User talk:Dbachmann/archive9

Categories
A Dane had created a category named Category:Danish archaeology. I changed it into Category:Scandinavian archaeology, since there is no field of study called Danish archaeology, it is called Nordic archaeology or Scandinavian archaeology at universities. I then added a few more articles to this new category. However, this seems a bit too narrow, especially since that subsumes many Nordic Bronze Age articles under the name Scandinavian and the Nordic Bronze Age was also North German. I don't know how to solve that. Do you have any suggestions? Perhaps a Nordic Bronze Age category would do the trick?--Wiglaf 10:46, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Chalcolithic age
I notice you like this term over copper age. From what I've read in the literature, European archaeologists consistently avoid it in favor of copper age, a pattern I have scrupulously followed. Chalcolithic seems confined in usage to Middle Eastern archaeology.

I like your re-org of IE languages and of Kurgan. --FourthAve 14:04, 12 August 2005 (UTC)


 * saw your note on Minusa. Will revise accordingly. You might look at Maykop culture again. I've clarified the location, and added a bit on Gamkrelidze and Ivanov's views, which actually support your own vis-a-vis Maykop, but Mallory gives no source for his comments. I also added a paragraph about how easy it seems to be to get from Maykop (the city) by water into the Don-Donets system via the Sea of Azov. We know the IEs had boats. I find it inconceivable that they would have not traded directly with the Yamna culture. The connection would have been direct, and not hand-to-hand trading. --FourthAve 21:07, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Thanks
Thank you for supporting my nomination. AlistairMcMillan 09:31, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Kura-Araxes culture
See my discussion at Talk:Kura-Araxes_culture --FourthAve 19:32, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Mesopotamia.jpg
I've edited it a bit, and it's now at Image:Mesopotamia.PNG. I updated the link in the Mesopotamia article too. raylu 21:07, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

PIE
I have addressed your objections at Talk:Indo-European_languages. --Grzegorj 10:20, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Map
Great! Thanks Dab! I don't want to tire you with requests, but a similar map centered on the Volga would be great ... if you have the time :).--Wiglaf 15:15, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Yes, you're right :). Great! I have a set of cultures I can draw maps for now!--Wiglaf 15:32, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Swiss stone age colony in Sweden
Hi Dab, there was apparently a Swiss stone age colony in Sweden ;-).--Wiglaf 19:19, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Category EIEC
Somebody made this category defunct. Where have all my references that I no longer keep on my user page gone? This is a heavily populated category that currently grows daily. And has the person who made it go away de-red-linked this heavily populated category and otherwise re-linked it to something reasonable? And has he spoken to me about his intentions?

Tripolye culture is a mess It's now Cucuteni culture. I just left this red linked, and and a few days later it's a victim of the Balkan wars. I inserted an editorial comment into the enormous disambig paragraph.

Look into Wiglaf's mail and find a punk who stepped on my merger of the THREE Linearbandkeramik articles. Boy was I pissed. An hour of work that needed saving and this Slovak shit with limited editorial history re-moved and engaged in a pilpul just over name space: trouble is, he is unhappy that he's won (he really seems not to understand). An admin has to definitively fix Linearbandkeramik before I resume editing of the article. Yes, my feelings are hurt. And yes, the article still needs a lot of work. --FourthAve 05:39, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

paranoia
I spent so much time merging that article, and then I got stepped on, and had to do an un-redirect to save it, that I got very angry. And he really does not understand that he has won.

But I'm not gonna touch the article -- which reads like four articles badly merged together (which is exactly what it is) until a few days expire, and that I am assured the protection of Admins who understand what I'm doing. Wiglaf suggests I move the article to my own name space, so eventually I will: Linearbandkeramik (and that I can type it correctly off the top of my head is a good sign). --FourthAve 06:43, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

User:Rktect
You sound like you know Indo-European languages. Could you please take a look at Votes for deletion/3ht and User talk:Rktect and let me know if he knows what he's talking about when he says that English words like acre, "thank you" (I KNOW that's wrong), legal, regal and others derive from Ancient Egyptian? Zoe 05:50, August 15, 2005 (UTC)

Great. Thanks for your input. Zoe 06:18, August 15, 2005 (UTC)

Anitta vs Anittas
I think Anittas is the correct name to refer to the King. I'm aware that some use the name of Anitta, mostly Germans, but Anittas is the popular name. E. Britannica uses Anittas, and so do most sources.

--Anittas 08:04, August 15, 2005 (UTC)

Satem again
Hi Dab! I am not hostile towards your opinions. And believe me, I know what I am telling on Satem. Please have a look at my translation of parts of Bednarczuk's text at Wave theory discussion. And I hope it will manage to convince you that I am right. Of course, if the term "Proto-Satem" sounds false for you, propose another. My point is to underline that there are scientists who think that "Proto-Satem" (or: "Satem community") was a phenomenon of the same kind as "Proto-Indo-Iranian" or "Proto-Indo-European". Personally, I am convinced that they are right which is however unimportant for Wiki. The thing of importance is the fact that there really are such scientists, so I have been right making my addition. Finally agreed? Or should I search for other sources? Remember, I do not want to quarel. I do want the truth, like you, nothing more and nothing less. :-)

--Grzegorj 08:22, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Opposition to Islam
Hi, on Opposition to Islam I removed all of the stuff by Germen in "Ethical critism"... on the talk page I quoted his section and went through a litany of huge problems with it... I would like your comment and to know if you think I was justified. I was hoping the creation of this article would help get criticism out of the gutter but it seems it still hasn't. gren グレン 16:05, 15 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Yah, that's quite understandable... it's a shame that the good editors have less endurance for that annoying stuff than the pov warriors... There is plenty of pertinent material and since I figure enough people want to focus on the negative that maybe they can write good sections... okay, thanks for all of your past efforts.  gren グレン 16:20, 15 August 2005 (UTC)


 * :) Good luck with pointy hat, haha, that looks interesting and a rather fun non-controversial subject, enjoy and I'll see you whenever you get back. gren グレン 16:37, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Many Thanks
Thanks for supporting my RFA. It couldn't have happened without your effort. FeloniousMonk 17:03, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Adminship
Thanks Dab, but I'll pass on it for now. Being an Admin would mean I would have to hold back some of my personality traits (which we've seen occasionally). ;) Thanks though, I'll consider it in the future, Alex 23:11, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

I have the feeling some actions of mine in Wikipedia should not be tolerated in an admin, and since I don't feel like doing away with such actions yet, I shouldn't seek Wiki admin nomination. Alex 02:41, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Eidgenossenschaft
Please see Talk:Eidgenossenschaft. Lupo 06:42, August 16, 2005 (UTC)


 * BTW, why did you link "Covenant" over in Switzerland to oath? We do have an article on covenant... (Just asking, I wouldn't know which one was more appropriate. Covenant, according to our article, indeed seems to be something slightly different, but in that case, shouldn't the translation be changed to read "Oath"?) Lupo 06:46, August 16, 2005 (UTC)

Macedonia
Can you please help unprotect and restore the original article in Macedonia? I've already contacted twice the admin who protected it (because some extremist was calling it biased) but it appears that he doesn't give a crap. The Discussion is finished and it's obvious to everybody that we were dealing with a nationalist (if you don't take my word for this then ask Decius). Despite that, the article still remains protected and in the "wrong version". Miskin 13:11, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

I called it vandalism because I was 99% sure that I knew what I was dealing with, and apparently I was right. The arguments Ibinski came up with were those of a blinded nationalist who wouldn't even admit that Macedonia is a Greek word and would refer to scientifically-masked propaganda. Anyway I gave him serious responses in order to refute him, eventhough I didn't think he deserved it. Similarly I'll stop calling his edits vandalism, eventhough that's what I consider it. Anyway, thanks for paying attention to my request. Do you by any chance happen to be a francophone swiss? Miskin 14:05, 16 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Miskin, don't go overboard. Then User:Kim Bruning (et al.) will just be saying "See, I told you so! Those nationalist Greeks!" etc. etc. Decius 14:15, 16 August 2005 (UTC)


 * He won't say that. I tried to initiate a conversation with him right after he protected the article but I didn't get a response, so he obviously doesn't give a shit to think twice on the subject. Besides, calling names is one thing, backing them up is another. Miskin 14:29, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Makednoi is a Homeric word dab, there's no question on whether it's Greek or not. What should be into question is whether or not the word Makedon derives from Makednos. Herodotus' standard word to refer to Macedonians is the Greek word 'Makednoi' (plural of Makednos), so it can't just be simply a coincidence. Then again as you probably know there is the Attic-Ionic word "Mèkos", whose Doric form becomes "Makos", something which IMHO should be explicitly mentioned in the ancient Macedonian language article. Miskin 14:29, 16 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Etymology of the name of Macedonia - nice try Miskin

Don't you think you're a little bit prejudiced against me? I might have a short temper but I'm not an one-sided fool. On the subjects where I have been strong opinionated (can be given many names), it's because I was right. Miskin

Earliest spoked wheels
Hi Dab, I thought, this might interest you.--Wiglaf 17:02, 16 August 2005 (UTC)


 * What a coincidence. Sure, there are three locations on the original map. I will try with Gimp later tonight, when the family is asleep :o). Can't promise that I will make it work at once, though.--Wiglaf 17:18, 16 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Beautiful :D. I will send you a map with the locations so that you can add them.--Wiglaf 17:47, 16 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Here is a new map with the locations and names. They are from ca 2000 BC. It is great that the map has rivers, as that makes the positioning more exact.--Wiglaf 18:01, 16 August 2005 (UTC)[[Image:Spokewheellocations, 2000 BC.PNG|200px|right|thumb|earliest spoked wheels locations]]

Problem with an abusing administrator
Hi.

Please go to User:Roozbeh's page, then go to his "user contributions" section. His past 200 or so edits have ALL been nothing but following me around, and deleting the tags I already put on images I uploaded, and replacing them with fictitious copyvio tags. Here are 2 examples of the hundreds of images he is unwarrantedly deleting:


 * 1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Iran_peoples.jpg (the U Texas link at the bottom clearly states the map is free)
 * 2) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Wheel_Iran.jpg (scroll down to see the history of this picture. I CLEARLY say even what I used to take this picture with.)

What do I do with him? Is there a way to report Roozbeh? This man really is trying to flush down the toilet everything I have been doing. And it isnt his first time either. Thanx.--Zereshk 09:39, 17 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Please look closer at the wheel image page: I clearly wrote "I, Zereshk took this photo with a Sony 5.1 MegaPixel Camera" under file history. I put a GFDL tag there. He erased it!! He is an admin. It says it on his page.--Zereshk 09:51, 17 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Dab, please note Roozbeh rarely if ever provides any source to back up his claim that the images are unfree. Because he cant. I took a lot of those shots. Some I didnt, but alot I did. And those which I didnt, I felt fully justified in doing so for legal reasons which Roozbeh has chosen to dispute via backdoor negotiations and lobbying. I dont have time to sit down and properly change tags for some 200 images. At best (as his proof), he provides a link to a website which has copied off WP material, or pics which I have been putting up on other websites (such as Iranian.com). It is amusing to see Roozbeh slapping copyvio tags based on his personal whims, opinions, and interpretations of the word "provided by Zereshk". If he challenges me on a picture, it is up to him to bring me documentation that the image is not free. From the photographer or creator. Not some flimsy web link that takes its stuff from WP or from some other website who has already copied it from 15 other sites. Unfortunately, Roozbeh even goes far as to making backdoor arrangements so as to have some files, specifically be "declared" copyright violations. Not to mention that he NEVER contributes to any article, but merely tries in various ways to reduce, disintegrate, and water down articles already there, written by others. If an editor comes out opposing him, well, he sets out on a crusade to erase, tarnish, and just be a royal pain in the ass to him in every possible way until the poor shmuck "considers not editing in Wikipedia anymore" to quote his own words to me. He knows Im right about the copyright situation from Iranian sources. Yet he goes around making backdoor arrangements just to piss me off. That's just sad and pathetic.--Zereshk 03:19, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Germen on opposition to Islam
I agree that constructive edits are needed and Ril's were not... but, it is hard to be constructive to Germen's work from what I saw with it... some of them maybe, but not the ones just citing hadith. In any case I would ask that you let me revert it forcing Germen to use footnote3 style if he wants his edits shown. The page is using that style (or if he really wants he can convert to one of the other footnote styles) so he should adhere to it and possibly prove his willingness to do syntax and consistency work instead of just pushing his section. So, I ask if it is reasonable to revert it. I think you might understand why I'd feel uncomfortable editting his work which I am quite at odds with and plan to fix up (section by section). But it seems to me if he can't make it use the proper syntax then his stuff should not be allowed to screw up the footnote system. So, would it be alright to delete what does not use that system? Because, I don't want the footnotes screwed up... but that section is a travesty to encyclopedic work and I can't in good faith support it in any way. (All but what Sorna Doon did, that is) gren グレン 11:50, 17 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Oh, I come to wikipedia so I can act like a kid and complain :) ...but, one of my biggest problems with editors on Islam articles that cause problems is that all they do is make controversial edits.  Me.  Say I was viewed by all to be an apologist, at least I do lots of work with dead end pages, I translate from French at times, I create new articles... so, I am not a hindrance to wikipedia as a whole.  I am not a great editor by any means but I try to take on my share of cleanup and non-controversial help.  When users that don't do that can't even bother to have proper syntax I get rather annoyed.  In any case I placed a comment on the talk page and will place it on his talk page and then remove the parts with improper code.  So, maybe this is my little way of rebelling... but I don't want to spend undue amounts of time on opposition since I know these editors like opposition enough... I'd rather force them to do things correctly. gren グレン 13:21, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

Chariot map
Hi Dab, I think the chariot maps are excellent. I have checked with Barber's map, and the positioning appears to be spot on! I am very impressed with your drawings, and I guess you have learnt to master the Gimp.--Wiglaf 13:51, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

What chariot map? I would like to see it. --Anittas 18:26, August 17, 2005 (UTC)

Nice article. Did you draw that one by yourself? Or did you draw it by following the lines from another picture? I could use someone who knows how to draw for a project of mine... --Anittas 19:27, August 18, 2005 (UTC)

Semitic 'Ez and PIE *aig
Don't know if you've read any references on the subject, but has any linguist seen anything other than a coincidence between Semitic 'ez or az (goat), and PIE *aig-, 'goat'? The Nostratic theorists probably have (I'm not one myself). ---Decius 10:17, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

Thanks. It is probably just a coincidence. A similar form has been found (or they think they've found one) in Eteocretan. I think the form is isa in Cretan. Decius 10:37, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

Thor's hammer
Hi Dab, I remember you left an edit summary about Thor's hammer being of stone. This is probably correct, because stone age battle axes that people found were believed to be lost copies of Mjölnir. I have a book on that and when I have time, I'll add it to Mjolnir.--Wiglaf 11:31, 19 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Sorry about the accidental revert. I was laying back in my chair having my hand in a bad angle.--Wiglaf 13:46, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

Norwegian anon acting up
Do you think you could help out with a Norwegian anon who's seriously disrupting the work on Norwegian language? Personal attacks, complete disregard of sources and constant reverts. Despite long experience (close to a year) he does not seem to care for reading policy pages. Any help would be appreciated, if only to help make this a more credible RfAr...

Peter Isotalo 15:12, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

Hesychius of Alexandria
some anon added this text to wikisource, and I thought it could be you. if it is you, it would be great to indicate where the text comes from (if you scanned it yourself, or the original website) many thanks ThomasV 17:02, 20 August 2005 (UTC)

Indo-Iranians
I've spent some time on Indo-Iranians. I've commented out most of the earlier stuff, in that there is still some that can be salvaged. Also check out my Nuristani languages. Peek at the bottom of my user page. This greatly resembles your Kurgan hypothesis page; I've abandoned any attempt at explaining the kurgan waves, but have gathered together all and everything archaeologically associated with Yamna (Finally, I'm mining category EIEC). This will lead to an IE template article.

Well, dab, I'm writing the chariot-culture article. I see them as drunken Indo-Indics too soma-drenched-drunk (ephedra and cannibis) to realize they've reached the Mediterranean Sea and that there are too few to take over, but the survivors rapidly realized that, and then rapidly assimilated or otherwise got dead. Chariot culture is indeed sensational.


 * I don't understand "see also" reference to the Pamir languages in Nuristani languages. I've done some more work on Nuristani as well as Indo-Iranians. You should look at

Iranian languages which has some very strange statements about its origins. --FourthAve 18:23, 21 August 2005 (UTC)

RfAr
Yes, you're right. Thanks! I am just not familiar with the workings of the arbcom.--Wiglaf 10:21, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

User:Giglaf
LOL! Should I feel honoured by this attention from trolls, or worried?--Wiglaf 14:55, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

It might be a coincidence, but I think User:Antifinnugor returned. He also reactivated himself in HuWiki today under hu:User:Phys. -- nyenyec &#9742; 15:12, 22 August 2005 (UTC)
 * makes sense; I'm quite sure it's him then. dab (&#5839;) 15:36, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Regarding Armenian "colonization" Anatolia & Transcaucasus
My point is that if the core population are IE autochtons and he Hurro-Urartians are migrants from Caucasus what makes the European 2nd IE wave migrants to the region of Armenia the main component of Armenians just because at the time of Herodotus and later Alexander's time the language spoken was closer to Hellenic and Paleo-Balkan languages, similar clothing, arms etc. A little bit earlier same could have been said in relation to Hittites. Why assume that this particular Balkan refugees/migrants/invaders define Armenians and not say Hittites, Hayasa etc. The current passage is inaccurate and out of context as it doesn't tell the whole story. It's just not as simple as that. It's not easy but early Greek history is also a mess with both IE's and non-IE's: Minoans, tons of Pelasgians and Myceneans.--Eupator 19:39, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Kaafirphobia
Hello.

The kaafirphobia is of no significance and a relatively new invention of some stranger on the net from Malaysia that claims to be a sociologist. And the quoted sociologists are not real sociologists. Check out the reference, the name of the sociologists and User:Colin_chee. Take note that the university that he claimed to have gotten his PhD from doesn't offer PhD course in sociology. Furthermore, the university doesn't use the term faculty. It officially uses school. More on this at a blog. We could personally send an email to the university to double check that blog's assertion.

Moreover, by mindful of the url and its root directory or rather, its index page.

All this convinces me that this is a prank. If we allow this on Wikipedia, Wikipedia's reputation will be damaged. __earth 08:52, August 23, 2005 (UTC)


 * I think we misunderstood each other. The reason why I don't think the term merit inclusion is because the referred sociologists are fake, which make the reference itself untrustworthy and subsequently, the unimportance of the term. __earth 09:15, August 23, 2005 (UTC)

Hello, there is a revert war at the same page again. I'm sorry for pulling you into this. __earth 05:24, August 24, 2005 (UTC)

Flooding in Switzerland
I guess you are ok, but I saw ground floor houses flooded and cars carried away by water. Stay dry! :-) Chronographos 18:23, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Dry is a-ok but warm? In August?!?  I'm running the a/c full throttle in here!  Chronographos 19:16, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Macedonia
Hi. I see you unprotected Macedonia on 13:23, 16 August 2005. Recently I came upon this article and found an ongoing revert war, so I protected the page, and blocked User:Miskin with an expiry time of 24 hours for WP:3RR. Since I am not familiar with this dispute, I would like you to review both these actions, and revert them if you feel I was in error. Thanks. --Ryan Delaney talk 15:40, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

If I knew that dab was currently "active" I'd refer directly to him. Anyway thanks to the existence of some other neutral admins who would care to read the rules before applying actions, I managed to find justice. The article Macedonia is (again) locked in the wrong version, which according to shouldn't be, but I suppose we're going in circles until someone who gives a penny comes along. Anyways the moral of the story is one: ''Never ask for random help nor follow what you consider to be the right procedure, before all your dynamic IP reserves have run out. Miskin 16:57, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

Opposition to Islam
I know you're taking a break from Islam articles mostly but I have a question. I know when this page was created it was said that this article would be held to a higher standard so it wasn't the typical crap we had been getting. After removing another batch of references quoting hadith as their source for opposition and realizing that a bunch of others were linking to Islam Q&A (that weren't intra-Islam criticism) I realized how low, at least the ethical part, this article has sunk. In fact, on that section Ali Sina's citation is one of the best documented. In typical style it's also a laundry list. Are we going to do anything to hold this article to the level of quality they said it would be? Thanks gren グレン 08:34, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

The um... report, and stuff :)
Man, that report was fun! :)))

I couldn't agree more on your attitude towards the naming issue. (That'be predictable given the fact that I am a Macedonian myself, no?) It is stupid as hell, as it is stupid the "I am the real son of Alexander" attitude among both nations and their efforts to prove that. I am amazed that some Greeks get to be annoyed by the very mentioning of the Republic of Macedonia, to that extent. I mean, my girlfriend got sacked from her summer job in Greece just because when she was asked where she was from, she responded: "Macedonia". "Either you say you're from FYROM or Skopja, or we cut of our collaboration." (!) On the other hand, there are some Macedonians who try to convince me that Alexander the Great was in fact a Slav, or actually a "proto-Slav" (:D), and find my resistance to their attitude on the Macedonian Wikipedia, as an act of "betrayal".
 * This goes to prove to you that we are also sensitive in that matter (imagine that!). I would fire her too, if I were her boss, just as I would fire her if I didn't like her perfume or if I thought her haircut was inappropriate for a doctor's office.  Simple as that.  This is capitalism you know: a business is owned by its owner, not co-owned by the owner and the employees.  She has no inherent and inalienable right to employment in Greece - in other words Greece does not owe her or you a living.  You will have to earn your living yourselves, just like anybody else.  If you come asking me for a job, you can have it by my terms, not yours.  If you don't like that, it's "nice to meet you, now go elsewhere".  The concept is called "a free market".  Chronographos 13:54, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * And let us for a moment suppose that those who claim Alexander the Great as a Slav are correct: this would make him the most glorious and important Macedonian Slav in history. If therefore "Slav" is an insult for your people, how come they want to claim Alexander as one?  If "Slav" is an insult to them, isn't it also an insult to Alexander?  This reinforces my point: that this touchy-feely crap about how "insulting" the Slav designation is, is nothing more than a well-orchestrated PR affair in the finest Communist tradition.  Chronographos 23:25, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Alexander is every bit as glorious Mehmed the Conqueror, no doubt. But let no Greek who glorifies the conquests of Alexander bemoan the conquests of the Ottomans, that would really be a double standard. dab (&#5839;) 16:06, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * It's only the stupid assumption that ethnicity and nationality strech back to eternity unchanged. (It is called "nationalism") There is an another line also claiming that the Slavic invasions didn't happen. (:D) And again, I don't find the "Slav" ancestry insulting, in itself, (I don't believe that the Slavs remained an isolated tribe, though) but the fact that somebody intereferes with my right to state my national identity as I want. I don't mind if Macedonians of Greece use it, and I don't find their existence as a threat. I even don't mind if they use it in terms of nationality, but they don't. BTW, excuse my red scum mindset, but are you acquainted with the concept of "labor rights", or that concept didn't managed to reach the "west"? --FlavrSavr 13:18, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Absolutely. If your girlfriend believed that her labor rights were violated, she could have gone to the courts and claimed her due.  Of course for her claims to be admissible for adjudication, she would have had to possess a visa that allowed her to work in the EU, registered with the Greek Internal Revenue Service so that her earnings would be taxed per Greek law, etc etc.  If all these conditions were met, I am surprised she did not pursue the issue.  If on the other hand she had a tourist visa and wanted a free vacation with some pocket money on the side, then it's "no can do". Chronographos 13:31, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * So, in other words, her employer is employing her illegally? --FlavrSavr 17:55, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * If she did come here on a tourist visa and did not register with the IRS and Social Security, yes, he did employ her illegally. And she got exactly what she bargained for.  If the matter were brought to court, he would have to pay the monies (employer contribution) he did not pay to Social Security plus a fine on top, and she would be deported for violating immigration laws and the Schengen treaty, and denied reentry.  This is the law of the land and the Union.  If you don't like it, stay away.  Chronographos 18:38, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

However, I disagree that "Macedonian Slavs" is the "perfect dissambiguation term" as you put it, because there are actually other Slavic-speaking peoples in the region, namely, the Bulgarians and Serbs, so the "Macedonian Slavs" applies to them, as well. Confusion between Ancient Macedonians and Macedonians can be avoided with the "Ancient" prefix (I mean seriously, does some one actually confuse modern Egyptians with the builders of the Pyramids). Confusion with the other inhabitants of the wider region of Macedonia (although I think that "confusion" is overblown by Greek nationalists) can be avoided with by naming the article Macedonians (nation), Macedonians (people), Macedonians (nationality),etc. Then again, you have those other encyclopedias (except MSN Encarta) that refer to "Macedonians" as "Macedonians". Also, nobody confuses the modern Macedonian language with the Ancient Macedonian language. The Naming dispute proposal policy is also in "our" favour.
 * Except the Serbs and Bulgarians in Macedonia do not call themselves plain "Macedonians", so this horrific potential confusion you are so afraid of actually only arises in your head: not in real life. Chronographos 13:54, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Humm, correct me if I am wrong, but don't Greeks use it as a regional identifier, the same way the Bulgarians do? So, again, it is not plain Macedonians (in terms of nationality) --FlavrSavr 13:18, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Really? What is it then? Chronographos 13:36, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * It is obvious, they use Greek as a national and Macedonian as a regional identifier. Same applies to Bulgarian Macedonians. There isn't much difference, really. --FlavrSavr 17:55, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Playing dumb, huh? Chronographos 18:38, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

Well of course, naming someone a "Slav" isn't a racial slur, in the sense that "nigger" is, but it is offensive (I call it a "mild" ethnic slur) to name a modern nation with the "Slav" suffix as if they were these axe wielding, red haired savages that are somehow alien to the region, even if the Slavs arrived here 14 centuries ago, and practically mixed with the local inhabitants for centuries... I find comparable with French Celts (for the French), Portuguese Latins (for the Portuguese), Russian Slavs, Dutch Saxons... so it's really quite dumb, even dumber than the name of the Republic issue.
 * Again, Mr. Strawman has a field day: there are no other Celts who call themselves French besides the French ones, no other Latins who call themselves Portuguese besides the Portuguese ones,, no other Slavs calling themselves Russians besides the Russian ones, and no other Saxons calling themselves Dutch besides the Dutch ones. There are however 2.5 million Macedonian Greeks, connected by language and culture to the millennia-old history and culture of Macedonia, who have feelings too, and the right to protect their identity. Chronographos 13:54, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * "No other Slavs calling themselves Russians besides the Russian ones" What? See, that's my problem - Slavs are not a nationality, they are only a group of peoples. --FlavrSavr 13:18, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * That's the consequence of your choosing the name in the first place, without regard to how other Macedonians feel. You could bypass the issue by calling yourselves "Slavomacedonians" (one word) for example.  But no, you'd rather have your cake and eat it too Chronographos 13:35, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Again, Wikipedia should not attempt to say which side is right or wrong. However, the fact that the Cabindans call themselves Cabindans is objectively true – both sides can agree that this does in fact happen – whereas the claim that the Cabindans have no moral right to that name is purely subjective and is not a question that Wikipedia can, or should, decide. --FlavrSavr 17:55, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

I personally find it hard to accept that someone actually is convincing Macedonians that they shouldn't find the "Macedonian Slavs" term offensive, when they actually do find it offensive. I don't know, and I am not even interested why the Roma people find the "Gypsies" term offensive, but they do, and therefore, I am not using it. It's as simple as that. BBC, for example, formally apologized for using that term.
 * So, only your feelings matter, huh? They are somehow special feelings.  Chronographos 13:54, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

Now, I am not accusing you for saying that (and I am not a Human Rights organization, as well :)), but I would like to know your opinion about the above said. Don't ignore me, pretty please with cheese on top! --FlavrSavr 11:23, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

well, I cannot solve these bilateral antipathies for you, so my stance should really be seen strictly confined to the purpose of writing an Encyclopedia in the English language. The naming dispute is notable, no doubt, and should probably get its own article. But it ends there, remaining terminology will be dictated by current usage in English. "Slavic", like "Greek" is primarily a linguistic term, and has little to do with red hair, nose shapes, or choice of battlefield implements. In that sense, the French are "Romance", not "Celtic" (except for a few Bretons), although they have Celtic ancestry, and the USians are "Germanic" (more precisely, "Anglo-Saxon"), just like the English. Thus, there is the FYROM/RoM, which is predominantly "Slavic" (it's official language being Slavic Macedonian), and the Greek area (three principalities peripheries) of Macedonia, inhabited by Greek Macedonians, seeing that the official (and predominant) language is "Greek", the "Attic" koini neoelliniki. If Greeks use "Slav" as a slur, and Slavs use "Greek" as a slur, that is their problem, but we cannot consider the term a slur for the purposes of this Encyclopedia. dab (&#5839;) 14:12, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I understand. However, there are other Encyclopedias in the English language that refer to this nationality as "Macedonians", plain and clear and here's a full list of them (actually the only encyclopedia that refers to them as Macedonian Slavs is MSN Encarta). Also, isn't it rather strange that a major, English media outlet such as the BBC apologizes to them for calling them Macedonian Slavs? Isn't it also strange that the Greek Helsinki Watch calls them ethnic Macedonians ? Now, dab, that was my whole point - the official language of RoM is not called "Slavic Macedonian" it is "Macedonian", the same way their official self identifying term (as well as how are they reffered to in every international organization) is "Macedonians", not "Macedonian Slavs". There is a problem when the term "Slavs" is used as an ethnic designation - there is no such ethnicity, nor nationality named "Slavs", so the slur parallel really doesn't work just because of that - while "Greek" (when used in ethnic terms) is a nationality, "Slavs" or "Slavic" isn't. Moreover, how come Wikipedia does not refer to modern Egyptians as Egyptian Arabs, or Arabic Egyptians (their official language being Arabic)? --FlavrSavr 13:18, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * This from Bill Buckley's National Review Online, a source of impeccable conservative credentials (for whatever that's worth to anyone): "For the ultimate logic of a regime of group rights inevitably fractures political communities into ever-smaller — and ever-more antagonistic — sub-units, as individuals seek out the company and protection of their own kind. It leads, in other words, to situations like the violent disintegration of Yugoslavia in the 1990s, a disaster with which we both have much unhappy experience at first hand. As the former president of Macedonia (Todor -sic - Gligorov), summed it up in this chilling aside: "Why should I be a minority in your country when you can be a minority in mine?" Chronographos 15:49, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Don't ever believe anything you read in that neocon rag!--Theathenae 16:22, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Are you doubting the veracity of the quote? Chronographos 16:34, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * great quote. I have sympathies for the RoMian quest for nationhood. "Slav" isn't a nation, it's a linguistic family (much like Alamannic). "Macedonian" isn't a nation, it's a geographical designation (much like Alpine). "Slavic Macedonian" however, must make do as a term for a young nation, for lack of a better one. If there wasn't the ingenious "Swiss", I would have to call myself an "Alpine Alaman", too. The RoM would be well advised to look for some neologism to refer to their nationhood, along the lines of "Swiss", be it "Romian" or "Skopian" or whatever. Until they do, they will have to be content with "Slavic Macedonian" or "Macedonian Slav" as the only really unambiguous one. In fact, if "Romian", an acronym with an imperial chime to it, isn't cool enough, how about Slavedonians, Severomakedons, or Slavomacedons indeed? Think about it, these can be cool self-designations if chosen by the people themselves. dab (&#5839;) 15:58, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

Some points

 * I've never heard of a Macedonian president named Todor Gligorov. Nevermind that. Before we get off topic (again) I'd like to point some things (sorry to interrupt your naming spree :D, How about SlavoMacDaddys?):
 * Dab, could you please answer the questions I have asked you :)?
 * Excuse me, but "Macedonian" is a nation. (If you apply that logic Egyptian isn't a nation, it's a geographic region, so let's name them Egyptian Arabs) That't the whole point. Macedonians have officially declared themselves as Macedonians for over 60 years, and had their Republic (allthough with the Socialistic Federative add-on) and nobody really objected. While the name of the Republic of Macedonia is a matter of international dispute, the name of the nation "Macedonians" isn't. They exist as such on international documents as well in works of reference, not to mention that they are commonly referred to by the term "Macedonians" for 60 years. That cannot be said for Bosniaks who identified themselves as Bosnian Muslims until the 1990's. However, even if they did declare themselves only for this 10 years, still (see the below point)
 * Citing Naming dispute: Wikipedia should not attempt to say which side is right or wrong. However, the fact that the Cabindans call themselves Cabindans is objectively true – both sides can agree that this does in fact happen – whereas the claim that the Cabindans have no moral right to that name is purely subjective and is not a question that Wikipedia can, or should, decide. Wikipedia is descriptive, not prescriptive. That is precisely why Wikipedia refers to Republic of China as such even at the expense of ambiguity with the PRC, and even if the both sides are involved, in not only a naming dispute, but also a territorial dispute (of much bigger geopolitical importance, I might add). We might have an entire article that they do, or do not have the right to call themselves as such, but, we should stick to the name the use for themselves which also happens to be the term that every international institution, (including the UN), government, most major news outlets, and as well encyclopedias use. It is also in direct opposition of the NPOV policy, as I will explain in the following point.
 * Chronographos, I don't beleive that Britannica, as well most of these encyclopedias (except MSN encarta), nor these international organizations are as much popular as Britney Spears is. However, even if I am bringing "popularity" to the scene that still is an argument for using the term "Macedonians" (with the proper disambiguation) - because (citing the NPOV policy): "Articles that compare views need not give minority views as much or as detailed a description as more popular views." Naming them "Macedonian Slavs" is very much reflecting the minority view (not in ethnic terms), even if we assume that it is the true ("the perfectly dissambiguating term" as dab put it). The majority of international institutions, (including the UN), governments, most major news outlets, and as well encyclopedias refer to Macedonians as Macedonians (even if we disagree that they shouldn't do so). The most common name for the ethnic group in question as we can see in Zocky's Google test (which is also a valid proof for determining the popularity of terms - see Google test). So obviously, Chronographos, you're not only making generalizations, but you're also not acquainted with the ways Wikipedia actually works.
 * As for your "No compromise whatsoever" that "people like FlavrSavr" pursue - let me remind that the same NPOV policy which in your opinion is confusing an encyclopedia with the "Top of the Pops" clearly states that: "the NPOV policy is absolute and non-negotiable".
 * To conclude, your claim that Macedonian Slavs is the "perfect disambiguation term" is reflecting a minority POV (even if we accept that it is the true one). The best disambiguation terms, IMHO, are "Macedonians (nation)", "Macedonians (people)", "Macedonians (nationality)". All confusion with the other meanings of this word can be easily avoided in prose. There should also be a separate part, or article dealing with this naming issue.
 * Now, if you excuse me, I have some serious studying to do. --FlavrSavr 19:29, 29 August 2005 (UTC)


 * How about Вардарија, or, if one must hark back to antiquity, Пеонија?--Theathenae 16:22, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Macedonia secunda isn't bad either :) Would that be Vtoromakedons or similar? Or, if "2nd" is somehow humiliating, what about Novomakedons or even Yuvomakedons? I opt for Yuvomakedons! That's a great ethnonym, from Yugo- to Yuvo-, how about that! dab (&#5839;) 16:26, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Anything containing Macedonia is unoriginal, really. I say go for something radical and innovative. How about an international naming competition? ;P--Theathenae 16:36, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Except your arguments don't count for people like FlavrSavr. He wants everything, his way.  No compromise whatsoever.  He insists not on clarity but on "popularity" (the way he defines it, of course).  He is confusing an encyclopedia with the "Top of the Pops".  If there is any popular, majority world view about the matter, it is this one: no one really gives a damn. Except for the people really affected by it.  And there is only room for popularity where it suits him: his own country, not the whole region.  Look at the pitiful original vote on the issue.  What happened to the "disclaimer in the first sentence"?  Oh, well that was 2 years ago, no one remembers it.  So let's keep what's ours and attack that God-forsaken "consensus" with an ... edit war!  Hoorayyyyy ....  Salami tactics, that's what it is.  If you cannot stuff someone with the whole salami, slice it and do it bit by bit.  Stalin would be oh so proud ... Chronographos 16:30, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

you, sir, are a great editor in terms of knowledgeability and humoristic value, but sometimes you really are asking for trouble. I can hear Sterbinski now, "the Greeks admitted to using Stalami tactics! Bloody fascists!" :)
 * Yes, but will it earn me a one-way free trip to The Hague? Will it be on Helios Airlines?????  Chronographos 17:30, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * No regard for their feelings, huh? You, sir, are a callous, ruthless sadist!  Chronographos 14:22, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

re, the "gypsies" term, it is easily avoided, and it is a misnomer anyway (assuming Egyptian origin of the Roma, while they are from India originally). "Slav" is quite a proud self-designation, otoh, stemming from slava glory. And the English term "Greek" was imposed on the poor Hellenes, but it is still the current English term, and attempts by Greeks to introduce "Hellenic" as a synonym have failed so far, since "Hellenic" is already an adjective, but with another scope, referring to the Greek culture of (pre-)Classical Antiquity, and not to modern Greeks. My point is that the Greeks would have much more reason to object to their designation in English than the Slavs do. dab (&#5839;) 15:28, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * We are kind of resigned to it. Nevertheless all official documents in English etc always refer to the "Hellenic Republic", and to the "Kingdom of Hellas"/"King of the Hellenes" before that.  Obviously the usages Ελλάς/άδα, Έλλην/ας/ίς/ίδα, Ελληνικός/ή/ό are universal in Greek.  And to think that poor Sterbinski was sharp in his retort: "Alexander did not spread Greek culture, he spread the Hellenic one" !!!! :-)))) Chronographos 15:58, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * good old Sterbinski! what a pity to lose that flower of Macedonian intelligentsija for Wikipedia :) dab (&#5839;) 16:58, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Have you seen this?? "We would like to ask you to allow us to put your accountas potential contact of any possible research in the future of our organizations, concerning this issue. This means that, if you give us your aprovement, we will send a recomendation to our centre to contact you (between the others) if they decided such a contact is necesary. Also, we would like to point out that we won't reveal publicaly any information or critics towards Wikipedia before first contacting the leaders of this project. Please, if possible, send us your answer in the next 20 minutes, because that is our timeline that we have to respect. Thank you once again, I sterbinski 01:26, 28 August 2005 (UTC)" !!!

I wonder what would happen to a Greek employee if he told his Skopjan employer that Macedonia was Greek?--Theathenae 20:11, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
 * What's wrong with you, imagining hypothetical situations? Are you turning into FlavrSavr or something?  What Greek in his/her right mind would ... migrate to ... Skopje to look for a ... job?!?!?!  Chronographos 22:39, 28 August 2005 (UTC)


 * dab, let me apologize for even giving the incentive for turning your page into a forum. You can see who's picking straws and who isn't, at the Macedonian denar discussion, if you're interested. Chronographos, please stop stalking me. --FlavrSavr 02:28, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Nobody is stalking you, FlavrSavr. Dab and I collaborate wonderfully on a variety of articles which are way beyond your ken, and I have been monitoring his talk page for that matter.  Your sense of self-importance is rather revealing, I must say. Chronographos 09:26, 29 August 2005 (UTC) (Let the record show that you choose to attack the messenger rather than respond to the message, i.e. answer my arguments with counter-arguments of your own)
 * You seem know much about my ken, Chronographos. It's only your arrogance that have led you to defend such a silly position on the disclaimer. Could you explain me again, what's the difference between a US dollar and an American dollar? However, the others participants in the debate, seem to be equally unimpressed of Pallas Athene's self esteem. --FlavrSavr 13:18, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * That the former is the official name whereas the latter is the common one. Rather simple, really ... Chronographos 13:31, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Simple indeed. But even with the FYRO add-on the name is still Macedonia. We don't use Kingdom of Sweden's krona, am I wrong? No, your argument is based on the fact that Wikipedia used United States dollar, because American dollar will be "confusing" or only a "convienience name" (although the opening lines of the article are "United States" or "American dollar). And how come Wikipedia is naming Republic of China as such? --FlavorSavore 19:29, 29 August 2005 (UTC)


 * look it up: ambiguity. The Suiones have no currency in circulation. You wouldn't want people to mistake the post-1991 RoM with the pre-1991 YROM, Greek West Macedonia, the Roman province of Macedonia, or Macedon, would you? Unfortunately, the adjective "Macedonian" applies to all of them. On top of ambiguity, common use. I suppose "American Dollar" would be unambiguous enough, it just so happens that "US Dollar" is both unambiguous and in common use. or this reason, I endorse "Macedonian denar", but I disendorse terms like "Macedonian culture", "Macedonian territory" etc. when referring to the RoM. dab (&#5839;) 19:50, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * You have struck bullseye. Chronographos 20:02, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * you will note to my credit, I trust, FlavrSlavr, that I have just gotten Chronographos to accept "Macedonian denar". This, the annoying Swiss art of compromise, cuts both ways, though :) dab (&#5839;) 20:20, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I trust you do not suffer from premature ejaculation. The currency you refer to is next in importance to the Mauritius Rupee (no disrespect to the wonderful Mauritians).  It could be called a sestertius for all I care.  FlavrSavr's country, like Albania and Bulgaria, lives on Euro invoices anyway.  10% of FYROM citizens have applied for Bulgarian citizenship.  The Albanians are protected by peacekeepers.  EU membership is as far away as the Galactic Republic.  Therefore I predict that FlavrSavr will not yield a single inch of ground.  He's got nothing else to hold on to.  Just you wait and see.  Chronographos 21:04, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * well, so? They still have a currency. Besides, contemporary Greece isn't exactly the apex of civilization itself. It may be doing pretty well compared to its neighbors, but after having spent a night in a Thessaloniki police station, I am less than impressed by their idea of law and order. I wouldn't have preferred to spend that night in an Anatolian police station, to be sure, but that's beside the point. dab (&#5839;) 05:30, 30 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I have this friend, who is a music producer. He is also big on warez.  He is online pals with this German guy, who used to live and work in LA for 20 years as an Information Technology company owner and had a huge, private FTP server hosting warez.  The German guy's visa expires by mistake, police knock on his door the next morning, handcuff him, drag him to the station, and hand him a 48-hour deportation notice.  He scrambles through his lawyers, but to no avail (BTW police know nothing about his warez server, so it's unrelated).  The day after the next he has to pack and, with his American wife and their two American-born underage children, board a plane to Frankfurt under police escort; their house, belongings and financial assets all left behind.  What does this teach you about US law enforcement?  Just about what you said above.  What do all these have to do with FlavrSavr's intrasingence?  Absolutely nothing  :-))) Chronographos 06:27, 30 August 2005 (UTC) (BTW what did you do to get you arrested, you bum?)
 * And to get back on topic, see this and this, and tell me what you think. Chronographos 06:36, 30 August 2005 (UTC)
 * precisely my point, what does the RoM GNP have to do with adjectives? The USA is, of course, turning into God's banana republic as we speak, no doubt about that :) dab (&#5839;) 06:50, 30 August 2005 (UTC)
 * It's just one of the factors I use in my analysis in order to predict FlavrSavr's stance. Let's see who will prove the more accurate in his predictions :-) Chronographos 07:01, 30 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Am I a prophet or what? Instead of trying to compromise along the lines you laid out, he ... asked the same questions all over again!  :-))))  Chronographos 17:58, 30 August 2005 (UTC)  (BTW I did not mean to "beat you to it" by answering him there myself)
 * Do you plan to answer yourself, or have you lost interest? In the former case I'd rather wait for your response and then lay out mine.  Unlike FlavrSavr, I'm not interested in the monopolization of issues. Chronographos 09:12, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
 * That's a pity, given your token neutrality and linguistic background. Chronographos

Hurricane Katrina
I have two old friends and colleagues who live in New Orleans. Both fled in time with their families: one to Baton Rouge and the other to Atlanta. And there they are, not knowing whether their houses still exist, and not even being able to find out if they do! Chronographos 18:06, 30 August 2005 (UTC)
 * And I had my share of trouble too: a faulty Serial ATA card put 2 hard disks out of commission and killed my Windows. It happened most inopportunely as this is the time of the year I rely most on my PC for work, so I had to scramble together some leftover IDE disks and prop up an OS to take care of due reports and stuff.  I hope to get a spanking new PC next week (how does an AMD X2 with liquid cooling and Windows 64 sound? :-))) ) and get things in order so that I can try to salvage my data from the dead disks.  Fortunately critical data were properly backed up in Firewire external disks, so workflow was not significantly interrupted, but entertainment certainly was.  BTW my friends' houses near New Orleans only had some minor tree damage.   One of them, who is an amateur pilot, hired a Cessna and flew over just to make sure!  The area had not flooded at all, being above sea level.
 * They will eventually have to relocate regardless, as the area is financially and ecologically doomed. Being medical subspecialists, they will not have trouble finding royally-paying jobs elsewhere in the States, but the kids' schooling will be severely disrupted and they will lose a lot of money selling their houses.  Chronographos 10:07, 7 September 2005 (UTC)
 * Actually schooling is a bigger problem than it looks: for us Europeans public schools are generally decent and quite alike one another in academic achievement, and private schools are easy to come by if one can afford them. Not so in the States: public schhols are the pits, and private schools are mostly denominational or downright religious.  They both had considerable trouble finding good non-denominational private schools within a manageable distance from home.  As a matter of fact one of them is thinking of shipping his daughter to Greece, to stay with the grandparents and go to an American school in Athens until the end of the semester at least.  This way she'll get full accreditation for her courses and return when the family is settled.  Day-to-day life in the States is not as trouble-free as it often looks, even without hurricanes demolishing cities. Chronographos 15:50, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

Dolgoruki
Since you have participated in "Use English" talks, please visit Talk:Ekaterina Dolgorukova to contribute to the current poll. 217.140.193.123 06:07, 31 August 2005 (UTC)


 * that's beside the point. Dolgorutski is not "English" for Dolgorukoi. The change was, rather, some unfathomable decision by a translator. Another translator will use Dolgorukoi, and a third, grand-duke Longarm. dab (&#5839;) 08:51, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
 * (the above reply is re Talk:Erast Fandorin) dab (&#5839;)

My dispute with Zeresk
Hi. I answered your message on my talk page. roozbeh 11:00, September 1, 2005 (UTC)

User categorisation
You were listed on the Wikipedians/Switzerland page as living in or being associated with Switzerland. As part of the User categorisation project, these lists are being replaced with user categories. If you would like to add yourself to the category that is replacing the page, please visit Category:Wikipedians in Switzerland for instructions. --Army1987 14:11, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Costa del Azahar
See my article on Peñiscola. The subject was as funny in 1911 as it is today. So I treated it with all the sober factuality they did. It's actually a good article. It took me a long time to figure out where the actual municipality was. Red Bull is a pretty phallic brand name; I imagine someone is squatting on the ever more phallic brand name cum registered trademark Peniscola as a brand-name of a cola. I must say, as an American, the first time I saw the toponym, I mis-scanned it initially as "Pensacola", as in Pensacola, Florida. English deserves a good Costa del Azahar article, tho' my research indicates it's rather downmarket tourist destination. I'm simultaneously posting this on Dab's and Wiglaf's page. --FourthAve 06:48, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

Asatru
Hi, I'm new here, so please excuse me if I'm asking something obvious... but... I'm wondering why the Asatru page was merged with Germanic neopaganism, where it seems like Germanic neopaganism is more of a catagory of several related articals. Dsmouse 17:17, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

adminship
No one's ever offered to nominate me for adminship before; I'd be honored! --Angr/undefined 14:28, 3 September 2005 (UTC)
 * I know, and have now done so. --Angr/undefined 15:40, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

pelekus and labrys
We can't just drop pelekus out entirely, can we? if that's the usual Classical Greek term for a double-headed axe. So I added your comment into the text as a stop-gap, but when you have time, would you discuss pelekus at Labrys, since you find they are not equivalent? --Wetman 10:32, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

IVC
I looked at the article. I can find the same figure elsewhere online, and similar figures as well. I'm pretty sure it's been reported in the literature just on that basis. I don't have any familiarity with the source material, though. So I would probably try to find out who originally added that fact, and get a cite from him or her.

I think the stated measurement is overly precise, but given a material as easy to work as ivory, it's not too hard to produce a scale with a high degree of accuracy. The trick isn't to produce one scale, it's to produce identical scales over a long period of time, of course...

Ken talk 23:04, September 6, 2005 (UTC)

Responded on my talk. Ken talk 22:39, September 7, 2005 (UTC)

My RFA
Hi, thanks for voting for me in my RFA. I was really touched at how many people voted for me! --Angr/undefined 22:45, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Cimmerians
Hi - on Proto-Celtic language you added "Historically, the date of 800 BC would fit with the migrations of the Cimmerians (variously claimed as ancestors of the Cimbri, Sugambri, Cymru)." Could you add a reference where a named author claims this? I can see the first two, but the Cimmerians as ancestors of the Cymru (and thus, previously of all the Brythonic peoples?) seems a stretch. --Nantonos 03:29, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

Articles for deletion/Expansion theory
Just thought you'd like to know I admire your passionate and well argued defence of this article. I hate to kill a potentially good article, although in this case I fear that it's probably only a case of vanity publishing by a man prepared to go to great lengths to promote the book. I just cannot find much in the way of significant notice for this book. The Yorkshire Post really does seem to be the zenith of this book's reach. But I could be wrong. --Tony Sidaway Talk 19:59, 14 September 2005 (UTC)

==Request for comment on User:Garywbush Hi, just though you'd like to know that I've created a reqeust for comment about sockpuppetry and Garywbush's conduct in relation to the article Kafir at Requests for comment/Garywbush 80.45.115.110 13:07, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

Abuse
Hey, I want to ask you something. What can I do, to stop an Admin harassing me? This guy ridicules my English skills and he reverts (sometimes he edits) my text. Recently he reverted my personal talkpage. He follows me around and 'corrects' my English by editing articles that I've started. I emailed info-en@wikimedia.org, but so far, I got no reply. Any suggestions?

Thanks! --Anittas 22:48, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

.
Dbachmann, thanks for the message about the Gothic "a" and the runic character, I didn't even know templates like that were possible. Crypticfirefly 02:57, 23 September 2005 (UTC)

..
Don't all admins have the ability to see the IP adress hiding behind an editor's username? I'd like to give you the usernames of a certain editor who I suspect to be editing articles under multiple identities. This will help to put an end to many edit wars so would you help me? PS, I might have accidentally spread some unicode garbage in your page, so you might want to revert my edit. Miskin 13:56, 27 September 2005 (UTC)

Samhain
Hi Dbachmann. Looking in the edithistory of Samhain I see here that on 15:25, 21 June 2005 you added some text about Coligny. Could I ask what your sources were? In particular: In general, I think that using specific terms s uch as Coligny calendar, mediaeval irish calendar, is better than using vague terms like "the ancient celtic calendar" because the two systems may not have been the same and our sources about them are very different.
 * equating Samonios (which means summer month) to Irish Samhain is popular, but has been challenged;
 * starting the month at full moon is a popular claim, especially in Neopagan writings; ancient writers however state that the dark of the moon (Caesar), or the "sixth day" of the moon (first quarter?)(Pliny, Natural History) was the start

Comments on WP:AN/I
There's was a message posted on WP:AN/I that was signed with your username. Were you not logged in, or is someone impersonating you while you're on wikivacation? TenOfAllTrades(talk) 18:01, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

EU
No, the idea that US was a part of Europe geographically or culturally was not my argument, although I wouldn't agree that there is a "European" something, I guess you mean culture, that uniformly and uniquely characterizes the "geographic" Europe--although there may be general differences with the United States within most cultures (and like you said I agree Americans and Europeans would both acknowledge the existence of a distinct American cultural identity; we have had centuries to create it in a unified political state and in a different economic and physical environment). But you can much more coherently create a genealogy of a culture loosely called Western and Christian than one of European. And even perhaps within it, the UK has more in common culturally with the US (and especially Australia and Canada) than it does with Orthodox and formerly Ottoman and then Communist Bulgaria, for example. And wouldn't you agree that the Ukraine as a whole has more in common with Russia than Catholic and Protestant Europe at this point?

My argument is that one cannot say that anything that ever happended in the European landmass should be considered the exclusive heritage of the European Union with its fetishistic use of the cliche of "Europe". If Switzerland is not a part of the European Union, how can the EU's leaders use this rhetoric then? Your ideas about "ceasing to be European" or what it means to be "un-American" are perhaps the more bigoted ideas, although I won't try to jump to conclusions as you seem a bit wont to do. I won't argue with your point about the name of the country because it has been beaten to death. However, I will admit to the contradiction that the United States originally took this name because it saw its claims about republicanism and anti-colonialism as the future of the Americas, perhaps like the EU sees the goals of its project for the European landmass with whatever its core values are. So, ironically, maybe we are actually in total agreement without realizing it. Perhaps both of us will have to rethink... Tfine80 17:24, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

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Worrisome Swastika Article "Happy Tones" Comment from May 2005
I would be more careful about promoting the use of the swastika. Its a very sensitive issue. Please take care; it seems like you are a productive Wikipedian and it wouldn't do for such a person to be criticized or censured for participating in a discussion. Religious symbols can be incredibly important and it isn't seemly to be callous or offhand about such things in a workspace such as Wikipedia. Thanks for reading. Take care. --McDogm 13:12, 19 October 2005 (UTC)

Happy Tones
Um, I don't really have the energy to change the swastika article. That would be a lot of work. It just seemed that the writers were ignorant of the symbol's basic culture. Asians are up a tree at this point due to the events in Europe during the last century. That symbol is on every road map (indicating shrine, temple, holy mountain, monastery, seminary, etc) and is displayed at said shrines and temples and holy mountains. Its a public relations boondoggle for the tourist industry. Like they don't have enough problems already. Its really difficult to talk about, so I really am not putting any energy into developing any ideas for the article per se. I had just thought to say something positive about the situation without upsetting anyone. Technically I am not a semiotics expert； if I were I suppose I would have something to say. --McDogm 12:31, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Happy Tones
Um, I don't really have the energy to change the article. That would be a lot of work. It just seemed that the writers were ignorant of the symbol's basic culture. Asians are up a tree at this point due to the events in Europe during the last century. That symbol is on every road map (indicating shrine, temple, holy mountain, monastery, seminary, etc) and is displayed at said shrines and temples and holy mountains. Its a public relations boondoggle for the tourist industry. Like they don't have enough problems already. Its really difficult to talk about, so I really am not putting any energy into developing any ideas for the article per se. I had just thought to say something positive about the situation without upsetting anyone. Technically I am not a semiotics expert； if I were I suppose I would have something to say. --McDogm 12:32, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

RFA
Dbachmann, thanks for your constructive comments on my RFA. If you ever need anything, don't hesitate to ask. See you around. &mdash;thames 18:35, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

More Happy Tones
For some reason my prior comment was posted twice. At any rate, I think your last comment on User:McDogm is very good, and sound, but I actually don't think I edited the Swastika page itself. I checked through Page History there and didn't see anything by McDogm; I am pretty sure I remember not actually going into the article; it happened to be the day it was featured on the Main Page. I really don't feel qualified to edit that article. So, I would have to close by saying that I really made my Swastika:Talk comment to bolster the positive image the symbol has in Asia, as I have some experience studying over there. It really seems like a hot issue to me, so I am a bit trepidatious myself about joining the discussion any more deeply. I wish I had more to add, but I don't. Cheers! --McDogm 20:05, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Re: Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Threat
I've responded to the link above, and I thank you for the comment. I readily admit that i'm not the nicest person in the world to those who are not nice to others, but i'm not going to give up on trying to reform him into a civil user. Let's just say the "sheriff" is in town ;-) Karmafist 14:38, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Good point, I definately need to work on being more detached, both on here and in the real world. Ultimately, my goal is to try and reform Pig if possible though, thus the entry at the bottom of the WP:AN/I page after he sent me the threatening e-mail. People like him will be good practice for even tougher civility cases (which btw, was the cause for the block -- a vio of WP:CIVIL,WP:WQT and Key Policy #4 of WP:RULES). I didn't fight it afterwards because I figured he'd just become more uncivil afterwards, a case similiar to that of 68.174.131.197. If you can help me reach that goal of becoming a better independent dispute mediator, please feel free to send the comments over. Right now, I think the Dispute Resolution process is too bureaucratic to truly be effective.Karmafist 18:58, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
 * I have sent you no threatening e-mail. Your claim is a lie. Retract it immediately. Andy Mabbett 11:21, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

Great comeback. My HATS OFF!
You wrote: "yes, you've found us out, Wikipedia is a yellow journalism materialist blog, and will surely be punished by the LORD for its impertinence. You are too good for wasting your time with this crappy website and should visit more godly sites, like http://www.landoverbaptist.org/" AHAHAAAAAAA I Aplaud your point of view Artoftransformation 23:49, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

request
Are you a linguist? Can you take a look at Talk:Arvanitic language. Thanks. +MATIA &#9742; 12:21, 2 November 2005 (UTC)
 * More specifically, User:REX is attempting to move Arvanitic language to Arvanitic (linguistics) in order to deny the basic right of the Arvanites to have their language called a "language". He has called a "poll" on the issue, and all the usual suspects (who have had a bone to pick with Greeks in the past) have come to his aid. This is clearly not how such disputes should be resolved on Wikipedia.--Theathenae 12:26, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

I do hope that you could help expanding the linguistic part of the article in a not-nationalistic way. Take care. +MATIA &#9742; 19:32, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

NOT Spamming.........................
I was raised AS a US "military brat", NOT given to alarmist material,"Spamming",etc. I hope I taste good... you just bit a NEW Wikipedian. In the military, you get ALL of the info., so that any actions taken result in victory, not defeat.Martial Law 07:20, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

SOMEONE had rumored that Denmark is also experiencing riots, I was investigating this scuttlebutt when this accusation landed in my talk page. IF that matter is proven true, like I had earlier said, NATO may get involved.Martial Law 07:24, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Google Search:Denmark,riots
Just did a Google search about this matter. You'll have to see this to believe it. I am NOT stating what I had found on the other talk page until you examine this.Martial Law 07:32, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Still investigating...............................Martial Law 07:33, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Is the Denmark situation real or scuttlebutt ? SOME of my family were MPs. I HOPE THAT is scuttlebutt, some sick rumor. I was trying to dispel a rumor.

Checked the onboard link. Author has doubts, so I went to GOOGLE to find more. Hope this is all a sickening rumor.Martial Law 07:49, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Agreed. Upon retiring from military service, some of my kin became police officers. THAT, other reasons are why I do'nt like rumors.Martial Law 07:54, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Can you suggest some ? We had a media scandal in some of our media, incl. one in which Dan Rather of CBS had to "retire".Martial Law 08:00, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

You got that right
"If there is ever an article about myself, I vow I won't touch it, even if it says I'm a kitten molester or something." LOL!! Very wise. SlimVirgin (talk) 08:00, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Found who said that ....................
I've found WHO had said that Denmark was also experiencing riots AS you read this, I'll be looking into this. Go to "User Talk:Grazon". Found this on the history page.Martial Law 08:13, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Had a glitch w/ my keypad. Yuck !Martial Law 08:14, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

For some reason I cannot access this wikipedian directly, so, as stated, had to go to the history section to access his User Talk page.Martial Law 08:21, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Did'nt leave anything, just examined the whole page.Martial Law 08:23, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Between us, we'll get to the truth. Love the nickname "ML". Do you have access to any news websites that I can examine ? All I have is CBS,ABC,NBC,FOX News,CNN, all american sites. YUCK ! I've got a shortwave, but I'm in a radio dead spot. Appreciate the assisstance,honesty. I do'nt see that often.Martial Law 08:37, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Interesting
[]

This claims that a WAR is going on. Can't confirm this,nor deny it. Appearantly, this site is from a European publication.Martial Law 09:18, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Just got a wireless keypad for the computer.Martial Law

Appreciate the assisstance,honesty.Martial Law 09:27, 7 November 2005 (UTC)