User talk:Ccyypp

July 2010
Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, at least one of your recent edits, such as the one you made to Qtrax, did not appear to be constructive and has been reverted or removed. Please use the sandbox for any test edits you would like to make, and read the welcome page to learn more about contributing constructively to this encyclopedia. The reverted edit can be found here. Thank you. A le_Jrb talk 18:46, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Blocked - Qtrax
Hi there. Thanks for contacting me regarding the Qtrax article. It is Wikipedia's policy to always delete libelous material when it has been identified, see WP:LIBEL for more information. However, we do not allow you to threaten legal action on Wikipedia, per our policy on No legal threats. We cannot prevent you from taking legal action, but if you chose to do so, we require that you do not edit Wikipedia while such action is threatened. If you chose not to persue legal action, you can make an unblock request stating that you have retracted the threat. To have the page looked at with regards to your complaint, you should read Libel and follow the directions on that page.

If you need any more help, reply on this page - I will be watching it. Thanks. A le_Jrb talk 19:10, 6 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Hi,

Thank you very much for your explanation. We are sorry if you felt that there was any implied threat against Wikipedia. We hereby unreservedly withdraw any such implications and ask that the IP address be unblocked. It remains however of great concern to us that somebody can post extensive untrue statements in a neutral forum and if anything the forum rules seem to work against our rectification of these statements. We will follow your suggestions for resolution but in the meantime we would ask that all references to Qtrax be removed until you are able to be fully informed of the facts and have made your determination.


 * Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ccyypp (talk • contribs)


 * Thanks for retracting your threat of litigation - your account should now be unblocked; if you are unable to edit Wikipedia still, let me know. I am more than happy to work with you to improve our article on Qtrax. I am researching the article in its current state, but it would be helpful if you could highlight any statements that you believe to be false. Alternatively, if you would prefer, you can follow the instructions on our WP:LIBEL page and have someone else look at it. At this time, however, it is unlikely the article will be wholly deleted, as it appears that its base statements (i.e. that the company failed to launch in 2008, and that it made several false claims regarding agreements with record labels) appear to be true (and are sourced to reliable sources). A le_Jrb talk  19:38, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Hi, Please see below:

1.	We think it is unbalanced to make the MIDEM story the centerpiece of an article about the Company in general. After all, we have a number of more important significant elements in our story- e.g. Being the ONLY company in the world with global licenses for downloadable music. (If you go to the Wikipedia article on Exxon, the Valdez disaster is not even included in the main article.) We would like to be able to provide more information on the Company preceding the MIDEM description.

However, we would accept that if the MIDEM “aborted” launch involved us lying perhaps then it SHOULD be the centerpiece. We NEVER told a SINGLE lie at Midem. We did make an incorrect prediction before MIDEM, in one publication that we would have ALL requisite licenses because that’s what we were being told. We were wrong. Here however are the facts:

2.	MIDEM is the annual gathering of the music industry. The top 1500 execs of the industry get together in the preceding 2 days called MIDEMNET. Qtrax was the sole sponsor of that event. It was attended by the Chairmen and key execs of many music companies. There was nothing done without the knowledge of the industry who indeed were invitees at Qtrax events- and mostly applauding that we were finally launching. (Think about it: If we were going to launch without permission and/or licenses, we would not do it in the midst of the industry, while putting on high profile events and being a key sponsor).

We are not at liberty to disclose confidential contract details but suffice it to say that there were existing valid licenses that required, in some cases, additional understandings to launch the newer Qtrax product. One of those understandings fell away during MIDEM- to the upset of ourselves and some other licensors. It is simply UNTRUE to say that we did not have permission of any of the majors or that no licenses were in place to permit the MIDEM launch. Simply UNTRUE- despite how many times it might be repeated. (And once again- think about it: Would we have gotten all the licenses subsequently if we had lied about it- common sense would dictate that contrary views are untrue and defamatory). In fact, we did not speak about licenses at the MIDEM conference- only about “support” from the industry- which we clearly had- until it sadly fell apart for a short while.

3.	We are pilloried in the article for a usage statistic: Namely 22,000 users per millisecond had hit our site. This was quoted by engineers at the time to us as the reason the servers crashed. I believe that your quoted extrapolation is incorrect (79b users etc) as it refers to a sustained period rather than a moment in time.

4.	We are also questioned for indicating we would have 25 million tracks: The 25 million tracks is an estimated 1/3rd of tracks available on legal and illegal services- our estimate of how many we could incorporate in the service. At the time, my CTO informed me, we had 40 million fingerprints for p2p tracks- that is 40 million identified tracks. (Also, at the time of MIDEM, there was a P2P component embedded in the software. This enabled a search for any P2P song of which we, reasonably believed, we could clear 1/3rd. We have since evolved a different structure for procuring P2P songs).

5.	Notwithstanding multiple misleading statements in the article, we have launched now in 6 countries/territories (India, Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia, Australia & NZ).

More to follow.

Thank you.

In the Qtrax box top right of page this is the correct info

Developer: Qtrax inc

Stable release: 3.0

May 1 2010

Operating systems: Windows 2000, Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7

Type: Web based music service

Website: Qtrax home page

It's fair that Qtrax (or any company for that matter) is allowed to explain what the company is or does in the first few paragraphs of Wikipedia. Assuming you agree please reinstate the following.

Qtrax is a digital music service that has unique global licenses with major record companies. that allow high quality music files to be downloaded for free onto a users computer. In addition these files are portable to most phones and mp3 music players. The commercial profile is a 360º revenue model generated through a number of business arrangements including advertising programs, strategic partnerships and affiliate online retail transactions. According to IFPI (International Federation of the Phonographic Industry the organization that represents the interests of the recording industry worldwide), 95% of all music downloaded globally is stolen and/or copyright infringed many experts consider the number to much higher. The largest pirate sites of the past decade (Napster, Kazaa, Limewire) have proven the voracious desire among music fans to acquire downloadable music files for free, not necessarily because they want to steal but mostly because technology has enabled them to do so easily and for the most part anonymously. The licenses Qtrax have, coupled with it’s encyclopedic music editorial and links, creates the opportunity to provide a far superior free (and legal) music destination that satisfies music fans behavior but ensures artists and copyright holders get paid every time a song is played.

Qtrax is live in the following countries and territories: Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Hong Kong, Malaysia, India, with more to follow.

Qtrax is based in New York. The company had an aborted launch in January 2008 when it planned to activate the business with a combination of existing contracts and new agreements.[2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13]

QTRAX TECHNOLOGY AND CONTENT PORTAL

Qtrax is a web based music destination that requires no downloading of software, just log in to search, download and play. This simple functionality allows for easy adoption in any country or territory worldwide across all operating systems. Surfing the site exposes the user to a myriad of options above and beyond the core competency of searching, downloading and playing of free music. When you log in and click on “My Qtrax” the social networking parameters of the site come to life, along with the ability to build and post playlists, “send to a friend” recommendations and build communities around shared musical tastes. The editorial content includes full discographies, artist bios, album reviews, photographs and more. Every musical relationship to an artist or band is highlighted and linked.

GLOBAL PERSPECTIVE

Free music crosses all socio-economic lines, not to mention borders and cultures alike. Large common denominators aggregated and positively exploited provide the ultimate opportunities, clearly the internet in this regard is blessing and a curse in that it has the ability to massively fractionalize or cohesively bring together these shared interests. In the case of filesharing, music fans are scattered and distracted and no commercial model has succeeded in ringfencing and focusing this huge audience. Qtrax has the ambition and licenses and to achieve this elusive goal. Any percentage of conversion on a worldwide basis from pirated to legal will generate enough revenue to initially get everyone’s attention but subsequently escalate quickly through viral and strategic marketing into a significant revenue difference for artists and bands from all genres and all geographies.

Under "Global Release" it reports missed launch dates of a start up company which hardly seems like relevant information considering we have launched and are live in 6 countries.

Under "Criticism" Musicblog was wrong in what it claimed Qtrax had editorial listings but Qtrax never made music available.

Under "Client" it should say.... Qtrax is a web based music service that does not require any downloading of software.


 * Hi. Thanks for providing that information. All information included on Wikipedia much follow our core content policies, including Reliable sources and Neutral point of view. Under the second of those, if there is any current positive coverage of Qtrax, that should definitely be included. I couldn't find any news articles much more recent than August 2009ish. Under the first of these policies, any information you wish to add (such as regarding a valid launch in multiple countries) must be sourced.
 * For example, you claim that 'our' extrapolation is incorrect. In fact, this is what the news article in question said. You also point out that you wouldn't launch if so-and-so were true, e.g. you wouldn't launch without the licences. Unfortunately, this directly contradicts The Times newspaper which states that says (and I quote), "EMI, Warner, Sony BMG and Universal all confirmed that they had not agreed deals with Qtrax". Obviously, The Times is a much more reliable source than Original research or first-person information.
 * It is also irrelevant what the reasons were for making the claims that there would be 25 millions songs etc. Maybe the company was misled. I don't know. It doesn't matter. The article states that the "CEO ... noted that ... 25 millions songs were available". This claim was not invented by the users of Wikipedia, it was taken from The Guardian and engadget. I'm not sure whether you are claiming that all of these reputable news outlets are lying, but as long as they are saying it, we can quote them on it.
 * To help improve the article, you need to find some reliable sources - that page tells you what the definition of that is - that supports your claims. Generally, news coverage is much better than press releases of comments made by the company. If the nature of the program has changed - i.e. it's entirely web based - you can safely change that in the article. I should point out, however, that according to the legal disclaimer on Qtrax's own site, LTDnetwork Inc. is the owner of Qtrax. A le_Jrb talk  21:39, 6 July 2010 (UTC)