User talk:BDD/Archive 5

Nomination of Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting conspiracy theories for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting conspiracy theories is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting conspiracy theories until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. p b  p  02:14, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Miami cannibal attack
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DYK nomination of Put Your Hand Inside the Puppet Head
Hello! Your submission of Put Your Hand Inside the Puppet Head at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! BlueMoonset (talk) 03:55, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Dar es Salaam
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Move discussion closing?
Hey there BDD. Currently a move is being discussed for Shark Island Extermination Camp and it looks to have reached a weak consensus to move the page - at least to me it does, anyway - and it's now 11 days since it was re-listed. Can you/another admin take a look at it to see if it really has reached consensus and can be moved? FOARP (talk) 16:47, 27 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not actually an admin, and the discussion looks too close for me to feel comfortable performing a non-admin close. You may want to post at WP:ANRFC to alert multiple admins of the situation. Good luck, BDD (talk) 18:56, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Discussion on the AFT5 Request for Comment
Hey - this is to notify you that there is a discussion starting on the Article Feedback RfC talkpage that has ramifications for the RfC itself. Your input is much appreciated :). Thanks! and apologies if I've missed anyone Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 16:35, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Jaguar Cars
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Deletion sorting
Hi there, I noticed you delsorted this deletion discussion under People. Where a person is listed under Politicians, Actor etc. it is unnecessary to list under People as it just swamps that generic delsort. For example a Soldier would be listed under People & Military whereas a Track & Field athlete would be listed under Sportspeople. Therefore I have crossed out/struck the people delsort as it was unnecessary & removed it from here. Regards &#9733;&#9734; DUCK IS JAMMMY &#9734;&#9733; 03:29, 30 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Good catch. I must've been running on mental autopilot. --BDD (talk) 06:22, 30 January 2013 (UTC)
 * No worries, I made a few sleep deprived slip ups with the new script, I accidentally sorted the article rather then the AfD. &#9733;&#9734; DUCK IS JAMMMY &#9734;&#9733; 06:27, 30 January 2013 (UTC)

Jermaine Jenas
Would a citation suffice? Yours etc. 87.232.1.48 (talk) 23:55, 31 January 2013 (UTC)me
 * The problem isn't with the information about his (loan) transfer to QPR. That's true enough, and someone will supply a citation. "January 3st," ok, probably just a typo. But the fake Redknapp quote? That's what I'm calling out as vandalism. I even searched for it, because sure, I can imagine Harry saying something like that. --BDD (talk) 23:58, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Touché. I was misinformed. All the best, 87.232.1.48 (talk) 00:05, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

Talk:River Lee (Ireland)
As an active editor for WP:RM, I welcome your comments on: Talk:River Lee (Ireland), thanks. Tiggerjay (talk) 07:59, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of List of breweries in South Carolina


The article List of breweries in South Carolina has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * This is not an index to Wikipedia articles, as none of the organisations listed have an article. Most or all can be assumed to fail the relevant notability guideline WP:ORG. Delete per WP:NOTDIR and WP:EL.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. – Fayenatic  L ondon 16:59, 4 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I didn't create the article or anything, but I've overhauled it in response to your concerns. In particular, I've removed all the external links to individual breweries. If you still feel it runs afoul of WP:NOTDIR, you're welcome to take it to AfD, but keep in mind WP:NLISTITEM. --BDD (talk) 17:20, 4 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the latter link -- that's helpful. And well done with the overhaul; as the whole list is cited to an external source, which I assume is reliable, I have no further problem with the page. – Fayenatic  L ondon 17:29, 4 February 2013 (UTC)
 * If you fancy doing any more, you could work your way round the states. I don't know if they all have lists. I added a link to the same source at List of breweries in Nevada but didn't tidy up. – Fayenatic  L ondon 18:10, 4 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, cleaning up that series is sort of on my long-term to-do list. But these prods (pun?) to action can be helpful. Personally, I think beer topics are one area where Wikipedia is surprisingly weak on coverage. --BDD (talk) 18:15, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Presidency of Barack Obama
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Talkback
Camyoung54  talk  21:49, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Jack Ryan move
Your comments would be appreciated at User talk:Malik Shabazz. --Izno (talk) 05:30, 6 February 2013 (UTC)

Matt Ridley page moves
Hi,

You recently closed discussion and implemented the move from Matthew White Ridley, 5th Viscount Ridley to Matt Ridley, which seems sensible to me. But now User:Rrius has just moved the page again (without discussion) to Matt Ridley, 5th Viscount Ridley, which seems a very odd choice of name. My instinct is just to move it back, but I would value your thoughts. Regards, Jonathan A Jones (talk) 16:34, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for letting me know. You're right; moving back is appropriate here, and I've already done it. I'm sure the move was made in good faith, but it shouldn't've been made undiscussed. --BDD (talk) 16:59, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

Many thanks. Jonathan A Jones (talk) 17:02, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

Demon Fuzz
You tagged Demon Fuzz with "condense." I've changed it accordingly; please take another look and delete the tag if this is resolved. 24.24.214.15 (talk) 00:09, 9 February 2013 (UTC)
 * That does look better! Thanks. --BDD (talk) 06:39, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Syrian civil war
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Suggestions please
Hi there. I see that you have put a "globalize" tag on the blizzard article. Please suggest some sources for global information. Thanks! Gandydancer (talk) 01:51, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
 * ✅ See Talk:Blizzard. --BDD (talk) 18:06, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
 * You state on the talk page, "Realistically, there are some regions of the world that just won't experience blizzards, but we can do better." and list a bunch of sources that you googled. Please read the article more closely and be aware that weather channel information is not appropriate for the Blizzard article.  Gandydancer (talk) 21:48, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the help. Gandydancer (talk) 04:25, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Notification of discussion
A few months ago, you participated in a discussion on Wikipedia talk:Did you know about Gibraltar-related DYKs on the Main Page. I am proposing that the temporary restrictions on such DYKs, which were imposed in September 2012, should be lifted and have set out a case for doing so at Wikipedia talk:Did you know/Gibraltar-related DYKs. If you have a view on this, please comment at that page. Prioryman (talk) 22:01, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

WP:SONGCOVER
Hi BDD. You asked about WP:SONGCOVER here. I looked more into it and posted this. -- Uzma Gamal (talk) 08:57, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

Aviation in the New York metro area move
Thank you for carrying out the move of the Aviation in the New York metropolitan area article. As I noted in the original move request, and was noted by others supporting the move, the edit history now suffers from an improper cut-and-paste move as part of a claimed merger for a dodge to get around a previous move. I wonder if you might be able to do a hist merge if its not to much trouble. oknazevad (talk) 20:05, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I can put in a request for an admin to do that. Where was it improperly moved to? Was it List of airports in the New York City area? That was the only other mentioned title I saw with significant history. --BDD (talk) 20:20, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I had originally moved it to Airports in the New York Metropolitan Area, following my interpretation of the merge decision at the AFD. The article has been tagged as needing attention, so someone will get to it. oknazevad (talk) 04:58, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Looks like Anthony Appleyard is on top of things. --BDD (talk) 15:57, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

notification of current state of work title capitalization rules discussion over at WT:MoS
Hi. As you're one of those folks who contributed to the work title capitalization rules discussion over at WT:MoS but then seemed to tune out (and therefore – as opposed to the "MoS regulars" – probably didn't follow it any further), I just briefly wanted to point you towards my latest post there (beginning with "As there has been little progress"), which might well be the last overall: I'm phasing out, and since there hasn't been much input by other users lately, it's likely that over the next few days, the thread'll die (i.e., disappear into the archives) without there having been made any changes to the MoS. So I'd be much obliged if you took the time to stake your support for or opposition to my proposal (should I also have put an RfC tag there?) and – unless it's accepted (I'm not holding my breath...) – maybe even considered keeping the debate going. Thanks. (I'm aware of the unsolicited nature of this message, so if you feel molested by it, I apologize.) – ὁ οἶστρος (talk) 14:25, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I think I said this at the very beginning of that discussion, but we need an RfC. The only thing that has kept me from proposing one is uncertainty about the new wording. If it were up to me, I'd strike "prepositions and coordinating conjunctions shorter than five letters" and replace it with "words shorter than four letters." I think this would avoid most of these awkward cases where our usage diverges from most other sources, and it would be much simpler than asking editors to identify constructs like coordinating conjunctions. This is difficult enough for native English speakers, and it's just another stumbling block for the non-native speakers we should be welcoming and encouraging. What do you think? --BDD (talk) 16:13, 15 February 2013 (UTC)


 * I agree that overcomplicating things is always a danger, running the risk of deterring new users, but I think going with [prep] prop 2 – thereby identifying the few words not to capitalize – (and keeping the exceptions regarding phrasal verbs and stuff) wouldn't be more confusing than any "shorter than x letters" rules. Further and specifically, a "shorter than four letters" rule leads to, for example, renderings such as


 * The Englishman Who Went up a Hill But Came Down a Mountain,
 * It Came From Outer Space or
 * From Russia With Love,


 * all contrary to "default" / common / widespread (and often [semi-]official) usage. – ὁ οἶστρος (talk) 16:42, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Sure. I'd support that over the status quo. But that still leaves the problem of how to proceed. We could use my proposal, we could use yours, or we could present options. The main reason I don't want to present options is that that seems to muddle discussion. In recent RFCs regarding USPLACE and Ireland naming issues, those supporting the status quo had one clear option to argue, while proponents of change were split among several other options. If a reform fails in a straight yes-or-no vote, fine, I can live with that, but I don't want to see it derailed on procedural grounds. So where does that leave us? If you want to be bold and start an RfC with your proposal, go ahead. I'll give my support. The reason I think my proposal might be more successful is its simplicity—if you try to prescribe a list of words, editors may bicker over individual words' inclusion. And if any RfC fails, a second is unlikely to be successful soon after. --BDD (talk) 17:29, 15 February 2013 (UTC)


 * I'd prefer my proposal over yours because I think it's actually more stable, less prone to bickering. Sure, the next Trek film's title might not include ... from ... or ... with ..., but there's still a ton of titles that would become "out-of-sync" with a "shorter than four letters" rule, in my view unavoidably leading to even more strife. It's cool that you'd give your support to what I suggest, I really appreciate that (somehow, one doesn't seem to often encounter encouragement on Wikipedia...), but I wouldn't even know how to initiate an RfC. Do you think I could just add some tag, so people could vote below my last post there? (where I bolded recommend) And frankly, after thinking and writing quite a lot about the subject recently, without being met with too much of a response and not finding a good style guide source for what looks to me to be the most established way of capitalizing work titles, I've grown frustrated and was kinda hoping I could pass on the torch to someone else and bow out. – ὁ οἶστρος (talk) 18:17, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I could do that. Does the list of words not to capitalize already exist somewhere? --BDD (talk) 18:59, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Hey, that would be great! – but be aware that you might incur a curse by doing that...
 * "Does the list of words not to capitalize already exist somewhere?" (BDD) – IMDb has a list here (also, that link's already mentioned in the discussion; you'll find it if you do a Ctrl+f search with "Getting Started > Submission Guides > Title Formats"). However, they don't state where they themselves adopted that style from (it certainly is a lot older than that website, though – and obviously much more widespread and not limited to film titles). – ὁ οἶστρος (talk) 19:40, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Ok, I could propose that. But IMDB gets sort of a bad rap around here. If we could point to any other reliable sources that use the same convention, that could be a big help. --BDD (talk) 20:32, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * In the discussion, I list some on- and offline publishing organs that use it. I don't know, methinks most people already agree it's the de-facto standard out there. If that is contended, maybe one could do something like taking ten work titles examples for every word in question and check each for their capitalization in the same one hundred respected, authoritative sources. But that would be quite some [and maybe futile] work. (By the way, I've gotten one support over at WT:MoS. Yay!) – ὁ οἶστρος (talk) 09:09, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:World financial capital
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HMS Staunch
Hi Bdd, Please move the article HMS Staunch back to HMS Staunch (1804). There were three HMS Staunches in the Royal Navy in the 19th Century, and possibly others in the 20th too. That there are currently no articles on these other Staunches or no disambiguation page for HMS Staunch does not justify your move. Your move just means that you are making unnecessary work for someone else, and perhaps creating a misleading implication. I am sure there are many other articles on naval vessels without a disambiguation page yet (e.g., HMS Grecian); that does not mean that the first article on one of these vessels should be titled HMS Grecian. Regards, Acad Ronin (talk) 19:36, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Is there an existing policy or guideline that ships should be pre-disambiguated? If so, I'll probably move it back. While some editors favor pre-disambiguation, we generally disambiguate only when necessary. If this is just a difference in opinion, RM would be the right forum for this. --BDD (talk) 19:39, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Ok, I see you've made a dab page. This doesn't change the fact, however, that we only have one article on a ship by that name. The current dab would qualify for G6 speedy deletion. But if you could make a stub out of one of the others, the whole issue could be resolved. --BDD (talk) 23:36, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi BDD, Wasn't me that made the DAB page, but my thanks to whoever did so. However, I find bizarre the notion that we should throw away information that other people have gathered. Even if there is currently only one blue link on the DAB page, and the rest are red, why would you want to throw that information away too? Surely providing information should have a higher priority than aesthetics. Someone looking for HMS Staunch might find it useful to know that there were several, even if all but one have no article at this time. Perhaps it might help the searcher pin down which one their grandfather served on and that it was a destroyer, and even better, perhaps to prepare an article. Also, I don't much care to be told that I need to write an article, even if only a stub, to prevent a page being what I would consider vandalized. This strikes me as as close to a form of extortion. "Nice little article you have there. It would be a shame if something happened to it." Regards, Acad Ronin (talk) 00:22, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not trying to intimidate you or anything. If I had just come across that dab, I probably would've nominated it for speedy deletion. A dab that doesn't provide access to more than one article may be useful, but it still meets the criteria for speedy deletion. I'm not telling you you need to write an article, but I do want to let you know that the next time an uninvolved editor trying to apply policy to these pages comes along, you may find yourself complaining to him or her. So you might want to save yourself the trouble. I won't pursue the issue further. --BDD (talk) 00:26, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I reverted the move of the article, and created the ship list page. It is a WP:SETINDEX article, and not a dab page, and thus would not qualify under G6. ("A set index article is not a disambiguation page"). Pages like this are useful and in keeping with policy, just in case you come across instances like this again. Benea (talk) 08:35, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Ok, sorry for the trouble. --BDD (talk) 16:03, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Learn something new every day. Thanks Benea.Acad Ronin (talk) 16:12, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Coimbatore Airport
Hi. Since you are an administrator and the discussion for the page move is closed. I think that the page should be moved to "Coimbatore International Airport". I tried to move the page myself but it did not give me permission to. Thanks! Snoozlepet (talk) 00:33, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Hang tight. I'm not an administrator—in the RM, I was just an uninvolved editor who closed discussion where consensus was clear. Per the instructions for non-admin closures of RMs, I've tagged Coimbatore International Airport for speedy deletion so Coimbatore Airport can be moved there. I or the deleting admin will follow through and perform any necessary cleanup after the move. It's not too lengthy a process; it should be completed within 12 hours or so. --BDD (talk) 00:38, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Speedy deletion converted to PROD: Red lantern
Hello BDD. I am just letting you know that I have converted the speedy deletion tag that you placed on Red lantern to a proposed deletion tag, because I do not believe CSD applies to the page in question. Thank you. JohnCD (talk) 18:05, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Out of curiosity, where do you see an assertion of notability there? --BDD (talk) 18:06, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't, but WP:CSD does not apply to books: "This criterion applies only to articles about web content and to articles about people, organizations, and individual animals themselves, not to articles about their books, albums, software, or other creative works." JohnCD (talk) 18:10, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I was under the impression that it was a webcomic, but I see your point. --BDD (talk) 18:14, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I did think of that, but the article said that while most of it was available at the website there were some "pages withheld to encourage the sales of the hardcopy." Cheers, JohnCD (talk) 18:47, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks!, I missed that. JohnCD (talk) 20:47, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/2013 RfC/2
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Disambiguation link notification for February 27
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DYK for Mission (olive)
— Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:03, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Move
I noticed that the only current RM that has been relisted more than once is Dennis and Gnasher → Dennis the Menace and Gnasher, but it has no responses, other than an unrelated comment about updating the logo. Per closing instructions there is no minimum response, and if there is no response, the RM is always closed, move if it conforms to guidelines, and no move if it does not. I know that the editor who relisted it the second time was unaware of this closing instruction... By the way, we are making excellent progress in whittling down the backlog, and I am sure that you are responsible for much of this and deserve a barnstar for your efforts... Apteva (talk) 18:46, 28 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, I can't take too much credit. I close one or two from the backlog a day where appropriate, and I try to get RMs "expiring" that day to prevent the backlog from expanding further. It seems more administrators are paying attention to RM. Miniapolis is a new administrator who has helped in this regard, and is better deserving of a barnstar than I am.
 * The documentation you pointed out to Tyrol5 ought to be better publicized. It's tempting to treat an empty RM as we would an empty AfD, but ultimately we still have the nominator in support, and it's fair to treat the request as a technical one. I wish RMs just attracted the levels of participation that AfD does, but until then, we work with what we have. --BDD (talk) 18:51, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ships
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Talkback message from Tito Dutta
Tito Dutta (contact) 01:19, 3 March 2013 (UTC)

MT Carney
No worries, but then I will add the website as the ref footnote for that statement. It shouldn't really be unsupported. Cheers. In ictu oculi (talk) 17:57, 4 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Mmm, maybe not, the website doesn't really look WP:RS for such a statement either, better perhaps to just leave it unsourced. Hey ho. Thanks for the note. In ictu oculi (talk) 18:01, 4 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I wasn't going to stop you, the main page of an official website used as a reference is only slightly better than using another Wikipedia article as a reference. I'm all for proper sourcing, especially for BLPs, but I think WP:COMMONSENSE dictates that readers don't need their hands held every step of the way. --BDD (talk) 18:03, 4 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Well maybe one day there'll be a newspaper interview and someone will ask her about it. Then there'll be a source. So agree with you. In ictu oculi (talk) 18:09, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Talkback message from Tito Dutta
Tito Dutta (contact) 18:28, 4 March 2013 (UTC)
 * And one more! --Tito Dutta (contact) 21:41, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

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Alfons Much closure
Just letting you know that I fixed the formatting of the close (had to remove the collapse top and collapse bottom to do it), and therefore removed your comment about not being able to figure out how to format the close properly. Hope you don't mind. See here for details. ··· 日本穣 ? · 投稿  · Talk to Nihonjoe ·  Join WP Japan ! 19:22, 4 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks! I didn't want to have to reformat the discussion, but I suppose it was necessary. --BDD (talk) 20:32, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Water fluoridation
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