User talk:Cielquiparle/Archive 2

Barnstar of Excellence

 * Thanks @CaroleHenson! Great collaboration. Has been inspiring to see all the intersections and look forward to the next one. Cielquiparle (talk) 23:54, 6 February 2022 (UTC)

Harriet Robinson Scott
Wonderful work. The page looks so great! Be4waugh (talk) 19:12, 9 February 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks for following and your past research for that page. Cielquiparle (talk) 12:11, 11 February 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Francis B. Murdoch
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 12 February 2022 (UTC)

Verena Conzett
I have nominated the article and included you as a creator in the nomination so you get a credit for it. Feel free to suggest other hooks.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 09:48, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * @Paradise Chronicle Looks good, thank you! (Shortened slightly and added English source for ALT hook.) Just wanted to ask, is it supposed to appear under February 27 or February 20 on the DYK page? (Still figuring out how DYK works.) Cielquiparle (talk) 12:18, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Have now proposed a second ALT hook and gone ahead and moved the nomination up on the DYK page (to February 20). Cielquiparle (talk) 16:27, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * How DYK works, we can always learn more. I guess the reviewer would like to trim the article a bit. And for the long run, the autobiography published in her own publishing house is a good primary source but wikipedia specifically prefers secondary sources. See WP:PRIMARY and WP:SECONDARY. Anyway, most of what I read in her own bio, I also read in the Treichler book (A secondary source), sometimes even in more detail than I found it in the article, so if this gets an issue we need to improve a bit on the sourcing. For example the text cited by the source of the pages 171-177 from the Conzett bio could be split, made more precise and supported with a secondary Treichler source. Paradise Chronicle (talk) 21:20, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks @Paradise Chronicle, have cleaned up and cut further. Let me know if you have any other questions / thoughts. May add a few more sources which may trigger further minor edits but will try to keep it simple. Cielquiparle (talk) 12:16, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

DYK for David Nelson (abolitionist)
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:02, 5 March 2022 (UTC)

Anarchism
Hi Cielquiparle,

I saw your work on articles related to anarchism and wanted to say hello, as I work in the topic area too. If you haven't already, you might want to our noticeboard for Wikipedia's coverage of anarchism, which is a great place to ask questions, collaborate, discuss style/structure precedent, and stay informed about content related to anarchism. Take a look for yourself!

And if you're looking for other juicy places to edit, consider expanding a stub, adopting a cleanup category, or participating in one of our current formal discussions.

Feel free to say hi on my talk page and let me know if these links were helpful (or at least interesting). Hope to see you around. czar 17:16, 5 March 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Tatiana Saunders
theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/they) 00:30, 11 March 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Floating Freedom School
theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/they) 00:32, 11 March 2022 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Redirect2203111


Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. This is a notice to inform you that a tag has been placed on Redirect2203111 requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section A3 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is an article with no content whatsoever, or whose contents consist only of external links, a "See also" section, book references, category tags, template tags, interwiki links, images, a rephrasing of the title, a question that should have been asked at the help or reference desks, or an attempt to contact the subject of the article. Please see Wikipedia:Stub for our minimum information standards for short articles. Also please note that articles must be on notable subjects and should provide references to reliable sources that verify their content.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. (t &#183; c)  buidhe  10:11, 11 March 2022 (UTC)


 * @Buidhe Apologies for the error (intended the page to have been created in User space) and thank you very much for speedily deleting! Cielquiparle (talk) 10:25, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * no worries, that's what it's for. In future, if you accidentally create a page just copy and past g7 and an admin will delete it. (t &#183; c)  buidhe  10:27, 11 March 2022 (UTC)

Women in Red
Hi there, Cielquiparle, and thanks for creating several well presented biographies of women. It seems to me you would be a useful member of WikiProject Women in Red where we are chipping away at the gender gap. You can do so by registering in the box at the top of our project page. But even if you do not join, I look forward to many more articles about women. Happy editing!--Ipigott (talk) 11:55, 13 March 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks @Ipigott! What does membership entail? Is it different from contributing articles? Cielquiparle (talk) 12:03, 13 March 2022 (UTC)


 * There are no firm obligations although we do of course encourage members to create articles about women and their works. As you probably know, less than 20% of biographies on the English Wikipedia are about women. Each month we put together two or three priorities on which we think it would be useful to work. We find it useful to help each other along and whenever possible we provide support to those who run into problems. We have a wide variety of redlists pointing to women who may deserve biographies. You can find out more about our activities and the support we offer on the main wp:Women in Red page and on its talk page, probably the most active of any wikiproject.--Ipigott (talk) 12:18, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks @Ipigott, will check it out. Out of curiosity, is membership what triggers automated newsletter delivery to one's User Talk page? Or is that triggered in another way? Cielquiparle (talk) 13:38, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * If you wish, I can add you name to our mailing list now but I'll certainly add it if you become a member. For the time being, you can see below our priorities for March.--Ipigott (talk) 15:24, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks so much, @Ipigott. The whole reason I found my first WiR event in the first place was through this newsletter on someone else's Talk page. (So it did its job, amazing!) But now that I know how to find the events, I don't need the newsletter anymore, if that makes sense. That is one reason I haven't wanted to sign up as a member. It also took me a very long time to figure out that #1day1woman didn't necessarily mean you were signing up to create 1 new article a day, which I could never do. Anyway I have been nothing but impressed with what I've experienced so far through WiR. I'm just not sure I can commit to more than an event or an article here and there. Cielquiparle (talk) 17:24, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * OK, that's fine but most members are far less active than you. Even if you join, if you don't want to receive the newsletter I can just leave your name off the mailing list. You can always see what we are doing under Events on our project page. If you haven't already done do, you might find it useful to look through our Primer for creating women's biographies and some of our other essays. Just let me know if ever you run into difficulties or need assistance. Happy editing!--Ipigott (talk) 07:24, 14 March 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Verena Conzett
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 14 March 2022 (UTC)

Precious
You are recipient no. 2713 of Precious, a prize of QAI. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:05, 14 March 2022 (UTC)


 * Hello Precious and many thanks @Gerda Arendt! Cielquiparle (talk) 15:19, 14 March 2022 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for March 24
An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Chinese Fables and Folk Stories, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page American Book Company.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 06:03, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Minnesota State Capitol artwork
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 12:02, 8 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you for nominating the article! Myotus (talk) 14:32, 8 April 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Chow Leung
— Maile (talk) 00:02, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Chinese Fables and Folk Stories
— Maile (talk) 00:02, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Mary Hayes Davis
— Maile (talk) 00:02, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Royal Theater (St. Petersburg, Florida)
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

 * Thanks @CT55555, also for your work on the front lines of the AfD process. Cielquiparle (talk) 19:47, 15 May 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Lucy Moss
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:03, 20 May 2022 (UTC)

Lucy Moss
Thanks for expanding the article about her! I've been obsessed with SIX lately so it was cool to see this article in the DYK section. Also, I like her last name. Anything that has anything to do with clovers or moss gets a smile from me. :) Clover moss  (talk) 21:01, 20 May 2022 (UTC)


 * She's one of a kind, no category! Great that @Clovermoss likes her story. DYK her crowning glory. For five, four, three, two, one more minute... Cielquiparle (talk) 23:12, 20 May 2022 (UTC)

List of female American football players‎
Personally, I think the criteria need to be tight and include only those who either already have an article, or warrant one based on available coverage. When coverage is purely of local interest trivia, e.g. high school firsts & records, homecoming queens, etc., or independent sources do not go beyond passing mentions in routine coverage, the people should not be in the list. wjematherplease leave a message... 11:50, 25 May 2022 (UTC)


 * @Wjemather That was my original thinking as well. At one point, I was even on the fence if the high school section should even exist, given that so few of the players have Wikipedia pages (though as it turns out Maida's is just a stub even if having a movie made about you is notable).
 * After looking at what's there, I was wondering if it would be possible to have a different set of criteria just for the High school section. Without a doubt, Adults have to meet the normal standard of "notability". But for High school only, could we say:
 * Simply being a female player is not notable – there has to be something else establishing notability
 * High school firsts and records are not notable
 * County level firsts and records are not notable
 * League / conference level firsts and records are notable, if they are verifiable
 * State level firsts and records are notable, if they are verifiable
 * National / international firsts and records are notable
 * Certain awards are notable (mostly corresponding with above)
 * The other thing that has really given me pause while reviewing the page, is the fact that the list page itself has previously received media coverage, plus the fact that this page actually has historically had a lot of traffic. I think people are looking for these types of facts (see AV Club article here), there is interest in them, and we could provide them if they are verifiable and meet a certain standard of notability. Cielquiparle (talk) 12:15, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Sounds reasonable but would just clarify that the source for verification should always be independent of the league/state/award/etc. and we should avoid woolly claims of firsts (e.g. "believed to be..."). The trouble with interesting facts (trivia) is they are very often not suitable for inclusion in an encyclopedia. wjematherplease leave a message... 12:27, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
 * @Wjemather Yes thanks, will explicitly state the independent sources requirement in framing the criteria on the Talk page (personally I prefer multiple sources for most facts anyway). Point taken about not-a-trivia-almanac and avoiding woolly claims.
 * Will go back and and do another pass from the top. (Will probably add a few more notable high school players later but it would be a handful at most, no additional homecoming queens, and as USA Today notes, by 2017 female high school football players are not that uncommon anymore so it makes sense that notability is in some ways "harder" to achieve over time.) Cielquiparle (talk) 03:19, 26 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes indeed. It's much easier to justify inclusion of those without articles when multiple good sources exist. Good work. wjematherplease leave a message... 10:10, 27 May 2022 (UTC)
 * @Wjemather: I just ordered The Women's Football Encyclopedia by Neal Rozendaal, so I'm all-in now. Unfortunately the most recent edition appears to be from 2016/2017 – we'll see how helpful it is once it arrives – but it seemed better than not having it at all. Whether this is technically TNT or not, it feels like taking a step back and looking from outside-in – what do the sources say, also about the bigger picture – can only lead to improvement. Cielquiparle (talk) 10:57, 27 May 2022 (UTC)

Good job with the penguins
I've come across West London Penguin Swimming and Water Polo Club. Very impressed with how well you have expanded the article since it was nominated for deletion. To go from one source to eighty four in a month must have taken quite a bit of work. RicDod (talk) 20:39, 26 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks @RicDod, I might have "gone off the deep end" with Penguin, but what a rich history, and thank goodness for the Wikipedia Library and Newspapers.com, etc. (Not to mention all the Olympic athlete pages, many of which are/were stubs, but for genuinely notable people.) Was also excited to have a reason to set foot in the British Library, absolutely thrilling. Cielquiparle (talk) 04:03, 27 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Also... @The wub: Please pass on to the team out that develops Visual Editor: Thank you for all the work that you do. Over the past year I have definitely noticed performance improvements and for a user like me it makes all the difference in the world. It just makes everything so much faster. Cielquiparle (talk) 07:03, 27 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Glad to hear it! I passed on your message for them. And once again, fantastic work on rescuing the Penguins! the wub "?!"  16:38, 27 May 2022 (UTC)

DYK
I added an author credit for you at Template:Did you know nominations/Joseph Eiboeck. I can remove it if you don't want it. SL93 (talk) 19:22, 28 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Oh nice, @SL93! Thanks so much. I was really surprised to find out so much about the German language press in Iowa. Plus the war over Prohibition. And then "printer's devil" as a topic sucked me in for a while (I didn't quite finish but at least that page doesn't say "citation needed" after every sentence anymore). Anyway, great find / addition to Wikipedia. It has also helped me to understand the Dakota War in Minnesota in a different way. Cielquiparle (talk) 19:53, 28 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Shared credit for DYKs is something that should happen wayn more often than it does. User:SL93 Good job!  7&amp;6=thirteen (☎) 20:07, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Ten Percent (TV series)
— Maile (talk) 00:02, 3 June 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Joseph Eiboeck
—Kusma (talk) 00:02, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

New Chapter
Hello Cielquiparle am just thinking, if this article does end up deleted I would consider deletion review and then merging all the content into Procter & Gamble. NemesisAT (talk) 11:59, 7 June 2022 (UTC)

Licensing
I saw you loaded to en:wiki. You might want to look at the commons template called "PD-UK-unknown" which says that if the photographer is unknown (and "Daily Mirror" or "Smith, Jones and Brown Ltd" = unknown) and the photo is before 1952 (70 years ago) then its out of copyright. In this case Millie Hudson's photo is at a reputable location and they don't know the photographer - so quick check on google images and then use the template above. Just a tip - feel free to ignore (obvs) Victuallers (talk) 15:48, 10 June 2022 (UTC)


 * Hard core. Thanks for the careful read-through, edits, and comments. (And welcome to the "Penguin Zone"!)   Cielquiparle (talk) 18:52, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Brilliant Work

 * Well done! 7&amp;6=thirteen (☎) 14:02, 22 June 2022 (UTC)

Peter Beveridge
Continuing from the article's talk page, it took about 30 seconds to type the name into the google books searchbox, so no big deal! the Jersey press photos are a very good find, but the portrait doesn't look much like any of the others, so much so that I did wonder if the newspaper had mis-indexed it. However, I got tired of fruitless newspaper searches and for my own satisfaction did 5 minutes of original research - which of course can't be used for Wikipedia - and from this there is no doubt, despite the coincidences, that these were two different men. I'm very happy to share it if you'd like, but as said it would be of no use for the article, although it may (or not, of course) give you a springboard from which more easily to find appropriate secondary material, so let me know if you're interested. Ingratis (talk) 07:34, 18 June 2022 (UTC)


 * Sounds intriguing, thanks ! So tantalising yet frustrating that the Jersey Evening Post donated that massive photographic archive to Jersey Heritage, yet the digitisation of their newspaper archives remains incomplete for exactly the decades we would need. Another major avenue to explore is several decades' worth of Swimming Times magazine, which would require a lot of in-person library time (plus pre-ordering volumes in advance), but having done some of that recently I'm not sure I want to do it again just yet. My interest in this really just stemmed from wanting everyone to exercise more caution before jumping to the conclusion that two individuals with the same name (and same middle initial) necessarily are the same person, as in the past I have spent weeks untangling historical biographies that got completely confused, as in Shakopee (Dakota leaders), Zhaagobe, and Sha-có-pay (within those three articles are references to six confirmed individuals called "Six", plus a possible seventh, and there were easily others). Cielquiparle (talk) 08:38, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
 * You were clearly right to be sceptical and it would been an odd combination. I've left a couple of notes at User:Ingratis/Temp page 2, mostly from the 1939 survey, which makes it clear that there were 2 different PHB's then in London. The diver was born just "Harry" but added the Peter, which was his father's name. He apparently died in 2002, but no information on where: his son's wife and child ended up in New Zealand. The policeman is certainly notable - I may put together a stub. I'm not sure whether civil registration indexes can be counted as secondary sources - lots of articles have them, but more extreme editors seem to like to delete them as OR - but the entries are available without subscription at freebmd org uk Ingratis (talk) 07:41, 19 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Fascinating. Thanks @Ingratis for the background info and leads. The Scotland Yard Big Five story sounds like a winner too. Happy editing! Cielquiparle (talk) 12:22, 19 June 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Belle White
&mdash; Amakuru (talk) 00:03, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Millie Hudson
&mdash; Amakuru (talk) 00:04, 20 June 2022 (UTC)


 * Morning Cielquiparle. Thank you for your hard work on this article too!  Lugnuts  Fire Walk with Me 07:02, 20 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for creating the article, @Lugnuts, and for looking after it once we started expanding! She did so much, there actually is more I could still add to the article, but I'll give it a rest for today. :) Cielquiparle (talk) 07:34, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

DYK for West London Penguin Swimming and Water Polo Club
&mdash; Amakuru (talk) 00:04, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks
Thanks for turning that article from a tyrannosaurus wreck into dino-mite. CT55555 (talk) 19:34, 30 June 2022 (UTC)


 * Oh @CT55555: Thank you so much for making me laugh!!! I still can't stop laughing about page size. In a good way. And of course for all your hard work and thoughtfulness as always. Cielquiparle (talk) 19:41, 30 June 2022 (UTC)

Dakota War re-write
I was contacted by the Minnesota Project to go over the current article. My opinion is that it needed a complete re-write for multiple reasons. Here is the link to that sandbox. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Mcb133aco/New_sandbox I would appreciate your input. In my regular sandbox is an article for the Mankato Hangings you are welcome to look at also. Thank you Mcb133aco (talk)mcb133acoMcb133aco (talk)

Disambiguation link notification for July 1
An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Titus (dinosaur), you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Natural History Museum.

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Dakota page
Sorry. I have signed. As to size of edit and your revert. The Article needs a rewrite. Mcb133aco (talk) 22:32, 6 July 2022 (UTC)mcb133acoMcb133aco (talk) 22:32, 6 July 2022 (UTC)


 * I am liking your bulletpoint list of issues with the article, @Mcb133aco! Still working through the list, but as I go through each point, I've also been checking your proposed rewrite of the page for more information, so please know that all the effort you put into the draft has not been wasted. It is clear that you have been reading critically across multiple related Wikipedia pages, which are in need of fixing as well. We still have a long way to go to get that page to Military history B-class, but if/when we get there, you will have definitely played an important role in that. Cielquiparle (talk) 10:35, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you for compliment. The article has major flaws starting with the title, which I believe came from the MHS.  When it comes to the War the MHS has a corrupted history that should be issue on Wikipedia.  Another opinion is that the MHS has developed a Mdewakanton centric world view of the Dacotah.  That alone highlights the issue of pov in what they publish and should challenge their status as a Wikipedia reliable source.  Using the noun Dakota without the adjective Eastern is an issue that comes from the laziness of the MHS.  The use of the noun alone, as a descriptor, is unacceptable on multiple levels.  Beyond that, the article suffers from a sanitized vocabulary and censoring of historic facts.  It's grading is inflated, if a C is average.  A D+ or C- would be more accurate.  In the area of Military History the war has become unique in that the loser has gotten both the name of the conflict changed as well what they are called in the narrative.  Those things could be issues in grading the article.  I also believe the other active editor on this article is a candidate for a a COI tag.Mcb133aco (talk) 20:17, 17 July 2022 (UTC)mcb133acoMcb133aco (talk) 20:17, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
 * To be clear, @Mcb133aco: This is an article about a war and we will never make everyone happy. There is lots of room on the Internet for many points of view, but Wikipedia has to maintain a NPOV and a few of the issues you have raised on the list will be more challenging to work through. But it's a net positive for everyone to discuss, and we need to respect multiple perspectives while working through them. (I agree with your grading by the way.) Cielquiparle (talk) 20:37, 17 July 2022 (UTC)

Stanley Stair
Thank you for your work on Stanley Stair. I think it would have been deleted if not for you. Polycarpa aurata (talk) 03:07, 9 July 2022 (UTC)


 * @Polycarpa aurata: Thanks for your work in finding and adding the sources to begin with. What a gem of a story! I also learned from this process that it's often hard to discuss these issues in the abstract, and you don't really know what is there until you try to engage with the content and attempt to fix. Cielquiparle (talk) 20:30, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

Daily Mail reference at West London Penguin Swimming and Water Polo Club
Hi. Please do not use the Daily Mail as you did at West London Penguin Swimming and Water Polo Club. It is not a reliable source. See WP:DAILYMAIL. Kind regards, Robby.is.on (talk) 10:30, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks @Robby.is.on. I will remove it, if it hasn't been removed already. I actually wasn't relying on it as a source for anything but to note that some sources refer to the club as "London Penguins" but I'm sure we can find other instances of that. Cielquiparle (talk) 10:37, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
 * You're welcome. Thanks for finding a better source. Happy editing, Robby.is.on (talk) 20:50, 17 July 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Ellaisa Marquis
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 18 July 2022 (UTC)

Mdewakanton-Wahpekute 38 +2
This article was submitted and rejected. The stated reason was that the Dakota War article covers the topic and that there had been no discussion for a stand alone article on the subject. Do you have any thoughts on that. Mcb133aco (talk) 16:49, 20 July 2022 (UTC)mcb133Mcb133aco (talk) 16:49, 20 July 2022 (UTC)


 * I didn't realize you were in a rush to submit. (You're running fast in a lot of directions, @Mcb133aco – I'm having trouble keeping up!) A better approach might be to work in Draft space (rather than User space), so that other editors can contribute and comment. A lot of good Military history articles start like that. My advice would be to cut the first half of the article, which does overlap a lot with the main Dakota War page, and focus on the trial and executions – or maybe the trial and the executions have separate pages. And/or, we can start with the List of the individuals who were executed first, which was my first suggestion to you, as a standalone page. Anyway, I think you need to prioritize a bit and make sure we're not introducing even more quality problems. It is July 21 now and we have ~10 more days left in August, which is when everyone starts looking up the Dakota War again and we'll see a spike in traffic. I think we should focus on checking and fixing all the Dakota War pages – the ones that need the most work are the main massacre pages (starting with Attack at the Lower Sioux Agency). For the executions, it would be good if we could have any new content published by December, so we have some time to get it right; it is a complex and difficult subject, which I think needs to be more of a collaborative effort. In the meantime, I'll keep working on the list of issues you flagged for the main Dakota War page. Cielquiparle (talk) 04:37, 21 July 2022 (UTC)


 * Rush is not a word I would use. I had a good deal of time into this article when the editor asked me to look at the War.  I told them that the War would have to wait.  When I had the 38+2 complete I encountered two view points.  One that it was a stand alone subject while the other was that it should be rolled into the War.  At that point I looked at the War and decided it would be simpler to combine the content.  I do not see that as going in many directions, but that is my viewpoint.  I have no knowledge of Draft space.  You reverted my edit, I am thinking you should revert my bullet list too, there is more that could have been listed.  Thank youMcb133aco (talk) 15:52, 21 July 2022 (UTC)mcb133acoMcb133aco (talk) 15:52, 21 July 2022 (UTC)


 * You decided to use the bullet-list I posted to explain my edit as a to-do list for yourself. My opinion is that you are the one going in different directions.  It very much seems that you act as though you "Own" the Dakota article and act as a gatekeeper.Mcb133aco (talk)mcb133Mcb133aco (talk)


 * That was not my intention at all. I thought we should respect the points you raised and try to address them. I think the discussion on the article Talk page has been good so far. Let's keep editing and discussing and improving the article. Cielquiparle (talk) 19:54, 24 July 2022 (UTC)

Articles for deletion/BBC Studio
Hi. Just to let you now I closed this AFD, and moved the content to a new List of BBC studios page to form the set index page. I think what I have done reflects the consensus that was reached, but please let me know if you meant something else. I wanted to let you know directly as you suggested that you might work on the set index page. Cheers TigerShark (talk) 03:45, 21 July 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks for creating the Set index page, @TigerShark and for letting me know. I'll start working on the content. (I think I actually meant for "BBC Studio" to redirect to "BBC Studios" as a misspelling-type Redirect, but I'll work on the actual content of the Set index page first and then work out next steps after that so that I'm 100% sure it's the right move, and we don't keep moving in circles... It may turn out it's fine the way it is now.) Cielquiparle (talk) 04:05, 21 July 2022 (UTC)

Theatre Royal, Southampton
Hi there, hope your well. First and foremost, I am incredibly thankful and grateful for your edits to Theatre Royal, Southampton. The expansion and sources (which may I say are excellent finds) have massively improved the article from what it was originally at the time when nominated for deletion.

In response to your improvements made over the past two days, I have withdrawn my AFD. There was a discussion within the AFD from Mjroots that suggested that the article could be draftified, but due to the impressive expansion in such a short amount of time, I don’t think that is even no longer necessary. Perhaps I may have been a bit quick/harsh with the AFD, but up to that point there had been little edits or discussion surrounding the article, and to put it mildly, it was essentially neglected. It felt like a lost cause after I was struggling to find information about the theatre. However, the AFD did bring some good, bringing some much needed attention and improvements to a page that seemed to have fallen into the shadows.

Overall, I would like to again thank you for your finds and improvements to Theatre Royal, Southampton which was an ultimate factor in the page surviving. Great work! Fats40boy11 (talk) 10:03, 27 July 2022 (UTC)


 * @Fats40boy11: It was a good lesson on why it’s not OK to create two-sentence stubs in mainspace without reliable sources. All the key facts in the stub were wrong. Even the picture was misleading. And you were right that it wasn’t easy to find sources. It was an appropriate AfD nomination. If no one turned up to help solve the history mystery, it would have been perfectly fine to draftify or delete. As it stood, the information was bad.
 * That said, thanks for withdrawing your nomination and for your comments! Agree that in the end it was a net positive. Appreciate your professionalism and considerateness and hope you are enjoying EURO 2022. (First half yesterday was a nail-biter…) Cielquiparle (talk) 12:55, 27 July 2022 (UTC)
 * No worries, you deserve the praise. I did get confused when before the nomination it said that the theatre was destroyed by a bomb in 1940 whilst the source said 1942. This isn’t mentioning that this was confused with Mayflower Theatre. As you’ve found, there were a range of misleading information beforehand, and I’m surprised it didn’t get flagged sooner. I have no doubt that the article was made in good faith, but it was in poor shape and I do find it frustrating when stubs are created and then abandoned for others to do the hard work.
 * In regards to EURO 2022, I am most certainly enjoying it and let’s finish the job on Sunday! Hope your enjoying it too. Fats40boy11 (talk) 13:57, 27 July 2022 (UTC)

Rescue Barnstar

 * Hi @Fats40boy11, hope you are ok. In case you are open to distractions at the moment and/or have connections in Southampton...I was wondering if we could get a photo of the Theatre Royal site for lower down on the page (added via Commons). Maybe a photo of the historical marker (like this one) and a photo of the "high rise" itself (since we're referencing it in the DYK hook)? What do you think? (Not a priority by any means, it was just a thought.) Cielquiparle (talk) 15:50, 11 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Hi @Cielquiparle. I think that’s a great idea. I know exactly where it is, near the Southampton Register office and Medieval Merchant's House on French Street.
 * I’m not sure how soon I’d be able to get this, but I will attempt to get some photos the next time I head in that area. Fats40boy11 (talk) 18:35, 11 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Just further to this, I’ve just looked at my calendar and I will be heading into that area on Saturday. If I have time, I’ll definitely attempt to get some photos. Fats40boy11 (talk) 18:59, 11 August 2022 (UTC)
 * @Fats40boy11 Awesome, in that case we'll definitely beat the article hitting the main page, as it's not yet in the queue...! Cielquiparle (talk) 19:12, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

Rescue Barnstar

 * Thanks @Taung Tan, also for your edits. I still have some questions about sourcing though, which I've left on the article Talk page. Please take a look. Cielquiparle (talk) 07:00, 6 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Stanley Stair
&mdash; Amakuru (talk) 00:02, 3 August 2022 (UTC) theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/they) 02:09, 4 August 2022 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

 * @CT55555: The article was in dire straits, but it helped to take a different tack with all hands on deck. Thanks for taking the helm on this one, it helps so much that you know the ropes and are willing to sail close to the wind when needed. Cielquiparle (talk) 17:46, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
 * I also award you the pun bar star. lol CT55555 (talk) 20:36, 7 August 2022 (UTC)

Congratulations and "something else"
Hi there Cielquiparle! Looking here I see you are a great editor and I want to congratulate you for your work. Great editors are rare and in short supply! Ok, so I read what you asked me to about linkrot, and went to a page that supposedly fixes some of it. It fixed some of the bare urls' on Christy Martin vs. Deirdre Gogarty, I think. Go check it out and let me know if there is more I can do or should do! Thanks and God bless! Antonio I am really a Rock Star!! Martin (que me dices?) 08:47, 8 August, 2022 (UTC)
 * Hello ! Thanks for the update and for the kind words. To be honest, I am quite torn now because I will probably need to resign as your DYK reviewer if I start helping you too much. It is great that you made a start with Reflinks, but there is still a lot to do (with the URL clean up but also other points I had mentioned in the DYK review). I am still trying to think of the best way to help you get this across the finish line, but will get back to you. In the meantime, keep going with the improvements! Cielquiparle (talk) 18:58, 10 August 2022 (UTC)

Soldiers vs Warriors ~ Dakota War
You accepted another editors source for maintaining the use of soldier without verifying the word they cite: akiçita:. A simple google produces the definition in the Dakota Dictionary Online @ University of Minnesota: "warrior". That dictionary has no listing for the word "soldier". According to the 1852 Riggs Dakota Dictionary the primary meaning of the word akiçita: is "warrior". The 1890 reprint of the dictionary leaves the definition unchanged. Both editions list "soldier" as a secondary definition. Given that the war took place between publications the definition listed is the most applicable to the Dakota War narrative, not one published 100 years post-war. That other editor cites the current Sissiton Dictionary without explanation as to why the historic "primary definition" has been replaced. That raises the question of creditability of the source. The change in definitions is significant enough to raise the question of editor bias in the source. There are too many sources written by amateurs concerning the war. The revisionist effort to paint Little Crows warriors as soldiers is an example. "Soldiers" are trained in the "conventional warfare" of their period. Warriors are trained as "asymmetrical warfare" fighters or guerrillas throughout history. The Military History project does not interchange combatants of one type of warfare with the other and identify all as being the same. The Military History Project should not grade this article above a "C" while it identifies Little Crows warriors were soldiers. Using "soldiers" in place of "warriors" is an attempt to rewrite the historic narrative. The use of Soldier for Warrior reflects a revisionist rewrite utilizing inaccurate terminology. The fact that you can cite multiple sources that failed to verify correct terminology and comprehend the content illustrates a Wikipedia issue whereby poorly researched sources are given creditability by meeting the reliability standard of simply getting published. The Dakota War soldiers vs warriors is an example of this.Mcb133aco (talk) 19:07, 8 August 2022 (UTC)mcb133acoMcb133aco (talk) 19:07, 8 August 2022 (UTC)


 * Historian Gary Clayton Anderson, as well as the Minnesota Historical Society, seem to use "soldier" and "warrior" interchangeably. Anderson also writes extensively about the role of the "soldiers' lodge" as a group. @Mcb133aco, if you really want to pursue this discussion further, you could post to the Talk page for one of the WikiProjects, like Military History or Indigenous People of North America. Be careful not to fall into WP:SOAPBOX. Cielquiparle (talk) 20:40, 9 August 2022 (UTC)


 * Anderson and the MHS did not write the Dakota Dictionary so why do you reference them?  Neither one has a neutral pov.  Do you consider them better sources than the Dictionary?156.99.40.14 (talk) 17:06, 10 August 2022 (UTC)mcb133aco156.99.40.14 (talk) 17:06, 10 August 2022 (UTC)Mcb133aco (talk) 17:08, 10 August 2022 (UTC)mcb133acoMcb133aco (talk) 17:08, 10 August 2022 (UTC)
 * As you yourself said, the Dakota–English Dictionary by Stephen Return Riggs lists both "warrior" and "soldier" as possible definitions. Anyway, I understand your frustration. Why not open the discussion with a broader community on one of the WikiProject pages? These issues come up all the time. Cielquiparle (talk) 18:39, 10 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Edward Duplex
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Collingham Gardens
— Maile (talk) 00:03, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Thomas Yarborough
— Maile (talk) 00:03, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

Thank you and
Thanks for your extensive contribution to Banaras Law Journal. Wondering if you can kindly contribute to: Both are historical and important journals in their respective fields in India, but currently under WP:AfD. Thanks again, User4edits (talk) 21:21, 13 August 2022 (UTC)
 * National Geographical Journal of India, and
 * Journal of Scientific Research of the Banaras Hindu University


 * @User4edits: Academic journals are hard. At first, I wondered why you published 2 articles to mainspace with no secondary sources, but I think I understand now that you were trying to write them according to what the essay said (which turned out to be "just an essay" and not a policy or guideline, and somewhat confusing). In the end, always safest to stick to WP:GNG. Cielquiparle (talk) 16:57, 15 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Noted. Thanks, User4edits (talk) 19:28, 16 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Rina Amiri
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:02, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Graeme Saunders (sailor)
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:02, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Jacob Saunders
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:03, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Chester Yacht Club
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:03, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Theatre Royal, Southampton
Vanamonde 00:02, 24 August 2022 (UTC)

Great job! We'd love to see your articles up on The 10,000 Challenge! Anything done since 2016 can be added.♦ Dr. Blofeld  17:25, 24 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Sweet Vengeance Mine
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:02, 27 August 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Beth Nealson
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 12:02, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

Barnstar for Ginger Howard

 * @DaffodilOcean Thanks for your edits and Newspaper.com clippings I stumbled on because you were several steps ahead, sorry for the edit conflict, and thanks as well for your hard work earlier this summer in fixing the bio for the Ambassador! (Still not entirely comfortable with the awkward way in which Wikipedia ends up communicating with BLP subjects...) Cielquiparle (talk) 05:04, 12 September 2022 (UTC)


 * I was just coming here, too, to thank you for improving Ginger Howard and other articles that come to discussion at AFD. What we ultimately want here is quality articles and your attention to articles on the margin of a delete debate really enhances the project. I can imagine how much time this costs you so thank you for all of your contributions. Liz Read! Talk! 23:55, 12 September 2022 (UTC)


 * I keep expecting to lose interest and move on to other things, but so many interesting content questions come up during deletion discussions. I'm glad some of the comments and article improvements have been useful. Thanks for all your hard work @Liz in keeping the machine running, also with the bigger picture in mind. Cielquiparle (talk) 04:26, 14 September 2022 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Danny Kaleikini
Hello! Your submission of Danny Kaleikini at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at your nomination's entry and respond there at your earliest convenience. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! – Muboshgu (talk) 03:56, 9 September 2022 (UTC)

List of medical schools in the Caribbean
Hello, Cielquiparle,

You did such an impressive job with Washington University of Barbados, could you glance at List of medical schools in the Caribbean and make sure the listing for this defunct university is accurate? You probably now know more about this school than anyone on Wikipedia. Thanks for any help you can provide. Liz Read! Talk! 03:07, 17 September 2022 (UTC)


 * @Liz Can of worms!!! The easy part was deleting WUB from that page completely (since the header says list of "current" medical schools)...but much of the information on that page is suspect, and I've now posted my first query to the Reliable sources/Noticeboard. More to follow from this, I'm sure. Cielquiparle (talk) 06:57, 17 September 2022 (UTC)

Cleonike Damianakes
Have created two hook options for Cleonike Damianakes. Apologies if they read like clickbait, but we do want people to read the article. You are of course most welcome to create other hooks, and to continue expanding. Edwardx (talk) 21:07, 27 September 2022 (UTC)


 * I laughed. Cielquiparle (talk) 21:10, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
 * I will count that as a result. Edwardx (talk) 21:17, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Danny Kaleikini
~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 04:38, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

DYK for The Kahala Hotel & Resort
~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 04:38, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Cleon
She gets four image-heavy pages in Salisbury's book, but no other authors or covers are mentioned. Edwardx (talk) 23:18, 2 October 2022 (UTC)


 * @Edwardx Thanks. Referred back to the way you originally had it, and added books from Jackets Required. Please check. Now in a race against time (!) to find better image for infobox. Will keep you posted. Cielquiparle (talk) 16:48, 3 October 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Cleo Damianakes
&mdash; Amakuru (talk) 00:03, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

 * Hear, hear! The hook led to over 10,000 views on the day. Suprisingly, Gilbert Bundy (same day hook) had 18,000. Who would have thought that suicide would out-score sex? Edwardx (talk) 13:09, 11 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks both! @Whispyhistory
 * @Edwardx: I was going to point out that A Farewell to Arms was at ~10.7k yesterday, but Battle of Tarawa exceeded that as well at 11.7k! So when it comes to Venus and Mars, maybe War wins over Love after all. (Who writes these hooks anyway?) Congratulations on your smashing double DYK day. Cielquiparle (talk) 17:22, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

Reply to your message
Hi and thanks for the email. I'm doing ok by spending my time on off-wikipedia stuff. CT55555 (talk) 12:44, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Action Deaf Youth
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 12:02, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for October 16
An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Brendan Bechtel, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Fortune.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 05:58, 16 October 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Seven Days (magazine)
Vanamonde 12:03, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

Pronunciation of ukulele
And I just saw the article talkpage. That. Is. A. Mess. 😳

Maybe you've got an idea though (Hawaiian topics use "oo-kulele", others use the more common yew-kulele), as it doesn't look like anyone proposed it there. I'd gone out and done my due diligence, but since all the sources besides blogs etc. said "yew-kulele", it seemed fairly straightforward. Apparently it wasn't. Mako001 (C) (T)  🇺🇦 11:50, 23 October 2022 (UTC)


 * Mahalo @Mako001! It. Is. Indeed. I am now thinking of flagging it, not to the Ukulele Talk page, but to MOS:HAWAII. Cielquiparle (talk) 12:37, 23 October 2022 (UTC)
 * It definitely needs some sort of broader (and hopefully more conclusive) discussion. There are few things more frustrating than a "no consensus" for something that really needs it, one way or the other. I care less about what the consensus is, than I do about simply having one. Mako001 (C) (T)  🇺🇦 12:47, 23 October 2022 (UTC)

Women in Red
Hi there, Cielquiparle, and welcome to Women in Red. On the basis of the women's biographies you have already created and your suggestions on our talk page, you should be a useful contributor to the project. If you wish, you can add the WiR template to your user page. Please let me know if you run into any difficulties or need assistance. Happy editing!--Ipigott (talk) 14:33, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Toasting fork
— Maile (talk) 12:02, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Brendan Bechtel
Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:03, 7 November 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Meteor Studios
&mdash; Amakuru (talk) 00:02, 11 November 2022 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/Swimming with dolphins
Thanks, but you don't have to do that--oddly enough that's the second such offer I've gotten today. I don't write that many anymore anyway. But your kindness and attention can benefit the project elsewhere: if you can help getting even one old DYK nomination out of the way, that would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, and I hope you get lots of hits. Drmies (talk) 21:46, 13 November 2022 (UTC)


 * @Drmies Too late: I already did an initial review of yours immediately after I offered. Quite honestly, my heart sank when I saw what the topic was...but it is important and I realized I might as well be the one to review it. (Sorry...I should have left a message on your Talk page or pinged.) A difficult topic but I liked the structure and had a few suggestions and a question about the hook. Cielquiparle (talk) 02:47, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

Unicorns II merge
On the AFD discussion you offered assistance in the merge of the Unicorn-based short story anthologies. (Thank you for adding sources, by the way.) I've combined the two pages at Unicorns!, but that messed up some of the footnote naming/numbering. If I am being painfully honest, I admit that I'm NOT the person you want trying to fix citation errors. If you want to take a look at the merged article, I'd much appreciate it. Joyous! | Talk 17:16, 16 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks @Joyous! for merging (what a great name). Citation clash appears to be fixed now. Cielquiparle (talk) 17:47, 16 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your help! Joyous! | Talk 17:52, 16 November 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Swimming with dolphins
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:03, 18 November 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for a good one, and the extra effort you put in to make it so! Opera and Advent choral music on my talk --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:47, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Matthew Benham
— Maile (talk) 00:03, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

Thank you so much!
Hi Cielquiparle, thank you so much for your effort on the Kamifusen (duo) page! The edits you made and the sources you added are very helpful! Really, really appreciate it! Sushi114Su (talk) 01:09, 23 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Good to hear,@Sushi114Su. Thanks for going to the library and sharing what you learned and explaining so thoroughly. Made it easy to follow. Cielquiparle (talk) 10:36, 23 November 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Christian Lamb
— Maile (talk) 00:03, 26 November 2022 (UTC)

Henry D. Sokolski
I saw your comment on at User talk:Vanamonde93's about wanting to see what conversation develops about whether this article should be the target or the source for the merge. It's been over a week since the AfD close, and no one has said anything on either talk page. I think that there won't be much discussion about it unless you start it, maybe pinging some of the major contributors to the article or others who seem knowledgeable. Joyous! | Talk 16:53, 27 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks @Joyous! for following up and for the advice. I am working on some text and will try to post in the next 24 hours. Cielquiparle (talk) 20:07, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Elisabeth Griffith
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

DYK for John Cooper (New Jersey politician)
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 10 December 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Strawberry pie
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:02, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

Railway with a Heart of Gold
Hi - thanks for the review. Yes, the film is often played in the shop and cafe at the Railway, but I doubt there's any RS I could add to support that. John Snell does appear in the film - he was Driving No. 3 at the time of the derailment, and is sourced in Fuller, but at present John Snell doesn't have an article. John Bate, who later became the railway's chief engineer, also appears (they also serve who stand and bash things with hammers). Incredibly John Bate is still occasionally active on the railway. Neither of these characters have articles yet, though they should be notable enough, but I'll add them into the article as redlinks. Hope you enjoy the film! — Voice of Clam 10:08, 15 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks I just thought it was nice that The Times (25 February 2014) actually mentions Snell's appearance in the film as well: "He even took part in the film Railway with a Heart of Gold during the sequence where locomotive No. 3 is derailed. The Talyllyn and that incident were the inspiration for the hugely successful 1953 Ealing comedy The Titfield Thunderbolt." Cielquiparle (talk) 10:16, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

Happy holidays

 * Thanks @Beccaynr! All the best to you too. (Love the image on the right, reminds me of the etchings of Cleo Damianakes...) Cielquiparle (talk) 15:01, 19 December 2022 (UTC)

100 Women BBC 2022
This article needs established editor to be created Draft:Gehad Hamdy 196.153.62.147 (talk) 18:21, 19 December 2022 (UTC)


 * I'm not a reviewer, but on first glance, it looks ok, so hopefully it will get accepted sooner rather than later. Good luck! Cielquiparle (talk) 19:04, 19 December 2022 (UTC)

DYK for PEI Architects
— Maile (talk) 00:02, 23 December 2022 (UTC)

Season's greetings

 * Thank you @Whispyhistory, you are such an inspiration! Wish you all the best for the holidays as well. Cielquiparle (talk) 17:27, 24 December 2022 (UTC)

Happy Holidays

 * Thanks @Bruxton. All the best to you too! Cielquiparle (talk) 00:07, 27 December 2022 (UTC)

DYK for Ann Howard (author)
Z1720 (talk) 00:03, 27 December 2022 (UTC)

Good work
Good work with prep 6 - it is time consuming. The quirky hook is a good one too! I wanted to ask if you would copyedit this article for me. I often miss my own mistakes. There was a DYK reviewer concern that I need to address. Bruxton (talk) 15:00, 28 December 2022 (UTC)


 * @Bruxton I've now proofread. Not sure what gaps the reviewer was referring to, but maybe he means the gap between ~1912 and 1978? And/or post-1978 to present? If you can find any more info about the history of the reservoir and/or recent developments, it would probably help. Another thing I wondered was whether "Fort Casino" needs to be higher up (mentioned in the lede and/or bolded), if someone is looking for the history of Fort Casino and this is the main page. (Yes, that quirky hook is a winner!) Cielquiparle (talk) 15:17, 28 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the help. I thought it would be an easy one to DYK. Bruxton (talk) 15:56, 28 December 2022 (UTC)
 * @Bruxton Maybe you could rename the page to focus on "Collapse of the..." and reframe the lede slightly to make it clearer you're only focusing on the disaster? Cielquiparle (talk) 11:43, 29 December 2022 (UTC)