User talk:DefendEurope





You are in danger of violating the three-revert rule. Please cease further reverts or you may be blocked from editing. Fut.Perf. ☼ 08:45, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

In a 2007 arbitration case, administrators were given the power to impose discretionary sanctions on any user editing Balkans-related articles in a disruptive way. If you, you may be placed under sanctions including blocks, a revert limitation or an article ban. Thank you. Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:49, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

HELP US MAKING THE PROJECT OF ANCIENT GREEK WIKIPEDIA
We are the promoters of the Wikipedia in Ancient Greek. we need your help, specially for write NEW ARTICLES and the TRANSLATION OF THE MEDIAWIKI INTERFACE FOR ANCIENT GREEK, for demonstrating, to the language subcommittee, the value of our project.

Thanks a lot for your help. Ἡ Οὐικιπαιδεία needs you! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.40.197.5 (talk) 19:55, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

Blocked
You have been blocked for 24 hours for violating the three reverts rule on Ancient Macedonians. You may resume editing after the block expires but continued edit warring will result in longer blocks without further warning. Kafziel Complaint Department 10:27, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

I was correcting vandalism. I am not a vandal. DefendEurope (talk) 16:18, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

No personal attacks, no ethnic insults
As you were making ethnic personal attacks against fellow editors, I am hereby placing you under civility parole for the next six months. If you behave in an incivil or aggressive manner again, you will be blocked. Please note that cvility and not making personal attacks is a very central part of how we do things here. Fut.Perf. ☼ 16:19, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Also, stop misusing talk pages for soapboxing, as you did . Talk pages are for discussing improvements to articles, they are not for exchanging your opinions about who is right and who is wrong. Of course, your opinions about the Ancient Macedonians have all been heard a million times, they are unhelpful. Fut.Perf. ☼ 06:58, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Welcome!
Καλώς ήλθες, παρακαλω ενημερωσου λιγακι για το πως "δουλευει" η wikipedia, καλυτερα να πας λιγακι με το ρευμα παρα να μην πας καθολου, αν καταλαβαινεις τι εννοω... Ακομα, σε αρθρα με εντονη διχογνωμια καλο θα ηταν να συζητας τις οποιες επικειμενες αλλαγες στα discussion pages. The Cat and the Owl (talk) 20:43, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Ναι, καποιος εκανε αρκετα καλη δουλεια εκει... ;) The Cat and the Owl (talk) 15:36, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Προσεξε!
Παρακαλω προσπαθησε ν'αποφυγεις χαρακτηρισμους οπως εδω, χρησιμοποιησε αν θες ορους οπως "Σλαβομακεδονες" αλλα οχι "Skopians-Vardarskans" (που το θεωρουν προσβλητικο) γιατι το πιθανοτερο ειναι να σε διωξουν... Δες εδω: Civility. The Cat and the Owl (talk) 22:31, 11 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Καταλαβαινω απολυτα, αλλα ειπαμε, καλυτερα να πας λιγακι με το ρευμα εδω, παρα να μην πας καθολου... :) The Cat and the Owl (talk) 22:43, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

?
Exactly these are Greeks ( Slavs ,Turks, Jewish, Albanians etc )  do you know any Albanian yourself by any chance ?


 * who are you? and to what are you responding? Clear that out. And of course Slavs, Jews, Turks, Albanians are not Greeks. what was that? and yea i know Albanians. i have Albanian friends since i was a kid.DefendEurope (talk) 16:52, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Blocked
Since you have ignored my warning and continued to misuse Wikipedia for fighting out your nationalist causes, aggressively attacking other editors on a personal level, I am now blocking you. It's three days this time. Next time I see you do this, you will be topic-banned from all articles and talkpage discussions relating to Macedonia. Fut.Perf. ☼ 17:09, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


 * oh my.. are you fantasizing? do you see Greek propaganda Ghosts everywhere? Show me ONE propaganda saying made by me or other Greeks.. Greeks always fight propaganda with Truth. Propaganda is for the Barbarians. Not us. Can you still not see who is making up propaganda?

I never fought. I argued. Within a logic based dialogue. With arguments and evidence. Listening to the arguments of the other side too and answering in a Civilized manner. Being Civilized includes being able to argue logically. I never misused wikipedia articles. I just talked in the discussion fields. Is that illegal? Isn't that the purpose of the existence of discussion fields? To talk towards a solution upon supposedly controversial subjects? What's the matter with that? ..you are confusing tension and intense arguing upon historical truth with "fighting" for supposed nationalistic causes.. if you cannot see who is making up propaganda for nationalistic causes with pseudoscience and pseudohistorical propaganda, there is no hope for you...DefendEurope (talk) 17:54, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Do you think what i said there http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Toci is a mere opinion and point of view? If it was a cheap point of view you and your balkanfever friend could debunk them. Which you cannot. DefendEurope (talk) 18:31, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

check out that propagandist too> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:PelasgicMoon he says Slavs, Albanians, Africans, Turks, Jews are all Greeks..... do you think it's wrong to disprove that kind of pseudohistorical ridiculous propaganda? if that's wrong in here, i'm in the wrong site. i was looking for a valid encyclopedia. DefendEurope (talk) 19:02, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


 * You are not getting the point. Wikipedia is neither a battleground, nor a soapbox, nor a debating club, nor a place where you ought to be trying to spread (your version of) the truth to others. Therefore it's also not "to talk towards a solution uposn supposedly controversial subjects". All "debating" focussing on which side is right or wrong is out. Debating in your aggressive, personalising style even more so. All we are supposed to do here is documenting what views exist about a topic. Yes, trying to "disprove" what you feel is "pseudohistorical ridiculous propaganda" is, very much, wrong in here. You actually are in the wrong site. Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:37, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


 * The more you talk, the more I see you might be the "hater of truth", the pseudoscientific supporter and the wrong doer and not me and I don't say that offensively. here is my reason>

if we equally expose - document - as you say, every possible view existing upon a subject, without explaining and giving reasons, facts, evidence, proof, analysis and conclusions for any of those views, as the source provides when stating that view, then we only confuse the unsuspected and not-in-the-subject reader. Example: There are many views upon Egyptians. some Afrocentrists claim Egyptians were sub-saharan blacks, some White supremacists claim they were caucasian, Egyptians claim they were a separate North African non-sub-saharan Nation, some Arab nationalists claim they were Arabs. Can all these vastly different views be correct? No. They do exist though. Should a serious encyclopedia host every view equally without explaining which one is more supported and what are the evidence for each one? You tell me. Example 2: There are more than one theories on how and who did 9/11. Can we host every one equally? Without explaining the whole story? Of possible motives, footage etc? ..Anyway, don't take my word. Take Wikipedia's word. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:V
 * How can the reader know where the view is based if we just document the view and not explain and support it with reasons, facts, evidence, proof, scientific analysis and conclusions ?

"I can NOT emphasize this enough. There seems to be a terrible bias among some editors that some sort of random speculative 'I heard it somewhere' pseudo information is to be tagged with a 'needs a cite' tag. Wrong. It should be removed, aggressively, unless it can be sourced. This is true of all information, but it is particularly true of negative information about living persons."

–Jimmy Wales

who's on the wrong site now? ..

when you welcome "i-heard-it-somewhere" information and nationalist propaganda equally with factual, sourced and checked, evident, proved truth: you are on the bad side. Don't you think? I, like most people who edit wiki and know history bring you sourced, proved, supported facts about Macedonians for example and you dismiss them as "cheap". But when propagandists like the Skopians say "Macedonians MIGHT not originally spoke Greek but were Hellenized" you welcome it, even if that theory is not sourced nor followed by any evidence whatsoever. As if they pass through the claim that the Macedonian tribe was not originally Greek (which is absolutely not true), the Macedonians will have more chances of being Slavs.. XD or "becoming" Slavs one day in the future, if you get what i mean... and the crazy thing is the same Skopian people who admit all Macedonians were absolutely Hellenized since Ancient Times are the ones who claim modern Macedonians are SoMeH0w a separate nation, non-Greek (!)... what do you have to say about this kind of propaganda that is spread? are you aware of all these? anyway.. i suggest you examine this http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Macedonia before welcoming propaganda about Macedonia DefendEurope (talk) 21:29, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm not in the mood for arguing with you. I'm just telling you, either you conform to our mode of operation here, or you're out. I'm tempted to block you for a longer period here and now as you are clearly unwilling to cooperate, but I guess I'll leave that to others to decide once you resume editing. Fut.Perf. ☼ 22:09, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Typical answer. But my hat off to you for the patience you showed anyway. DefendEurope (talk) 22:21, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Greek?
I am not. But their food and culture is amazing!  κaτaʟ aveno TC 00:36, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, I picked up a little Greek from some friends of mine from Πελοπόννησος. Γεια σας!  κaτaʟ aveno TC 01:08, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * It is quite hard for me but very satisfying when I can finally say a word or sentence correctly. I only know a handful of words and phrases.  (I had to look up Πελοπόννησος).  I can't really read/write it... only say and understand a few things. I would have to say that authentic Greek food tops my list of favourites! (My Greek friends I met in high school (over 20 yrs ago)... and I still talk to them every now and then.  κaτaʟ aveno  TC 01:25, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Vergina Sun
Τετρακτύς εν δρασει!



The Vergina Sun with animated analysis of its meaning to the ancient Greeks, the four Elements -Fire, Air, Water, Earth and the 12 Greek Gods (Olympians)-Zeus, Hera, Poseidon, Demeter, Ares, Hermes, Hephaestus, Aphrodite, Athena, Apollo, Artemis, Hestia and their classification-male/female/celestial/water etc

Found in ancient Macedonian Tombs and became symbol of Macedonia. Ancient Macedonian Tombs which automatically means Ancient Greek Tombs, as Macedonia is a region of Ancient Greece. there are also a number of depictions of Athenian hoplites (Argeads and the Vergina Sun) bearing an identical sixteen-pointed symbol on their armor as early as the 6th century BC DefendEurope (talk) 04:09, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Defendeurope, wiki requires for you to source material via bibliography so it can be used.If something cant be sourced and licensed wiki cant use it.If the license is wrong then wiki would be acting illegaly.Read the rules for image uploading carefully so you can avoid problems and see how you can actually use this feature.Megistias (talk) 09:25, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Blocked
Okay, this is enough. Out. Blocked for 1 month. Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:38, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

1. i absolutely did not do disruptive editing. can you find any from me? ..

2. this> was just a rather intense comment upon FuturePerf's recent contributions, weird objections and massive POV pushing which i can further demonstrate and judging his actions as an editor and administrator. Commenting on his contributions. not personal attack like he accused me in order to block me. Personal attack is something else. Outside of contribution judging. 3. Even if i touched the limits of personal attack, 1 month block is not justifiable for this, as far as i've seen here in wikipedia. and i don't have a history of vandalism nor i intend to vandalize or disrupt Wikipedia.DefendEurope (talk) 22:27, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

can you mention to me what were the ethnic slurs i used? the other time i called someone a thief for his propagandistic POV pushing, that's why my block was perfectly justified. but now what did i say that is called an ethnic slur?DefendEurope (talk) 22:48, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * The diff above by Future Perfect at Sunrise is enough.  Jmlk  1  7  22:58, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

it was in an offensive tone yes. but where is the ethnic slur you mentioned? can't you provide it specifically? wikipedia is all about being accurate...DefendEurope (talk) 23:05, 16 March 2008 (UTC) if the "ethnic slur" is the reason of my block, then if the ethnic slur does not exist that makes my block unjust.DefendEurope (talk) 23:13, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * You were blocked for your second period of disruptive editing in a few days... you used "slav" in a purposely derogatory term. Simple enough.   Jmlk  1  7  23:15, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

what was my disruptive editing? and Slav is a branch of a wider Eastern European ethnic group. a real one. not a slur for that. a word like Amerindian, Greek, Sub Saharan, Germanic, Celtic etc. The one who understands it as a slur is a racist or self-hating if he is one. i'm neither. i didn't call Futperf a slav. i called BalkanFever a Slav because he indeed is a slav. i just made fun of their POV pushing angst. no more, no less. i have seen serial vandals and badmouthed article rapists get simple warnings and 24-hour blocks. If i did no disruptive editing or used an ethnic slur i don't deserve the block. find a more decent excuse for my block at least.DefendEurope (talk) 23:27, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Playing coy doesn't work my friend. You know you were being disruptive, as your posts on Sunrise's talk page show. You have been blocked 3 times in 2 weeks now for editing issues. I suggest you avoid those issues from here on out, as I'm pretty sure the next step is an indefinite block. See you in a month. Jmlk  1  7  23:36, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

"Playing coy doesn't work my friend" and "you know you were disruptive" are your points? Solid. DefendEurope (talk) 23:52, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I've wasted more than enough time on a disruptive and negative "editor" here... once again, see you in a month. Perhaps you can avoid an indefinite block then.  Jmlk  1  7  23:56, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

What to do so you don't get blocked/banned in wikipedia
>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/74.43.230.254 <<<< he got a 48 hour block

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/89.205.30.76<< true edit hero. no block

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/62.162.183.189

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/81.215.232.131

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/170.177.19.11

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Gaygreeks

Blocked again
You came off your last one-month block for ethnically motivated personal attacks just yesterday and plunged immediately back again into the same behaviour. I'm therefore blocking you right again, again for a month. Next time will be indef. Fut.Perf. ☼ 12:34, 18 April 2008 (UTC)


 * I got asked by the user to review the block. I've had a go at briefly doing so, looking at the specific quotes cited.


 * Judging by the talk page, this is a user who wishes to present a specific viewpoint they hold ("Read and learn kids..."). That's not a problem in itself, but does mean one has to take especial care to respect content and conduct policies, because people with strong viewpoints often find that more difficult.


 * The topic of "Macedonia" has been a contentious area. For that reason, the Arbitration Committee has given administrators very much more than usual power, to clamp down on any troublesome editing on that subject area. Edits like this calling others "thieves" and calling others "sick and disgusting" are more than enough to merit civility parole. This means that your edits that do not meet civility norms will probably result in blocking.


 * On 123 March you were blocked for fighting nmationalistic causes. From what I see, I agree that that's a fair description and block, especially given the above.


 * Comments like this and this though, suggest you aren't learning, despite a one month block.


 * In brief, I have reviewed your conduct and the blocks and parole with absolutely no prior impressions or beliefs, and I feel that the handling is in fact, reasonable. Your email that you are blocked "for no reason" I'm afraid I don't agree with either. The problem is we are trying to write an encyclopedia here. Even though you have stopped using direct insults, you are still basically doing the same, speaking in a way that attacks and causes tensions with other editors who are on "the other side" rather than finding ways to work with other editors to create a neutral article. You need to understand that anywhere else in the universe you can hate your opponents however you are allowed to. You can talk to them how you like. Here, we're trying to work together. Your conduct is hindering that and not helping it, even if it's not directly "an attack". ArbCom has had enough of this, and so has the community, and so administrators have been given power to remove editors even for acting in a slightly unhelpful manner. I am sure that editors on the "other side" are also now and then removed or blocked for their conduct. Your problem for today is your conduct. If you change it, then you won't have problems like this any more, and you will be able to edit without being told to change by administrators.


 * My apologies, but I feel in this case, you will be best to change your style to reflect that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia building community, and users are expected to work with others. if you need help doing this, I do suggest asking for a mentor or someone to help you avoid these kinds of issues. You'll find any administrator will be glad to help, if you ask them! :)


 * FT2 (Talk 14:04, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

well ok i don't have a big problem with that. but it is truely weird that they let others away with vandalism and insults but they block me. i remain idle and then i see my profile blocked. go see all the other barbarians posting on Macedonian subjects. raping and vandalizing. they still do. noone tells them nothing. but when i am being true to points and discussion i am considered a threat.

one month block for talking in a heavy tone to a vandal?

really? ..DefendEurope (talk) 19:39, 18 April 2008 (UTC)


 * You are not really getting it, are you? Let me make it clear: If after coming off this month's block you ever talk again in the tone you just did (like "other barbarians" etc.) or call other editors vandals when they are not, you will immediately be re-blocked for longer. Fut.Perf. ☼ 08:21, 19 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Ok Fut. Besides, you're a non-POV example for all of us. see>

-Fut:"I am actually a non-Greek admin. Even though I speek Greek and am friends with some Greek users here, I'm not one of them and I actually tend to disagree with the Greek side more often than not, whenever I get involved in some disagreement. But whatever, don't worry," http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:WikiBakel

need i say more?... anyway, let's end this in good terms, i apologize, i admit i have really been disruptive but not by malicious intent.

-DefendEurope (talk) 19:38, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

comparison
so we have 2 languages' words from 500 years Before Christ:

Blocked Indef.
haha jk don't get too excited now XD lololol DefendEurope (talk) 02:51, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

the truth i wanted to get into wikipedia is already in.. so i don't care much about important stuff in here anymore. DefendEurope (talk) 04:40, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

HELP US MAKING THE PROJECT OF ANCIENT GREEK WIKIPEDIA
We are the promoters of the Wikipedia in Ancient Greek. we need your help, specially for write NEW ARTICLES and the TRANSLATION OF THE MEDIAWIKI INTERFACE FOR ANCIENT GREEK, for demonstrating, to the language subcommittee, the value of our project.

Thanks a lot for your help. Ἡ Οὐικιπαιδεία needs you! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.40.197.5 (talk) 19:55, 30 May 2008 (UTC)