User talk:Brian/Temp/Similarities between Canada and New Zealand

Shouldn't that be "links to the British Crown are still maintained? Otherwise the "but" makes no sense - quite apart from the fact that, formally at least, it's true. seglea 03:45, 18 Nov 2003 (UTC)

I haven't noticed ye but are there similar pages between EVERY country comparing itself in some obscure way to every OTHER country? This type of page seems trivial at best! SD6-Agent 17:22, 30 Nov 2003 (UTC)

The part about Canada being more conservative than the US until recently isn't true. For most of Canada's history it has been dominated by a Liberal Government.


 * I agree. The people who have put this together have done a good job, but the article doesn't seem suitable for a encyclopedia.  HistoryBA 15:18, 14 Nov 2004 (UTC)

"very violent (in regards to ice hockey)" seems POV to me. I would agree with SD6-Agent that this article has dubious value. RedWolf 05:58, Jan 16, 2004 (UTC)

I'm not convinced that this page is very encyclopediac, but it is pretty much 100% accurate and I think it would be difficult to claim that it is biassed in any particular way. Also, it is in itself of interest. Worth keeping, on the whole. Tannin 06:40, 16 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Does anyone have a way of describing rugby and hockey that is more NPOV than "very violent"? NerdOfTheNorth 03:39, 25 Mar 2004 (UTC)


 * Done. Now to start an article on "Differences between Canada and NZ", of which there are many! NurgOfTheSouth

Few more details added... and there are similarities in speech patterns too, eh? :) Grutness 11:59, 23 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Well, there may be similarities, but there are differences. People may think that the relationship between New Zealand and Australia is like the one between Canada and the US, but it isn't. New Zealand doesn't share a land border with Australia, so has less exposure to its larger neighbour than Canada has with the US. Apart from historical links, I don't think that Canadians and New Zealanders see themselves as having that much in common. It was Mark Steyn who said that the thing that Canada, New Zealand (and Australia) have in common is the belief that they have nothing in common. Also, the use of 'eh' is different. In Canada, it's with a question mark, in NZ, with an exclamation mark. Quiensabe 00.40 (UTC), 30 Dec 2004

I've just overhauled the spelling &amp; grammar of the article, but I must admit to having the strong feeling, throughout the process, that it's all a bit pointless (as SD6-Agent, HistoryBA, &amp; RedWolf have already suggested). Mel Etitis ( &Mu;&epsilon;&lambda; &Epsilon;&tau;&eta;&tau;&eta;&sigmaf; ) 21:54, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

nz/canada
they are both progresive places. nz has a fem prime minister, canada a chinese fem governor general. they also both turned down the u.s. to suport them in their iraqi invasion. also, auckland and vancouver look a lot alike.

Borders
although australia and new zealand are separated by water, theres alot more (real)interaction between ausis and kiwis than there are between canadians and yanks (not just simply tourism). eventhough you can drive from usa to canada, the two countries are divided by all sorts of things. an american is only allowed to stay in canada for 3 months max, if he doesnt have any official business. it's also much harder to get visas for yanks in canada and vice versa. australians are allowed to work in nz and vice versa. this means that you will have alot of kiwis living in australia and vice versa, whereas its much more dificult in north america. l would also argue that its probably easier for englishmen to live and work in canada than an american. it may be that usa has bad foreign relations, but americans are generally not allowed to stay too many places for long periods of time. yanks arent really allowed to stay long in australia too or work for any lengthy period of time. i do know that englishmen are allowed to stay for a year.

by the way, canada and nz are both members of the commonwealth.


 * Chinoiserie I don't know why you start every sentence and spell every country, nationality, and organisation without a capital letter. For the record, not all British people are 'englishmen [sic]'.


 * While there are stricter immigration controls between the US and Canada, that doesn't deter many Canadians from moving to the US. As it happens, while Australians can live and work in New Zealand, very few choose to do so - they would rather go to the UK. Young British citizens can only stay in NZ on a working holiday visa. Does Canada have such a scheme for young people? I don't think so.


 * Also, the fact that Canadians can watch US TV channels (despite the CRTC's absurd restrictions) means that they have far more exposure to the US than New Zealanders do to Australia. You can't get Australian TV channels like ABC and SBS in New Zealand - full stop.

Quiensabe 02:47 UTC 1 Jul 2005

"does canada have such a scheme for young people? i dont think so" apparently you dont think, just babble. you really need to do your research before you open your big mouth. http://www.workpermit.com/canada/working_holiday.htm in fact, englishmen are allowed to stay in canada longer than americans. can we say englishment are allowed to stay in new zealand longer than australians? i dont think so! it's really pointless for you to bring up where australians prefer to go because the topic was whether or not one is allowed to go places. since when did you become the spokesman for all australians? "very few" australians choose to live and work in new zealand? you speaking for all australians now? it's pointless for you to bring up the fact that canadians work in usa, especially since the % of kiwis working in australia the same or higher.

television programmes count as exposure? whats your point? you can also watch american programmes in india and china. does that really count as interaction? youre clearly living inside of a tele. come join us in reality. im talking about real people. do you really think watching beverly hills 90210 gives you real exposure to american culture? you can also watch neighbours in new zealand. so what? youre missing the point completely. sure there are canadians who go to usa and work. how many americans go to canada to work that arent under the nafta? there simply isnt the freedom to move back and forth and that makes a huge difference. the focus of my comment was never about tele shows, and tele shows should never qualify as real interaction.

Whoever or wherever you are, before you rant and rave, learn to write properly (why the aversion to capital letters?) and to use correct terminology (I repeat, not all British people are English - capital 'E' - or men, or for that matter 'englishment', whatever that is!)

Have you been to either Australia or New Zealand, never mind both of them? Do you know anything about their societies and their culture? If you did, you'd know that their young people regard working and travelling in Europe as something of a rite of passage - so much so that they often know Europe better than each other's countries, or parts of their own countries.

The reason why more New Zealanders move to Australia than vice versa, is because Australians (rightly or wrongly) see New Zealand as just a smaller, more provincial version of their own country, and not worth bothering with - just as British people have traditionally regarded Ireland. As regards TV, it is the exposure of Canadians to the US media, the same channels, not just to individual soap operas or sitcoms, but news coverage, advertisements. It is this proximity to such a large and culturally pervasive neighbour, that makes Canada's relationship with the US different from New Zealand's relationship with Australia.

Anyway, this entire article is pointless!

Quiensabe 22:48 UTC 18 Jul 2005

Canada is larger than the US
Canada is larger than the US in total area, but the article says New Zealand and Canada are both near a "larger" neighbor. I'll change it to "more populous" instead of "larger".

Canada and US Reference
When did Canada become more conservative then the United States. The article says it was recently. I've lived in one or the other (mostly Canada, but I have split citizenship) for pretty much all my life, and I don't remember us loosing our helth care, strong welfare system (except in Alberta), or any of those other not-traditionally conservative things. What exactly does the writer mean here.

VfD
this article was recently featured on VfD. See Votes for deletion/List of similarities between Canada and New Zealand. -- Earl Andrew - talk 20:59, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)

canadian conservative
canada is definitely NOT more conservative than usa. usa still practises death penalty, does not have a female governor general, takes a hard stance on drugs. usa has a $400 billion military budget compared to canadas low budget. if you want to read about the differences between usa and canada, there is a book called fire and ice.

So, uh
When're you guys providing sources? Or is it necessary to throw the article into VfD again? --Apostrophe 18:55, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

How about the two Queen Streets?
I've never been in Canada. But I know there is an Queen Street in Toronto and about a year ago I googled "Queen Street" the first results was the Queen Street in Toronto. Is it a main street in Toronto as in Auckland?

An idea
While this might make a fine magazine article, the topic isn't really of encyclopedic interest, and it's bound to be put up for AfD again someday (if not by me then by someone else). What if, instead, we reconfigure this to be an article about New Zealand-Canada relations, an eminently encyclopedic topic that would rightly discuss some of the cultural similarities in both arising from British settler societies and dealing with more powerful neighbors while avoiding assimilation.--Pharos 08:37, 14 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Agree. --cj | talk 09:03, 15 January 2006 (UTC)


 * What about Geography of Canada and New Zealand compared? Geography is quite a broad, sweeping term and includes cultural phenomena and natural, i.e. environmental, phenomena. Maybe this will reduce the heat this article takes... I just don't want to unilaterally move the page for it to be moved back again. -- Greaser 09:17, 24 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Actually, the whole point of my suggestion was to get away from comparing the two countries arbitrarilly- like on the shared use of "eh". While environmental comparisons etc. might be interesting in a New Zealand tourbook about Canada or vice versa, they're not really topics of universal interest.  Now, the relations between the two countries is to me a real topic, involving diplomats, physical embassies, meetings at international fora and importantly, even broader cultural relations that are already discussed here.  This proposal would include what's arguably the substance of the article while eschewing trivialities.  Now, I wish I was just a bit more knowledgable on the topic...--Pharos 07:45, 25 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I've added some information that covers the trade, wars fought in together (the latter is albeit, mentioned very briefly). -- Greaser 08:41, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Political Seperation?
"New Zealand does not have a similar regional separatist movement, though in the 19th century there was a desire in the South Island for political separation from the North Island."

Eh!

Source?

I am from NZ and i have never heard of such a thing, can someone give me some proof, or it'll have to be removed. Mannycalavera 19:59, 4 June 2006 (UTC)