User talk:Bobdatty

I cannot see your logic for changing this article from Newspaper wrapper to Wrapper (philately). This artice was about postal stationery newspaper wrappers not about wrappers in general. The first sentence now reads "In philately a wrapper is a form of postal stationery which pays the cost of the delivery of a newspaper or a periodical." - which is not correct. In philately the word wrapper is used in a variety of different ways such as - letter wrapper; parcel wrapper; bundle wrapper; weather report wrapper; book wrapper; as well as newspaper wrappers. JPKos (talk) 21:34, 26 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I don't recall having heard any on these other wrapper names used in any philatelic literature. While many people may refer to wrappers as newspaper wrappers, such wrappers can be, and have been, used for many other things than newspapers. I see no problem with the renaming. ww2censor (talk) 22:26, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I sent the previously named article (newspaper wrapper) to George Kreiger, a longtime member of the Board of the United Postal Stationery Society and expert in the field. His comment to me was direct and specific.  The term used in philately is "wrapper", not "newspaper wrapper", even though its purpose was for sending newspapers and periodicals.  (Bobdatty|talk)  04:49, 28 Dec 2010 (UTC)
 * I checked twelve of the most recently published books I have, which cover the subject of newspaper wrappers - only three used the term "wrapper" and the other nine used "newspaper wrapper". The nine books are as follows:-
 * 2007 - Alan Huggins and Colin Baker - Collect British Postal Stationery. A Simplified Listing of British Postal Stationery 1840 to 2007
 * 2004 - Peter Thy & John Inglefield-Watson - The Postal Stationery of the Bechuanalands and Botswana
 * 2002 - Bernard Clancy & Otto Jung - Postal Stationery of Ireland
 * 1998 - W J Quik & G H Jonkers - The Postal Stationery of South Africa
 * 1992 - R D Samuel - New Zealand Postal Stationery Catalogue
 * 1989 - The J B Catalogue of Malta Stamps and Postal History
 * 1989 - Steven Tan - Standard Catalogue of Malaysia-Singapore-Brunei Stamps and Postal Stationery
 * 1987 - Wilfrid T F Castle et al - Cyprus 1353-1986 History, Postal History & Postage Stamps
 * 1983 - David MacDonnell - Stamps of Ireland
 * I am sure that if I was to go through my entire library I would find many more examples. I would be very interested to learn how many reference books George Kreiger consulted before he gave his opinion.JPKos (talk) 00:15, 29 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I emailed George again. I pointed out that all of your references dealt with British former dependencies and wondered whether we were talking over a difference between U.S. and British terminologies.  In the US the two standard works are the UPSS publications "Catalog of the 19th Century Stamped Envelopes and WRAPPERS, of the U.S." and "Catalog of the 20th Century Stamped Envelopes and WRAPPERS, of the U.S.".  Here is George's reply:
 * Most catalogs use the term wrapper to describe a stamped sheet long enough to fold around an object but not fully enclose it like an envelope. Many British wrappers carry the following admonishment: “This wrapper may only be used for Newspapers, or such documents as are allowed to be sent at the Book-rate of postage, and must not enclose any letter or communication of the nature of a letter (whether separate or otherwise). If this rule be infringed, the packet will be charged as a letter.
 * Thus I recommended changing the title. I have edited one book (on British East Africa by an English author) written several articles on postal stationery and edited the US Possessions catalog and use the term wrapper. If there are wrappers only to be used for newspapers then calling them Newspaper Wrappers would be correct. What do the postage rates tell you? The answer should end the discussion. Bobdatty (talk) 14:38, 29 December 2010 (UTC)


 * My understanding of wikipedia is that all statements should be based on verifiable sources. A statement such as "Most catalogs use the term wrapper" is an opinion not a source. What does the statement "What do the postage rates tell you? The answer should end the discussion." mean - my answer to the question is newspaper (or perhaps more correctly printed paper - but this is not a term in common use for wrappers). JPKos (talk) 18:26, 2 January 2011 (UTC)


 * First you solicit George's views by asking how many references he consulted. Then after I print his response you say it's not up to Wiki standards?  Give it a rest. Bobdatty (talk) 16:05, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

Ugly image placement
I see you are jamming prose between two image like this and this, which is extremely ugly, make text harder to read and is discouraged in MOS:IMAGES; which states that we should avoid sandwiching text between two images that face each other. I have never seen a non-ugly sandwich placement. File:HardingMemorial-Gutters.jpg really adds nothing new to the article as File:DDRsheet5and10pf1953.jpg also essentially shows the same style of gutters except there are St Andrew's Crosses in the gutter but on imperforate stamps. the other When there are too may images for the amount of prose it is suggested to queue the images on the talk page until there is sufficient prose. Just because images are available does not mean we must use them. Please remember this is an encyclopaedia so the prose is the most important. Good luck ww2censor (talk) 02:58, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Duplex cancel
Are you sure the caption you added is accurate? Was it actually misapplied? IIRC in some postal administrations it was the practice not to cancel the indicium, only adhesives. I don't know if this applied to Cuba or not. Do you have any additional information? ww2censor (talk) 02:56, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
 * I collect Cuban postal stationary. This is the only example that I have in this time period where the killer did not cancel the indicium. Bobdatty (talk) 04:27, 21 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Hmmm, that does not actually answer the question. As it stands now the implication is that the cancel is not correct and contrary to the rules. Perhaps a more NPOV caption would be better such as, "Duplex cancel, on Cuban postal stationery, that dose not obliterate the indicium" or something similar. ww2censor (talk) 16:27, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
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File:Se-tenant Stamp Cuba.jpg listed for discussion
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