User talk:BobKilcoyne/Archive

Mark as epitome of Matthew
Hi Bob. Perkins (the first of the two works cited at the end of the sentence) says Mark was traditionally thought to be an epitome of Matthew (Perkins p.57). Generally speaking I'm not in favour of using ancient sources as they're close to being primary sources, and in any case the point being made in the article is not what Augustine thought or believed but what was believed for many centuries - for that idea we need Perkins. Still, if you really want that source, I won't delete again if you reinsert it. PiCo (talk) 07:51, 13 June 2017 (UTC)

On Shobab
Hey Bob,

I saw your addition of "Shobab" over at the List of minor biblical figures. When you say the mother of Shobab was unknown, is that out of some kind of concern over the authenticity of the claim in 1 Chronicles 3:5, which identifies his mother as "Bathshua"? I know there's some people who have a fairly low opinion of Chronicles' historical accuracy, but I'd like to have some kind of reference to it in the list. I thought I'd run it past you first and see if you have any suggested wording I should go with, or whether I should just stick it in. Alephb (talk) 07:37, 11 July 2017 (UTC)


 * Thanks, you are quite right to raise this - I had focused on the 2 Samuel text, please see my amendment. BobKilcoyne (talk) 05:42, 12 July 2017 (UTC)

Abimelech (Judges)
Hello, I have reverted some of your most recent edits on Abimelech (Judges). My reason is the excessive use of religious texts as a source. Though it wasn't entirely you, you have a common practice of using the Bible as a source which is fine, but too much and editors and readers will question the reliability and neutrality of the content associated with the source via WP:V, WP:OR, and WP:NPOV. If you had added biblical verses as your primary source years ago, it would have been accepted as the norm. for sourcing biblical related topics and content. However, over the years, editors have been implementing their own personal research through this style of sourcing, which has caused so many disputes and blocks to the point where the Wikipedia community had to update the policies and guidelines in more detail. Im not trying to discourage you from editing, I'm trying to keep you from doing something that could get you into trouble. Here is policy dealing with Islamic related articles: WP:MOSISLAM and a nutshell dealing with religious sourcing overall: WP:Reliable_source_examples#Religious_sources. (This message has or will be sent to another editor also.) Happy editing and Cheers! — 04:36, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

Jeroboam's feast
Thanks for referring to that. Obviously, as a practicing Jew, I can hardly condone that (or much of anything else the man did). But as we scramble around in the five days after Yom Kippur getting ready for Sukkot, we can really appreciate the idea of having an extra month to prepare! StevenJ81 (talk) 12:44, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Ichthus: May 2018


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Last month's auspicious relaunch of our newsletter precipitated something of an uproar in the Wikipedia community. What started as a localized edit war over censorship spilled over onto the Administrator's Noticeboard finally ending up at Wikipedia's supreme judicial body ArbCom. Their ruling resulted in the admonishment of administrator for his involvement in the dispute. The story was reported by Wikipedia's venerable flagship newspaper The Signpost.

The question of whether to delete all portals--including the 27 Christianity-related portals--was put to the Wikipedia community. Approximately 400 editors have participated in the protracted discussion. Going by !votes, Oppose deletion has a distinct majority. The original Christianity Portal was created on November 5, 2005 by and the following year he successfully nominated the portal for Featured Portal. has revived WikiProject Portals with hopes of revitalizing Wikipedia's system of 1,515 portals.

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Achievements

Four articles in the Project were promoted to GA: Edict of Torda nom. by, Jim Bakker nom. by, Ralph Abernathy nom. by and Psalm 84 nom. by. The Psalm ends with "O Lord of hosts, blessed is the man that trusteth in thee." Words to live by. Please support our members and send some WikiLove to the nominators!

Featured article Nominated by Operation Auca was an attempt by five Evangelical Christian missionaries from the United States to make contact with the Huaorani people of the rainforest of Ecuador. The Huaorani, also known as the Aucas, were an isolated tribe known for their violence, both against their own people and outsiders who entered their territory. With the intention of being the first Protestants to evangelize the Huaorani, the missionaries began making regular flights over Huaorani settlements in September 1955, dropping gifts. After several months of exchanging gifts, on January 2, 1956, the missionaries established a camp at "Palm Beach", a sandbar along the Curaray River, a few miles from Huaorani settlements. Their efforts culminated on January 8, 1956, when all five&mdash;Jim Elliot, Nate Saint, Ed McCully, Peter Fleming, and Roger Youderian&mdash;were attacked and speared by a group of Huaorani warriors. The news of their deaths was broadcast around the world, and Life magazine covered the event with a photo essay. The deaths of the men galvanized the missionary effort in the United States, sparking an outpouring of funding for evangelization efforts around the world. Their work is still frequently remembered in evangelical publications, and in 2006, was the subject of the film production End of the Spear. (more...)

Did You Know Nominated by

"... that, shortly after being sentenced to death for treason, Ioan C. Filitti became manager of the National Theatre Bucharest?"

- Ichthus is published by WikiProject Christianity &bull; Get answers to questions about Christianity here Discuss any of the above stories here &bull; For submissions contact the Newsroom&bull; Unsubscribe here Delivered: 19:15, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

Ichthus June 2018


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Here are discussions relevant to the Project:
 * Liberty University has an RFC regarding the university's relationship with President Trump; see discussion
 * Is Genesis History? has an RFC regarding acceptability of movie reviews for inclusion; see discussion
 * United States pro-life movement has a requested move to United States anti-abortion movement; see discussion

The following articles need reviewers for GA-class: Type of Constans nom. by, Tian Feng (magazine) nom. by. Your assistance is greatly appreciated.

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... that in 1636, Phineas Hodson, Chancellor of York Minster, lost his 38-year-old wife Jane during the birth of the couple's 24th child?

Featured article Nominated by The Mortara case was a controversy precipitated by the Papal States' seizure of Edgardo Mortara, a six-year-old Jewish child, from his family in Bologna, Italy, in 1858. The city's inquisitor, Father Pier Feletti, heard from a servant that she had administered emergency baptism to the boy when he fell sick as an infant, and the Supreme Sacred Congregation of the Roman and Universal Inquisition held that this made the child irrevocably a Catholic. Because the Papal States had forbidden the raising of Christians by members of other faiths, it was ordered that he be taken from his family and brought up by the Church. After visits from the child's father, international protests mounted, but Pope Pius IX would not be moved. The boy grew up as a Catholic with the Pope as a substitute father, trained for the priesthood in Rome until 1870, and was ordained in France three years later. In 1870 the Kingdom of Italy captured Rome during the unification of Italy, ending the pontifical state; opposition across Italy, Europe and the United States over Mortara's treatment may have contributed to its downfall.

- Ichthus is published by WikiProject Christianity &bull; Get answers to questions about Christianity here Discuss any of the above stories here &bull; For submissions contact the Newsroom &bull; Unsubscribe here Delivered: 11:58, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

Trade Remedies Authority moved to draftspace
An article you recently created, Trade Remedies Authority, does not have enough sources and citations as written to remain published. Given that it is still a proposed department it might be too soon for there to be an article. It needs more citations from reliable, independent sources. (?) Information that can't be referenced should be removed (verifiability is of central importance on Wikipedia). I've moved your draft to draftspace (with a prefix of " " before the article title) where you can incubate the article with minimal disruption. When you feel the article meets Wikipedia's general notability guideline and thus is ready for mainspace, please follow the confirms on the Articles for Creation template atop the page. Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 00:36, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

Ichthus: July 2018


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The big news was the marriage of Prince Harry and Meghan Markle. The Top 7 most popular articles in WikiProject Christianity were:  
 * 1) Elizabeth I of England – legendary monarch who ushered in the Elizabethan Era over the dead body of her half-sister (#5)
 * 2) Henry VIII of England – on his deathbed the last words of the king who founded the English Reformation were "Monks! Monks! Monks!"
 * 3) Martin Luther King Jr. – can't wait to see the new US$5 bill featuring the "I Have a Dream" speech
 * 4) Seven deadly sins – surprisingly "original research" is not one of the Seven deadly sins
 * 5) Mary, Queen of Scots – arrested for Reigning While Catholic (RWC)
 * 6) Michael Curry (bishop) – our article says that he upstaged Meghan at her wedding. Did you see her wedding pictures? All I can say is
 * 7) Robert F. Kennedy – when informed that missiles were being installed in Cuba he famously quipped, "Can they hit Oxford, Mississippi?"

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... that the little-known 1758 Methodist hymn "Sun of Unclouded Righteousness" asks God to send the doctrine of the "Unitarian fiend ... back to hell", referring to both Islam and Unitarianism?

Our newest Featured list Nominated by List of dates predicted for apocalyptic events. Predictions of apocalyptic events that would result in the extinction of humanity, a collapse of civilization, or the destruction of the planet have been made since at least the beginning of the Christian Era. Most predictions are related to Abrahamic religions, often standing for or similar to the eschatological events described in their scriptures. Christian predictions typically refer to events like the Rapture, Great Tribulation, Last Judgment, and the Second Coming of Christ.

Polls conducted in 2012 across 20 countries found over 14% of people believe the world will end in their lifetime, with percentages raging from 6% of people in France to 22% in the US and Turkey. In the UK in 2015, the general public believed the likeliest cause would be nuclear war, while experts thought it would be artificial intelligence. Between one and three percent of people from both countries thought the apocalypse would be caused by zombies or alien invasion. (more...)

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- Ichthus is published by WikiProject Christianity &bull; Get answers to questions about Christianity here Discuss any of the above stories here &bull; For submissions contact the Newsroom &bull; Unsubscribe here Delivered: 06:39, 3 July 2018 (UTC)

Psalm 133
Hi, it's not clear what you're doing with your last edits. You are adding to the lead extremely minor information about two words in the psalm, and then using the psalm itself as a source. I have been working with another editor on expanding all the psalms, and the standard lead has yet to be added here. (See as an example the lead for Psalm 134.) Why can't you leave these minor notes in the Structure section? Yoninah (talk) 19:39, 27 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Yoninah, leaving the text in two places was a mistake (rushing, when visitors arrived!), but I don't agree with you that these similes are "minor": due to the shortness of the psalm, what would be left if these two similes were not there? I would prefer this within the lead, and you can still add the standard material you have in mind. - BobKilcoyne (talk) 03:03, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, putting two similes in the lead is totally not in the spirit of WP:LEAD. The psalm has far more importance in Judaism than, and I'm sure can add more to the Christian side. I will work on the lead and the expansion next week. Best, Yoninah (talk) 11:23, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I have relocated this information away from the lead, in the spirit of verse 1. However, I don't understand your suggestion that this is about "just two words": I am referring to two illustrations of unity as similes - the whole of verse 2 is one simile and the whole of verse 3 is a second simile. See, for example, Dobbs-Allsopp, Psalm 133: A (Close) Reading, p. 9: At the heart of this poem — and ultimately one of the chief ways that it means — are two similes, one picturing “the finest oil” and the other, “dew". I will leave you to extend the lead. Peace. - BobKilcoyne (talk) 04:57, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * OK, I have completed my expansion, and will soon update the musical settings. I feel that the sources you quoted, and the source you are quoting above, are just a few of many, many grammatical treatments of the psalm which are based on personal scholarship rather than on the classical commentaries. We are trying to expand the Psalm pages with a more broad-brush approach. Yoninah (talk) 22:02, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Pulpitt commentary
Hey. I know it's been a while, but in March, you added a section to Isaiah 9 based on what the Pulpitt Commentary said. This is an unreliable source and you shouldn't cite it on Wiki articles. I've removed it from the page. If you've added this source to other biblical pages, I'd ask you to remove them. If you want to contribute to these pages but haven't bought a reliable commentary, then just click here. It's a PDF of the entire Oxford Bible Commentary, published by Oxford scholars John Barton and John Muddiman in 2007.Wallingfordtoday (talk) 01:23, 6 January 2019 (UTC)

P.S. I should also note, as I continue going through the chapters on Isaiah, that the Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Bible is also unreliable and should not be used.Wallingfordtoday (talk) 01:46, 6 January 2019 (UTC)