. I appreciate it. It seems to be relatively slow and low-level right now but if it escalates I'll follow your advice to have my User page semi-protected and take additional actions as necessary. Thanks again for your help and advice! ElKevbo (talk) 17:50, 11 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Quite welcome... (of course, there's also the admin who did it); happy to help, although not in the need for it! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 21:46, 11 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Ooh - I hadn't noticed that Orangemike actually levied the block. Thanks for pointing that out to me! ElKevbo (talk) 21:50, 11 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Again, quite welcome - I'm complimented by your assumption I'm an admin! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 13:25, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

2012 GOCE requests archive
Hi. I've changed a couple of column headers before I realised that might impact the development of your program. Please let me know if it does, and I'll revert it. Cheers, --Stfg (talk) 14:02, 13 June 2012 (UTC)


 * I haven't written that section of the program yet (I've just finished doing LoCE, GOCE templates, and GOCE drives), so no problem; thanks! I'll discuss this further on the GOCE talk page. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 19:50, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Wikipedia Help Survey
Hi there, my name's Peter Coombe and I'm a Wikimedia Community Fellow working on a project to improve Wikipedia's help system. At the moment I'm trying to learn more about how people use and find the current help pages. If you could help by filling out this brief survey about your experiences, I'd be very grateful. It should take less than 10 minutes, and your responses will not be tied to your username in any way.

Thank you for your time,

the wub (talk) 18:05, 14 June 2012 (UTC) (Delivered using Global message delivery)

Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot
SuggestBot predicts that you will enjoy editing some of these articles. Have fun!

SuggestBot picks articles in a number of ways based on other articles you've edited, including straight text similarity, following wikilinks, and matching your editing patterns against those of other Wikipedians. It tries to recommend only articles that other Wikipedians have marked as needing work. We appreciate that you have signed up to receive suggestions regularly, your contributions make Wikipedia better — thanks for helping!

If you have feedback on how to make SuggestBot better, please let us know on SuggestBot's talk page. Regards from Nettrom (talk), SuggestBot's caretaker. -- SuggestBot (talk) 15:13, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Help needed
Hi! Could you please take a look at the second paragraph of the "Parliamentary elections" section (in its introductory bit) of the Elections in Croatia? I seem to have mangled an explanation in there, then tried to clarify, so I would really appreciate if you could see if everything is alright in there. A lengthy explanation of the situation which I tried to sum up in the paragraph is present at Talk:Elections in Croatia/GA1. Thanks!--Tomobe03 (talk) 14:46, 16 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Sure! No problem... Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 14:53, 16 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks for lending a hand! I really appreciate it.--Tomobe03 (talk) 12:59, 17 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Quite welcome. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 14:11, 17 June 2012 (UTC)

Vandalism Warning
That was not vandalism, apparently Huggle didn't revert the 5 edits of vandalism User:Dneeraja made several edits and deeply embedded vandalism. Thank you for catching the overlook :-). <3 ♥ Solarra ♥  ♪ Talk ♪  ߷  ♀ Contribs ♀ 13:47, 18 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Quite welcome. Doesn't Huggle use rollback when available and applicable (last several edits were by the same user)? Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 13:57, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

My inadvertent vandalism of European Day of Languages
Thanks for catching this - I thought I'd used Igloo to revert myself, but clearly it hadn't worked properly. Too many vandal-fighters tripping over one another in their rush to revert! Cheers, Yunshui 雲&zwj;水 13:42, 18 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Heh! Quite welcome; I've removed the template. Do you think it was simply a matter of speed, or that Igloo's code needs an examination? Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 13:52, 18 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Probably an overclick on my part, although Igloo's been disconnecting on me a lot today. Problems at ClueNet, perhaps? With the exception of the repeated loss of connection everything else has been functioning normally, so I see no immediate cause for overhauling the code. Thanks for removing the template. Yunshui 雲&zwj;水 14:03, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

The Signpost: 18 June 2012

 * Read this Signpost in full
 * Single-page
 * Unsubscribe
 * EdwardsBot (talk) 01:44, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

July drive
Hi Allen. The drive discussion seems to have slowed down, though I don't think it has really bottomed out all questions. I'm thinking of starting a new section tomorrow, summarising on the basis that I suspect that the latest statements not to have been challenged may represent a consensus, and inviting everyone to express any differing views. If that goes well, I can then create the drive page on Wednesday (20th). Are you happy with that plan? Are there any issues you'd like addressed before we do that? I've also asked Torchiest and Dianna. Cheers, Simon. --Stfg (talk) 20:09, 17 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Sounds good to me. I've been working away at programming gathering data from the drive and requests archives. I've found problems with interpreting both due to renames, disambiguation, etc of articles, and username changes by editors; I think I'll have it solved soon. (It doesn't help that people, not knowing that I'd be coming along using a program to interpret the results, haven't always been very consistent about formatting their sections of the drive pages...) Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 21:57, 17 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes, it's very difficult (or is this an understatement?) to get people to format things consistently. We may find ourselves needing to tidy some up when we go looking for what to review. Before I create the drive page, we're going to need to settle on how to tell people to mark entries for requests and oldest months, so that we can apply the markup. I have some questions about the archives one when there's time, too, but let's get the drive announced first. --Stfg (talk) 22:12, 17 June 2012 (UTC)


 * I've wound up doing some tidying of the past drive "Final numbers" pages, actually - part of what's been occupying my time... Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 14:28, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

Hi Allen. It looks as if a consensus is emerging for a leaderboard with 5 columns of 6 rows, and a 50% increase in the word count for both requests and articles from the oldest 3 months. Those markups apply only for the word count for the main barnstar, not for leaderboard positions, so what we've done in the past and I think we should do again is to have people enter the real word count in their entries, and then we calculate the markups after the drive closes. To help us do that, I suggest we might have people mark requests with *R, and old articles with *O immediately after the article's word count. That's just a suggestion, though -- we can do whatever makes it easier for you. What do you reckon? --Stfg (talk) 14:05, 19 June 2012 (UTC)


 * That looks good to me (it's a sequence of characters that's fairly unlikely to occur otherwise, which makes it easier for the program to spot); do be sure to clarify on the discussion page that the word count boost for both R and O only count for the total word count, not the leaderboard (that's currently not quite clear for Requests). (Any review marking - checked or n or whatever - would be after that?) If people could put any comments like "section only edited" or whatever after the article link but before the parenthesis for the word count, that would help. It would also be helpful if people could be a bit more careful about using the actual article title - not a shortened version without a parenthetical note at the end, for instance - in the listing, although the older cases of that problem that I've seen may well be article name changes that the person couldn't expect. (The program is now looking for links from disambiguation pages and pages redirecting to a page to handle some name changes.) I have one comment regarding the requests page articles, but I'll put that on the discussion page. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 14:28, 19 June 2012 (UTC)


 * I've just created the new drive page, trying to incorporate all of those in the new paragraph at the top of the Totals section. Could you check it out please? --Stfg (talk) 13:59, 20 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Looks good, thanks! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 18:28, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

GOCE Requests Archives
Hi, looks as if you've been making some progress. I saw you'd corrected some dates based on history files. Would you like me to go through the Purpose column to make it more consistent, like removing "for" and free-form comments like "plot section only"? Are there any other changes that would facilitate things? I'm not going to touch the layout any more without your say-so, but we can if you want.

I'm not yet sure what output you're planning to generate. Is it an issue if aims change after a copy edit? -- for example, requesters somtimes get cold feet and go for PRs or A-class intead of the FAC they said they were going to, or just tinker with the article for months; and on a couple of occasions I've completed a copy edit by tagging the article for a citation check and saying fairly strongly on a talk page that the article isn't ready for FAC/GAN until the fake citations have been dealt with. --Stfg (talk) 11:24, 22 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Hmm... I see that I haven't been clear - sorry! I wasn't planning to (yet) look at stated intentions - just at whether pages, after the date of a copyedit, became a GA, FA, or FL. (This would include pages that later lost that status, although those would probably be noted separately.) I've about finished with the program to gather what pages the LoCE/GOCE has copyedited; these currently include 11687 pages (of which 10918 pages have known copyeditors and thus completely known times of edits). Next will be:
 * Updating the barnstars program a bit to take into account false positives/negatives the other program has located on past drives (not in the most recent one, don't worry!);
 * The program - which I anticipate being rather easier - to gather data on when those articles became GAs/FAs/FLs (and on their current status); and
 * Possibly some variety of table, or set of tables (split by month/year, copyeditor(s), or reviewer(s) if any) of all of the copyedited articles.
 * If you can think of any other outputs that would be of interest, I'd be happy to work on them. (I've also done some corrections on past drive "Final numbers" pages, incidentally.) Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 12:27, 22 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks, that's fabulous. It looks as if this program could be a wonderful source of data to inform future strategy. I don't have any specific ideas at the moment -- perhaps new ideas will emerge from seeing the results of the existing programs. --Stfg (talk) 13:06, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

The Signpost: 25 June 2012

 * Read this Signpost in full
 * Single-page
 * Unsubscribe
 * EdwardsBot (talk) 05:45, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

Copyediting A8
Hi! I was wondering if it would be possible to declare copyediting of the A8 (Croatia) completed on the WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/Requests if there's nothing left to tackle there, so that I could add a new request to the GOCE page? Thanks.--Tomobe03 (talk) 11:40, 26 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Oh. I thought I had already. Oops! Sorry about that... I tend to be forgetful about doing that. Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 13:47, 26 June 2012 (UTC)


 * No problem. I wouldn't notice it had I not went to the GOCE request page about another article. Once again, thanks for the copyediting.--Tomobe03 (talk) 20:30, 26 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Quite welcome; looking forward to the GA! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 00:15, 27 June 2012 (UTC)


 * The article just passed GA review - and it is in a great part thanks to your thorough copyedit and overall improvements, just like in many other articles. Thanks once again!--Tomobe03 (talk) 13:20, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Copyedit?
Hi Allens, I hope things have been going well with you. Glad to see that you're doing well in the election. I know you're busy, but I thought I'd ask if you'd be interested in copyediting my new project, Marshall Applewhite. You might find it interesting, he led the largest mass suicide on American soil. No problem though if you don't have time or energy. Thanks, Mark Arsten (talk) 03:57, 28 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Pretty well, albeit rather busy - I'm teaching a summer course (covering in 5 weeks what I'd normally cover in 15!). Thanks regarding the election! I'll try to get around to looking at Marshall Applewhite, but I'm not sure when it will be. You may wish to list it on the GOCE requests page - we're trying to promote working on pages listed there during the upcoming July copyedit drive. Hope you're doing well! Allens (talk &#124; contribs) 13:10, 28 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks, whenever you have time is fine. I recall taking 5 week summer courses back in college, it always felt somewhat odd seeing the campus comparatively deserted. Mark Arsten (talk) 16:45, 28 June 2012 (UTC)