User talk:Detubug

Pseudo-Encyclopedia
Blatant examples of Wikipedia's pseudo-credibility (random):


 * 1. Julius Caesar, Jesus Christ, Napoleon, Budha, Muhamad all have 1 (one) article each. However the Bosnian folk singer Haris Džinović has TWO :)))- Haris Džinović and Haris Dzinovic :))) Both articles exist for months (if not years) in a peaceful coexistence :)) A merge was proposed 100 years ago and the admins do nothing (except presenting useless barnstars to eachother :))) )


 * 2. I suspect that a lot of references provided in Wikipedia lack reliability and credibility. Just one example: Military history of Republic of Macedonia during World War II article:

Official sources on the subject, such as the one from the Ministry of Defence of Republic of Macedonia have been rejected. At the same time, questionable Bulgarian or pro-Bulgarian sources are left intact. why? Example: Кои беа партизаните во Македонија Никола Петров, Скопје, 1998 (Who were the partisans?- Nikola Petrov, Skopje, 1998) (an openly pro-Bulgarian biased source). Who is Nikola Petrov and what are his academic credentials? i got no answer to this at the talk page from the editors who constantly push it as a source. We know very well that literaly anyone can publish a book these days, but you cant just put anyone in an encyclopedia as a source, right? :) Moreover, that mysterious Nikola Petrov is used as a "source" in the VMRO article.


 * 3. The article Music of Republic of Macedonia is constantly being vandalized by User: Asteraki but of course no one moves a finger. At this moment, the article is renamed to Music of the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia. The user is blatantly biased, his user page is filled with ultranationalist iconography and no one cares. NPOV? suuure :))


 * 4.The National Liberation War of Macedonia is an official term used in Republic of Macedonia for the antifascist war as for example the Former Soviet Union countries (notably Russia) also have their official designation for their WWII resistance, namelly: Great Patriotic War. How come Russians (and other ex-Soviets) have the right to use their official historiographical/ political term at Wikipedia, while the Macedonian article National Liberation War of Macedonia has been moved to Military history of Republic of Macedonia during World War II and moreover, like the other Macedonia-related articles it has been rewritten to suit the official Bulgarian POV?


 * 5. Why the chronological order at Template:History of the Republic of Macedonia starts with the Bulgarian Empire? ;) The history of the territory of today's Republic of Macedonia starts much earlier, it goes back to the Neolithic period (see History of the Republic of Macedonia). The territory was partially a part of Ancient Macedonia and Paionia and what not. Not everything begins with Bulgaria, if you get my point. I can only guess the nationality of the editor who made it to start with Bulgaria? ;-)


 * 6. The article about Kiro Gligorov is being constantly abused by the Bulgarian editors despite the rules saying that biographies of living persons should be handled with care. They've managed to sneak-in some highly questionable "sources" published online by a Bulgarian nationalist political party regarding his alleged ethnic self-determination. Those documents were issued by the Axis allied Bulgaria during the occupation of Macedonia in WWII. Fascist Bulgaria was not a democratic country and it was imposing a policy of national assimilation (Bulgarisation) as the other fascist countries did too, such as Germany in Austria, Italy in occupied Dalmatia or Hungary in occupied Vojvodina. Fascism as we know goes together with nationalism. The Bulgarian state regarded Ethnic Macedonians as Bulgarians. Gligorov couldnt freely declare any other nationality than Bulgarian, in a same way he couldnt freely declare any other origin than Serbian during the previous Serbian rule of Vardar Macedonia (see Vardar Banovina, Kingdom of Yugoslavia). I strongly beleive that such statements given in such specific circumstances, under a regime internationaly regarded as totalitarian and fascist can not be accepted as a given on a free will.


 * 7. Other questionable statements and "sources" (Military history of Republic of Macedonia during World War II):

Quote: As the Bulgarian army entered Vardar Macedonia on April 19, 1941, it was greeted by most of the population as liberators, source: МАКЕДОНИЯ 1941, "Възкресението" - С. Нанев, 1941 г. (Resurection - S. Nanev, 1941)


 * The source is Bulgarian and its published in 1941. Normally, it represents the POV of the Axis Bulgarian occupational authroities :)). This is like quoting a Nazi German source from the 1940's claiming something like "when we occupied the Netherlanders they greeted us as liberators". I beleive that such war propagadha can not be accepted in a serious encyclopedia.

Quote: However, under pro-Serbian pressure a decision was later reached that Vardar Macedonia will become a part of new Communist Yugoslavia.


 * Not only that Tito was not a Serbian (half Croat, half Slovenian actually), but moreover he imposed some policies that were later regarded as anti-Serbian by the Serbian nationalists (notably by the Serbian academy and leaders such as Slobodan Milosevic). Namely: Tito recognized the existence of a separate Macedonian nation (Socialist Republic of Macedonia) established on a territory formerly controled by Serbia (Vardar Banovina). He later sort of partionioned Serbia by granting wide political and cultural autonomy to parts of Serbia such as SAP Kosovo and SAP Vojvodina. Also, he recognized a separate Montenegrin ethnicity and later a separate Muslims by nationality ethnicity in Bosnia-Herzegovina. How come he could be under that alleged "pro-serbian" influence? Again, purely a Bulgarian POV.

Quote: According to official sources the number of Macedonian communist partisan's victims against the Bulgarian army during WWII was 539 men, which is not a high level.


 * How much dead people are "sufficient" for a "high enough level" then? How can anyone put such infatile sentence in an encyclopedia and stay alive? Counting dead human beings is not counting potatoes or tomatoes at the Ilienci vegetable market in Sofia.

Quote: 1944 when the Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia was established.


 * SFRY was formally established on November 29 1943 in the town of Jajce, Bosnia and Herzegovina at AVNOJ not in 1944. The Macedonian Republic that became a part of it had its official name(s) first Democratic Macedonia, then People's Republic of Macedonia and finally in 1963 - Socialist Republic of Macedonia which is not mentioned in that article at all.

There are plenty of other questionable statements in the article and around Wikipedia as a whole. Some of them may have been corrected in the meantime, but i really doubt.

Thank you for your attention.Detubug 22:26, 30 July 2007 (UTC)


 * You have a remarkably sophisticated understanding of how Wikipedia works for someone who only started to edit yesterday - and to such a controversial article as well. Would you mind telling us your original account? Spartaz Humbug! 07:42, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

REPLY TO SPARTAZ: How can I defend myself and reply to your cynical accusations when im blocked as you know and I cant post a damn reply in your Talk page?! What kind of people become admins here? :) you lack basic logic, let alone competence on the particular issue from which the whole thing started. And regarding my "understanding of how wikipedia works": sure i do understand its whole system, everyone knows, it works like this: certain BULGARIAN and GREEK centers are donating money to Wikimedia Foundation and hence, Bulgarian and Greek editors are free to breach every possible rule and abuse Ethnic Macedonian-related articles. On the other hand Macedonian editors are being constantly blocked and kicked out and their edits, even legitimate ones are being constantly reverted indiscriminately. All of these things are being documented as text, screenshots etc. and are/ will be presented on numerious websites, blogs etc.. so the general public can have an inside view of how this pseudo-encyclopedia works.

Now you will probably ask me: why are you registered in wikipedia when you despise it? My motivations are purely innocent- Im bored. I havent even edit an article so far as you can see, however i do enjoy rightfully bashing of the obvious agenda-pushers in the talk pages like Laveol, Mr. Neutron, Jingibingutingy and other POV pushers who are doing this for political or financial reasons (payed by IMRO – Bulgarian National Movement) :))) Now lets see some examples of your so called NPOV: this guy for example, he is NOT BIASED right? Nooo he's a "neutral wikipedia editor", just he has some bizzare taste for his interior design ;) sure sure Spartaz ;) NPOV, VPON, PONV, 4Q. Detubug 18:18, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Obviously I have the page watch-listed and checked back for an answer. I have left a message with the blocking admin about the sockpuppeting linkage and, either myself, or another admin will review this when he has responded. Spartaz Humbug! 21:14, 30 July 2007 (UTC)