User talk:Allreet/Archive 28

Baseball
Hiya Allreet. You wrote the Minor League Baseball section on the Allentown page, correct? Just wanted to let you know that I moved it into its own article, History of baseball in Allentown, Pennsylvania. I've broken this section out from the Allentown main page to allow for better expansion, organization and inclusion of images. I think this is a great little section, and one of a subject matter important to Allentown's history. Having this as a standalone article will not only serve the function of reducing the size of the main Allentown article, but will hopefully motivate editors to perform some of the enhancements described above. I'm not a sports-guy, so you might want to review and tweak the lead-in off the main Allentown page as necessary. Alphageekpa (talk) 11:24, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Cleanup Tag

 * Another editor threw on that cleanup tag within minutes of me breaking out the section onto a standalone page. What is it lacking?  I think the article would be greatly improved by 1) an introductory paragraph, 2) breaking the article into sections with headers, and 3) the inclusion of images, etc.  #1 and #2 should be more than enough to remove that cleanup tag. Beyond that, it's a great little section. Alphageekpa (talk) 19:53, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Lehigh County Historical Society
Hiya Allreet. I started an article today for the Lehigh County Historical Society. Your review and feedback would be appreciated. Alphageekpa (talk) 12:08, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Excellent and more than just a start! A few minor edits are in order: a typo in the site listing and in the Library section, some adjective and verb replacements.  I'll go ahead and make these edits since they're easier to do than explain. Beyond that, some subjects could be fleshed out. Suggestions:
 * Previous Society publications bear mentioning, including Roberts' three-volume 1914 history, the two-volume Allentown 225-year history (1987), and softcover books on Trout Hall and William Allen. These are important in reflecting another aspect of the Society's contributions. The website doesn't mention them, probably because they're no longer being sold. The books could be described in 4-5 sentences (total), obviously with some research required.
 * Regarding the Proceedings, a couple of sentences could be added on the nature the articles, breadth of their topics and types of people who wrote them.
 * A very small historical point: The Society's claim of having published the Proceedings since 1906 may not be entirely accurate. Volume I came out in 1908, and it includes minutes from a 1907 meeting when the printing contract was awarded. No other mention is made in minutes dating back to the Society's first meeting. If you're interested, see the first pdf in the Historical References section of my User page.
 * The historic sites should probably be described. These are all covered in brief elsewhere, but since none has its own article, this is as appropriate a place as any for fuller descriptions.
 * Frank Buchman House is not mentioned. The site is probably still owned by the Society, but is no longer open on any regular kind of basis. This may explain why eight properties are mentioned on one of the website's pages, but only seven are covered in its site listing. By the way, I researched this for the Allentown article and found next to nothing on the web on the Buchman House (plenty on Buchman himself).
 * The years the Society occupied Trout Hall might be better in the caption than "for many years." If you don't mind, I'll track this down. The Society was quite young when it first asked the Parks Department if it could use the building, but I haven't found the year it finally moved in.
 * An interesting addition down the road would be a history of the Society itself, from the early days when this was something of an elite club through the development of the new public museum. Potential sources: minutes from the Proceedings and newspaper articles.
 * Perhaps Frank Whelan's baseball exhibit article should be replaced by Geoff Gehman's article in the Call over the weekend. Besides being more timely, the article is linkable: []
 * Hope that's the kind of feedback you were looking for and that I didn't go overboard. All of the above interests me, so if you want me to pitch in anywhere, just let me know. Sorry I was late responding, but vacation intervened. Cheers.Allreet (talk) 19:32, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * The more the merrier. Improve as you see fit.  It's an area of interest for me as well (obviously)...and I threw the article together in about 30 minutes, with the intent that it was merely a "starting point" (and at that, more than many other historical societies on Wikipedia). Alphageekpa (talk) 10:28, 25 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Shall do. By the way, 30 minutes isn't fair. It sometimes takes me that long to do a footnote. But I'll get over it. Allreet (talk) 18:34, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Re: John Walson
I don't even remember having edited this article, but I'm not at all doubtful I did. Really, the further fate of the article is of no concern to me, rather obviously. But I still appreciate the heads-up! It's a very considerate gesture on your part. But I take no issue against your modifications, so you'll hear no word of protest from me. - Vianello (talk) 07:05, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Express-Times reporter
Hey, my name is Colin, I'm a reporter with The Express-Times. I'm considering writing a story about Wikipedians who live in the local Lehigh Valley area, and I have been trying to find Wikipedia contributors who contribute a whole lot to the page on a regular basis. I'm not sure how often you yourself contribute or where you live, but I saw you post pretty consistently about the Lehigh Valley and I thought I could either talk to you, and/or you could direct me to some other local Wikipedians.

Please let me know! Either respond to my talk page or e-mail me at cmcevoy@express-times.com whenever you get a chance.

Thanks! -- Hunter Kahn (talk) 22:28, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Allentown Band Expansion
I've expanded the Allentown Band article (which I had previously created). If you could give it some editorial review, I'd appreciate. Alphageekpa (talk) 12:01, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Excellent treatment of a worthy subject. Factually, this is solid historical info, and the only thing lacking is more background on Meyers (who may warrant his own article). But this tells the story. And the pictures are also great. There's one style issue: repetition of band, Allentown Band and performed. The verb has a sufficient number of synonyms, but not the noun. Group, organization and other common collectives don't quite fit, so a sentence here or there needs to be restructured, just to break things up. One other thought: ProQuest. Is it kosher to link readers to a login page that most won't be able to use? Offhand, I'd prefer that these were not linked, because that leaves everyone to their own devices and doesn't frustrate anybody. Allreet (talk) 03:03, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Allentown Fair Expansion
I've also been adding some deep historical content to the Great Allentown Fair article. Been doing this piecemeal, so the mid/late 20th century history is lacking. With the exception of minor mods made to intro paragraph and addition of logo to infobox, I haven't touched anything outside of the "History" section...and other sections require work to become less "list-oriented." Anyhow, if you could (also) give it some editorial review, I'd appreciate. Alphageekpa (talk) 12:01, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * This is really outstanding. I grew up near the fairgrounds and thought I knew something about the fair. As it turns out, not much. But I do now. Just one comment: It's not clear how many years the fair was interrupted for the Civil War. Should be an easy enough hole to fill. Thanks. Allreet (talk) 03:17, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Still a lot out there to fill in.  Anyhow, the fair resumed in 1863.Alphageekpa (talk) 19:50, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I noticed one other thing while reading the article and forgot to mention it. The seating capacity at the grandstands today is important, especially because the earlier figure of 2,500 sticks in your head. So the questions are, when were grandstands expanded and what are the seating capacities today? Allreet (talk) 03:30, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

George Taylor (delegate) and George Taylor House
Have removed the various stub-status tags, and have reassessed. You should be proud of these, both articles look great! Alphageekpa (talk) 11:10, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

Egypt
Thanks for the positive feedback, Allreet! My wife's family lives in Egypt, and her ancestors (Peters/Rinker/Frantz/Flickinger) have been in that immediate area going back into the 1700's. I must admit that I am negligent in not including the origination of the name, and will do so. And yes, in earlier records (more specifically church records), you'll see the vicinity referred to as "Egpyt" or "Egypta." It was not a formal "legal" boundary, just a reference to a particular geographic region - kinda like our modern usage of "Lehigh Valley" I guess. Alphageekpa (talk) 09:31, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd be interested to hear more about your research. You can e-mail me thru Wikipedia, the link is on the left of my talk page (toolbox > e-mail this user).  Alphageekpa (talk) 11:27, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Bjorner
Hi Allreet, Many thanks for your supportive words about Bjorner. Of course I value Bjorner for having built up such a vast & accurate database of Dylan performances & recording sessions. Dylan article is currently going through FAR, and to be honest, some of the criticism seems negative and condescending, but we must weather it to preserve the quality of the article. So it is very welcome to read a few words of support. On the FAR page [] I quoted from what Michael Gray said about Bjorner in his Dylan Encyclopedia. This entry has not made any impression on the powers-that-be. I shall write to Michael Gray and Clinton Heylin and ask them to say a few words about why Bjorner is authoritative. Then I'll make a final attempt to woo the wisdom of Wikipedia. When I do that, could you please write a note giving your reasons for supporting this point of view. I'll drop you a post. Thanks again and best wishes Mick gold (talk) 10:42, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi Allreet, I've just posted my comment on Bjorner as a reference source, including long contribution from Michael Gray. thanx Mick gold (talk) 14:18, 1 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your remarks. If our refs were sourced to Bjorner's books there'd be no hassle, but I can't afford these books (I've spent ludicrous sums on my Dylan books already) and Bjorner has deliberately put all his research online. (Dylanological equivalent of human genome project!) I hope Michael's arguments carry some weight. Looking at some of the comments that go on FARC can be chilling, often they're condescending & self-righteous, but I think article has improved as a result of this FAR: it's shorter and better sourced. Let's stay in touch. Mick gold (talk) 21:35, 1 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your supportive comment, much appreciated Mick gold (talk) 17:04, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Dylan copy edit
Hi Allreet, Thanks for incisive copy editing on Dylan. (You seem to have a talent for copy editing?) But there was one sentence I took the liberty of reverting. I replaced:
 * On October 1, 2007, Columbia Records released the triple CD retrospective album Dylan, anthologising his entire career.[207] Using the Dylan 07 logo, Mark Ronson produced a re-mix of Dylan's 1966 tune "Most Likely You Go Your Way (And I'll Go Mine)", which was released as a maxi-single in October but not included in the Dylan triple album. The release marked the first time Dylan was to sanction a re-mix of one of his classic recordings.

with:
 * On October 1, 2007, Columbia Records released the triple CD retrospective album Dylan, anthologising his entire career under the Dylan 07 logo.[207] As part of this campaign, Mark Ronson produced a re-mix of Dylan's 1966 tune "Most Likely You Go Your Way (And I'll Go Mine)", which was released as a maxi-single. This was the first time Dylan had sanctioned a re-mix of one of his classic recordings.

Dylan 07 was whole campaign embracing triple CD, single CD, Ronson re-mix, and ingenious use of Dylan with placards at beginning of Dont Look Back, and other extras.[] Also I was puzzled by the structure of your last sentence, puzzled by the 'This release marked the first time Dylan was to' construction. I hope this isn't out of line. Mick gold (talk) 17:29, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

More Dylan
Thanks for comment, but please include yourself in the kudos! Your copy editing and precision have been exemplary. I've taken cognizance of your querying Dylan & Baez at 'rallies'. As for the year 1961, this FAR has focused on removing as much minor material as possible. Which inevitably means article has ended up as a record of albums, significant films, major tours and performances. I'm not sure if there is room for much more detail in 1961. For example, Warchef added many interesting Dylan performances & recording dates aside from the studio albums (Allen Ginsberg sessions, Doug Sahm session), & included 29 July 1961 WRVR hootenanny from Riverside Church. This material is fascinating, but it's been stripped out in FAR, so do we need more 1961? I'm not sure what will happen at FAR, it's unpredictable what other editors might say. (I followed the progress of the FAR on Law [] which was quite tortuous & complex.) I think Dylan's readable prose is now 59-60 KB. WP:SIZE suggest 50 KB may be upper limit. I've noticed that Ronald Reagan article is 71 KB of readable prose, I think Law is 65 KB, so Dylan is by no means the longest, though I don't have necessary skill/tools for assessing the lengths of all Featured Articles. Heylin, Sounes, and Gray all have plenty of material on 1961&mdash;to say nothing of what Dylan told us in Chronicles, Volume One. I fear we suffer not from a lack of knowledge but from coming up against WP:LIMIT. best Mick gold (talk) 11:08, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

Lehigh County Politics: Swing District
Personally, I'd hit it with the tag (as you did), and would remove in a week or two if not addressed. Alphageekpa (talk) 10:35, 24 November 2008 (UTC)

Numbers over ten
Numbers over ten can be spelled out if it can be done in one or two words. From Manual of Style (dates and numbers): ''As a general rule, in the body of an article, single-digit whole numbers from zero to nine are spelled out in words; numbers greater than nine are commonly rendered in numerals, or may be rendered in words if they are expressed in one or two words (16 or sixteen, 84 or eighty-four, 200 or two hundred, but 3.75, 544, 21 million). This applies to ordinal numbers as well as cardinal numbers. However there are frequent exceptions to these rules.'' Bubba73 (talk), 23:29, 30 November 2008 (UTC)


 * No, I have no real problem with them. Most or all of them were to centuries. Bubba73 (talk), 00:32, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Subterranean Homesick Blues
Hi Allreet! I think your intent to re-write Influences section as prose is admirable. I don't have any profound thoughts to contribute, but I noticed that ref/cite for the name of the Weatherman (organization) is a broken link. Peter Doggett's recent book, There's A Riot Going On: Revolutionaries, Rock Stars, and the Rise and Fall of '60s Counter-Culture, has much to say on this topic. I don't have a copy at home but read parts of it serialized in a magazine. all best Mick gold (talk) 10:46, 8 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Splendid! Much better after your re-write. I removed the Trivia tag, and added a ref for Kerouac's Subterraneans. Gray's Song & Dance Man III has a dense 3 page footnote, detailing Dylan's debt to various writers of the Beat movement. Gray makes the same point in his Kerouac entry in his Bob Dylan Encyclopedia. best Mick gold (talk) 08:33, 10 December 2008 (UTC)


 * I exaggerated, it's only one page, but the typeface is extremely small. Mick gold (talk) 16:59, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

I-78
I'll help you out with it if you need anything. For guidelines, check out WP:USRD, WP:PASH, and WP:IH. Deigo (talk) 21:45, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

Hope you don't mind
I stole your "Wikipedia Pages" for my page. It's just so useful. Hope it's not being a giant dick. --Leodmacleod (talk) 04:33, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

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WVOX
Background: I know very little about this station. The article was created by a sockpuppet of a banned user and could have been speedy-deleted, but after I looked at the article I decided it deserved to stay (after editing to eliminate the copy-paste aspects). The content that I added to (or left in) the article is minimal, but my Googling provided a huge amount of hits on this station, in many cases (such as this page) describing it as "community radio." Someone who knows and cares enough about the station to have good ideas on structuring the article could write a really interesting article about it. The material I have read about the station indicates to me that the station is probably one of the grand-daddies of community radio in the U.S., having given free air time to a diverse variety of community people as long ago as the 1950s. Here's a book by the owner in which he repeats the claim that the Wall St. Journal called it the "quintessential community radio station." Although it's clearly a commercial station, much of their current schedule is community-access-type programming, such as the programs listed at http://www.wvox.com/shows.asp. The fact that the station does not fit the definition of "community radio" as it is currently understood in university towns and other communities where these stations thrive, does not mean it's not part of "community radio," particularly in the historical development of the concept. --Orlady (talk) 03:11, 12 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your thoughtful reply. You led me into a trip down memory lane, looking at articles and other resources for various radio stations I have known and loved. I've even added one more station to the U.S. community radio category: WDVX -- this is a music station that was started as an all-volunteer station broadcasting out of a trailer parked in a campground (not a mobile home in a trailer park, nor even a motor home, but a trailer in a campground) and still is a noncommercial, listener-sponsored, mostly-volunteer operation, although they now have a real studio in an urban downtown location.
 * Community radio looks to me like one of those good ideas (much like certain patterns seen in fossil life) that arose or evolved independently at roughly the same time in several different places and forms. As you note, many noncommercial community stations rose out of Pacifica. However, I don't think that's true of all the stations listed now; for example, I think that WORT arose independently (but joined up with Pacifica), and some others may have evolved from campus stations. I even know of a couple of small-town public radio stations that function pretty much like community radio, with minimal budgets and heavy reliance on volunteers. WVOX is an outlier in that it's a commercial station, but like most community stations it's a low-power station and it provides a platform for volunteer programmers. I see this as an alternative evolutionary pathway, but functionally similar to most of the other stations listed in the community radio category. I don't think there's a basis for discussing this station in the Community radio article, but I'd like to keep it in the category to provide a navigational connection (from that article as well as to that article).
 * I do take issue with your statement that "Commercial stations from the 30s through the 70s were usually very community-minded." I listened to a lot of radio in several of those decades. While commercial stations in that era were locally based and staffed by local announcers who had more autonomy than their modern counterparts, I don't recall them as being particularly community-minded. Formats were highly formulaic, even on low-power daytime-only AM stations, and community voices were heard on the air only on the request line and during phone-in contests. FM was almost a new frontier in the 1960s (many radios were AM-only), so FM stations were generally more likely to offer unusual programming choices, but they were no more likely to be community-focused. As I remember it, in the mid-1970s any station that deviated from a standard commercial formula was an amazing breath of fresh air, whether it was public radio (then in its early days), an innovative commercial station like KZAM, or community radio in its purest sense. --Orlady (talk) 04:16, 13 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your latest reply on my talk page. As I have stated above, I really don't know much about WVOX nor the community it serves. However, based on what I've read, I continue to think it belongs in the Community radio category, although it need not be covered in the article. I agree that this is nothing like a Pacifica station, but I continue to believe that it's "community radio" in the broad sense of the term. The article says "Community radio is a type of radio service that caters to the interests of a certain area, broadcasting material that is popular to a local audience but is overlooked by more powerful broadcast groups." WVOX displays several attributes of community radio. It devotes a significant fraction of its schedule to programming produced by volunteer citizens (that's "participation by community members in producing content"), and although it claims a large audience, it is decidedly unpowerful (i.e., it's a 500-watt AM station) compared with other broadcasters in its area. It does differ from other U.S. community radio stations in being commercial and proprietary (not nonprofit and governed by volunteer citizens), in having a larger budget (I surmise that the larger budget is due primarily to being in one of the wealthiest parts of the densely populated New York City metro area; it probably doesn't require a whole lot of "appeal to advertisers" to stay afloat in such an inherently lucrative market), and in providing programming time to citizens from across the political spectrum (in contrast to most U.S. community radio stations that are overwhelmingly left-leaning). I submit that it's merely a different model for community radio. Although it's not at all communitarian in its governance (in contrast to the typical community station), in terms of its program content it could be considered more truly community-oriented because it broadcasts content from across the full political spectrum, unlike the typical community station. (Indeed, I think the political diversity might be due to the non-communitarian governance. It would be nearly impossible for a station governed by passionate community volunteers to give air time to people with right-wing views, but a commercial station need not worry about offending dedicated volunteers.)
 * I certainly don't see any harm in including this in a subdivision of Category:Community radio. --Orlady (talk) 02:42, 16 February 2009 (UTC)


 * As it happens, I just finished adding some new material to the WVOX article. The station seems to be one of a kind, mostly because of the one-of-a-kind guy who owns it, who is an outspoken advocate of local radio and free speech. The article says he was one of the first inductees in the state broadcasters' hall of fame, which is impressive, but it's even more impressive when you see that the other inductees included Walter Cronkite, Don Imus, and Bill Paley. --Orlady (talk) 03:18, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Radio stations audiable from Lehigh County
I read your comments to reverting my edit (intended to be more inclusive of a broad choice.) Chicago and Boston are irrelevant to Lehigh Valley airspace due to being so distant. Our smaller neighboring markets overlap us as our larger ones do. I have WRFY-102.5 and Frank FM 107.5 among my car radio buttons. They both are capable of providing good tunes when commercials or mediocre music seem to have the best of our and Philadelphia's commonly-listened FM stations. Berks County residents listen to our stations as we do to theirs---conveniently and curiously. Heff01 (talk) 06:05, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

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Re: Desolation Row
I highly doubt it was you. I was going through all of the My Chemical Romance-related articles tagging them for WikiProject Emo, and I noticed they all had "disputed subgenres" links in their infoboxes. These all appeared to have been added by the same editor. I think User:Zntrip simply copied it over from one of the MCR articles when he added the infobox for the MCR version. The so-called "disputed subgenres" bit comes from the fact that folks constantly edit-war and bicker endlessly on Talk:My Chemical Romance and all related articles about what genres the band's music falls under, so Friginator decided he'd go around and add "disputed subgenres" to every MCR-related infobox, making it a link to the style section in the band article. This is inappropriate, because the "dispute" is amongst WP editors and we shouldn't allow it to result in weasely wording and unintuitive internal links in the articles themselves. We present sources, discuss them on the talk page, and come to a consensus about what the article should say. We don't add garbage disclaimers to articles.

Long story short, no, it wasn't you. And I enjoyed some corned beef & cabbage today myself :-) --IllaZilla (talk) 02:27, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

Fred Snodgrass
Hi. Just for the record, someone else put the obituary there before, not me. I just changed the section title and added quotation marks. PM800 (talk) 23:19, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Easton, PA
I agree that the Easton (PA) article needs a lot of work. Perhaps you could add some of your research material to the talk page there, for others to follow up. As a graduate of Lafayette College, I knew the town as a student, and as a returning alumnus. I see lots of missing information, just from my own knowledge, and I am sure there is more. Perhaps you might find someone at the college willing to work on the article. DThomsen8 (talk) 14:37, 21 March 2009 (UTC)Dthomsen8

KEOS ENTRY
Hi, I have been posting constantly for the KEOS entry for the radio station and everytime my stuff is deleted. You have advised me to contact you and changing the language of the entry. Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Toilets07 (talk • contribs) 05:22, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

Inclineplane
Thanks for your report at WP:AIV. I've protected the page at Cedar Crest College for a week to stop the slow moving edit war. Please continue to try drawing him into a discussion, as you have been doing. If he continues blindly reverting after the protection expires, let me know. Kuru talk  01:54, 1 April 2009 (UTC)

Re: Neil Young
Thanks for the comments on my recent slew of Neil Young edits. I'll probably continue to work on the article and will add some more citations, since that seems to be a weakness in many parts of it. I'm not too familiar with the Wikipedia standards of what constitutes "enough" citations, so feel free to tag and un-tag where necessary. Kai.sheffield (talk) 02:50, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

Ralph McTell
Thanks for taking the time to explain the need for more citations, and for offering to help. I have added citations throughout the article. Some statements remain unsourced - please review and comment on whether you regard them as contentious or libellous and should be removed. Notthesameasyouremail (talk) 09:22, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your kind comments. I will be grateful if you could take a look at the discussion on 'Article Rating' on the Ralph McTell discussion page and suggest further improvements, please. Notthesameasyouremail (talk) 22:51, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

No probs with your stylistic edits. You are at least the third person to suggest replacing Ralph's personal name with his adopted surname. It seems disrespectful to do that to a living person - I would never call him 'McTell' (I even call Dylan 'His Bobness'!). However, if that's the WikiRule, go ahead... but please bear in mind that Ralph's family name is May, and he did not become McTell till he had a professional career. For example, it would be absurd to refer to Winifred May as 'McTell's mother'; if McTell has a 'mother', he's called Blind Willie. Notthesameasyouremail (talk) 14:18, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Hello again, Allreet. I have prepared a draft of the Ralph McTell article in my Sandbox, with the names 'May' and 'McTell' replacing 'Ralph' (or not) as appropriate. Please tell me what you think.  Notthesameasyouremail (talk) 13:09, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for your careful critique. I have mostly followed your advice - feel free to make the change where I have not if you feel it will be better. Notthesameasyouremail (talk) 19:13, 17 May 2009 (UTC)
 * OK, It's been a fortnight since I made the changes - what else do we need to upgrade the Article Rating from B-Class? Notthesameasyouremail (talk) 20:49, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

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Folk music and Folk rock
Just stopping by to say how I appreciate your work on these articles, particularly in pointing out what needs to be done and how we might do it. The folk music problem is likely to be an particularly difficult one as the article is particularly contentious, and the topic huge. I have hesitated over a clean-up for some time, as it seemed to me that it needed much more than just a correction of grammar and a lot of citations. Your plan suggests a way forward I think and I will chime in where appropriate.

Since it looks like you may have your hands full I have posted some suggestions on the folk rock article and will undertake them when I can. Obviously it would be great if you can take a look at them and/or the finished rewrite when you get time. Keep up the good work.--Sabrebd (talk) 09:01, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Hi. Glad to see you are enthusiastic about the idea of a rewrite. It looks like you are more immersed in this than me, but I am happy to help, I am also happy if you want to take the main lead on writing the text. Your plan sounds like a good one, shall we start with an outline and go from there?--Sabrebd (talk) 12:24, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Wenner quote
What's your opinion of this? [] best wishes, Mick gold (talk) 10:18, 26 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, I'm delighted you agree. I did waver for a few minutes when I proposed a draft incorporating Wenner, but Moisejp accurately pointed out it didn't work. You've reached the same conclusion. An editor called Ty appears to argue that we have some kind of duty to report Bielen's view, simply because it exists. He writes: "It seems to me a perfectly legitimate and reasonable interpretation of Wenner. However, what I or other editors think is irrelevant. Per NPOV it's not our job to resolve contradictions or inconsistencies, only to represent what sources say." Perhaps you can make one of your your concise interventions. 20:38, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

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Bianca Jagger
If you want to make yourself younger and also be famous, you've got to start as soon as you're born (or before...). You did a very nice job on the research. I don't see how any revision could stand up to scrutiny now.Notmyrealname (talk) 15:54, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Genres
Hi Allreet, I see you done heroic work trying to order & make sense of genres. Genres are a bit of a joke with Dylan, aren’t they? I think I remember hearing Dylan say on TTRH, “I’m in favor of a world where there are no musical barriers between people”. Genres make me think of Polonius in Hamlet Act 2 scene 2:


 * either for tragedy, comedy, history, pastoral, pastoral-comical, historical-pastoral, tragical-historical, tragical-comical-historical-pastoral, scene individable, or poem unlimited: Seneca cannot be too heavy, nor Plautus too light.

But genres are a convention and you’ve done the right thing. I have in the past added Gospel. I think it’s a huge element in Dylan’s music, from ‘Dink’s Song’ to 'Tryin’ To Get to Heaven’. But it quickly got deleted. Probably by people hostile to Christian Dylan (cf Jann Wenner!). I doubt if his forthcoming Christmas album will be filed under Gospel. Best wishes Mick gold (talk) 09:45, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Tragical-historical-pastoral Folk Rock
Wow! You've bitten off a big subject. I would find it hard to sort out such a complex genre because the interactions are so…. er, complex. Nevertheless I’m sure you could easily produce something far better written and better sourced than what is currently in this article. I find the insistence on the Beatle’ primacy in folk-rock odd. Not because the Beatles were the ‘enemy’ of folk music, on the contrary, they were irrepressibly eclectic. They utilised everything they could lay their hands on from Carl Perkins to Stockhausen. Lennon idolized Chuck Berry, McCartney idolised Little Richard and liked Broadway show tunes, Harrison liked both Chet Atkins and George Formby. (Is George Formby folk music?) ‘You’ve Got To Hide Your Love Away’ (recorded for Help!) was described by Ian MacDonald as being “in the 12/8 strum of the international folk style” and Lennon’s vocal sounded Dylanesque to me.

The whole US-UK interaction is so intense and dialectical. Paul Simon spent time in UK folk clubs where he learnt Scarborough Fair. Dylan visited London end of ‘62/early ’63 and learnt several traditional tunes from Martin Carthy which he turned into his own songs. The Animals’ first two singles (Baby Let Me Take You Home & House of the Rising Sun) were taken from Dylan’s first album, given a stylish rock arrangement and exported to the US Top Ten. (In Dont Look Back, Dylan is clearly interested in Alan Price.)

On BBC TV, we’ve just had a 3x1 hour series called Folk America which was good. The first part was the 20s and 30s, Charlie Poole & the Carter Family. Part two was the popular front, Woody Guthrie, Leadbelly, John & Alan Lomax. And part three was the 60s revival, Baez, Dylan, The Byrds, Barry MacGuire (!) which spiralled away into psychedelia, country rock etc. (In the Byrds' sequence, McGuinn explained that he was emulating Beatles style lead guitar parts in Mr Tambourine Man and Turn Turn Turn.) I’ve read Richie Unterberger when he’s written for Mojo and he’s a good music writer. I agree with the ‘road map’ you left on my Talk page.

I've recently focused my energy on Van der Weyden's The descent from the Cross. Someone suggested that I should go for WP:GAN but I've never engaged in that kind of thing before. Best, Mick gold (talk) 00:02, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

The singer-songwriter article
Hello again. I just saw your recent edit summary (about writing credits), and I think you might have slightly misunderstood what a traditional singer-songwriter actually is. It's not someone who just sings and writes their own songs, but someone who actually sings, writes and performs their songs alone, often only with a piano or acoustic. Neil Young, Bob Dylan, Nick Drake etc are good examples of this. That means writing songs, but performing them with a full band or to a backing tape would not make you a traditional singer-songwriter. Erzsébet Báthory(talk 19:07, 8 September 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm certain I don't misunderstand the term, though I do think the article defines it too narrowly - and without citation. As I noted on your discussion page, none of the examples you give - Dylan, Young, Drake - fits this definition since they (Drake, of course, being deceased) haven't performed solo or acoustic for decades. Furthermore, no contemporaneous source that I've seen strictly limits the category to solo songwriters who perform and record either unaccompanied or with low key backup. Allmusic, for example, which reflects the work of many writers, identifies a wide range of artists as singer-songwriters. It does make a distinction in some cases between more traditional S/S artists - Tom Paxton and James Taylor, pop to mind - from many S/S today by using the qualifiers "contemporary" and "alternative", but it does not make a big deal about it, and nor should we, otherwise this listing would pretty much be limited to folksingers of the 1960s coffeehouse variety. So while I may be in error in some specific cases, I don't think I'm breaking new ground, and in fact, with all the artists that I've added or left in, I have the sources to justify their inclusion. Allreet (talk) 13:39, 9 September 2009 (UTC)


 * Hey, sorry for not replying earlier. I've been really busy, and still am, but I'll try to have a thorough reply tomorrow and work out some of the issues. Cheers. Erzsébet Báthory(talk 00:59, 23 September 2009 (UTC)

A few things concerning The Byrds
Hi Allreet! I'm sorry to say that I've just reverted your edits of "the Byrds" in the "Mr. Tambourine Man" article to "The Byrds". This is because "The", with a capital letter is part of the band name, just like "The Beatles" and not simply a prefix to a singular or plural noun. The capitalisation of "The" in the band's name is as per WP:MOSTM and WP:MUSTARD. It's not like "The Jefferson Airplane", which is wrong because the band is actually called "Jefferson Airplane" and as such, you would write "all of the albums by the Jefferson Airplane" or even better, just "all of the albums by Jefferson Airplane". Anyway, I just wanted to give you the heads up and say sorry for treading on your toes with this. I also have a favour to ask you regarding The Byrds' related articles, if you're interested in participating a little in their up-keep. So do let me know. Kohoutek1138 00:24, 27 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your reply Allreet! I'm glad you remember me from the times we've communicated in the past. Yes, this is a bit of a conundrum because to my mind, since "The Byrds" is a trademarked name, it should be written with capitalisation on both words at all times. I also have to say that the music themed magazines and websites I have written for in the past all specify in their respective style guides that if a band's name starts with the word "The", the T should be capitalised every time it's used. On the other hand, I take your point about Allmusic using a small t once the band's name is established...something I find surprising to be honest. Still that's obviously part of their own particular style guidelines and they're certainly not alone in using this method.


 * Ultimately, I guess I'm saying that the particular editors that have worked on The Beatles articles have got it right but that's only my opinion. To my mind it's a bit like General Motors, the "The" in The Byrds is no different to the "General" in General Motors, the two words are the trademarked name of a commercial group, one selling cars the other selling albums and music. I know that's a hell of an analogy and there's probably lots of better examples that I could've used but hopefully you can kinda see what I'm getting at. As for The Beach Boys article, I would argue that this should also always be written as "The Beach Boys" and in fact, there seems to be a lack of consistency on that band's main article page.


 * I don't know, this is a tricky one because I can certainly see what you're saying and it makes a lot of sense but on the other hand, I kinda feel like I'm also correct and unless I'm missing something, I believe my point of view is supported by WP:MOSTM and WP:MUSTARD (and in particular this section). I would suggest that like the editors on The Beatles main article that we agree to adopt the full capitalisation rule but obviously you're not in agreement with that. Kohoutek1138 02:45, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia Takes Philadelphia
 You're invited to the

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Stupid typo
Hey, thanks for letting me know about the typo...you see, this is why all writers need an editor. Pretty ironic that it was a mistake in a sentence that mentioned how obsessive I am about accuracy! Still, I was talking about the history of music, not the correct written application of the English language! It’s true...I can’t spell for s**t! :-D Still, my grammar and punctuation is usually OK. You can’t have it all, can you? Anyway, thanks again. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 03:50, 29 September 2009 (UTC)

Correction on KOOP
Thanks so much for your good explanation of your correction. I have no information on that matter; I was simply trying to streamline the Wikipedia page, and I made an unjustifiable assumption. Thanks again.Raymondwinn (talk) 17:03, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

Recent Mr. Tambourine Man edits
Hi Allreet! Yeah, I saw that you'd said you'd put something on the talk page but when I looked I couldn't see your comments, although I can see them now. Maybe you were still writing them when I looked. Anyway, I would agree that the first performance in London is more important but I still think the Al Aronowitz/Judy Collins thing is interesting and a worthwhile addition. As for the list of people Dylan played the song to - yes, that is a bit trivial maybe but then again, it does reinforce just how much he though of the song. Have you heard the version cut for Another Side of Bob Dylan with Ramblin' Jack Elliott? It's really not very good at all...Ramblin' Jack Elliott's harmony is about a mile out of tune. Although, interestingly it was this version that The Byrds were given to learn the song, which is actually mentioned in the The Byrds' section of the article.

Anyway, I guess if you wanna remove the bit about him playing the song to folks that's OK but I think the Al Aronowitz bit should stay (just my opinion though). I also totally agree with the cleaning up of grammar and syntax to improve flow/reading. This is one of my bugbears on Wikipedia and I often reword people's text myself - not changing anything factual - just making it flow better. Sometimes it’s because the original author's first language isn't English. For instance I've recently rewritten the article for Cher's All I Really Want to Do at the request of a guy based in Europe. He's really knowledgeable about Cher but struggles with written English a bit. I'll take a look at the LSD section of Mr. Tambourine Man if you want and see if I can improve it a bit. By the way, thanks for the WikiProject Bob Dylan link, that looks interesting. I've been doing an awful lot of work on The Byrds' albums & singles articles, so there's been a fair bit of crossover with Dylan, as I'm sure you can imagine. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 02:52, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

List of people who have recorded BD songs...
Before you add more, have you seen User:Richhoncho/Artists recording Dylan songs? What do you think? Cheers. --Richhoncho (talk) 14:41, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

Don't worry about your additions, I am already on them, and besides, somebody else has added! I totally agree about the alphabeticalisation, but I suspect there's a Wikipedian cleverer than me who can fix it. I think the answer is hidden text (lightbulb moment, of course it is). Also I wondered about albums/singles information, I could add an unsortable column for notes, but wanted more comments. I am not entirely happy with what I have done yet. Strange Baez isn't on the list yet (I am ready to add to my list). Citations, I am with you there, I have added citations so far, but I am not sure how to add several songs to one one citation...more study to do. Should I move the page over to the project pages? --Richhoncho (talk) 16:03, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

Oh well, the lightbulb didn't work. Wiki markup is excluded from the sort mode. --Richhoncho (talk) 16:16, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

Request for copyediting
Hello. I saw your name at the GOCE page, and I was wondering if you could take a look at Howard the Duck (film). It's a current GAN that needs some work. Could you help out? (Ibaranoff24 (talk) 22:56, 12 October 2009 (UTC))

Need a little advice on duplicate pages
Hello Allreet! I hope you don't mind but I just wanted to get your opinion on something. I've just stumbled up two exact duplicate pages on Wikipedia for the Village People's Cruisin' album (please, don't ask me what I was doing checking out Village People albums). It seems that just a few days ago someone created a mirror page, an exact duplicate, under the alternate title of Cruisin' (album). In the Edit Summary of this new page, the user who created it has said that he's done this because he wants to create a disambiguation page for the word Cruisin'. Now, firstly, this was 3 days ago and he's done nothing of the sort, so we’re left with two identical pages and secondly, does Cruisin' even need a disambiguation page?

I just wondered what the best thing for me to do here is? Should I erase the original Cruisin' page and turn it into a disambiguation page instead? Or should I nominate the newly created Cruisin' (album) page for speedy deletion and notify the user who created that page that I've done so? I'm unsure as to what Wiki policies are for this eventuality and would welcome any advice you might have. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 19:56, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your advice Allreet, I'll notify those two users and see what happens. With regard to articles featured on DYK, yes, I've had three Dylan related ones chosen so far and one rejection. The DYK process and criteria are fairly strict though. Firstly only articles that have been expanded fivefold in the last 5 days or brand new articles that are no older than 5 days are eligible. The assessors are really hot on these criteria (in my limited experience). For instance, I recently nominated The Byrds' 1973 reunion album, Byrds, and it was rejected because although I'd expanded it A LOT, I'd only expanded it something like 4.5 times, so it was no good. I'm currently nominating the article for The Byrds/Gene Clark song "Full Circle Song" which I created three days ago. Brand new articles have to be at least 1,500 characters long (not including references, infoboxes, lists or tables etc, etc) and must be really well sourced with plenty of inline citations. Whether my nomination for "Full Circle Song" will be accepted or not though is anyone's guess.


 * Although these criteria might seem somewhat draconian, you must remember that DYK isn't meant to be a general trivia section, it's meant to be a showcase for new Wikipedia articles (as the tag line on the main page says; "From Wikipedia's newest articles:". Based on these rules and having had a look at the The Masked Marauders edit summary, I don't think this article will be eligible I'm afraid. Probably better to keep working on it and try and get it awarded Good Article status instead.


 * If you want to nominate future articles you've created or expanded for DYK, you'll find a handy list of DYK eligibility criteria here. When you're happy that an article you've worked on is eligible, you’ll need to post it along with a hook, which in the case of The Masked Marauder album would be something like you're suggestion of - Did you know that in October 1969, a self-titled hoax album named The Masked Marauders was released, supposedly featuring contributions from Bob Dylan, John Lennon, Paul McCartney and Mick Jagger? Hooks need to be short and snappy, with the name of the article in them (in bold) and with no more than 250 characters I believe (not including links). They also need to end with a question mark.


 * Once you've got your hook worked out you need to post it on this page, at the top of the section corresponding with the date that the article was created or first expanded fivefold - NOT the day that you're nominating it. You need to specify whether it’s a self-nomination or not and also list all users who’ve had a hand in creating the new article or in expanding an existing article fivefold. There are special templates that you use for posting nominations but they can be found on the main DYK nominations page, here. If you look on the main DYK page here, towards the top of the nominations for October 14, 2009, you'll see my currently pending "Full Circle Song" nomination, which should give you a clue as to how nominated hooks are formatted.


 * Once your hook is approved it needs to be moved to the DYK Preparation area. From there an administrator will move it to the main page when its turn in the queue comes up and there you go! Phew! Hopefully all my rambling has been helpful to you in some way. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 23:29, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Copyedit request

 * Hi, User:Truthkeeper88 and I have been copyediting The Naked Brothers Band: The Movie, which is a WP:GAN, but I've been for over a year trying to get it to featured article status with no luck, and was wondering if you could help by making some copyedits and making a list of suggestions for us here. Thanx! ATC . Talk 23:48, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

Paul Simon
You were too polite - this article is a total embarrassment. I did a quick first pass of the first few sections, getting rid of some of the more egregious garbage, but even those sections need much more work and I haven't looked at the rest. And that's not even starting to address the ludicrous lack of sourcing. This is Paul Simon, for heaven's sake - we can do better than this! Any ideas on how to recruit people who can pitch in and make this piece better? Hope you'll come back and see what you think. Wow. Tvoz / talk 08:53, 30 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the praise - sometimes it feels like I'm whistling in the wind, so it's always nice to know someone notices improvements. I'll have a look at what you've done and will try to get back into it as well.  We'll get there!  Cheers Tvoz / talk 20:33, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

Like a Rolling Stone
Hi Allreet, We're still thinking/talking about the point you raised, see []. I've been busy, and haven't done as much as I hoped, but your suggestion has not been forgotten. best, Mick gold (talk) 14:14, 8 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for message, but I'm just setting off on a business trip that will take me away from my computer & reference books for 48 hours. Why don't you post your draft for others to comment in same way Moisejp has posted a draft? Must dash, look forward to reading your material. Like you, I think this "quitting" makes LARS more crucial and more interesting. Mick gold (talk) 17:25, 8 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree it might be cool to lead with extended Writing section, including Dylan's temptation "to quit". I agree with your "out of intense internal turmoil springs a song that sets a new direction" thought. Look forward to reading your draft. I posted brief message [] to suggest we re-write this stuff in 2nd half of December & 1st half of January. Better to delay peer review until you,me, Moisejp, & other editors committed to improving article are satisfied. I'm currently editing a film about Van der Weyden, so I'm too busy for Wikipedia until Christmas break. I hadn't thought about the quitting "as a prelude to Dylan's dropping out a year later", but it's an intriguing thought. (Of course it's far too POV & speculative for a sober academic journal of record such as Wikipedia!) I've always thought about the events after the famous accident of July 1966 as a combination of physical trauma, emotional/psychological exhaustion, plus a profound need to re-evaluate his life, his art, his values. But maybe that too had roots, as you suggest. regards Mick gold (talk) 13:47, 13 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I've added to 'Writing and recording' an introductory para on Dylan almost quitting the music business. I'll be interested to see if you like it, or want to improve it. Mick gold (talk) 10:51, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Talkback notice
-- I.M.S. (talk) 05:30, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

Hamilton Mall
Hi Allstreet.... I did try to write that section in a NPOV. I lived though the era of the planning and the beginning of the construction of Hamilton Mall in the early 1970s. Indeed the abridged version that I wrote felt about the right size for the Allentown article. It could be expanded into it's own article if one wanted to include the complete planning as all that material resides on microfilm in the Allentown City library.

What I did include was basically a background for the reason the Mall was constructed (which was first proposed in 1958), the testing of the concept in April 1971 (which I remember well. I recall walking up to Hamilston street one saturday morning and riding the minibus for fun up and down the closed off streets, and seeing how strange it was that the traffic was all gone.   The funny thing was that the shoppers were walking on each of the street - on the sidewalk.. and the three lanes of Hamilton street were totally empty and devoid of cars and trucks of any type except for the minibusses). The complaints to City Council were many and are very well documented in the Morning Call. The entire project would have been scrapped in fact had it not been for the Leh family who still ran the department store. Phillip Berman - who ran Hess's was dead set-against it and it was the Lehs who proposed the two-lane limited traffic and allowing cross streets to be open that wss the compomise that allowed it to be built. But the idea was to get RID of the cars on Hamilston street - that never really happened.. So what I wrote for the Allentown article was not all of the story - you're very correct.. but enough to include as Hamilton Mall changed the downtown shopping area of Allentown significantly.. it was a Utopian project that might have worked in 1958.. but not in 1973 after the opening of Whitehall Mall and the other shopping areas outside of Hamilston street in the 1970s...

Another aspect that I left out of the article was the rise in crime in the downtown area starting in the 1980s, which today leaves Hamilton street pretty devoid of anyone but criminals after dark. No one comes to downtown Allentown any more for shopping as they did during my teenage years of the 1960s...   People today avoid it largely due to no compelling reason to go there   day or night...

Bwmoll3 (talk) 10:59, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Best wishes for the new year & new decade...
...from me and Carl Sagan and Stephen Hawking Mick gold (talk) 17:43, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

GA reassessment of Ray LaMontagne
I have conducted a reassessment of the above article as part of the GA Sweeps process. You are being notified as you have made a number of contributions to the article. I have found some concerns which you can see at Talk:Ray LaMontagne/GA1. I have placed the article on hold whilst these are fixed. Thanks. Jezhotwells (talk) 15:17, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

AfD nomination of David T. Walker
An editor has nominated one or more articles which you have created or worked on, for deletion. The nominated article is David T. Walker. We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also Notability and "What Wikipedia is not").

Your opinions on whether the article meets inclusion criteria and what should be done with the article are welcome; please participate in the discussion(s) by adding your comments to Articles for deletion/David T. Walker. Please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes ( ~ ).

You may also edit the article during the discussion to improve it but should not remove the articles for deletion template from the top of the article; such removal will not end the deletion debate.

Please note: This is an automatic notification by a bot. I have nothing to do with this article or the deletion nomination, and can't do anything about it. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 01:10, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

Ralph McTell article
Hi Alreet, how're you doing?

I wrote most of the original Ralph McTell article. I know the subject reasonably well so I've read with interest the correspondence on the article's talk page.

I've recently added to the article and left a note of explanation on Notthesameasyouremail's talk page. In fact, editor Notthesameasyouremail. S/he has done a lot of additional work on this piece and deserves a Barnstar don't you think?.

You, too, have greatly improved the article itself and offered some really constructive guidance to its editors: thank you. I think you deserve this ...

Best wishes, Andy F (talk) 08:44, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

WikiProject Bob Dylan Newsletter
Greetings! This message has been sent courtesy of WikiProject Bob Dylan, which you are a member of. Our project now has two Featured Articles: Bob Dylan and Like a Rolling Stone, and three Good Articles: Mr. Tambourine Man, It's All Over Now, Baby Blue and Madhouse on Castle Street. Suggestions are now being canvassed for the next article to work on, as part of the WP Dylan collaboration team. Please voice your opinion here. Regards, --Richhoncho (talk) 22:57, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Hello & Freewheelin'
Hi Allreet, hope all is well with you. Our position on the inclusion of Christmas In The Heart in the lead has been queried. What do you think? I've started work on revamping Freewheelin' alongside Moisejp & IMS. I'm glad LARS scored a positively barnstarred result. best wishes Mick gold (talk) 09:12, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

You're invited to Wikipedia Takes Philadelphia
This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 14:57, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Grab some glory, and a barnstar
Hi, I'd like to invite you to participate in the Guild of Copy Editors July 2010 Backlog Elimination Drive. In May, about 30 editors helped remove the tag from 1175 articles. The backlog is still over 7500 articles, and extends back to the beginning of 2008! We really need your help to reduce it. Copyediting just a couple articles can qualify you for a barnstar. Serious copyeditors can win prestigious and exclusive rewards. See the event page for more information. And thanks for your consideration. ɳorɑfʈ Talk! 14:36, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer
Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, will be commencing a a two-month trial at approximately 23:00, 2010 June 15 (UTC).

Reviewers can review edits made by users who are not autoconfirmed to articles placed under flagged protection. Flagged protection is applied to only a small number of articles, similarly to how semi-protection is applied but in a more controlled way for the trial.

When reviewing, edits should be accepted if they are not obvious vandalism or BLP violations, and not clearly problematic in light of the reason given for protection (see Reviewing process). More detailed documentation and guidelines can be found here.

If you do not want this userright, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. Karanacs (talk) 17:07, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

Hi Allreet
Hi Allreet, I just wanted to say welcome back to Wikipedia and to WP Dylan. Thanks for your idea about Robertson and Royalties on the Basement Tapes talk page. There may (or may not) be something to your idea. Levon Helm in his autobiography does talk about Robertson perhaps unfairly claiming songwriting credits for compositions they all worked on but whether or not we can find any sources linking that to the choice of songs on TBT I don't know. I think I remember reading somewhere recently that one of the incentives for I'm not sure if it was TBT or another mid-70s Band album was that they needed money but I don't remember right now where I saw that. Right now my priority with TBT is just to get it promoted to FA but maybe after that if you have any ideas for sources and I can look through mine, and we could see if there is anything we can do with that idea. I'm going out of town for a few days but I will be back online sometime during the weekend. Take care. Moisejp (talk) 22:50, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Wanna Barnstar?
Good morning, fellow editors. We are currently in the process of launching the October wikification drive. If you would like to participate, please sign up here. Please direct any questions to Mono or WikiCopter or the project's talk page. Thank you!

Delivered by MessageDeliveryBot on behalf of WikiProject Wikify at 06:02, 1 October 2010 (UTC).

Witmark demos
Hi Allreet, good to hear from you. The Bootleg Series Vol. 9 – The Witmark Demos: 1962–1964 looks very interesting. Well done - a good start. Superficial comment: the on-line ref formats look "raw", so I've changed the first one. Now I have to run. Did you see Dylan on his recent visit to your neck of the woods? Mick gold (talk) 17:46, 28 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Hi Allreet, thanks for your note, and great to have you back! I left a reply on the H61R Talk page. Great work on Bootleg Series Vol. 9. I have been especially busy lately but hope to jump in and help you out with that at some point soon. Maybe we can make a GA out of it eventually, but one thing at a time. Hopefully I'll have a bit of time over the winter break. One thing I might do, if it's OK, is to revamp the references formatting. On my recent collaborations with Mick gold and I.M.S., and on H61R as well, we have been using the Harvard system, and I've found it to be a really clean and sleek formatting system. But I'm sure I can contribute in other ways, too, not just aesthetically. Take care! Moisejp (talk) 12:51, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Next drive
As you are either a participant of WikiProject or the October wikification drive or have signed up to participate in the planned December drive, this probably concerns you. Discussions that have been inactive for a couple weeks regarding the December drive have been reactivated, and we would like you to participate in these discussions, and also consider joining the December drive. We have taken upon ourselves a massive workload, encompassing a backlog reaching June 2008 and comprising articles. Barnstars will be awarded to participating editors, and also, please invite your friends to join! Please do not reply to this message here. Either reply here, here or here.

For the December Drive Coordinators,.

Delivered by MessageDeliveryBot on behalf of WikiProject Wikify at 23:22, 29 November 2010 (UTC).

Invitation to particpate in the December 2010 Wikification Drive
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GOCE elections
Sent on behalf of the Guild of Copy Editors via SMasters using AWB on 01:09, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

Oxford Town
Thanks for picking up the ball and running with it! Looks much better now. Cheers. --Richhoncho (talk) 19:56, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

AFD Notification of Reception of country music
Hi, is it possible to get your input on this matter? Articles_for_deletion/Log/2010_December_15. Thanks, Seniortrend (talk) 20:51, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Re: History of Sesame Street
Allreet, what nice words I found on my talk page written by you! I submitted this article to be copyedited because everyone I asked personally was too busy, so I thought I'd turn to the GOCE. I'd like to submit it for FAC, and wanted to make sure it was ready. FAC is kinda scary for me, especially for articles I've invested a lot in and have some emotional attachment to, like this one. It sounds, from your review of it, that you feel like it's already ready! Is that accurate? If I could get your support in FAC, that would be great and much appreciated. At any rate, thanks for the kind words and hope your holidays are merry! BTW, I love your username; it's so uplifting, something that's much needed in the world today. ;) Christine (talk) 22:16, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Please confirm your membership
Delivered by MessageDeliveryBot on behalf of WikiProject Wikify at 19:13, 22 December 2010 (UTC).

You asked
if it was okay to remove a couple of red links at the Dylan covers list. Here is my opinion and I have not yet checked to see what you did. It's a good idea to remove artists who are in red, but leave Dylan songs that are red because it might encourage someone to write articles about the songs. Like, you for example, or even me. Einar aka Carptrash (talk) 22:36, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

GOCE Year-end Report
Sent on behalf of the Guild of Copy Editors using AWB on 06:05, 31 December 2010 (UTC)

Main page appearance
Hello! This is a note to let the main editors of this article know that it will be appearing as the main page featured article on January 8, 2011. You can view the TFA blurb at Today's featured article/January 8, 2011. If you think it is necessary to change the main date, you can request it with the featured article director,. If the previous blurb needs tweaking, you might change it—following the instructions of the suggested formatting. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page so Wikipedia doesn't look bad. :D Thanks! Tb hotch ™ and ©  20:19, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

 

"Like a Rolling Stone" is a 1965 song by American singer-songwriter Bob Dylan. Its confrontational lyrics originate in an extended piece of verse Dylan wrote in June 1965, when he returned exhausted from a grueling tour of England. During a difficult two days pre-production, Dylan struggled to find the essence of the song, which was demoed without success as a waltz. A breakthrough was made when it was tried in a rock music format, and rookie session musician Al Kooper improvised the organ riff for which the track is known. However, Columbia Records was unhappy with both the song's length at over six minutes and its heavy electric sound, and were hesitant to release it. It was only when a month later a copy was leaked to a new popular music club and heard by influential DJs that the song was put out as a single. Although radio stations were reluctant to play such a long track, "Like a Rolling Stone" reached number two in the US charts and became a worldwide hit. The track has been described as revolutionary in its combination of different musical elements, the youthful, cynical sound of Dylan's voice, and the directness of the question in the chorus: "How does it feel?". "Like a Rolling Stone" transformed Dylan's career and is today considered one of the most influential compositions in post-war popular music and has since its release been both a music industry and popular culture milestone which elevated Dylan's image to iconic. The song has been covered by numerous artists, including Jimi Hendrix, The Rolling Stones, The Wailers and Green Day. (more...)

Phil Ochs: There but for Fortune
Hi. I saw that you're interested in starting an article about the new documentary. I've been meaning to do it, but I don't know when I'll have the time.

You can find links to many news stories about the film here. Let me know if you need any help. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 20:06, 7 January 2011 (UTC)


 * More than happy to help. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 20:16, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

Dylan bootleg
Sure, Allreet, I'll get on it. However, I really don't think it deserves a heading. If you're just trying to de-orphan the article, I can just slip that section in right underneath the one on Great White Wonder. I haven't read the article in all its glory yet, and if I find more reason to put a heading in, I will. The Gates of Eden (talk) 22:00, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

H61R
Hi Allreet, how are you doing? Mick gold and I want to nominate Highway 61 Revisited for GA. You were involved in the collaboration so would you like to be a co-nominator? Let me know if you don't. There's a brief discussion about it on the article's Talk page if you want to check it out. BTW, while I have your attention, there is also a matter I have brought up on the LARS talk page about a non-free photo that someone has added that maybe should be deleted. If you have time please check that discussion, too, Thanks! Moisejp (talk) 15:15, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Highway 61 Revisited
The article Highway 61 Revisited you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold. The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needed to be addressed. If these are fixed within seven days, the article will pass, otherwise it will fail. See Talk:Highway 61 Revisited for things which need to be addressed. Jezhotwells (talk) 13:51, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Articles on Dylan songs and associates
Thanks for your comments. I've noticed your work on Clayton and Ochs, and I agree that it would be good to give a more rounded account of Ochs's tragic death. A friend in New York told me he's seen the film There But For Fortune, and thought it was v good. I hope I get the chance to see it soon. I've made some improvements to Desolation Row and other articles when I get the time. May the road rise with you Mick gold (talk) 10:33, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

BLP = Biography of living people
Hi. Concerning this edit of your I would like to tell you that BLP stands for "Biography of Living People". You added this tag in thee article of a deceased person. Thanks, Magioladitis (talk)
 * I understood that and simply picked the wrong template. Allreet (talk) 19:56, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

D songs
Allreet, I was just about done writing you a long reply earlier today when the earthquake struck and our power went out, and I lost the message. Everyone here in the Tokyo area is fine, but some other parts of the country were not so lucky. OK, I am going to try to remember everything I said before and write it as quickly as possible.

John Wesley Harding: Yeah, I noticed a red link for this somewhere, I think it was on "Drifter's Escape" (not sure if that's the one you left). That may have been what gave me the idea to tackle this one, plus the fact that it's a song I've always really liked, and because the story of why Dylan decided to name the album after this song is quite interesting, to me anyways (though I haven't gotten to put that part into the article yet). I've decided this is going to be my next little project. When I finished "Santa-Fe" and it got GA, I realized how relatively easy it is for one person to put together a GA article if the subject is "small scale." If one chooses a subject that has had just the right amount written about it, the person can cover it without too much strain, and still make the article interesting. For our Dylan WikiProject collaborations it seems we often choose more "large scale" subjects that, even when we only aim for GA, have had so much written about them that to adequately cover the topic, it takes a lot of work, a lot of collaboration. And that's all good, and of course I intend to continue with our collaborations, but I realized I also have the capability to do some good smaller articles on the side, and so I hope to do more of that. Actually, I've noticed from a while back that Riendog does a lot of smaller GAs on his own or with just a little help, and I've always been impressed by that.

"Santa-Fe": On the box and liner notes for The Bootleg Series 1–3 there is the hyphen in the name, so I'm going with that. As you say, sometimes the song name can be found without the hyphen, and on bobdylan.com I think there is inexplicably an accent on the e: Santa Fé. In Tim Dunn's book The Bob Dylan Copyright Files, it actually says that at different stages of the copyrighting and later renewals of the copyright sometimes the hyphen was included and sometimes wasn't. I didn't think that was worth mentioning in the article, but do you really think it is?

About the song's lyrics, as mentioned in the article, the copyrighted version differs from what was recorded, and here is what Bjorner hears on the original recorded version:. I didn't include a link to that anywhere in the article because there are so many lyrics websites out there that are definitely not reliable sources, and I didn't want to go through the hassle of having to possibly argue that Bjorner might be. Dylan fans all think he is, but non-Dylan types sometimes argue he's not because it's just him running his website by himself. Whatever, I didn't really want to get involved in that debate, so I left this page out of the article. If anything, maybe it could be included in External Links, but I'm still not sure that I want to.

About filling in the gap of what the song might be about, we could emphasize that it's a nonsense song to satisfy readers' desire to hope for any kind of narrative or whatever. Bauldie wrote that it was "a typical combination of nonsense and fun, just for the hell of it, really". And Heylin, gives the quote in the article about the "usual wordplay and slurred diction to obscure any pretense to a deeper meaning". So, yeah, we could put something about that in the article (but where? Possibly expand the scope of the "Copyrighted version" section to "(Something) and copyrighted version") so we could talk about the (lack of) themes in the song. One tiny tiny glimpse Heylin gives to what the song could be about is "Those original lyrics revolve around 'dear, dear, dear, dear Santa Fe'—intended to be both a woman's name and the town in New Mexico. After five verses of rolling said words around, he moves on." Let me know if you have any thoughts about all of this. Thanks! Moisejp (talk) 13:56, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much for your concern, Allreet—it is much appreciated. Also, thanks for your suggestions for "Santa-Fe". I've added info about the variations on the title. Mick gold made several edits and I ended up making several more as well. If you have time to have a look at what has been changed and see if you agree with everything, including seeing if you notice anywhere where the wording could be improved, any further feedback would always be appreciated. Thanks! Moisejp (talk) 10:00, 12 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi Allreet! Thanks a lot for your suggestion. I'd be the first to agree I can sometimes be wordy in my writing. I appreciated that you gave me some hints and gave me the opportunity to try to fix it myself. I have to wait until I'm in the right frame of mind, though. These last few days any edits I've been making have been more mechanical-ish ones, not ones that require lots of thought. Anyway, I'll try to get to that in the next several days. Take care and talk to you again soon! Moisejp (talk) 13:03, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi Allreet. Thx for all your hard work on BoB. I'm sorry I've been kind of busy and haven't been able to jump in there and do the heavy editing I've wanted to, but I guess if we all at least keep picking away at it. I hope it hasn't been too lonely for you doing the lion's share lately. I'll try to get something down for "Absolutely SM" soon. Sorry about my period/quote marks mis-edit. All right, talk again soon! Moisejp (talk) 14:24, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi Allreet, no problem about the dashes! I was thinking about mentioning it to you at some point, and probably would have eventually, if you hadn't eventually caught on. But in the meantime I didn't really mind making the changes myself. Yeah, it applies to page numbers and to year spans like 1973–1999. Take care! Moisejp (talk) 14:11, 13 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Allreet, thank you for your message a while back. I've been wanting to write to you for a while. Life has thrown me some busy situations that need dealing with, and I have to basically drop out of Wikipedia for a spell. I'm pretty sure it'll be at least a few months, maybe longer. But I'm certain I'll be back sooner or later when things settle down. Sorry the BoB collaboration is not moving forward, but I guess when I and Mick Gold get some more time again maybe we can start things rolling once more. I really enjoy working with you, and look forward to eventually getting back on here. Take care, my friend. Moisejp (talk) 06:20, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Henry David Abraham, M.D.


The article Henry David Abraham, M.D. has been proposed for deletion because under Wikipedia policy, all biographies of living persons created after March 18, 2010, must have at least one source that directly supports material in the article.

If you created the article, please don't take offense. Instead, consider improving the article. For help on inserting references, see Referencing for beginners or ask at Help desk. Once you have provided at least one reliable source, you may remove the prod blp tag. Please do not remove the tag unless the article is sourced. If you cannot provide such a source within ten days, the article may be deleted, but you can when you are ready to add one. Eeekster (talk) 00:33, 8 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Added sources the day after notification. Replaced the article's Deletion template with Refimprove template. Allreet (talk) 21:35, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

GOCE drive newsletter
Sent on behalf of the Guild of Copy Editors using AWB on 07:02, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

Blonde on Blonde
Hi Allreet, Hope all is well with you & yours. I've been a a bit run over by work this year, but now I'm hoping to contribute to Blonde on Blonde, and I appreciate the progress you've made thus far. Let me know if what I'm doing conflicts with your plans and perspective. Best, Mick gold (talk) 10:04, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Sure, I'm confident we'll agree on major matters. Enjoy the vacation in Nova Scotia. As for what was written in Nashville, remember that "Visions of Johanna" (aka Freeze Out) and "Leopard Skin Pill Box Hat" were both recorded in early versions in New York. I think the NY LSPBH is rather good. Sean Wilentz's recent book has a good chapter on BoB, with some diplomatic comments on controversy over how many recording sessions took place in Nashville. Best, Mick gold (talk) 13:11, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi Allreet, I've been adding to the article and feel I've taken it as far as I can for now. I'd love to hear your opinion of our progress thus far, and your thoughts about points raised by Moisejp. I was hoping that if you & Moisejp & I & other editors can tidy up, then we can shoot for GA. All best Mick gold (talk) 23:28, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

Allreet, how are you? Thinking of putting some sound clips on the Blonde on Blonde article and currently collecting votes for the ones to do. See the article"s talk page. Thanks! Moisejp (talk) 14:22, 12 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Allreet, how's it going? I see you're back on Wiki after a few weeks off. Great! Listen, BoB is almost there, almost ready for GAN, but it feels like it has stalled—maybe that's just my perception, I don't know. I've been to blame as well, distracted with other stuff. But if everyone has time, I say we give a final, concerted push and I'm sure we're 97% of the way there and we can get it finished. What do you think? I'm going to send Mick gold a message, too. Take care! Moisejp (talk) 16:42, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi Allreet, hope all is well. As Moisejp mentioned, we're heading towards GAN on Blonde on Blonde. Let us know if there's anything you want to change/re-write.
 * A Query: Did you add the references to Gill 2011? I had thought this book was simply a re-issue of the 1998 Gill book which I possess (Classic Bob Dylan 1962-69: The Stories Behind Every Song) but with different pagination. My Gill 1998 book contains 144 pages, but (according to amazon) the Gill 2011 has 208 pages. The titles of these 2 Gill books seem to be similar, but the info seems to be different. Gill 2011 is cited as the ref for: "'Obviously 5 Believers', Blonde on Blonde's second-to-last track, is a roadhouse blues love song similar in melody and structure to Memphis Minnie's 'Me and My Chauffeur Blues'." My 1998 Gill does not make this point about O5B. Do you have Gill 2011? Would you be able to check the references? I've checked all the refs relating to the books which I possess, and I believe they're all OK. Best Mick gold (talk) 10:25, 13 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Agreed, switch it all to 2011 if the material is there. I couldn't find Memphis Minnie in my "Obviouly 5 Believers"! Thanks Mick gold (talk) 20:34, 13 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Allreet! That's super that you could merge the two Gill books into one ref. I think we're ready for GAN. I added some more comments to the bottom of the Talk page. Oh, while I'm writing to you now, if you have that Zappa biography by Miles, do you think you could add a ref for the June 27 release date? Thanks!!

GOCE drive newsletter
Sent on behalf of the Guild of Copy Editors using AWB on 16:04, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Blonde on Blonde
The article Blonde on Blonde you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Blonde on Blonde for comments about the article. Well done! There is a backlog of articles waiting for review, why not help out and review a nominated article yourself? Jezhotwells (talk) 19:50, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Congratulations! Moisejp (talk) 01:09, 20 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks for all your input, Allreet. Another successful collaboration. Mick gold (talk) 09:28, 20 October 2011 (UTC)