User talk:AtheneanArtist

St Benedict's School

I note that you have now added a source for your recent additions. However, that does not address the problem to which I alluded in my deletion note that the additions are generally (a) not noteworthy and (b) use inappropriate language. For example, observing that a school arranges trips to enable pupils to broaden their knowledge is otiose; it's what all schools do and is not a differentiating factor for this school; you might as well say that they teach Maths! Words such as "worthwhile" and "effective" are fundamentally inappropriate as they express a judgement on the activities described and therefore contravene the Neutral Viewpoint Principle. What anyway is an "effective travel plan"? The only addition in this section that could arguably be retained is the bit about tree planting in Central America, although this too needs to be rewritten to deal with the "Healthy Planet" reference which seems to imply this is something with which the reader should be familiar.

Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a marketing brochure! --The Sage of Stamford (talk) 22:58, 15 November 2011 (UTC)


 * If you have a question, concern or comment related to improving an article put a note in the article's talk page. You do that by clicking the "discussion" tab at the top of the page. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Tutorial/Talk_pages


 * I know you are very adept on the highways and byways of Wikiland. I would prefer to discuss any of your concerns in the way indicated above so all users can access the Talk. Marketing brochure? No. Not interested in marketing, anything. Very keen on communication. Communication of material relating to the character of a school is relevant to an article about a school, since I would suggest this information ranks as high, arguably higher, than tweaks to history etc., . On a separate point, I notice it is a very long time since you have made any significant contributions to this article. Is it likely that you might do so soon, if so I for one would welcome it since it is apparent you are:
 * knowledgeable about the School
 * an erudite and capable editor


 * or are you of the view that none is needed/ you cannot identify area in which a contribution, welcome I am sure by all, from you could be made to all Wiki Users benefit? Best
 * --AtheneanArtist (talk)


 * It is actually quite customary to raise concerns about an edit on the relative privacy of a user's own talk page rather than on the actual article page, particularly where the instinctive reaction is just to delete the edit in its entirety! The normal custom in reply is then to put a notice on the other user's page so that they see it when logging on; I wouldn't normally turn to your user page! The problem with "character" is that it's judgemental rather than factual, so one needs to recite the facts so that they speak for themselves. Words such as "worthwhile" and "effective" are inherently promotional - I for example might not agree that something is "worthwhile". I think your discovery re the tree planting is potentially interesting and a point worth developing. I'm afraid that my views on school trips and charity fund raising days are unchanged - they say nothing whatever of use in terms of character or otherwise; very few schools would not claim these. Yes, I'm reasonably expert on the school (you will see from my user page that I'm an OP - 1974-81 vintage) and have read both Watson & Kollar from cover to cover and agree that much more needs to be done on the history - the current article is far too focussed on the present at the expense of the whole sweep of time - I'm forever having to weed out the latest piece of ephemeral trivia about events on the rugby field! I'm afraid my professional life over the past year has left all too little time for Wikipedia generally, but this article remains on my radar. Meantime, I notice you have added a whole lot more stuff which I object to for the same reasons as above. You can't use terms such as "awe inspiring", "happily participate" (what, all of the pupils? Don't believe it!) "respectful and prayerful", "excellent role model" etc. The same sort of message was being pumped out 30 years ago in official communications, yet the truth was that by the time of the 6th form, at least 75% of pupils sat stonily through mass, refusing to engage in any of the responses or sing and certainly declined to go to communion; given general trends in society since then, this situation won't have improved which would fundamentally undermine much of the stuff you have written in the this section. This reads entirely like a marketing brochure - it's what the Headmaster would no doubt like you to believe but it is not dispassionate and objective fact. It is opinion, even if it is the opinion of the Inspectorate. As this is your section, I'm happy to give you the first chance to edit this into something which meets the tests for inclusion in Wikipedia.....failing which I will get out my electronic scalpel to put it into a better shape! Regards, --The Sage of Stamford (talk) 21:00, 16 November 2011 (UTC)