User talk:Aranel/archive1

This is an archive of User talk:Aranel from August to the end of October 2004. Please do not edit this page&mdash;any comments or additions should be directed to User talk:Aranel.

Welcome to the Wikipedia
Here are some links I thought useful:


 * Tutorial
 * Help desk
 * Foundation issues
 * Policy Library
 * Utilities
 * Cite your sources
 * Verifiability
 * Wikiquette
 * Civility
 * Conflict resolution
 * Brilliant prose
 * Neutral point of view
 * Pages needing attention
 * Peer review
 * Bad jokes and other deleted nonsense
 * Village pump
 * Boilerplate text
 * IRC channel
 * Mailing lists
 * Current polls
 * GNU Free Documentation License

Feel free to ask me anything the links and talk pages don't answer. You can sign your name by typing 4 tildes, like this: ~.

Be Bold!

Sam [Spade] 23:45, 2 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Press Release
Instead of reasonable resolution of conflict you have grown this tiny issue of some User:Mzajac having personal attack and stalking on me, which continues like a chain reaction between his friends (User:Mzajac -> User:Timo Honkasalo ->User: Aranel -> User:HappyDog -> User:Farside -> User:Mirv) - you can easily tell that they have common interests and when one cannot answer reasonably to a discussion, his friend takes a turn, to a HUGE issue of group harrassment and deletion of everything possible.

I am going to write "Wikipedia: Crash Course" article on major web news sources and you will receive public attention, what you will say then? Don't you think it is self-destructive way to your community?

Wikipedia is ONLINE and FREE Encyclopedia. It is itself built based on links and it cannot exist without the rest of WWW.

Principles of Wikipedia broken by the above mentioned members:


 * 1. Assume good faith. Wikipedia has worked remarkably well so far based on a policy of nearly complete freedom to edit. People come here to collaborate and write good articles. Wikiquette


 * 2. Avoid reverts and deletions whenever possible, and stay within the three-revert rule except in cases of clear vandalism. Explain reversions in the edit summary box. Wikiquette


 * 3. "Don't ignore questions. If another disagrees with your edit, provide good reasons why you think it's appropriate" Wikiquette


 * 4. "Concede a point, when you have no response to it; or admit when you disagree based on intuition or taste. Don't make people debate positions you don't really hold."Wikiquette


 * 5. "Be respectful to others and their points of view" Dispute resolution


 * 6. "Respect other contributors." Policies and guidelines


 * 7. Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers Please do not bite the newcomers

Vitaly 17:06, 27 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Request for arbitration
Dear Aranel,

I am requesting arbitration because you have removed my contribution to Favicon article without good reasons:


 * 1. Removal of link to useful resource which gives information which you cannot find in article.
 * 2. Removal of FAQ section. Reason: "I'm sorry, but the FAQ format is not appropriate to an encyclopedia". I was unable to find this in Wikipedia guidelines.
 * 3. Removal of Troubleshooting section. Reason: "this is not a technical support site, after all" but article gives code and instructions on adding favicon to website. And if favicon doesn't work - it is extremely useful to know possible reasons!
 * 4. You have removed my examples of favicons with your new images which are cropped and not so easy to understand as my examples was.
 * 5. Removal of link to Icon Edtitor. There is note about about icon editors in article and it's normal and useful to have link to one of the editors.

All my contributions were removed by fake reasons.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration#Current_requests_for_Arbitration

Middle-earth articles
Just wanted to give you a quick thanks for the maintenance you are doing on the various Middle-earth articles. Great work. Anárion 23:43, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)
 * You're welcome! :) (Huh, that's a relief, I was afraid my mass editing was going to get annoying.) --Aranel 23:44, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

''> Please ... use the format: "T.A. 2851". This is what Tolkien himself'' > uses in the appendices to The Lord of the Rings . ''> If you'd like to dispute that convention... ''


 * I would think 'yyyy TA' is more consistent with the use of AD, BC and CE, see Anno Domini but if JRRT used T.A. yyyy who am I to argue... 213.51.209.230 17:38, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * > (Hey, you should register an account!) --[[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 18:04, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * I did... see User_talk:Sonett72 213.51.209.230 18:22, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)

> ... I have done some research and have discovered that... --Aranel

The only research I did was to check the Anno Domini article... There you will see that it is either 'AD yyyy' or 'yyyy BC' or 'yyyy CE', all without the dots. Following that convention we should use 'yyyy TA', (like I started to do until you gave me a hint). But, again, if JRRT used 'T.A. yyyy' who am I to disagree.... as long as whatever we use, we use it in a consistent manner. That 'TA' can also mean 'Teaching Assistant is hardly relevant, just see the CE disambig page. 213.51.209.230 20:18, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)

You want to paint the Wikipedia red?
Hello, Sarah, princess. Welcome to the team! I enjoyed reading your User page. Just to give you something in your favourite colour, how about User:Aranel/Princess? If we are all careful, you'll have that red for ever. Kind regards. Robin Patterson 14:22, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)


 * how about this (you even get to choose the shade of red!): " Aranel  (Sarah) "? ;o)  – dab 15:01, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Internet security
Thanks for the note on RC patrol about Internet security. I restored the old article at Computer network security. The new how-to article could still use a lot of work, though. Wmahan. 06:22, 2004 Sep 1 (UTC)

List of rulers of Numenor
If you want to write an article ABOUT the Ruling Queens, I have no problem with that, but I would still prefer that each woman have her own article. RickK 19:08, Sep 2, 2004 (UTC)
 * I don't really understand why, since it would pretty much be duplicate information with some additonal header material, but since you feel strongly about it and I don't, I'm willing to do it your way (unless the overwhelming consensus goes otherwise, which seems unlikely considering the small number of people who have weighed in so far). --[[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 19:52, 2 Sep 2004 (UTC)

List of Neopets (Acara)
1. (I'm unsure if you're familiar with the site or not, so I'll assume you aren't for the sake of clarity) Go to Neopets and find the search bar on the bottom left. Search "Acara" and you will come up with several results. One of them is Species: Acara. Click on the link. A little window will pop up describing the species - the first sentence describes how they love to "live by the sea".

2. I'd like to add a paragraph on colors for every pet, yes, because not every pet can be painted the same colors. And not every redraw looks the same on every pet. (A Faerie Grundo is navy blue and has a starscape pattern on its wings, while a Faerie Acara is yellow and has pink wings. The Maraquan Korbat is like a manta ray, while the Maraquan Techo looks like a creature from the Black Lagoon, and so on.) It's also helpful if you're looking to see if a particular pet is neglected, or has less (or more) colors than a pet of its popularity might normally have, or any more of a multitude of things. I feel that a brief description of a pet's available colors is appropriate, and I'm willing to write it all myself. PMC 19:56, 5 Sep 2004 (UTC)

2. That's sort of what I meant. I guess I went a little overboard on the Acara, but how about basically saying how many colors a pet has, as well as naming one or two major redraws/novelties. (Pink Lenny being a flamingo, Poogles having two plushie variants, anything else of note) And then linking to Neocolours at the very bottom. PMC 23:26, 5 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Yay for consensus! ^_^ Um...nah, I don't mind updating the article once a week for new colors and stuff. It takes like two minutes, and I'll remember because I'm constantly on Neopets or Neocolours anyway. (*official geek*) PMC 23:54, 5 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Middle-earth categories
Fast work! 19:30, 6 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * You, too! (We both deserve cookies. That was good work.) --[[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 19:54, 6 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Lists of articles
Thanks for helping with the sort keys. :) --ZeroOne 17:24, 11 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Hmm. Just when I thought we tackled most of the sortkeyless articles, something like Category:Lists turns up - with 35 subcategories. Oh well. Just thought I'd let you know too in case you for some reason found it enjoyable to add the sort keys. ;) --ZeroOne 23:39, 11 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * Sounds like fun! ;) --[[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 01:50, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)


 * I wouldn't want to spoil the fun, but lists usually sort in alphabetical order if they are consistently named .. Looks better though with sort keys. Thanks. -- User:Docu


 * The problem is that the lists are not consistently named. Some are "List of articles about x", some "List of Xyzzy" and some "List of foo". That should be in the order "foo, x, Xyzzy" but is sorted "x, Xyzzy, foo" due to capital letters coming before lowercase and the word "articles" messing it all up. And it does also look better with the sort keys, yes. ;) --ZeroOne 19:36, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)

The Return of the King (movie)
Thanks for tidying my edit. Rich Farmbrough 00:40, 19 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * And that you for accepting my compulsive lurking so graciously! --[[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 00:41, 19 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Middle-earth scholarship
I like the idea, in principle. However, it is hard to draw a line between the 'mere' enjoyment of Tolkien's works and scholarly interpretation. I know I don't know when I crossed the line, if there is one. It makes sense to have a place to get an overview of scientific literature about Tolkien. I would still like to keep an overview of the linguistic publication landscape at Languages of Middle-Earth, and at least a reference to the scattered "Elfcon"-publications near Tolkien's bibliography (since it's about texts written by him, after all). I don't have an overview of all the "Middle-Earth" categories on Wikipedia. Somehow they look as if the were just heaped on top of one another. So yes, I think there should be a scholarly category, but maybe there should be a wikiproject to discuss the whole structure of Tolkien related stuff on WP (or is there one, already?) As to the name, middangeard, midgard means the world inhabited by humans, between the upper and the nether worlds. In Tolkien, Middle-Earth is the inhabitable continent between the far East and the far West. Therefore, I think "Middle Earth scholarship" would be scholarship that takes place in Middle-Earth (i.e. Pengolodh etc.); I think "Tolkien scholarship" would be preferable for what you intend, because as soon as you begin to analyse Tolkiens work, you will of course leave the fiction and try to follow the development of Tolkiens mind, both before and after the concept of Middle-Earth had become fixed or central. Of course, scrictly speaking, "Middle-Earth" is overused already ("Middle-Earth languages" would unnaturally exclude the language of Aman, and Adunaic). "Languages of Arda" are not satisfying, either, because of JRRT's insistence that Arda is Earth. "Languages invented by Tolkien" is a bit prosaic, I admit, and I understand the preference to "stay inside secondary creation" as much as possible (though many aspect of Tolkien's work cannot be discussed without resorting to their "primary creation" genesis... Briefly, I may be overly pedantic, and the Category is certainly a good idea! dab 09:02, 29 Sep 2004 (UTC)

tableloom pic
Yeah, that's my loom, I actually have a MS in textiles so you'd think I'd use it more often. :) Pschemp 00:43, 30 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Hi Aranel
I was the "number" - 200.158.192.187 - who built the genealogy of Finarfin and Fingolfin. Realy thanks for the advice you gave me about Gil-Galad. =)

Now I am Imrahil, Son of Adrahil, Prince of Dol Amroth. I found the link "create my account" few hours ago! =)

question about the Morgoth article
Aranel, or should I say Sarah?, I was wondering and I mean that in the truest sense of the word...because I clearly know nothing about Tolkien compared to many of you fellow wikipedians who are doing some of the most noble work on these articles...could you answer/comment on a couple of questions for me? 1. What would you recommend I read next? I've read the Lord of the Rings trilogy, The Hobbit, and The Silmarillion. 2. in the article, Morgoth, I was wondering, there is a point in the Characteristics section that explains that Sauron is actually more powerful than Morgoth? Is that true? It seems contradictory to the fact(that I believe I read somewhere here on wikipedia) Illuvatar's (probably wrong spelling) most powerful creation was Morgoth... Can you comment and straighten me out on these? Thanks in advance! --Jpittman 02:52, 2 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Dr. Michael M. Krop High School
Hello Aranel. I am trying to "save" the article on Dr. Michael M. Krop High School. Can you please check the article now. It has "evolved" nicely since the last time you saw it. If you can change your vote to KEEP, it will be highly appreciated.--AAAAA 20:14, 2 Oct 2004 (UTC)

posted by User:142.58.101.24 on user page
thanks 'Sarah'...now you didn't have to go all the way to revert all the changes and edits i made about 'Middle-earth', THAT PAGE DOES NOT BELONG TO YOU, i was simply trying to better what was already there, what's wrong with you?! geee i'm sorry about all this yelling...i just felt like doing that... now you may be annoyed that i just wrote on your page... actually, not only annoying but angry.... =] i apologize...and i'm sure that you'll take no time in editing this part out huh~ btw, what you wrote was not all truth...the 7 sons of Feanor did not die until late in the War of the Ring, certainly all of them have survived long enough to enjoy some peace...

and Melkor was NOT exiled...he was driven out and cast into the void....

the straight road was not 'impassable by all but the elves..' it was clearly written in the Silmarillion that SOME mortals did find the way to Valinor and looked upon the Light of the Undying Land then died.'

not only were the Elves to return to the west, all the rings of power ended as well. BUT THE TRUTH WAS NOT FORGOTTEN, as long as their kingdoms shall last...

k this ends my lil shout-out...again i apologize, but it's really annoying when i corrected a few details and improve some of the wording then you IMMEDIATELY undid almost everything...

gee so much for a Tolkien fan....

btw, my name is Mike, in case if you want to shout back at me...i'll create a user name today...and i'll let you know
 * I replied to this at Mike's talk page. [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 23:13, 6 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Hellenic scripts


Signature idea
Hey, I read your thing about your signature, and how you like red. Here's another possibility:

If you put Aranel in your signature preference you'll get
 * Aranel

note that f00 is a bright red, you can change that to any 3 or 6 digit color, of course. Some other nice reds are #c03 and #903. Hope you find that useful (: &mdash; siro  &chi;  o  23:17, Oct 10, 2004 (UTC)
 * Thanks! I actually kind of like my current signature. (It's a clever&mdash;well, okay, sort of vaguely clever&mdash;reference to the tendency of Tolkien articles to link to every little thing and to follow every word with an English translation in parentheses.) Although I do have to admit that the notion of making it look like my user page is non-existent (and therefore linked in red) is rather appealing for purposes of my own entertainment. [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 23:21, 10 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Category:Passic County, New Jersey
Good job with the Passaic County category... except, you spelled Passaic wrong. Darkcore 03:59, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * I actually didn't start the spelling wrong&mdash;that's the category that several of those articles were already in. We'll have to fix that. [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 11:49, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC)

creating category page
I saw that you created the Category:Vancouver, Washington page that I had been trying to create. Could you please let me know how that is done, I need to create several of these pages. Thanks Cacophony 15:52, 14 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Video game music
If you can wikify the video game music list that would be very good. I've responded in the talk page, tell me what columns titles we need and which we do not and then we can get to work. I also have the database in CSV format if you need a copy.

It is my hope we can cover all video game music. I've also worked on the List of Number 1 Hits (USA), i.e. Hot_100_No._1_Hits_of_1960 to have an example of what it should look like in the end. --ShaunMacPherson 20:42, 15 Oct 2004 (UTC)


 * I've done a little work and List of video game music A is what the new database looks like, what do you think? --ShaunMacPherson 21:12, 15 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Oct 2 orphaned categories essentially finished
Just thought I'd say hi. I think we've been the primary folks fixing category orphans. The Oct 2 clump is essentially done. Have you talked with user:beland about the new format for listing orphans? I haven't done much using the new format. Looks like it might be helpful, but it's sooo verbose I think it might be harder to feel like progress is being made. In any event, happy categorizing! -- Rick Block 04:25, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)

birth/death by year categories
Hi Sarah - I noticed you're adding some birth/death by year categories. I recently suggested to user:docu that we start using a template for these categories, see user talk:d6. Docu's created a template, template:birthyr, which you reference like this, where year is the year number (e.g. 1582) and decade is the decade (e.g. 1580). I believe Docu intends to run a bot to create these categories, but I don't know if he/she intends to edit already created categories. There's a deathyr template as well, template:deathyr, with slightly different usage (e.g. for category:1582 deaths). Before instituting massive use of these templates we should agree on the referencing syntax (and birthyr and deathyr should clearly have the SAME syntax). I think it would be possible to create similar templates for the birth/death by decade categories as well. -- Rick Block 19:43, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * Looks good to me! Much easier that way. [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 20:13, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Magic Collaboration of the Week
Thanks for your nomination of List of magic tricks. By all means submit as much of them as you can. I'll try and sort out whether there's copyright issues with them. :) I've also nominated Magic Circle. [[User:MacGyverMagic|Mgm|(talk)]] 09:46, Oct 21, 2004 (UTC)

Hi Sarah!

Why have you removed link to CATCount - useful freeware program for translators: results of several months of coding in 3 seconds after it has been added? Is that was enough time to estimate its usability to users? Are you a translator yourself?
 * See Talk:Translation. [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 03:16, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Talk:translation
I've been trying to comprehend the mess that Talk:translation, Talk:favicon, and User_talk:Vitaly have become. Vitaly's request for arbitration was rejected by arbcom. You can request arbitration against Vitaly if you desire; it's probably the best place to turn, as arbcom decisions are binding and enforced. But I don't know if you'll be accepted. As I see it you have done everything required to ask for an arbitration; you talked to Vitaly, you brought in 3rd parties with the RfC. But I'm not an arbitrator, so I don't know. You could try requesting medaition, but this isn't an edit war - it's more of a personal disagreement and seems to be more arbitration-worthy. Read through Dispute resolution for more info.

However, your actions on Favicon weren't nearly perfect; when you removed the now-contentious Troubleshooting section, you masked it with a different edit summary for other edits you did. You should watch that in the future; use longer summaries or split up the edit into two steps, summarizing both.

I hope this helps; if you have any questions or need help with mediation or arbitration, I'll do what I can - but I'm trying not to take sides. Cheers, Whosyourjudas (talk) 03:47, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * Sorry if it appeared I was accusing you of a cover-up; I was just trying to point out that arb or mediation could get messy. If you don't want to have a side, then just step out now; leave the articles as they are and walk away.  But if you feel strongly about the talk: messages then WP:DR is what you should do.  I think the issue may be past simple discussion - if you want anything you'll have to go to DR. Whosyourjudas (talk) 04:03, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Adminship
I have nominated you for adminship. If interested, please accept at Requests for adminship/Aranel. Taco Deposit | Talk-o Deposit 15:05, Oct 28, 2004 (UTC)

Eru Ilúvatar
Thank you. Maybe you want to put in a word for some of the things removed by User:Steuard a few hours later? (Several changes, notably removals: speculation about speaking animals, weak Narnia parallel, unenlightening Bombadil non-connection) I think none of them deserved removal, but the article would have needed rearrangement to accommodate the material comfortably. I can think of no more appropriate place to treat the ideas of Creation in Tolkien, and the "Tom Bombadil is God" idea keeps popping up, so it's useful to have Tolkien's answer to that. dab 09:17, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Bon chance
Good luck with the admin nomination. I'm sorry that I had to vote Neutral, but I wanted to assure you that it was not due to your work on the project at all, but simply a matter of timing. Keep up the good work. (Just reading Return of the King for the first time since I was 15, and it's an entirely different book when you've studied Medieval stuff, and particularly Anglo-Saxon. Fascinating to me that the heavily Anglo-Saxon code didn't alienate me when I was a lad.)  Geogre 03:06, 30 Oct 2004 (UTC)