User talk:Dineshkannambadi/Archive6

What! You actually archived? Now I don't have to scroll endlessly to post here. Sincerely, Mattisse 16:35, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Architecture
I know the last time we discussed this, you lectured me about not knowing very much because I have not seen the temples. However, you do not have my book. To quote: It is significant that a surge in religion and its art is manifest almost from the time when Dantidurga made Ellora his capital....This phenomenon at Ellora needs some explanation, especially since a new rulership needs some time to establish itself before significant art programmes are launched. Here at Ellora there was:


 * Firstly, a continuity of guild activity among resident artisans which must have been enriched by a new band of court artists and artisans who gave a fresh touch to the art idiom.


 * Secondly, Buddhism overlapped Brahmanical activities during this transitional stage, in a somewhat experimental inflection, distinctive from the style of the newcomers, the Rastrakutas.

The period was traumatic for Buddhism, as the superimposition of what we may call an architectural and sculptural palimpsest &mdash; the dramatic smothering of Buddhism &mdash; in the Dasavatara cave would reveal.

Rastrakuta power bridged the traditions of the upper and lower Deccan. Through their involvements in the lower south of the peninsula where their art had its compeers in art synthesis and connoisseurship among the Palllavas, the Pandyas, the Gangas, and the Nolambas, and with the even handed art patronage of Brahmanical religion and Jainism, they had a rich equipment, not perhaps systematically cultivated but sensitively absorbed from the total pool of tradtions in south India.

I could go on, but I am beginning to think that if you do not read this book then you cannot know how so many factors came together, that the type of rock "successively and innovatively demanded that the techniques be modified at each stage..." and so on.

Sincerely, Mattisse 22:27, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Capital
Their capital was fluid. It's just that K.V.Soundara Rajan is only interested in Ellora, not the history of the Rastrakutas except as it pertains to Ellora. I'm just quoting a few small snatches out of the book, none of it derogatory to the Rastrakutas (from my point of view). So I don't see why you are so defensive!

The writer basically says that Ellora (the last part that the Rastrakutas were responsible for) is a huge work of art, maybe the biggest in India. He spends 200 pages trying to figure out how it all happened. I thought it was complimentary, especially since they unaccountably "shrank" right after for no particularly discernible reason. (I know the shrinking part from reading what you wrote.) Sincerely,  Mattisse 23:40, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

P.S. He is not blaming them for the decline of Buddhism, if that is how it sounds. He takes it as a given that Buddhism was declining anyway. He is not interested (in the book, at least) in religion, except briefly as it relates to architectural style. He only mentions religion by general names now and then and never explains anything specific about them (the religions). --Mattisse 23:55, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Rajan
Too bad I can't read very much of the book without getting a sinus headache. So I have not nearly read it and what I have read has been from back to front. (That must make a micro-chip designer shutter.) But this guy, Rajan, is several cuts above the average art historian. He appreciates that it is the artisan on the site that carries out the work, deals with the daily in situ decisions and he says the designs of specific "cult religions" evolve in the clergies head and are fairly meaningless regarding the result, as is the particular floor plan, political environment etc. This book rises above a book about an architectural site. It encompasses the process of artistic creation itself.

By the way, there are plenty of good photos of Ellora available for use. Sincerely, Mattisse 02:26, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

P.S. And I do appreciate your reading all those books and wonder how you find the time between snow plowing, office work, and some semblance of a normal life to write with quill and paper. You are obviously extraordinary. --Mattisse 02:26, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Nothing extraordinary. Just priorities!
I think in reality you just lounge around. You are making all this up to fool me. I bet there was no snow either. Sincerely, Mattisse 21:07, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Rashtrakuta art in Karnataka
That sounds quite specialised. I've been thinking about an article on artists guilds, or guilds in general, in India. This seems to be a subject you flick off, probably because your attitudes are whatever that other guy called me. But it wasn't the kings, or even the architects who built these temples. Those guilds were powerful, independent organisations with artistic traditions that in some ways were the most important element of the phenomenal Indian art. I don't know if they were considered a caste, as I don't know anything about castes in India, but this type organisation of artists/artisans is quite different than then way art is produced, say, in this country. (I need more books.) Sincerely, Mattisse 00:50, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Edit conflict
There was some kind of edit conflict and I completely lost my place and don't know what happend to my edits. Can't figure out what happened. Probably too tired tonight to do so. Tomorrow afternoon probably I'll work it out. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:22, 20 March 2007 (UTC)


 * For some reason my edits didn't take. Can't do them all over tonight. I'll do them over some other time. Maybe tomorrow. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:30, 20 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Sorry! All my edits are gone (I think) and the paragraphs has been rearranged somehow. So I have some figuring out to do. I'm just not up to it tonight. It's too hard for me to work out right now. Hopefully I won't have to do it all over. But I am confused on how the paragraphs changed but lack my edits, as far as I can tell, as I can see some glaring errors that surely I would have removed. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:44, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

A peculiar question
I have a peculiar question (not related to the current FAC). In history, we see kings of a dynasty often have the same name, and have to differentiate them by numbers (eg Vikramaditya V, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vikramaditya_VI etc). Same for Western history, too. Why so? I mean was there any rule that names should recur in a dynasty? Or just there were not enough names? You can answer this later, after the FAC-burden is over! Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 04:43, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply. It was enlightening. The use of Immadi, Mummadi etc seems to be somewhat unique, right? Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 04:47, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

FAC questions
1. Maybe you should say just what you answered, in essence: They are called Western Chalukyas to differentiate from the contemporaneous Eastern Chalukyas of Vengi, a separate dynasty. (I have wondered too why there is so much emphasis on the Western Chalukyas and hardly anything about the Eastern and who the heck are those Eastern Chakukyas anyway. Plus if they are all Chalukyas, why are they divided up into two or more different groups?) And is it really necessary to give explanations for all the different Western Chalukyas names, but not address what differentiates them from other dynasties with the same or similar names (e.g. Eastern Chalukyas)?

2. Spelling out centuries: I don't agree but the MoS probably addresses that. User:Tony1 would know instantly. (He knows all that stuff.) addressed below.

3. Imperial eq to metric would be useful. I have no idea what this means. Are you using "imperial" measures somewhere? If so, could you translate them roughly into metric so readers could relate the measures to units they know?

Questions 1 and 3 address the general problem with these articles. The names are so confusing and there are so many of them that it is only after copy editing them over and over that I have a rough idea of what is happening. And when there are measures that people can't translate to a meaningful amount, that adds to the obscurity.

In almost every FAC, someone says they can't read the whole article through. These articles you write are very complex. They are like reading User:Salix alba's mathematics articles. I do think that getting FAC feedback is useful and at least this time they are trying to read it! Sincerely, Mattisse 11:24, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Pagoda
Dictionary definition: (Dictionary.com)

1. (in India, Burma, China, etc.) a temple or sacred building, usually a pyramidlike tower and typically having upward-curving roofs over the individual stories.

2. any of several former gold or silver coins of southern India, usually bearing a figure of such a temple, first issued in the late 16th century and later also by British, French, and Dutch traders.

Maybe a stub link would take care of of the FAC question about what the word means. (Of course, the dates are off for your purposes. Maybe you know of a more relevant source for a definition.) Sincerely,  Mattisse 11:46, 20 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I made a not very good stub for pagoda Pagoda (coin). Maybe you can improve upon it. Sincerely, Mattisse 17:44, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Centuries
From Manual of Style (dates and numbers):

Years, decades, and centuries
 * 18th century or eighteenth century (Note: century is not capitalized, and "1700s" is not a century, but a decade)
 * 10th century BC or 10th century BCE (or "tenth")

So either is correct, but I think the MoS secretly prefers the number vs spelling the number out. Sincerely, Mattisse 11:58, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Eastern Chalukyas
Well, explain that to the FAR editors. That's sure to make them even happier! Sincerely, Mattisse 21:28, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Western Chalukyas
To tell you the truth, I fried my brain yesterday on it. I tried today but I can't tell what should be. It looks like my edits didn't take yesterday, and I tried to got through them again today but I just can't right now evaluate what should be to reconstruct. The thinking ts too effortful, trying to remember the rationale behind the decisions I made yesterday vs what is there now. I just don't have it in me right now to go through it again and reconstruct what was lost all over again, and I apoligise to you for that. Maybe I will be able to go back to it, but right now I am no good regarding it. I am too confused over the decisions I make yesterday and the rationale behind them, and I am not able to reconstruct them in my head today. I just don't have it in me do go through the whole process again from scratch at present. I apologise to you for that, but that is the situation. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:36, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Imperial units
I meant the grams could have the imperial equivalent listed alongside (ounces etc) Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  14:54, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks!
What is champu style? Sincerely, Mattisse 20:39, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

champu
Is there more that can be said about it? On Google, your articles are the only place the word appears, except one in a Karnataka article on that website. And you use it a lot. It would be good to have a little stub aritlce, or you need to redefine it every so often in parentheses, I think. Sincerely, Mattisse 20:44, 21 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, some sort of article is needed. There is nothing on line, although I did find a reference to champu poetry but it did not describe the form. --Mattisse 22:34, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

O.K.
I'm finishing off a glacier article so probably won't do much tonight. You are talking about Rashtrakuta? --Mattisse 23:26, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi!
Go to sleep now. (Maybe you will have to plow again in Brazil, what with climate change and all.) Good night. --Mattisse 02:49, 22 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I wrote you an email about that. The article has one name, the bolding has another name, and the template has a third. There is enough confusion, in my opinion, without having three different names up front. But, whatever you say. Sincerely, Mattisse 19:58, 22 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm ready. --Mattisse 21:09, 22 March 2007 (UTC)


 * If you call it R.... dynasty, how do you differentiate from all the others with the same name? --Mattisse 21:13, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

P.S. I had my fourth DYK today! --Mattisse 21:13, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Rashtrakuta -> Rashtrakuta dynasty
Hi Dinesh, The move is complete now. Is this how exactly it should be? - KNM Talk 21:54, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Done. It is fixed now. Thank you for figuring it out. :-) - KNM Talk 02:01, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Typing more into Economy
So that means I should stay away from the article for now, right? (I was just about to ask you, as I have lost my way on what I ought to be doing regarding your articles, what needs doing?) Sincerely, --Mattisse 23:54, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

DYK
For which article? --Mattisse 00:29, 23 March 2007 (UTC)


 * You mean in general and not for one of your articles? --Mattisse 00:37, 23 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I'll peruse both articles for a DYK. --Mattisse 00:43, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Then I don't understand your request
Maybe you could be more specific. I though you said to find a DKY out of one of those two articles, Rastrakuta dynasty or Western Chalukyas What did you mean? Sincerely, Mattisse 01:54, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Generally asking what?
I don't understand what you are asking? Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:01, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

(Hope it snows tonight! You need to plow more!)


 * Yes, we each have had long days. I no longer know what you are asking. Hope you have a wonderfully good rest tonight and don't try to do too much tomorrow. Do take care. Sincerely, Mattisse 02:28, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Name change
I wrote your friend KLM about this problem regarding Rashtrakuta Dynasty after the name change: This morning every once in a while when I save the article after a small change, I get the error message "Wikipedia does not have an article with this exact name" and an empty template with no article. Using the back button and trying again has worked so far. Do you think there is still some sort of redirect problem going on? Sincerely, Mattisse 14:21, 23 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Maybe it was temporary (something had to catch up with something, technically) as after a few times, the problem has not reoccurred. I went through the article as much as I could -- there is a strike out (under the Society section, I think). What is the situation with the Western Chalukyas? I read the FA notes but could not tell much about how it is going. Sincerely, --Mattisse 22:29, 23 March 2007 (UTC)


 * If you change the name of Western Chalukyas, an automatic redirect will redirect to there. You can change it by hand in the places you care about, but the Move sets up the automatic redirect. (I know this from experience.) Sincerely, --Mattisse 22:39, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

T.N. Srikantaiah
Just started a page on Ti Nam Sri. Do you have any literature than can add fluff to the page to help make it a DYK? Baka man  16:02, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: Western Chalukya Empire?
I do not anticipate any technical problems because of this name change. As long as you have valid defence on how this new name is more applicable to the article rather than the previous name, then we all should be fine. Looking into the article, I feel "Western Chalukya Empire" sounds more reasonable than "Western Chalukyas". Thanks. - KNM Talk 22:40, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

O..K.
I've been noticing that you've been doing an awful lot this evening. (A little scary for me!) Have a good night. --Mattisse 02:53, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Name change
Regarding your question on the effect of name change on the FAC, I don't have idea. Please consult. And do it quickly :)--Dwaipayan (talk) 11:25, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I wonder if you undid the #REDIRECT; retrieved the link to the FA editors' comments, then #REDIRECT both to new name. I'll go to the Village Pump and ask. Sincerely,  --Mattisse 14:44, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I just asked at the Village Pump. Someone will fix it I am sure. Either the person you asked or the Village Pump people. They know how to do things like that. It has been explained to me before how to do it, but I never could quite make it work. (I'm not good at following technical directions.) Sincerely,  --Mattisse 15:04, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Village pump (technical) If you look at the last question Redirect problem - FA comment page lost -- that's the question I asked. You could add on to that, or start a new heading (click + at top). --Mattisse 15:23, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


 * That's great! It has been explained to me how to do it in the past. This time I am going to get someone to show me how and really understand it. For some reason before, I just could not understand what I was being told. It is not that hard. I'm mad at myself for not already knowing this! --Mattisse 16:42, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


 * This is all it took. I'm fed up with being in the dark all the time! (I know it is my own fault that I don't take the time to read directions, etc.) Glad it's fixed. Sincerely, Mattisse 17:01, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Western Chalukyas to Western Chalukya Empire
Hello Dinesh,

Thanks for bringing that into my attention. Yes I just looked into it, and updated all the necessary changes. Just for future reference, here are the things that need to be done, when the article in FAC needs to be changed to a new name.


 * After having the consensus from the community, move the article to new name. Like, Western Chalukyas TO Western Chalukya Empire.
 * Move the FAC page to reflect the new name. Like, Featured article candidates/Western Chalukyas TO Featured article candidates/Western Chalukya Empire
 * Update the heading (section name) in FAC page, to reflect the new name. This would ensure the display of new name, in the list of candidates present in Featured article candidates
 * Edit Featured article candidates page and update the article to reflect the new name. Like, to.
 * Leave a note in FAC page that the movement is now complete. :)

Hope that helps. Thanks, - KNM Talk 15:22, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Rashtrakuta
Are you going to be working on Rashtrakuta more today, or can I start on the copy edit? --Mattisse 21:54, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

What para is that?
Off hand I can't find it but I will eventually.( "the land owner or tenant payed variety of taxes, including land tax, produce tax and overheads for maintenance of Gavunda") Who did they pay it to? --Mattisse 23:36, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


 * O.K. Done. There were two unclear parts marked. --Mattisse 00:21, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Maps
I've tried to unearth people. Usually, at best, they suggest some sort of graphics program that when I download it I find that it does not address maps. You have more "pull" than I do. How about asking Binguyen(bananas) for a suggestion? Sincerely, --Mattisse 15:32, 25 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I think User talk:Nichalp makes maps. Isn't he one of your fans? --Mattisse 15:39, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I couldn't help overhearing this conversation. You can contact User:Planemad too if you want some maps made. He is a busy fellow, but he does make some fantastic maps. If he doesn't respond then you can leave a message at WikiProject_Indian_maps. - Aksi_great (talk) 15:42, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Not too busy too be snooping on others' talk pages tho ;) so who wants what? --Plane Mad 15:46, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Check ur mail --Plane Mad 16:02, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Just had time to finish one, will be back next week --Plane Mad 20:48, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorry, i had misplaced Kannauj. The shape distortion is due to the different projection used for the maps. I used the rivers as a reference for drawing. Btw what was the capital of the Pala empire? i thought id mark that too --Plane Mad 06:49, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

1. Avoid names of multiple towns as it confuses readers. Onlt the regal capital is needed. 2. Use current Political map of India as background showing state boundaries for context. 3. No need to specifically show feudatory ruling families ( minor chieftains under major kingdom) as it confuses readers not acquainted with history. They are essentially considered a part of the empire and should not be explicitly depicted. 4. In the Rashtrakuta map, even showing the Pala and Gurjara's is not necessary as it may lead to conflicts. Other authors may depict their empire maps differently and this may cause conflict between users, holding up articles (please see the Pala maps in Pala Dynasty article to get an idea what I mean). Only Rashtrakuta mapp is enough. Hi Dinesh, i can modify the map quite easily. I merely made a replica of the maps you had sent me since you did not mention what you did or did not want included. But i do want to voice my suggestions to the map format in use:
 * 1) As a map, i feel that any important city in the empire should be marked, after all the map available here is a free version of a copyright map and we should include all possible details. The capital city can be marked much more prominently so that it can be clearly seen in the infobox.
 * 2) I feel rivers add more to a historical map than modern state borders, which bear no connection to previous kingdoms, so i dont see how it may add to the context.
 * 3) No problem, was just replicating the given map.
 * 4) Will do. I will split it into three seperate maps.

By the way, was any particular format decided before? Because i really think rivers should not be exempted from the map --Plane Mad 17:22, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

I would support the inclusion of the states boundaries give it a modern day context. We want Wikipeida to be educational, so say a person in class 8 say would look at the extent of the map and say, "Ok the extent of so and so kingdom included the present day MP, MH, AP etc. PS the above map is POV. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  05:20, 31 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Ive re uploaded the map to include state boundaries. The international boundaries are present day administrative boundaries, disputed boundaries have a different stroke so that it can be distinguihed and the map also contains "Disputed Area" in small font in the kashmir and ap region. This, i hope will clear it off the POV radar. The state boundaries are so marked so that they appear only on a large thumbnail and is not distracting at small sizes. Also increased the size of the capital locator so that it can be easily identified. Need your inputs before changing the other map. Hopefully if we decide on something i can make a history map template that can be used by oters to make maps quickly --Plane Mad 21:24, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

what's next?
I cannot decide what is important and what is unimportant for the main article. I do not know enough to do so. Only you can do that. So, what should I be doing? Stub articles? More copy edit? Sincerely, --Mattisse 00:28, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: chop
Do you trust my judgment on this? Do you mean whole paragraphs removed or just the details? I think I could go through and remove details comfortably from an "outside editor" point of view. --Mattisse 00:50, 26 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Thank you. --Mattisse 01:03, 26 March 2007 (UTC)


 * O.K. Take a look at first run through. --Mattisse 01:58, 26 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I am striking out what seems least important for the overall. The section (Economy) will probably require some reorganisation for continuity next. (I am listening to how many shootings have occurred in the last 24 hours in my area on the radio.) --Mattisse 03:05, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Western Chalukya comment
Sandy has left a very significant comment in the FAC. Please try to organise the "References" section alphabetically (per the last name of authors). Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 10:32, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: Chikkamagaluru District
Dinesh,

Thanks for your compliments. I am now working on the Shimoga district article and have made some updates (though incomplete yet, last few sections need to be cleaned up). Kindly check it out and let me know if you have any suggestions - Amarrg 12:25, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Economy & Society
I have run through each again to reduce size. Economy has been reduced by a fair amount (see strike outs) and Society not so much but some. Take a look and tell me what you think. Sincerely, --Mattisse 17:11, 26 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes. I'm done for now until I get some feedback from you -- if you need more reduction etc. --Mattisse 17:40, 26 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Let me know when you are done, as I just noticed that emergency (occasional) taxes are talked about in two places and need to be combined. Plus some paragraph combining for good looks etc. --Mattisse 18:20, 26 March 2007 (UTC)


 * O.K. Combined a few things etc. and then check the whole thing for consistency of spelling. What's next? --Mattisse 19:51, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Western Chalukya FA!!
Congrats!! Western Chalukys is now FA!! Sarvagnya 17:16, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
 * *clap* *clap* Congratulations on yet another FA! Great gong Dinesh!! Keep up the excellent work. Thanks for your contributions. - KNM Talk 19:48, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Congrats :) Baka man  16:42, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

I see that you have not added the Today's main page article request yet, in this page: Today's featured article/requests. Please add it at your earliest convenience. Thanks. - KNM Talk 17:29, 27 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Dinesh, Good job on creating the TFA request. However, I'm afraid, you have put the request under the Dates section where typically the requests are made for featuring on a specific date. For example, World Cup Cricket FA was requested to be featured on main page, specifically on the inauguration day of the event. Do you have any specific date in mind, when you want Western Chalukya Empire to be featured on main page? If so, please add the date along with the valid justification on how that date is sigificant/most-relevant to the article. If not, then please move the request to the top of the next section (ie, not date specific).
 * Let me know if you have any questions. Thank you! - KNM Talk 00:54, 28 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Looks perfect now! Thank you. - KNM Talk 04:45, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Next item
Is it gonna be Rashtrakuta Dynasty? :) --Dwaipayan (talk) 14:34, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Which article?
Rashtrakuta Dynasty? If so, the first map the letters are too pale to read clearly, I feel. The second map does need to have the capital stand out more, at least it would be more effective if it did. --Mattisse 18:12, 28 March 2007 (UTC)


 * P.S. ""Age of Imperial Karnataka" is definitely a more eye-catching name, and it is probably more descriptive. They didn't just "expand" like a bloated stomach did they? Didn't they conquer? (I personally don't know, but I suspect they conquered.) --Mattisse 18:16, 28 March 2007 (UTC)


 * O.K. I looked it up in the dictionary. "Imperial" has a variety of meanings.

"Imperialism": expanding a nations's authority by territorial acquisition etc. It's rather more vague than "conquer" but I have not looked up "conquer" yet. --Mattisse 18:30, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I guess "conquer" sounds more forceful. But British imperialism was considered bad when I was in school! --Mattisse 18:33, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: Information with Images
You can add/edit any of the information to the images you have uploaded, like the place name, date the photograph taken etc. This can be done anytime, even now. You don't have to worry too much about it...as long as you have uploaded with a valid license tag under which you have released the images. Having said that, it is worth spending time on adding the relevant information to the images. - KNM Talk 20:53, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Go to bed!
This is getting out of hand. Are you superman? Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:52, 29 March 2007 (UTC)


 * That is incredibly not true (that you have been doing nothing lately). I feel bad because I can' help you out and do more. How can you say that? Doing nothing lately - baloney! --Mattisse 02:58, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

Question
May I ask the reason for this method rather than the usual way? Sincerely, Mattisse 00:39, 30 March 2007 (UTC)


 * And do you have an objection to my box method? Sincerely, --Mattisse 00:48, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

box example
Look here: playbox --Mattisse 01:11, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Here is the box some strange person is working on (I told him he could): myBox12 --Mattisse 01:15, 30 March 2007 (UTC)


 * What do you think of my box idea:? --Mattisse 15:32, 30 March 2007 (UTC)


 * "Age of Imperial Karnataka" - I like the title. I guess I am wondering how it will fit in with the rest of the history articles. I can't evaluate that because I don't have the whole picture of your ultimate plan in mind. How are these all going to link up or sequence? What is your master plan? Plus what do you think of my box idea? --Mattisse 15:43, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Did you look at my box examples above? Not secure but because changes to it would show up on the Watchlist as Mattisse/boxabc no one is interested. I have never had anyone change anything in my boxes even vandals who knew I was keeping evidence against them there. Just the one Bangladesh person who asked first. --Mattisse 15:56, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Another idea
Another idea would be to call the article something boring that does not use any "trigger" words. Can't think of a title offhand. Then change it when it is done. --Mattisse 16:00, 30 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Look here: User:Mattisse/BoxD --Mattisse 16:38, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
 * We can use the Box Discussion page for notes. --Mattisse 16:40, 30 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I had to modify it some so that the headers won't show up in the edits. We can think of none descriptive names besides the alphabet. The idea is not to trigger anything. --Mattisse 16:58, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I am here!
So, did you read my emails and check out the box? Consider my suggestions and ruminations? --Mattisse 01:01, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Doesn't matter who does it
I am willing if you do not have the time. The main question is the headings. I say keep the heading if they are in my box especially. It would make it so much easier. I don't think my pages are on the radar of any of your harassers. Also, as I said, it is not usual for anyone, even psychos, to mess with someones user pages uninvited, (other than the talk page and the front user page. We can try it and alway change it to another system if necessary. --Mattisse 01:18, 31 March 2007 (UTC) P.S. You have sent me only one part, right? --Mattisse 01:18, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Fine
Muck around as you want and make it as you want. We have flexiblity and can figure out a method. --Mattisse 01:29, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

I have already been shocked!
That is, at your atrocious spelling! Not that I know how to spell -- far from it. Never fear. Lets not stress out over this. If we can work on the article in peace, there will be no problems. Have a wonderful weekend. (Hope it is for pleasure and not a workshop or something.) Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:03, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Hard to say
I am not a usual person. There is not a big divide for me between work and pleasure. My life is rather a mesh. There are no concrete divides. There were once, probably when I was your age. I want you and your family to have a great weekend and please forget about Wikipedia for two days! DON'T TAKE ANY BOOKS WITH YOU ABOUT THE HISTORY OF INDIA. This is said in good faith as I want the best for you and your family. Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:36, 31 March 2007 (UTC) P.S. I sprayed my Ellora book with antimold spray, hoping I can read it! --Mattisse 02:36, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Did you see my newest architectural article?
Indian vernacular architecture - having trouble finding picture for it. --Mattisse 02:43, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: Shivamogga
Dinesh,

Thanks for reviewing my Shivamogga district article. This is regarding your indication that the lion-tailed macaque may not exist in the Shivamogga district. I had included the image of this creature based on web reports of them being found in the Sharavathi Wildlife Sanctuary. Here are some of these reports:

http://indianwildlifereckoner.blogspot.com/2006/09/wild-life-parks-and-sanctuarys-in-india.html http://wgbis.ces.iisc.ernet.in/energy/sharavathi/svati.htm http://www.deccanherald.com/deccanherald/jan132005/d29.asp

However, if you feel that these reports may not be authentic and since I am not a wildlife enthusiast myself, I am willing to go by your words and change the image in the Shivamogga district article. Please let me know... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Amarrg (talk • contribs) 04:41, 31 March 2007 (UTC).


 * I miss you after one day. --Mattisse 01:30, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Re: Shivamogga
Thanks for the clarifications. I am now editing the Mysore district article. Request you to review the history section in that article. I saw many conflicting reports related to Gangavadi and I have tried to portray as much of a fact as possible. Please let me know if there are any changes that may be required.

By the way, I forgot the tilda's last time. Will try to remember them every time :) Amarrg 03:28, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Re: Mysore district
Thanks for bringing to my notice; the minor shortcomings in my edits on the article. I should say that the article is still in a very nascent stage and will require some cleanup (including some of my own edits). I am still working on it and will incorporate the changes that you have suggested - Amarrg 08:58, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

By the way, I am now trying to edit the "Culture" section in Mysore district article. This section will be a behemoth and I am trying to see how best I can organise to make it concise and readable. I think I will have to create a separate article for this. Some info that I will have to add is about Dasara, sandalwood art, Mysore silk sarees, palaces and may be about Ravivarma's paintings, masala dosa, rail museum, mysore pak, spiritual yoga. Any suggestions? :) -- Amarrg 16:18, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Join WP:WINDPA
I think u are interested in Wildlife and Protected areas of India (from ur userpage). Why don't u join WikiProject Protected areas of India. U can contribute to the National parks and sanctuaries of India. Moreover with ur credential of 4 FAs and other good articles I am hoping a lot from u. U can help Kaziranga and Silent Valley National Park at present to improve their quality. Amartyabag  TALK2ME  09:22, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Hoysala
Dinesh, don't you think you need to show that Hoysala occupied or controlled more than 50% of the area of Tamil Nadu to make that claim. There is no such history as far as I know. Some incursions were made, perhaps, but they are not big as I understand. --Aadal 13:11, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Welcome back
Send you one email that was returned as "delivery failed". Just sent you another. --Mattisse 13:24, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Yes
I just sent you an email. But it probably did not contain anything that you didn't already know -- except Playbox 2 and BoxD are different in content (I believe). --Mattisse 00:49, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

During the holiday
I cleaned it up. (Spelling, mild copy edit) Do you want me to do more? --Mattisse 00:55, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Read latest email and will check again. --Mattisse 00:57, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Both, but especially BoxD - but not enough I guess. I will check again tomorrow morning. Sorry! --Mattisse 01:15, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I can't add anything, of course, as I do not know the information. Did you look in Playbox2? (Too tired myself to sort it out this minute.) But if you would look and clarify to me, I will sort it out first thing tomorrow. Sorry for misunderstanding! Sincerely, --Mattisse 01:19, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Gettysburg
That is wonderful. It is a sacred place (mentally and physically, for me). But I am surprised about the amenities for dogs in India. Is that brought out in an article somewhere? --Mattisse 01:23, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

O.K
BoxD is it. Will Playbox2 every be relevant, or should I empty it? --Mattisse 01:24, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * O.K. I'll just wipe it out. --Mattisse 01:45, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Pics
That's great. You will get recognition for all this. You are doing a huge thing. (And you walk on water too!), Your admirer, --Mattisse 02:17, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

BUT . ..
You can't spell!

(I have not been to Gettysburg for years -- not since all the visitor's centers were built and such. I wonder if it feels the same.) --Mattisse 02:23, 4 April 2007 (UTC)


 * As you are probably aware, the Civil War was a defining episode in American history. Although the history of this country is not long, as is India's, it is filled with dramatic and miraculous moments that are were instrumental in it's creation. You are American, you said that you became an American citizen. I hope you have a chance to visit some of the truly special places outside the Northeast. Although I was born in the Northeast (Connecticut) I do not identify with that part of the country these days, even though my mother's family was the equivalent of "Mexican aliens" as they were French-Canadians who migrated yearly to the textile mills in New England. I remember when I was young, someone called my mother "white trash" and she was upset. I am not a Brahmin. Hope that's O.K. My father's mother was born in Norway and his father in Sweden. None of my grandparents had an eduction. My father was a law student at the University of Michigan but was swayed by Oppenheimer and became first a nuclear physicist and then a plasma physicist and well know in his field. My mother received her degree in Math from the same university. Enough about me!  Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:58, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Good (about the dog Virgal )
Or rather, about the Virgal for the Hound of a Ganga king. There was the "hero stone" episode also -- forget which kingdom at the moment. Sincerely, --Mattisse 03:02, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * P.S. Way past my bedtime so I am not thinking too clearly! Just so glad that you are back. --Mattisse 03:03, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

"References" in Rashtrakuta Dynasty
Please follow what Sandy suggested in the last FAC. List the references in alphabetic order (per the last names of the authors). The article seems a little bit low in image count, compared to previous ones. That does not matter though! Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 18:32, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Hi! yes i see you are working on something in the line of political history of Karnataka or stuffs like that, right? Please join the wildlife project as requested by Amartya. Kaziranga should go for FAC soon. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 19:05, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

My imagination?
Or does D repeat itself? Maybe I am not fully understanding. Sincerely, --Mattisse 19:47, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

O.K. > alphabetise
I was going to alphabetise Rashtrakuta Dynasty references. Is that O.K? --Mattisse 20:18, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

O.K. - no more
But I don't quite get what you are saying. Also, you last coment was confusing. I guess I'm "out of it"! --Mattisse 20:31, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * P.S. What about the person above who asked you to do it for Rashtrakuta Dynasty -- this is second time he has asked, I believe. --Mattisse 20:34, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

O.k.
I alphabetised the references in both articles and am now going through Rashtrakuta Dynasty for spelling and minor editing. Did'nt one of the persons leaving comments on your page feel that the pictures were not quite right? Sincerely, --Mattisse 22:17, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, all except the last
Are from the Ellora site, the last is from Elephanta. One is just another version of one on the Kailash Temple page. (And that page does not have a good representation of the pix available (from my point of view). Are you saying that only the Kailash Temple bears their stamp? --Mattisse 23:04, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Wiki Commons
Go look, Maybe you will see one you like. --Mattisse 23:08, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * []
 * []

My book is hard to tell
Mostly it talks about the craftsman. The only time it mentions the Rastrakulas is in association with the the polictical statement that building the Kailasa Jain Monlith made. (Otherwise, the book seems to say there were layers and layers as the cave temples evolved and perhaps craftsmen from different areas entered the scene and contributed new ideas, skills, etc.) So, I guess you would be safest sticking with Cave 16 in terms of temples. --Mattisse 23:20, 4 April 2007 (UTC)





I this those would add variety & interest
The ones you suggested along with the ones already on the page. --Mattisse 23:36, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

I agree
The ones in the arch section are the most uninteresting, especially in view of the spectacular monolith rock-cut temple they did create! --Mattisse 23:46, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

What are you going to put in their place?
Before you get your bed of nails ready tonight, consider visual interest for the reader. I think that was what made Hoysala architecture so good. The photos were so interesting and complimented the text so well. Also, you know in D, once you put in actual headings the likelihood of notice will increase. Still, I think the risk is low as my name is not on the radar. --Mattisse 00:28, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Pattadakal
Pattadakal --Mattisse 00:44, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

I think Kasiviswanatha temple and Kailash Temple are the same, though I could be wrong. --Mattisse 00:49, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Why don't you concentrate on the spectacular temple
Those other articles aren't well reference, and that one picture of the Kailash Temple looks wrong. Of course, I know nothing. Sincerely, --Mattisse 00:55, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Plus you already have one good pix of Kailash Temple in there - I like it at least. --Mattisse 00:57, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

I think you gave me a different ref number before.
O.K. Looks like you are right. I'm preparing my own bed of nails. Don't know if I will be any good in the judgment category tonight very much longer. You know best. As you know, I look for the over all visual interest of an article to keep the interested reader. Too bad your peers pressured you! Although that is why you are here in this country today, which is definitely good from my point of view. Do some walking on water! We have time, as the peer review process allows time. We will find good pictures. Lay out what you want and I will hunt tomorrow. Sincerely, --Mattisse 01:07, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Looks wrong
The one that is supposed to be the Kailash Temple. --Mattisse 01:10, 5 April 2007 (UTC) P.S. But who am I to say.

Confusion - I have probably added to it
This image This looks wrong but I I may have misread, misunderstood. You should go with your instincts and knowledge. I can't reconstruct the basis of my thinking. My bed of nails is calling. You know what you are talking about. I don't. And again,I stress there is time. Sincerely, --Mattisse 01:27, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

You mean?
Standup comedy instead of my bed of nails? Do you recommend it? --Mattisse 01:29, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Read article on Jaina Narayana temple at Pattadkal
So sad that they narrowly missed "prestigious international award, Asia Pacific Heritage Award, given by the UNESCO to promote conservation of historical sites across the Asia-Pacific region as it had overlooked the involvement of citizen groups or non-governmental organisations in its work, which is a UNESCO mandate." I feel so bad. I feel such an empathy with India. Sincerely, --Mattisse 01:42, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Yes, stick to the big world-shaking masterpiece
Stress it. Others, (unless they are like you) will not be able to follow all the details. (Maybe it is my "the hook" article writing experience. You can alway go into even more detail in sub articles,or sub sub articles. Suppose I got into the intricacies of the American Civil War with you (which I'm sure they did not at the Vistor's Center). Would there be a point to that? Just that your son was fascinated is wonderful. He will learn the complications and incongruities if he is interested in dedicating his life to it! Sincerely, --Mattisse 01:52, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

My secret thoughts:
You are sub nationalistic, as you put it. I don't care if you are. I am also for my own country (although I will never revel to you the truth!) Do what you want and write what you want and I will support you. Sincerely, --Mattisse 01:59, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Misson
Sounds like you have one. Saying you are a chip designer certainly throws people like me very off the mark. Well, I am very admiring of India, but your sub subs may elude me as they contains subtleties. Just my lack of understanding, as you probably have of my country. Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:12, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Humm!
Maybe you are an American also (besides being Indian). I was a Berkeley radical etc. but now I think this is the most wonderful place on earth for my particular (unusual) life style. I think you are wonderful, except for being pressured into a job your don't like. But maybe you do enjoy it, despite what you say. I finally figured out that working for anyone but yourself I cannot do. But it did take me years to realise. And all are not like me. I think you are doing wonderfully. Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:29, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Literature
The strikeout was out of place as it was in the context of the politics of conquering and expansion. It would belong in a section on the development of the arts.

Your second point is an interesting one, and goes along with my book (which you have somewhat pooh-poohed). It seems like all of it is a rich combination of both and that process deserves to be discussed. Perhaps it would help all this emphasis on which king and which lineage, etc. (that people war and vandalise over) as it was still the people in the villages, craftsmen and farmers, and those interesting independent entities, the merchant and craftsman guilds, plus mariners, seamen, traders, and who knows all who were actually implementing all this. The kings (when not fighting) were being entertained by dancing men and women or writing -- which is fine. But the energy of these empires/kingdoms/dynasties comes from the industry of the subjects, the people.


 * By the way, I am driving across the country starting May 31. But I will, most of the time, still have access to the internet. Sincerely, Mattisse 16:11, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Car
Well, maybe not exactly pooh-poohed my book, but very close, plus accusing the author of being biased. I am not suggesting anything for this article. (I don't really don't know where this article is going.)

But between what Keay says (as he talks about the various guilds here and there) and my pooh-poohed author, I might throw together something for my own self on this issue -- like my Indian vernacular architecture article or my Indian rock-cut architecture article -- if I ever get around to spending time on them -- which, I believe, you sub-pooh-pooh. (Just kidding, sort of, but someone reading your page and checking out my Vernacular architecture said it was worthwhile and contributed a picture!)

By the way, I am still not clear what we are doing now. Sincerely, --Mattisse 19:06, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Kailasnatha Temple vs Kailash Temple
They are one and the same plus more! See Kailasnatha Temple specially created for you. --Mattisse 21:23, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Kasiviswanatha (or Kasivisveshwara) temple and the Kailasanatha (or Kailasa) temple
"But yesterday we were discussing about Kasiviswanatha (or Kasivisveshwara) temple and the Kailasanatha (or Kailasa) temple which are different." Are you sure????

Also, I am 99.9999999999999 percent sure the Rashtrakuta Dynasty built at least one Jain temple at Ellora.

As far as the Box, don't fret about it as it will come together. Sometimes you have to write some in the wrong direction (I'm not saying that is what you are doing) but the creative process is such that you have to feel your way through it.

But I do wish I knew what your master two-year plan is. Sincerely, --Mattisse 21:32, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Name confusion!
How can I not let them confuse me, especially if they sound the same to the western ear? My ear is western. Or do I need an ear transplant?

Maybe the way to get around all this dynasty stuff is not to keep going into sub sub-dynasties but to write on topics that strattle -- like my guilds idea, although not necessarily that one. You said you wanted to write on on poetry. I would like to write one on guilds and such. You said you wanted to write a pillar article or one on the decorative elements of temples that are distinctively Indian. Or what about the articles from the Vijayanagara Empire left unfinished? Ancient city of etc. --Mattisse 21:42, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Why is there this plan?
Why? Why the DYK's? Why? --Mattisse 21:50, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Help!
You could help me with the Indian rock-cut architecture article. The architecture people went and put their template on it. You could probably see through my problems with it in a short time. India is the king of rock-cut, but I can't give India its due place. How about that? You have books, even. It won't take long if you helped. --Mattisse 21:57, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Shore temple
Not excavated but structural. I do note the overlap. Thanks! --Mattisse 00:21, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

No, I did not learn of DYK until recently
So be it. I am cogitating. How did I get on this space rocket of yours? Please explain to me your need to accompish this task, just so I can understand you. Sincerely, --Mattisse 00:50, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

No, it's been quite a while
Too busy with you and your MISSON. Sincerely, Mattisse P.S. But if you would help me......? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mattisse (talk • contribs) 01:23, 6 April 2007 (UTC).
 * But aside from the stats etc., do you not think these rock-cuts are  wonderful, marvelous creations? --Mattisse 01:26, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I know it is opposite from your approach, but is so organic, arising out of the origins of mankind! It is so beautiful and organic and in contact with the universe! Sincerely, Mattisse 01:41, 6 April 2007 (UTC)


 * (I know in some ways you are so much more sophisticated than than I am. In other ways, I have the wisdom of the ages.) I am going to my bed of nails. Your friend, --Mattisse 01:41, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

I know
You don't have to explain. You are doing a tremendous amount of work. I was kidding you, truly, and don't expect that from you. Just feeling somewhat discouraged is all. Sincerely, Mattisse 21:14, 6 April 2007 (UTC)


 * P.S. My trip has been moved up by a few weeks! --Mattisse 21:15, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Reply
It's being figured out. It depends on a variety of factors. Guessing, probably the middle of May. --Mattisse 22:02, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Also, I don't know when I will get back -- could be a short or long time. I might stay out there and travel about. --Mattisse 22:29, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Answer
I don't think so. I would hate to let you down. Sincerely, --Mattisse 23:07, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Photo
You stuck a beautiful photo in Western Chalukya Empire. Where do you keep all these photos. Do you have a photo of a horseshoe arched window (popular in Hindu temples)? Sincerely, --Mattisse 23:15, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

I won't
The box will always be useful and no one pays attention to it. No horseshoe arched windows in those articles. But I know I have seen photo somewhere. But where? (I did grab a few photos off those articles -- like temple with tank plus a house). Thanks! --Mattisse 23:32, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Question
Are you able to explain to me more what this drive (that has taken you over) is? I really do not understand. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:37, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Answer
Karnataka, and the sub sub sub issues regarding it. I have lived many places, but I do not perseverance on one -- they all have their place. So your experience is different from mine, and I would like to understand, as you are somewhat of a mystery to me regarding this issue. Sincerely, --Mattisse 01:53, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Another question
Don't want to be a pest but I find the description on caption unsatisfactory. Not to be mean to you, far from it. Just curious. Sincerely, Mattisse 02:08, 7 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Going to my bed of nails. Skipping the walking on water for tonight. Sincerely, --Mattisse 02:11, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

email
Thank you for it as it explains a lot. I have answered, hopefully in a way you understand. (Sometimes I am not good at explaining myself.) Sincerely, Mattisse 13:25, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

email reply #2
And thank you for yours. --Mattisse 16:51, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

(rearranged references-->alphabetical)
Why did you put "(rearranged references-->alphabetical)" on you last edit summary of Rashtrakuta Dynasty when, checking the diffs, I find that you changed not one thing (nothing) in the References since I spent some time doing an unpleasant task for you to make the references alphabetical in two different articles because the FA editors requested it. Talk about feeling worthless. I will not bother doing tasks like that again if that is how you see it. Sincerely, --Mattisse 11:44, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
 * p.s. Besides it is dishonest to take credit for my work. You get heaps of credit yourself, you don't have to take away my little bit. Sincerely, --Mattisse 11:47, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Apology!
I am so sorry. I am trying to calm down. (These are the times that I miss User:BostonMA so much and his words from the Tamil poet. I can hardly bear that he is gone.) I am under great stress in my real life and I have let it carry over. Please forgive me, Dinesh. Sincerely, Mattisse 17:01, 9 April 2007 (UTC)