User talk:Captain panda/Archive 8

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Question
Hello! My name is User:Monkeytheboy and I had a question. I found this page and it seems to me that it's not really either notable or it should be split or... I don't know. Something about it doesn't tell me it's wikipedia value. Could you take a look and let me know what you think? The page is Ed Waugh and Trevor Wood. Thanks! Monkeytheboy (talk) 18:51, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

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Bouncy wiki logo?
Cool! I like your page! It's SOOO creative... I wish my page were like that :( but hey! How do you put that bouncy wikilogo on your page! Oh, never mind. Some things are better left UNTOLD. Thanks. Please take a peek at my page. Thanks!

♥♥Blacky98 (talk) 14:51, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

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Tagging math pages
I noticed you tagged quite a few statistics talk pages with the maths rating template. Would you mind following up on that by filling in the importance parameter in the templates? There is no need to tag math articles just to say they are mathematics articles; we already have a List of mathematics articles that does not require any talk page tagging. If you don't fill in all three parameters when you put the template on a talk page, someone else has to spend time cleaning up the pages you have tagged. &mdash; Carl (CBM · talk) 21:08, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

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Crazy amounts of precision.
I see that in the MANY articles you've created about asteroids, the precision with which you state the orbital period is CRAZY! Please either state your sources for such extraordinary precision (in some cases down to one part in a trillion) - or go through and chop them back to something vaguely sensible.

IMHO, few if any of these articles are about notable asteroids - and it's likely that almost all of them would be deleted if WP:AfD got a hold of them.

SteveBaker (talk) 22:39, 24 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah - I see your reference - but in several of the articles, your numbers differ greatly from the numbers in the reference you claim - for example, 6102 Visby has an orbital period of 1532.0615152 days while the JPL database browser shows 1532.2319026 days. I only checked a handful of your articles - but several of them have similar descrepancies with the JPL site.  The difference (just a few hours) is probably due to that very overstatement of precision.  I emailed the webmaster at the JPL site asking him to please pay attention to this - because it's is a pretty outrageous example of overly precise statement of a number that cannot conceivably have been measured that accurately.   However, just because JPL screwed up - that's no reason why Wikipedia should.


 * Think about this for a moment - these numbers are stated in days - with 7 digits after the decimal point - that's a precision of one ten-millionth of a day...about 8 milliseconds! When you think about measuring the orbit of a tumbling odd-shaped hunk of rock - you're basically looking at it in a telescope that resolves it as maybe a couple of pixels and takes a good few seconds to maybe a minute to capture enough light to see the thing at all.  Given that - a precision as good as even one second would be astounding - but 8 milliseconds?!?!  No way!  With orbital precession and all of the other effects - I doubt very much whether the actual asteroid keeps to the orbit that precisely.


 * In case you think this doesn't matter - a member of the public popped into the Wikipedia science reference desk to ask why we were stating the number so insanely precisely - so people have noticed the problem.


 * SteveBaker (talk) 17:46, 25 November 2008 (UTC)


 * An appropriate amount of precision is probably the years figure - they quote that to three significant figures (eg they say 1.20 years rather than 1.2 or 1.200 - which suggests they know the orbital numbers accurate to maybe half to one percent. That seems pretty reasonable given the way they measure it.  So I think you should reduce the day numbers to 3 significant digits.  Hence 1532.2319026 becomes 1530 days.  (Don't say '1530.0' - that would imply MUCH more precision).   So I think you should round the numbers you see on the JPL site to the nearest 10 days.


 * However - if I were doing what you're doing - I wouldn't have made all of those articles - they'll NEVER get any bigger than they are and it would be much more convenient to make an article about minor asteroids in general and include a table with all of the orbital data and the discovery dates. That would be much more convenient for comparing various asteroids to each other - for seeing them in the order they were discovered...that kind of thing.  Having to search through dozens and dozens of one-line articles is just a pain...they do nobody any good.  If any of them ever do become famous, someone will be able to start a new article for the few that become notable.


 * I very much doubt these articles would survive an 'Articles for Deletion' nomination.


 * SteveBaker (talk) 03:27, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

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Happy First Edit Day!
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Delievered by SoxBot II (talk) at 03:48, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Asteroids
Hullo, Captain Sir!

I've been working on the asteroid table project here, and I thought you might like to take a look and see what you think. I've been trying to fill in enough objects in my trial table (Version 2 is probably the place to look, though some of the explanation from Ver 1 applies there too) to see how it looks. I think the named objects peter out somewhere between 10,000 and 20,000 (at least they are still going strong at 10,000 & look thin at 20,000), so I am thinking that there are between 10000 and 20000 named objects. I have a sinking feeling this is going to seem like a lot of articles to the stub sorters, so I thought I should have you take a look. My table links (via number and name) to your articles whenever they exist, as they mostly seem to do up through 10,000, and to the JPL sbdb page on the right. I just put in a block of 40 new ones around 3000, and compared a few with their articles. Except for the discovery information, it seems to me that the table really captures the essential physical data about the object pretty well, even down to around 3000. The period, velocity, aphelion, and perihelion, are of course easily computable, essentially exactly, from the six basic elements: a, e, i, node, perihelion, and M.

I really have no feel for how much trouble 10,000 stubs actually cause the sorting folks, but I am thinking there might be some call to cut off the stubs well before 20,000, and possibly even as low as 3000. If this happens I think I would propose we cut on H magnitude rather than number or name, as it is roughly related to size, independent of distance. Then we would have to negotiate about the proper cut for H. I am guessing it might be around H<12 if we need to cut much below the 10,000 number.

BTW, you will notice that a couple of the 40 new objects I put in have red links. The JPL data for them seem to exist, so I am wondering if they were missed somehow. I also noticed 2980 Cameron had an error in the text (wrong inclination), which I fixed. Since it might be a bug in your bot, I thought I better report it.

Cheers, Bill Wwheaton (talk) 13:15, 29 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I guess I think we should wait a bit and see what others think, but I have assumed the table would eventually have all numbered objects, with links to the wiki articles we decide to keep, and to the JPL and other external resources for each one. I'm not too set either way on allowing those that have no more information than the table.  I can't see how it hurts to keep them if they don't cause too much trouble for the stub gnomes and the computers. But if there is 100% redundancy with the table, then it shouldn't hurt too much to delete them.  But because observations are coming so fast, they are like to pop up again as new data come in. In general if there is a trade-off between lots of vacuous articles and fewer solid ones, I'd rather have us put our effort into improving the latter. Best, Wwheaton (talk) 06:17, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

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