User talk:Altruism/Archive 2

Re:Hi
I feel WP:NOR is essential to avoid creation of bogus articles. It does have side effects which we have to live with. I couldn't find time to review your edits properly. I would suggest splitting Guntur into two articles: Guntur district and Guntur (city). All district articles should follow the format specified in WikiProject_Indian_districts. Try to do this if you find time.--(Sumanth|Talk) 04:32, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Madurai Nayaks
I have made a few notes in the talk page of Madurai Nayaks. If the unknown user does not follow the advice, his IP address can be blocked. May I add that it is: తేళ్ళపాడు. Kumarrao 05:54, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Edit summaries/talk page comments
Some of your edit summaries/talk page comments may violate Civility. Please be more patient and assume good faith. Please try to respond in a lighter tone. --(Sumanth|Talk) 05:58, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Name
I know for sure it is 'తేళ్ళపాడు'. Kumarrao 12:53, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Intervention
Can you do something about this?

The Figures 1 and 2 in the articles Telugu script and Telugu language figures clearly mention the evolution of Brahmi script of Mauryan times towards modern Telugu and Kannada scripts. It is as given below:

1. Brahmi script of Mauryan period (3rd centrury BCE)

2. Brahmi script on Bhattiprolu Urn containing Buddha's dhatus (3rd century BCE)

3. Brahmi script of Satavahana period (1st centurey CE)

4. Brahmi script of Ikshvaku period (3d century CE)

5. Brahmi script of Gupta period (4th century CE)

6. Ancient Telugu-Kannada script of Salankayana period (5th century)

7. Tamil scripts of Pallava period (7th century)

8. Telugu-Kannada script of 7th century

9. Telugu-Kannada script of Eastern Chalukyas (10th century)

10. Telugu-Kannada script of Rajarajanarendra period (11th century)

11. Telugu-Kannada script of Kakatiya Ganapatideva (13th century)

12. Telugu script of Prolaya Vemareddy (14th century).

It is thus very clear that both the scripts had a common origin in Brahmi script as found on Bhattiprolu stupa urn. To call it s "Old Kannada" script is nothing but travesty of history, even though some authors might have referred it so. In fact, these figures were sourced from the same citation (Adluri, Seshu Madhava Rao Parachuri, Sreenivas. Origins of Telugu Script) which Gnanapiti refers to. But, Gnanapiti does not want to take cognizance of it. As a compromise, I agreed that it can be written as:

"The Telugu script is derived from Telugu-Kannada script which is also known as old Kannada script and developed independently at the same time as modern Kannada script which is why it has strong resemblance with it"

However, Gnanapiti insists that it should be "Old Kannada" rather than "Telugu-Kannada". It is plain chauvanism being imposed on articles regarding Telugu, Telugu language and Telugu script. Wiki should not encourage such fanaicas and chauvanists. Kumarrao 09:37, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you
Thank you. Can something be done about it? Kumarrao 05:12, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Kapaneedu
Yes. I was wrong. It should be "kaapaaneedu''.Kumarrao 12:53, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Corrections
I made necessary corrections in the text. I do not know how to correct the title. Can you help me? Kumarrao 13:49, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Requesting your comments
Could you please comment on Talk:Andhra_Pradesh?. --(Sumanth|Talk) 04:37, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Kaapaaneedu
Yes. It is Kaapaaneedu. It is ముసునూరి కాపానీడు in Telugu script. Kumarrao 06:33, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Origin
The meaning of the word 'Kaapa' is 'to protect' as in Kaapalaa. Kumarrao 07:06, 13 June 2007 (UTC) No. When we utter the name it is Kaapaaneedu but not Kaapaneedu. Kumarrao 07:11, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. Yes. I shall also work on 'Sundariah'. Kumarrao 07:55, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Pemmasani & Mirzapur
1. Ramalinga Nayudu was the grandson of Timmanayudu. 2. No. I did not hear about this Zamindar. Quite interesting! Kumarrao 12:19, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Probable
This is what Adluri says:

''By the time Pallavas moved to the Tamil country from Telugu lands, Sanskrit gained its prominence in South India and displaced Prakrit. The Pallavas took this newfound interest to Tamil Nadu and patronized some of the most illustrious Sanskrit poets like Bharavi and Dandin. At that time, Tamil (and Sanskrit in the Tamil land) used to be written in the "pallava grantham" script. Row 8 of Fig. T1 lists this script. Modern Tamil script eventually descended from it. A great number of south-east Asian languages including Thai and Malay had adapted variants of this grantham script and Telugu script over the centuries''. Kumarrao 05:43, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Right!
You are absolutely right. The historians also feel so. Kambhojas migrated from Andhra coast and established Cambodian kingdom. Script also travelled along. The words Karma, Kamma, Khmer, Kambhoja etc., are all related.Kumarrao 06:27, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks
I shall read these webpages. Regarding Pahlava-Kambhoja, Wiki has very many interesting articles. A terrific book on Ramayana and Central Asia/Afghanistan is : The Vedic People by Rajesh Kochar. It is a compulsory reading for persons interested in ancient Aryans, Vedas, Ramayana, Mahabharata etc.,Kumarrao 07:13, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

"Practise" doesn't make perfect
Howdy Altruism - Regarding your recent change of "practice" to "practise" at the Theravada article, I thought I'd mention that "practice" is perfectly good English ... American English that is. (See for instance this entry at the on-line Merriam-Webster's Dictionary: http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/practice.) My understanding is that, on WP, we should show no preference one way or the other and, ideally, we should follow the language preference of the initial editor. (Which here for instance appears to be American English.) Given your name, I infer your intention was one of not-knowing -- or, perhaps my understanding of WP's policies and practices or my assessment of the article's language precedence is in error. Either way, just thought I'd mention it. Great user name by the way! I wish you well. If I am in error in some way, please let me know. Best wishes, Larry Rosenfeld (talk) 16:52, 15 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Hi Altruism - thank you for the thoughtful reply. Regarding "kama," I can point you to some resources that might shed some light from a Theravada perspective, but regardng Indian origins or associations I'm ignorant.
 * Regarding "kamma" as a Pali word, while of course a great deal has been written about this word's ethical, metaphysical, cosmological and psychological implications, a useful source regarding its etymology and vast number of connotations could be found at the five-page entry for "kamma" in the on-line Pali Text Society's 1921-25 Pali-English Dictionary (PED): http://dsal.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/philologic/getobject.pl?c.1:1:315.pali. For instance, when this word is applied to a people or a place, it seems to frequently have the connotation of "work" or "building" or "weaving/artisan."
 * While I'm far from an "authority" (just someone with a few good resources), and I'm not sure who would be the best person to approach on WP for information regarding Indian Buddhism, here are some people who immediately come to mind with greater knowledge than myself: User:Buddhipriya (tremendously productive, seems to be particularly fluent in some matters involving Hindu-Buddhist integration); User:Stephen_Hodge (a true scholar with apparent command of several Indo-Aryan languages); User:Peter_jackson (very impressive, deep knowledge of scholarly material particularly related to Pali matters); User:TonyMPNS (extremely thoughtful and caring published authority, particularly on Mahayana matters); User:Sacca (deeply committed to the Buddha's teaching with an impressively wide breadth of knowledge gained through years of actually living the Buddhist path, and who has also traveled extensively to Buddhist pilgrimage sites and has shared spectacularly from such travels); User:Nat_Krause (a very helpful and laudably knowledgeable long-time WP editor-who-should-be-an-admin); and, User:Blnguyen (a breath-takingly prodigious and regularly praised editor who appears to know a great deal about India and has at least some obvious knowledge about Buddhism). (Of course, there are many more noteworthy and talented active WP Buddhism editors -- for instance, especially, User:Rudyh01 and User:Spasemunki, and also see WikiProject_Buddhism; those I've identified above are simply those with whom I've had repeated contact and who I recall having knowledge on Early Indian Buddhism and/or Theravada Buddhism.)
 * I hope some of this, somehow, helps. Best wishes, Larry Rosenfeld (talk) 14:52, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks
Thank you for the 'Barnstar'. I am waging an incessant battle with a bunch of unreasonable and irrational fanatics. Hope others will support me. Kumarrao 05:09, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Good luck for your battle.Gnanapiti 06:12, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

The above user probably doesn't understand what "canvassing" means. User:Kumarrao is only hoping that others would support him. He is not at all soliciting support. Please brush up, your knowledge of the English language before jumping to conclusions. Assume good faith   Altruism To talk  06:35, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Info
Please tell me how to contact Wiki administrators to solicit action against certain users and ask to protect my articles and edits.Kumarrao 07:47, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Kannada-Telugu
Sir, I have not made edits to any Telugu related pages, nor am I trying to cause edit wars. In fact I have tried to solve a few (Kannadiga) after Mr. Kumarrao came along. I have not tried to prove any language is superior either, just stated some counter points to points put forward by Kumarrao. It is Kumarrao who is going around snooping, questioning well established historians and mocking historians of National repute, glorifying a few who support his liking. Talk:Origin of Vijayanagara Empire is an example. I wrote the balanced Featured article Vijayanagara Empire and have read many books on the same. I have also visited Vijayanagara twice. I have tried not to be biased on this article knowing it is a hot point in Kannada-Telugu cultures. There were no Kannda-Telugu edit wars until Kumarrao came along. Yes, you are right, Kannadigas and Telugus have lived in relative harmony. He has an issue with a citation in Telugu script which he wants removed. He needs to discuss this with an admin. Or he could request me and I can talk to an admin and have it removed. Snooping around and scoffing at historians of National merit and glorifying foreign historians is not going to help. India and Indians have come a long way since 1947.cheers and best wishes.Dineshkannambadi 11:15, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

I hope the edit wars end too. There are other more important things to work on, than Kannada vs Telugu superiority.Dineshkannambadi 12:00, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Regarding the Origin of Vijayanagara Empire, I unfortunately had to tag the "Telugu origin" section because it lacks in citations, though I know exactly who are the historians who claim Telugu origin (and respect their claim). If I had the books by Venkataramanayya, Durga Prasad I would go ahead and provide citations myself. Please see if you can find the required citations as the page looks terrible with the tags. I had requested another user interested in AP history and will try again.Dineshkannambadi 12:11, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Misuse of Wiki
Dear Mr Altruism,

I am thoroughly convinced that Wikipedia is a highly susceptible tool for spreading falsehoods by a group(s) of people who can collude among themselves and then twist, distort and protect their articles from well-meaning Users. At the same time, they can prevent others from editing their contributions in a clever and premediated fashion. I do not regret that I lost to a bunch of fanatics and chauvanists. I only hope that Wikipedia owners, administrators and others take notice of my frustration and amend the guidelines to make Wiki more credible and authentic. Kumarrao 14:47, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

The "History of the Andhras upto 1565 A.D" is a good read. Its at History of the Andhras Regards,  Altruism To talk  12:20, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks
Yes. I read Durgaprasad's book. Well-wriiten and very balanced account.

Jayapa was from Chebrolu. I shall give a few references later.

There were no systematic studies on genotypic profiling of Kammas. As you know y-chromosome specific markers give info about men and mitochondrial DNA markers give info aboout women. It is considered that Velama and Kamma communities were of the same stock at the turn of 10th century. One theory is that they were all Buddhist migrants from Gangetic plains to coastal Andhra. Although there are many theories about their dichotomy noone clealy knows why they separated. Many of the gothras and surnames of the groups are same.Kumarrao 05:49, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

No clue
Thanks to the generous guy! I also did not know him. The strife between the social groups started during Palnadu war. It continued through Kakatiya times. Musunuris fostered the unity of all communities at a great cost. Jealousy reared its head when Kaapaya became the ruler of Warangal. Bahmanis succeeded in driving a wedge between both the groups. Singama and his sons killed Kaapaya and occupied Warangal but must have regreted soon when Bahmanis ultimately vanquished Padmanayakas.Kumarrao 07:21, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Jayapa
Your question gave me an idea to create an article Jayapa Nayudu. Please edit as you feel it necessary.Kumarrao 16:08, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Yelavarthy
Thanks, I thought it was a travesty that the Bombing didn't have a template of any kind - so thought I should create one. I'm not sure if anyone else notable died in the bombing, so if you happen to know, I'd certainly appreciate any additions to the template. I'm just a (mostly ignorant) Canadian after all ;) Sherurcij (Speaker for the Dead) 06:31, 21 June 2007 (UTC)